The point I was making is that it is a game and cannot actually be real... most information about Subs is top secret... every ones subs...
Data is only estimated and real systems are assumed.
I remember when the west found out the T-62s gun was a smooth bore and they went on an on about how such a weapon would be inaccurate to the point of being useless... yet today smooth bore tank guns are standard...
The main tank killing rounds a tank gun fires do not benefit from spin stabilisation... APFSDS rounds need fins because they are too long and narrow to spin stabilise (for the same reason a dart and an arrow use feather stabilisers rather than spin stabilisation), while HEAT rounds lose penetration performance if spun rapidly...
I'm pretty sure the soviets/Russians know the acoustic signature of a Captor mine so they can differentiate targets and see what is Actively targeting them and what is not.
Sorry, what?
When they get an active ping how do they tell what has pinged them?
Are you saying Captor mines have a sonar with a unique ping sound signal that is different from any other sonar?
I mean you can stay still but do not forget that the Designers of these torpedoes made the seekers with Decoys (Passive, Noisemakers, Not sure about using active decoy torpedoes) in mind hence most modern torpedoes (ADCAPs, SAET-80s, Fizik, etc) have some sort of re-attack logic so its highly NOT recommended to just stay in the vicinity of a decoy, besides, if the enemy has already tracked you (Discovered and triangulated you), staying silent would be pointless... it be better to quickly relocate, break track and then stay silent....
Ask the crew of the Stingray about reattack logic for torpedoes... but most don't arm if they turn more than 180 degrees... it is a safety feature.
Are you trying to say that the best way to hide from an active sonar equipped torpedo is to make noise and move?
The enemy has not already tracked you... in the scenario we were talking about they detected a torpedo launch... like I said before it would make more sense to sit just above a salinity layer and launch a torpedo and then drop a few hundred metres below one or more salinity layers while sending initial commands to the torpedo you just launched (via command wire)... then very slowly turn and leave the area listening for results and threats... the target you just launched a torpedo at is not the only threat in the ocean...
Not to mention, most trained Sonar operators of competent Navies isn't going to be fooled by passive decoys... Active maybe but it depends on the operator's wits... this is why from what i heard, you'd prefer to not break the wire of your torpedo as you can Command Guide your torpedo through the decoys if applicable but not easy to do that either....
But how can they take such care with their attack... should they not be trying to evade the torpedo you fired at them in the first place?
Why is it they can ignore your weapon but you have to immediately run and hide from theirs?
Assuming there is a thermocline for one... and the usual ranges of torpedo activation from your sub isn't large enough for an effective shadow zone to appear to break lock so.... I mean hopefully you'd break it but i doubt the chances of breaking lock would be high....
Assuming what, you think it would be an accident that I would launch a torpedo at you and whoops, hey there is a salinity layer for me to hide behind here... or a Taiwanese fishing boat, or large container ship. It is called tactics and planning... things you do before initiating an attack.
I doubt NATO would allow civilian vessels anywhere within a 50 KM radius of the battle groups in War time conditions (Especially after Russia made Club Missiles hidden in Civilian containers)....
Some locations they likely will, like in the Falklands war there was an exclusion zone, but sometimes main trade routes might not make that an option.
But then you'd need someway to waterproof the Verba...
Most similar naval weapons are at least salt protected... making them water proof would not be that big a deal... once on the surface pop the end cap off the end and point at the target and launch. The diver already has a mask.
A floating platform the size of an office desk could have a hemispherical IIR sensor with a staring focal array already used on aircraft to detect missile launches to detect heat sources in the air above the water. This could easily be used to launch missiles.
The Soviets had a mine that used an acoustic sensor that was mounted in trees at the end of NATO runways... as long as the noise of the aircraft got louder and louder the system would do nothing... when it started to get quieter the missile was launched at the air target... it used SA-14 missiles.
Imagine the aircraft was a bomber taking off with a nuclear bomb on board...
A more sophisticated model for naval use would be easy.
The platform could be a powered UUV.
Self contained with sensors and missiles, or just sensors with the missiles being launched from the sub.
Not something you can track without going to Periscope depth and deploying the radar mast (whilst Underwater because Underwater SAM so no need to surface) so you'd still be very vulnerable to Depth charge attacks or Torpedo attacks if the timing is bad (the aircraft so happen to be heading your direction when you reach Periscope depth or something, it becomes a question of who tracks and launches first)... seems like it would still be a gamble....
An unmanned underwater vehicle could be released and surface hundreds or thousands of metres away from the sub it operates from passing data about the air situation back to the sub to release ordinance as needed.
I'm not that well versed in LOAL yet though... I assume its similar to Bearing only launch capability like the S-300s where you just toss a missile to a general direction and altitude and hope its active sensor pics up something? or is it launching the missile, THEN give it tracking data (Like the F-35, SM-6 [LOAL-CEC capability combination] combination?
My understanding of the Morfei is that it will have an IIR seeker and a two way datalink so it can be launched from inside a weapon bay without seeing the target before launch.
It can be launched from a 5th gen fighter or a bomber, and will fly via autopilot in a specific direction where the target is expected to be (via the stealth fighter or bombers own sensors, or self defence suite in the case of anti missile use) The IIR sensor will examine the target and compare its view with an onboard 3D database of IR signatures and acquire the target and engage it. The two way datalink allows it to change targets if a more critical target is detected...
Also would like to see a report about the S-350 and Morfei having LOAL..
S-350 are ARH and simply don't have the radar apeture size to lock on before launch... especially considering they are vertical launched meaning unless the target is directly above the missile battery the chances of a lock on before launch are pretty slim.
As mentioned the Morfei are intended for internal weapon bay use in fighters and new generation bombers as a short range self defence weapon (including against SAMs and AAMs).
Do the Russians even have CEC capabilities presently on their air defense weapon systems?
Hahahahahahaha... you are a really funny guy... thanks for the giggles...
Or are you serious?
MiG-31 launched R-37 missile at target 300km distant that it cannot detect because it is not yet fitted with the Zaslon-M radar. Target detected and tracked by Su-30M with target data used for launch and interception in 1990s.
Tu-95 and Ka-25 variant aircraft used to guide very large anti ship missiles with flight ranges beyond the horizon...
Yes, the Russians have CEC capabilities for all sorts of weapon systems.
I'd understand if its a missile cruising at Mach 3 but against SAM? I'm assuming you're talking tactic used by Fighter pilots in defensive right? but i heard the newer AIM-120Cs/Ds and R-77-1s/77M have significantly higher G limits hence maneuvering Jets would have little effect on their missile evasion?
Why do you think there is a difference for fighter planes and SAMs?
A fighter plane can burn fuel and manouver to a better interception point, but at the end of the day they need to get their missile to hit the threat and they do that by getting their aircraft to the best possible interception point ready to launch a missile... if the incoming threat turns they might find they are not in a good position to launch a missile to intercept.
For a SAM the situation is much much worse because you want to intercept the target as far from your ship as you can, so it wont be close to your ship... meaning the SAM you send up has likely already burned up its fuel and is just manouvering without power... getting it to change position uses up energy that cannot be replaced... a SAM has small control surfaces only effective at high speed... burn up energy and it stalls and falls.
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