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    The Situation in the Ukraine. #27

    miketheterrible
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    The Situation in the Ukraine. #27 - Page 13 Empty Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #27

    Post  miketheterrible Thu Feb 15, 2018 3:51 pm

    kvs wrote:
    Walther von Oldenburg wrote:kvsm you sure about that?

    Ukrainian nationalist fervor is dominant in quite amsll area - only westtern Ukraine and maybe westernized youth in Kiev. The rest of the country does not really care about Russia and areas east of Dnepr are openly pro-Russian.

    It is more complex.   The younger generation born in the 1980s and 1990s has been worked over nicely to hate Russia.   The breakdown
    of the Soviet identity has left gaps filled by revisionist history (e.g. the Holodomor "holocaust of Ukrainians", in fact there were forced
    collectivization famines in various regions of the USSR and Ukrainians were not the Soviet equivalent of Jewish victims of Nazism.)
    I know a Ukrainian family from Crimea, the youngest brother is a Kiev regime supporter.   He is at odds with the rest of the family.

    After the events in Ukraine, I have stopped believing in good will and charity.   Russia has pumped $300 billion into Ukraine since the
    1990s and all they got was hate and resentment.   If these Ukr f*ckers feel that Russia is stifling them with aid, then they should bugger on
    off and support themselves.   But these morons actually thought they could get rich NATO to become their new sugar daddy.   A
    bunch of aggressive welfare bums.

    When the hobos have ran cold turkey for days without heroin.

    Things can get even uglier.
    Ispan
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    The Situation in the Ukraine. #27 - Page 13 Empty Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #27

    Post  Ispan Thu Feb 15, 2018 10:41 pm

    On a bright and hopeful note, an ambulance bought in Spain by a Russian emigrant made its way across Europe to arrive at Donetsk full of medical equipment

    http://antimaydan.info/2018/02/volonter_prignal_iz_madrida_v_nbsp_doneck_poderzhannuu_skoruu.html

    I am glad to have contributed a small sum ( I am penniless) and spread the word so more people did donations. If you ever wonder if it's worth donating to charities, yes, it works, just be careful on what projects you support. I am glad this guy achieved this goal. I also suggest the Little Hiroshima blog.
    ATLASCUB
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    The Situation in the Ukraine. #27 - Page 13 Empty Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #27

    Post  ATLASCUB Fri Feb 16, 2018 2:54 pm

    kvs wrote:
    Walther von Oldenburg wrote:kvsm you sure about that?

    Ukrainian nationalist fervor is dominant in quite amsll area - only westtern Ukraine and maybe westernized youth in Kiev. The rest of the country does not really care about Russia and areas east of Dnepr are openly pro-Russian.

    It is more complex.   The younger generation born in the 1980s and 1990s has been worked over nicely to hate Russia.   The breakdown
    of the Soviet identity has left gaps filled by revisionist history (e.g. the Holodomor "holocaust of Ukrainians", in fact there were forced
    collectivization famines in various regions of the USSR and Ukrainians were not the Soviet equivalent of Jewish victims of Nazism.)
    I know a Ukrainian family from Crimea, the youngest brother is a Kiev regime supporter.   He is at odds with the rest of the family.

    After the events in Ukraine, I have stopped believing in good will and charity.   Russia has pumped $300 billion into Ukraine since the
    1990s and all they got was hate and resentment.   If these Ukr f*ckers feel that Russia is stifling them with aid, then they should bugger on
    off and support themselves.   But these morons actually thought they could get rich NATO to become their new sugar daddy.   A
    bunch of aggressive welfare bums.

    Ukraine oligarchs wouldn't dream of NATO were Russia be strong enough to command allegiance and be a strong protector of allies. It has failed on both fronts that's why it has a land mass (Ukraine) historically part of Greater Russia now in bed with its arch enemy.

    You don't see Canada betraying its big brother to sleep with Russia, now why is that? The world can be very simplistic. The mess in Ukraine is a direct consequence of the collapse of the Soviet Union. Look at the Ottoman Empire today. These collapses have serious consequences and no one should take the blame except the Russian leadership at large for decades of criminal incompetence and ineptness. The U.S swooping in and taking advantage is what any respectable Empire should do vs. its enemies. Probe for weakness, exploit - rinse and repeat. Too bad if you end up the loser. The human condition.
    The-thing-next-door
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    The Situation in the Ukraine. #27 - Page 13 Empty Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #27

    Post  The-thing-next-door Fri Feb 16, 2018 6:56 pm

    ATLASCUB wrote:
    kvs wrote:
    Walther von Oldenburg wrote:kvsm you sure about that?

    Ukrainian nationalist fervor is dominant in quite amsll area - only westtern Ukraine and maybe westernized youth in Kiev. The rest of the country does not really care about Russia and areas east of Dnepr are openly pro-Russian.

    It is more complex.   The younger generation born in the 1980s and 1990s has been worked over nicely to hate Russia.   The breakdown
    of the Soviet identity has left gaps filled by revisionist history (e.g. the Holodomor "holocaust of Ukrainians", in fact there were forced
    collectivization famines in various regions of the USSR and Ukrainians were not the Soviet equivalent of Jewish victims of Nazism.)
    I know a Ukrainian family from Crimea, the youngest brother is a Kiev regime supporter.   He is at odds with the rest of the family.

    After the events in Ukraine, I have stopped believing in good will and charity.   Russia has pumped $300 billion into Ukraine since the
    1990s and all they got was hate and resentment.   If these Ukr f*ckers feel that Russia is stifling them with aid, then they should bugger on
    off and support themselves.   But these morons actually thought they could get rich NATO to become their new sugar daddy.   A
    bunch of aggressive welfare bums.

    Ukraine oligarchs wouldn't dream of NATO were Russia be strong enough to command allegiance and be a strong protector of allies. It has failed on both fronts that's why it has a land mass (Ukraine) historically part of Greater Russia now in bed with its arch enemy.

    You don't see Canada betraying its big brother to sleep with Russia, now why is that? The world can be very simplistic. The mess in Ukraine is a direct consequence of the collapse of the Soviet Union. Look at the Ottoman Empire today. These collapses have serious consequences and no one should take the blame except the Russian leadership at large for decades of criminal incompetence and ineptness. The U.S swooping in and taking advantage is what any respectable Empire should do vs. its enemies. Probe for weakness, exploit - rinse and repeat. Too bad if you end up the loser. The human condition.

    The reason for the problem was a lack of military response and the solution is a full scale military invasion.
    kvs
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    The Situation in the Ukraine. #27 - Page 13 Empty Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #27

    Post  kvs Fri Feb 16, 2018 7:12 pm

    ATLASCUB wrote:
    kvs wrote:
    Walther von Oldenburg wrote:kvsm you sure about that?

    Ukrainian nationalist fervor is dominant in quite amsll area - only westtern Ukraine and maybe westernized youth in Kiev. The rest of the country does not really care about Russia and areas east of Dnepr are openly pro-Russian.

    It is more complex.   The younger generation born in the 1980s and 1990s has been worked over nicely to hate Russia.   The breakdown
    of the Soviet identity has left gaps filled by revisionist history (e.g. the Holodomor "holocaust of Ukrainians", in fact there were forced
    collectivization famines in various regions of the USSR and Ukrainians were not the Soviet equivalent of Jewish victims of Nazism.)
    I know a Ukrainian family from Crimea, the youngest brother is a Kiev regime supporter.   He is at odds with the rest of the family.

    After the events in Ukraine, I have stopped believing in good will and charity.   Russia has pumped $300 billion into Ukraine since the
    1990s and all they got was hate and resentment.   If these Ukr f*ckers feel that Russia is stifling them with aid, then they should bugger on
    off and support themselves.   But these morons actually thought they could get rich NATO to become their new sugar daddy.   A
    bunch of aggressive welfare bums.

    Ukraine oligarchs wouldn't dream of NATO were Russia be strong enough to command allegiance and be a strong protector of allies. It has failed on both fronts that's why it has a land mass (Ukraine) historically part of Greater Russia now in bed with its arch enemy.

    You don't see Canada betraying its big brother to sleep with Russia, now why is that? The world can be very simplistic. The mess in Ukraine is a direct consequence of the collapse of the Soviet Union. Look at the Ottoman Empire today. These collapses have serious consequences and no one should take the blame except the Russian leadership at large for decades of criminal incompetence and ineptness. The U.S swooping in and taking advantage is what any respectable Empire should do vs. its enemies. Probe for weakness, exploit - rinse and repeat. Too bad if you end up the loser. The human condition.

    Attributing this 100% to Russia, as you do, is pure BS. Elevating some a Nazi butcher (Bandera) into a national hero takes the
    cake. Ukr morons thought that NATO would feed them charity to their heart's content. NATO didn't even give them $15 billion.
    They will never again have it so good as they had it with Russia.

    Your claim might of had some weight in the 1990s, but not in 2014. The spread of rotten oligarchy is Ukraine's problem. Russia
    went through a similar rot under Yeltsin, but Putin cleaned house. Ukr morons were too busy staging Orange revolutions and Maidans
    to clean house and like the bunch of inadequates that they are were busy crawling up NATO's ass to prove that they were part of
    Europe. F*cktards.
    kvs
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    The Situation in the Ukraine. #27 - Page 13 Empty Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #27

    Post  kvs Fri Feb 16, 2018 7:18 pm

    The-thing-next-door wrote:
    ATLASCUB wrote:
    kvs wrote:
    Walther von Oldenburg wrote:kvsm you sure about that?

    Ukrainian nationalist fervor is dominant in quite amsll area - only westtern Ukraine and maybe westernized youth in Kiev. The rest of the country does not really care about Russia and areas east of Dnepr are openly pro-Russian.

    It is more complex.   The younger generation born in the 1980s and 1990s has been worked over nicely to hate Russia.   The breakdown
    of the Soviet identity has left gaps filled by revisionist history (e.g. the Holodomor "holocaust of Ukrainians", in fact there were forced
    collectivization famines in various regions of the USSR and Ukrainians were not the Soviet equivalent of Jewish victims of Nazism.)
    I know a Ukrainian family from Crimea, the youngest brother is a Kiev regime supporter.   He is at odds with the rest of the family.

    After the events in Ukraine, I have stopped believing in good will and charity.   Russia has pumped $300 billion into Ukraine since the
    1990s and all they got was hate and resentment.   If these Ukr f*ckers feel that Russia is stifling them with aid, then they should bugger on
    off and support themselves.   But these morons actually thought they could get rich NATO to become their new sugar daddy.   A
    bunch of aggressive welfare bums.

    Ukraine oligarchs wouldn't dream of NATO were Russia be strong enough to command allegiance and be a strong protector of allies. It has failed on both fronts that's why it has a land mass (Ukraine) historically part of Greater Russia now in bed with its arch enemy.

    You don't see Canada betraying its big brother to sleep with Russia, now why is that? The world can be very simplistic. The mess in Ukraine is a direct consequence of the collapse of the Soviet Union. Look at the Ottoman Empire today. These collapses have serious consequences and no one should take the blame except the Russian leadership at large for decades of criminal incompetence and ineptness. The U.S swooping in and taking advantage is what any respectable Empire should do vs. its enemies. Probe for weakness, exploit - rinse and repeat. Too bad if you end up the loser. The human condition.

    The reason for the problem was a lack of military response and the solution is a full scale military invasion.

    No. These losers do not deserve such aid. Russia does not need this tar baby, let NATO pump them and dump them.

    It looks to me like NATO expected Russia to invade Ukraine. But Putin fooled them. Now the Kiev regime is living on borrowed
    time since the country is getting poorer every day and people are starving. At some point in the near future, there will be
    phase change in Ukraine where the reality of what happened will hit them. The maggots in Kiev will not survive.
    miketheterrible
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    Post  miketheterrible Fri Feb 16, 2018 8:34 pm

    It should be rather simple that after decades of Russia's investments, and bending over back for Ukraine, and then getting almost nothing in return other than a nation filled with retards wanting to kill them, is obvious cutting and running was the best option. While i think it should be in Russia's best interest to support the creation of Novorussia, the rest of their decisions have been pretty much on spot of what was needed.

    Now the money is returning to Russia. The production in Russia is growing because they don't rely on Ukraine anymore. All the while Ukraine is now slowly collapsing.

    I don't see how this was Russia's fault. I mean, they could have gone in and just killed all these fools. But, that isn't allowed (even if I promote it) and they didn't do it. So I guess thats the only fault of Russia.
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    Post  ATLASCUB Fri Feb 16, 2018 10:01 pm

    You all would repeat the same trope if Belarus were to fall next when we all know this is just the result of a collection of elites deciding Russian elites are not the best to suck up to - and they won the power tussle with the U.S cheering them on, scheming and supporting them. In effect, the best won, if you look at it from a purely competitive perspective.

    To KVS...I grew seeing Ukranians as Russians (ehm Soviets)... the distinction is practically non-existent (for the overwhelming majority). If a fringe is given power and freedom to propagandize filth and exploit circumstances to their liking, it will eventually get some buyers...and more and more with more repetition and the less competition of views. That's in essence how you propagandize and populations at large are NOT immune to this anywhere in the world - ANYWHERE. If you wished for all Ukrainians to be homogeneous thinkers you're obviously not rational. Fringe elements exist within Russia too. Moreover, with the dissolution of the Soviet Union Russia pretty much created a barrier between Russian people and told them - you're Russian no longer....but Ukranian, Belorussian etc....

    Don't expect them to see mother Russia as its mother...when it has been told it's not. Nor has mother Russia pick up the cannons to go fight for its child, even if some went the wrong way.

    As for fringes reshaping society....give the West-Liberals in Russia free reign and see what happens. Exactly.
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    Post  GarryB Sat Feb 17, 2018 5:08 am

    You all would repeat the same trope if Belarus were to fall next when we all know this is just the result of a collection of elites deciding Russian elites are not the best to suck up to

    Russia got rid of a lot of dead weight when the Warsaw Pact collapsed... not so much allies as bitches and hanger ons...

    If the cost of keeping the Ukraine was subsidy and support then Russia is best rid of them... I don't think Belarus is in the same category... it is not a well unit, but not a huge drain like a leech.

    - and they won the power tussle with the U.S cheering them on, scheming and supporting them. In effect, the best won, if you look at it from a purely competitive perspective.

    What has the US won?

    The EU has one a broken economy on its doorstep that wont be fixed over night... it has probably won lots of cannon fodder troops to fight in the wars the US and west like to engage in from time to time...

    From a purely competitive perspective they have won a dog... the same as in Kosovo.... if they need lots of hookers or a good source of body parts then both cases were a win for the west... yeah....

    It will cost many billions of dollars they will likely never see again to fix them however...

    To KVS...I grew seeing Ukranians as Russians (ehm Soviets)... the distinction is practically non-existent (for the overwhelming majority). If a fringe is given power and freedom to propagandize filth and exploit circumstances to their liking, it will eventually get some buyers...and more and more with more repetition and the less competition of views. That's in essence how you propagandize and populations at large are NOT immune to this anywhere in the world - ANYWHERE. If you wished for all Ukrainians to be homogeneous thinkers you're obviously not rational. Fringe elements exist within Russia too. Moreover, with the dissolution of the Soviet Union Russia pretty much created a barrier between Russian people and told them - you're Russian no longer....but Ukranian, Belorussian etc....

    You mean like republicans and democrats in the US who will see something that is good for everyone as being bad because it is the policy of the other side?

    So what?

    There are probably just as many Russians living in foreign countries trying not to be Russian any more as there are Ukrainian not wanting to be Russian... that is fine.

    Your problem seems to be that you think Russia is better off with Ukraine and Belarus as part of Russia... the honest truth is that it is not... Russia needs a debt like fixing ukraine like west Germany needed east Germany... if you spend too much helping them the westies get jealous, but more likely you are not going to be spending enough and the westies are still going to be pissed off at their wealth going to fix the east but the east will see it is not really as much as they could be spending... no one is happy...

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    The Situation in the Ukraine. #27 - Page 13 Empty Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #27

    Post  JohninMK Sat Feb 17, 2018 12:23 pm

    Russia rubbing its hands with glee at this positive boost to its demographics. A lose the Ukraine can definitely not afford as it transits toward a country of the young an old ruled by right wing robber barons.

    Saturday, February 17, 2018 - 12:00

    About 1.7 million Ukrainian citizens have applied to Russia since 2014 for obtaining Russian citizenship, refugee status, temporary asylum. This was stated on Thursday by Russia's permanent representative to the OSCE, Alexander Lukashevich.

    "Since April 1, 2014, about 1 million 700 thousand Ukrainian citizens have applied to the relevant bodies of Russia for obtaining legal status - Russian citizenship, refugee status, temporary asylum, temporary residence permit, etc. Even more Ukrainians regularly travel to Russia for earnings. Authorities come up with propaganda labels like "an aggressor country," but people vote with their feet," Lukashevich said at a meeting of the OSCE Permanent Council in Vienna.

    The Russian diplomat recalled in this connection with the fact that the conflict in Donbass began with the punitive operation of Kiev against its own population, which brought untold suffering to the inhabitants of the region.

    "Many were forced to flee, including to Russia," the Permanent Representative said.

    According to him, attempts to expose Russia as a side of the intra-Ukrainian conflict are an integral part of the policy of sabotaging the Minsk agreements, prolonging the conflict, preserving a hotbed of tension on the borders of the European Union and Russia, and creating competitive advantages for extra-regional powers.

    "All this is done at the expense of the peoples of Ukraine," he added.

    DONi News Agency

    JohninMK
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    Post  JohninMK Sat Feb 17, 2018 1:57 pm

    From Gabriel, German FM today, first time I have seen this mentioned anywhere. My highlight.

    Gabriel, a former economy minister, and Lavrov said they aimed to expand bilateral trade, which rose 20 percent last year.

    The two ministers are due to hold a face-to-face meeting later on Saturday, but plans for a four-way meeting on the Ukraine crisis on Friday also including France and Ukraine collapsed after a scheduling conflict.

    Gabriel also defended plans for the Nord Stream 2 gas pipeline that would connect Germany and Russia under the Baltic Sea, a project bitterly opposed by Poland, Ukraine and Baltic states on concerns it would increase Europe’s dependence on Russian gas and could cut off Ukraine from gas transit fees.

    He said Germany intended to ensure continued use of the existing transit pipeline through Ukraine, and he believed Russia was open to that possibility.

    The United States last month said it viewed Nord Stream 2 as a threat to Europe’s energy security.


    https://www.reuters.com/article/us-germany-security-ukraine-crisis-gabri/ukraine-progress-should-soften-sanctions-on-russia-germanys-gabriel-idUSKCN1G10B2?utm_campaign=trueAnthem:+Trending+Content&utm_content=5a87f3c304d3014246d95f64&utm_medium=trueAnthem&utm_source=twitter
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    The Situation in the Ukraine. #27 - Page 13 Empty Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #27

    Post  kvs Sat Feb 17, 2018 4:16 pm

    ATLASCUB wrote:You all would repeat the same trope if Belarus were to fall next when we all know this is just the result of a collection of elites deciding Russian elites are not the best to suck up to - and they won the power tussle with the U.S cheering them on, scheming and supporting them. In effect, the best won, if you look at it from a purely competitive perspective.

    To KVS...I grew seeing Ukranians as Russians (ehm Soviets)... the distinction is practically non-existent (for the overwhelming majority). If a fringe is given power and freedom to propagandize filth and exploit circumstances to their liking, it will eventually get some buyers...and more and more with more repetition and the less competition of views. That's in essence how you propagandize and populations at large are NOT immune to this anywhere in the world - ANYWHERE. If you wished for all Ukrainians to be homogeneous thinkers you're obviously not rational. Fringe elements exist within Russia too. Moreover, with the dissolution of the Soviet Union Russia pretty much created a barrier between Russian people and told them - you're Russian no longer....but Ukranian, Belorussian etc....

    Don't expect them to see mother Russia as its mother...when it has been told it's not. Nor has mother Russia pick up the cannons to go fight for its child, even if some went the wrong way.

    As for fringes reshaping society....give the West-Liberals in Russia free reign and see what happens. Exactly.

    I am half Ukrainian, with that part of my family coming from the western part that was under Poland between the Soviet-Polish
    war and WWII.   Don't throw NATO retard propaganda phrases like "mother Russia" at me.   You clearly have no idea of the
    public opinion in Ukraine.   There is no continuity with the USSR "harmony".   At least 40% of the population has bought into
    the anti-Russian Banderite "nationalism" that was succored by the west.    The expat Ukrainian communities in Canada, USA
    and elsewhere composed mostly of the Nazi collaborator trash that fled after WWII have succeeded in giving Ukraine a
    new identity.   Ukrainians clearly did not have the intellectual fortitude to develop a pragmatic one themselves.

    Running around waving pictures of Bandera is a clear sign of mental inadequacy.   I bet you will claim that Russian geriatrics
    waving pictures of Stalin are the same.  BS.  Stalin was an actual leader and had his act together during WWII.   It is typical
    NATO propaganda that paints him as some incompetent buffoon.   Compared to Hitler he was a genius.    And all the Soviet
    human rights abuses during the 1930s were not his sole responsibility.   He actually had reign in Khruschev from his campaign
    to exterminate all perceived political opponents, the same Khruschev who was later whitewashed into some sort of reformer.  
    Bandera was nothing more than Hitler's stooge and not an actual Ukrainian statesman.   Aside from Holocaust level atrocities,
    there is nothing to distinguish this butcher.  

    Also, how is Bandera relevant to Ukraine today?   What national identity does he represent?  Ukrainians were Slav untermenschen
    scheduled for eventual eradication by Hitler.   Bandera has nothing to offer in terms of Ukrainian culture.   He was merely one
    of Hitler's dogs.   Bandera is an identity symbol for all the collaborator expats and not for real Ukrainians living in Ukraine.   But
    they swallowed this turd anyway.
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    The Situation in the Ukraine. #27 - Page 13 Empty Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #27

    Post  par far Sat Feb 17, 2018 5:49 pm

    JohninMK wrote:Russia rubbing its hands with glee at this positive boost to its demographics. A lose the Ukraine can definitely not afford as it transits toward a country of the young an old ruled by right wing robber barons.

    Saturday, February 17, 2018 - 12:00

    About 1.7 million Ukrainian citizens have applied to Russia since 2014 for obtaining Russian citizenship, refugee status, temporary asylum. This was stated on Thursday by Russia's permanent representative to the OSCE, Alexander Lukashevich.

       "Since April 1, 2014, about 1 million 700 thousand Ukrainian citizens have applied to the relevant bodies of Russia for obtaining legal status - Russian citizenship, refugee status, temporary asylum, temporary residence permit, etc. Even more Ukrainians regularly travel to Russia for earnings. Authorities come up with propaganda labels like "an aggressor country," but people vote with their feet," Lukashevich said at a meeting of the OSCE Permanent Council in Vienna.

    The Russian diplomat recalled in this connection with the fact that the conflict in Donbass began with the punitive operation of Kiev against its own population, which brought untold suffering to the inhabitants of the region.

       "Many were forced to flee, including to Russia," the Permanent Representative said.

    According to him, attempts to expose Russia as a side of the intra-Ukrainian conflict are an integral part of the policy of sabotaging the Minsk agreements, prolonging the conflict, preserving a hotbed of tension on the borders of the European Union and Russia, and creating competitive advantages for extra-regional powers.

       "All this is done at the expense of the peoples of Ukraine," he added.

    DONi News Agency


    Is it safe to bring in 1.7 million outside rs into the country? It is not going very well for the EU.
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    Post  JohninMK Sat Feb 17, 2018 6:00 pm

    par far wrote:

    Is it safe to bring in 1.7 million outside rs into the country? It is not going very well for the EU.

    It must be a lot safer to bring in immigrants who speak the language, have a similar culture, are educated to similar standards, who can work immediately often in skilled jobs and who come in in what are often family units rather than the rabble who match none of those criteria.
    auslander
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    Post  auslander Sat Feb 17, 2018 9:27 pm

    par far wrote: Is it safe to bring in 1.7 million outside rs into the country? It is not going very well for the EU.

    Russia is far from being the patsies that eu is. You screw up here as a guest and you are out. Period.
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    Post  JohninMK Sun Feb 18, 2018 9:34 pm

    Not sure what to make of these what appear to be new old video of the Russian Army in Ukraine in 2014/5. Should have been around before now. More apparently coming.

    Glasnost Gone‏ @GlasnostGone

    My new video on Russian army columns in #Ukraine. 1st in a series of videos looking at columns which have either just entered Ukraine, or like one in this video, those seen moving location within it. https://youtu.be/9dt3WeA_k_0 #Donbas #Donbass


    miketheterrible
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    Post  miketheterrible Sun Feb 18, 2018 11:11 pm

    If Russian army was there, Kiev would have been taken.

    These are equipment bring moved. Guaranteed Russia supplied weapons. But men? No.
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    Post  franco Sun Feb 18, 2018 11:30 pm

    JohninMK wrote:Not sure what to make of these what appear to be new old video of the Russian Army in Ukraine in 2014/5. Should have been around before now. More apparently coming.

    Glasnost Gone‏ @GlasnostGone

    My new video on Russian army columns in #Ukraine. 1st in a series of videos looking at columns which have either just entered Ukraine, or like one in this video, those seen moving location within it. https://youtu.be/9dt3WeA_k_0   #Donbas #Donbass



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    Post  Unknown90 Mon Feb 19, 2018 5:18 am

    JohninMK wrote:Not sure what to make of these what appear to be new old video of the Russian Army in Ukraine in 2014/5. Should have been around before now. More apparently coming.

    Glasnost Gone‏ @GlasnostGone

    My new video on Russian army columns in #Ukraine. 1st in a series of videos looking at columns which have either just entered Ukraine, or like one in this video, those seen moving location within it. https://youtu.be/9dt3WeA_k_0   #Donbas #Donbass


    Nothing new whatsoever about the footage. It has been out for awhile and as Franco said, it is just footage of North Wind when the Iloviask and the Azov Sea offensive happened. All this particular video is, is just an “”””””expert””””””” pointing out obvious and trivial details.
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    Post  onwiththewar Mon Feb 19, 2018 2:47 pm

    Guys, what you think about the political developments at Munich and what's going to happen with the "Peace Keepers".

    My understandings:

    The West has lost patience in regarding to what's happening in Ukraine. They wanted land, natural resources, slave labor camp, but nothing is happening so they have changed strategy: 80% of what they asked for is better than nothing. Slaves can't make them money if there is a war going on and as a result, the slaves would have either gone to fighting (either against Donbass or against themselves) or run off to another country.

    They are pushing porky to sell state enterprises ASAP and Russia to accept the "Peace Keepers", so they can rob Ukraine "in peace". At Munich , Porky wished they can join EU and somehow "squeeze" Russia as if Ukraine has some power to do so. The West completely ignored what Porky said, didn't mention a single word if they'll help Porky get the missing pieces of "his country" back. Told him stop dreaming about EU or Nato membership. But told him over and over again about the "economical and anti-corruption reform", which means: "Porky, sell your fvcking country right now and make sure the money won't spill into Ukrainian hands."

    They are sending 30,000 "Peace Keepers" for business.

    Russia, was offered that these 30,000 "Peace Keepers" can be made of people from Belarus, Mongolia, or Greece (somewhat considered a Nato country that's "friendly" to Russia). Germany used the Nord Stream II project to blackmail Russia to say "yes" (Nord Stream II fvcks up Poland, but Poland is just another slave labor camp so who gives a fvck).

    Russia, obviously has loosened up this time. Peskov said the you can talk to Zakharchenko about "Peace Keepers". In other words, Russia has given a soft "yes".

    I think some guys from Germany and Norway are talking to Zakharchenko right now.

    My personal view is this time, "Peace Keepers" are very likely to land. Unless Russia is going to make Zakharchenko say no. But doing so will cost Nord Stream II, which is too much to lose.







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    Post  PapaDragon Mon Feb 19, 2018 3:02 pm

    onwiththewar wrote:.................
    My personal view is this time, "Peace Keepers" are very likely to land. Unless Russia is going to make Zakharchenko say no. But doing so will cost Nord Stream II, which is too much to lose.

    No way Germany will be fiddling with Nord Stream 2. They didn't allow USA near it, they sure as hell won't risk it for the Ukraine. Not even Merkel dares to touch it.

    Who owns Ukrainian slaves is irrelevant for Russia, as long as their geopolitical interests are covered.

    Ukraine is hemorrhaging money and population. Russia can wait them out at leisure.
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    Post  Ispan Mon Feb 19, 2018 3:38 pm

    onwiththewar wrote:Guys, what you think about the political developments at Munich and what's going to happen with the "Peace Keepers".

    You can read my latest blog entries using google translate

    https://guerraenucrania.wordpress.com/2018/02/13/2018-escenarios-pacificacion-guerra-o-desgaste/

    https://guerraenucrania.wordpress.com/2018/02/19/entre-munich-y-poltava-pacificacion-o-confrontacion/



    Not gonna happen. Russia knows all too well what happened in Yugoslavia. Moscow is only interested in peacekeepers to get the war to stop and freeze the conflict like in Transdnistria. The USA wants peacekeepers to conquer Donbass for the Ukraine's junta.

    The real problem is that there's nobody to make peace with in Kiev, and nobody is going to pour money into Ukraine to restore the economy, wich can only be done through restoring ties with Russia.

    Also, all the talk about "blue helmets" is all well and good, until the politicos are presented with the bill for such an operation, and finding countries willing to contribute troops. Sending troops abroad is very expensive, and you would need a dozen or so countries willing to contribute each 2,000 troops.

    I think the Russian leadership is very stupid or pig headed in pushing Minsk agreements. Will never work, not with this gang on Ukraine.

    I think this peacekeeper stuff is just a smokescreen to win time. If there was any real will, details would be arranged quickly instead of dragging for months.

    Four weeks more to Russian elections. Then Putin can start thinking ahead. In the US and Europe they are fed up with Poroshenko, so they will try to exert influence for early elections. In 2019 chances are Ukraine will go total nazi and into war with Donbass, if Poroshenko doesn't.

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    Post  JohninMK Mon Feb 19, 2018 4:48 pm

    I suppose they have to try and no doubt the Court will in the fullness of time rule against Russia.

    On February 19, Ukraine filed its memorandum in arbitration proceedings against the Russian Federation under the UN Convention on the Sea Law, which proves that Russia violated Ukraine's sovereign rights in the Black and Azov Seas and the Kerch Strait, the official website of the Ukrainian Foreign Ministry said on Monday.

    "Since 2014, Russia has unlawfully excluded Ukraine from exercising its maritime rights; it has exploited Ukraine's sovereign resources for its own ends; and it has usurped Ukraine's right to regulate within its own maritime areas. Through these violations of international law, Russia is stealing Ukraine's energy and fisheries resources, harming the livelihoods of Ukrainian fishermen, and blocking traffic to Ukrainian ports with its illegal bridge over the Kerch Strait, among other serious violations," the message reads.


    More at http://en.interfax.com.ua/news/general/486217.html

    President of Ukraine Petro Poroshenko has signed an order on the representation of Ukraine in the consideration of the issue in the International Arbitration Court in The Hague on the violation of the UN Convention on the Sea Law, to protect the interests of Ukraine entrusted to Deputy Foreign Minister for European Integration, Olena Zerkal.

    This follows from the order on the representation of Ukraine when considering the case in the International Arbitration Court about the violation of the 1982 United Nations Convention on the Law of the Sea, signed by the president, the presidential press service reported.

    According to him, Ukraine conducted unprecedented work to protect its legal positions.


    http://en.interfax.com.ua/news/general/486215.html

    "Today is the next stage. We have prepared an order on the representation of Ukraine when the Arbitration Tribunal examines the UN Convention on the Law of the Sea on the absolutely clear position of protecting Ukraine's interests in connection with the violation of the sovereign rights of Ukraine by the Russian Federation in the Black and Azov Seas and the Kerch Strait," Poroshenko said.


    President of Ukraine Petro Poroshenko has instructed to prepare documents for the International Court of Justice in The Hague concerning war crimes of the Russian Federation, and Minister of Foreign Affairs of Ukraine Pavlo Klimkin also announced the preparation of memoranda on the convention on the prohibition of racial discrimination and the prohibition of the financing of terrorism.


    More at http://en.interfax.com.ua/news/general/486221.html
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    Post  miketheterrible Mon Feb 19, 2018 7:00 pm

    They won't win. And if they win in court, Russia will ignore it for good reason. These kangaroo courts mean nothing now days. West and Ukraine broke all laws regarding the WTO, so they set themselves up also for large amount of lawsuits.

    Anyway, Russia won't tear down it's bridge because some idiots in another country tell them too.
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    Post  miketheterrible Mon Feb 19, 2018 7:15 pm

    onwiththewar wrote:Guys, what you think about the political developments at Munich and what's going to happen with the "Peace Keepers".

    My understandings:

    The West has lost patience in regarding to what's happening in Ukraine. They wanted land, natural resources, slave labor camp, but nothing is happening so they have changed strategy: 80% of what they asked for is better than nothing. Slaves can't make them money if there is a war going on and as a result, the slaves would have either gone to fighting (either against Donbass or against themselves) or run off to another country.

    They are pushing porky to sell state enterprises ASAP and Russia to accept the "Peace Keepers", so they can rob Ukraine "in peace". At Munich , Porky wished they can join EU and somehow "squeeze" Russia as if Ukraine has some power to do so. The West completely ignored what Porky said, didn't mention a single word if they'll help Porky get the missing pieces of "his country" back. Told him stop dreaming about EU or Nato membership. But told him over and over again about the "economical and anti-corruption reform", which means: "Porky, sell your fvcking country right now and make sure the money won't spill into Ukrainian hands."

    They are sending 30,000 "Peace Keepers" for business.

    Russia, was offered that these 30,000 "Peace Keepers" can be made of people from Belarus, Mongolia, or Greece (somewhat considered a Nato country that's "friendly" to Russia). Germany used the Nord Stream II project to blackmail Russia to say "yes" (Nord Stream II fvcks up Poland, but Poland is just another slave labor camp so who gives a fvck).

    Russia, obviously has loosened up this time. Peskov said the you can talk to Zakharchenko about "Peace Keepers". In other words, Russia has given a soft "yes".

    I think some guys from Germany and Norway are talking to Zakharchenko right now.

    My personal view is this time, "Peace Keepers" are very likely to land. Unless Russia is going to make Zakharchenko say no. But doing so will cost Nord Stream II, which is too much to lose.

    Peskov doesn't give green light to anything. His remarks are as simple as they come: it's up to the leadership of Novorussia what they will agree with or not.

    This has also been said multiple of times, that it's up to Zakharchenko. As Russia also stated in the past, Russia isn't even on the Minsk accords. They are not mentioned. Russia doesn't have the full say in this ordeal. They will protect and follow what DNR/LNR want in the end. But they are the ones who make the demands.

    So in other words it's a "don't ask us, ask them".

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