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    The Situation in the Ukraine. #17

    franco
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    The Situation in the Ukraine. #17 - Page 10 Empty Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #17

    Post  franco Fri Jul 10, 2015 10:01 pm

    Khepesh wrote:
    PapaDragon wrote:US financial bubble part might be up for debate, but the rest of this historical comparison and analysis is spot on, especially last paragraph.  thumbsup

    Borodino--2015

    http://fortruss.blogspot.com/2015/07/borodino-2015.html
    I think this is a false analogy as Russia is not at war, is not retreating. Rodzhers also conveniently completely misses out the important facts that the Prussian and Austro-Hungarian armies, while technically part of Napoleon's alliance, even after seeing what happened at Borodino never made any attempt to fight on Napoleon's side, and infact the Prussian Army were in collusion with Russian Army. To transpose the analogy of 1812 to 2015 would need a scenario where US forces are attacking Russia but their major battlefield allies in Europe, UK and Germany, were hanging about on the sidelines not taking part.

    Another point is what is Russia supossed to be waiting for? Russia is not about to attack Ukraine, Russia is not at war, Russia has no forces in the combat area. Despite the "northwind", which cannot be proved or disproved, it is DNR and LNR that are at war with Ukraine. While the bombardments are not reported in western MSM, their politicians, no matter now cynical they are, will know the reality, and if VSN do eventually mount a limited operation to try to stop the bombardments, the western politicians will know this to be a fact and not a "Russian invasion" no matter what noises they and their media shout. This issue of the ongoing bombardments is incorrectly inflated with some fantasy about marching on Kiev and so is shouted down as "warmongering" or being to hasty. On this subject of bombardments ukrops and "cunning plan" advocates are hand in hand as both want it ignored. Rodzhers also flails about accusing some of wanting "instant victory", yet I do not see this except in a tiny minority of people who likely have ulterior motive, but it suits his purpose to paint any opposition as rabid dogs, or even rabid raccoons.

    Until today I have had no objection to fortruss, but to see Hawks comments to this article have changed my opinion. He lies about Boris Rozhin and clearly does not want people to read him. He has tried to say that Rozhin originated the article about Polish T-72 being imported into Ukraine, when I know 100% that is was not him, it was dadzi. Hawk then flails about and waffles that if the T-72 article was not by Rozhin, then some other nonsense about T-64 from Bulgaria was his. This is lies and Rozhin certainly knows that Bulgaria does not have any T-64. That Hawk tells deliberate lies and tries to blacken Rozhin shows an agenda and that he is as biased as anybody and his articles should be put under microscope. I do not say fortruss should not be believed, or that all it's articles are wrong, as in fact many are correct, but it should now be seen as part of a concerted effort to tell people what to think.

    Who calls for "instant victory" ? who calls for a march on Kiev in the foreseable future? What is the wait for in terms of limited tactical action by VSN?

    Astute observations thumbsup
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    Post  ExBeobachter1987 Fri Jul 10, 2015 10:27 pm

    auslander wrote:Now isn't this interesting. 03 July publication of Mr. Putin's remarks to the Russian Security council.

    Transcript of Putin's address, from Kremlin.ru, to the Russian Security Council:

    http://fortruss.blogspot.com/2015/07/partners-no-more-its-official-putin.html

    President of Russia Vladimir Putin: "Good afternoon, colleagues,

    Our agenda today includes a range of issues concerning protection of our national interests in the face of the restrictive measures that some countries have imposed on Russia.

    We know the reasons for the pressure being put on Russia. We follow an independent domestic and foreign policy and our sovereignty is not up for sale. This does not go down well in some quarters, but this is inevitable.

    It is clear today that attempts to split and divide our society, play on our problems, and seek out our vulnerable spots and weak links have not produced the results hoped for by those who imposed these restrictive measures on our country and continue to support them.


    Our people, our key political forces, and our business community understand what is happening and know what to do. The timely measures we took have stabilised the economic and financial situation and the labour market and ensured the stable functioning of all strategically important economic sectors. We continue implementing our most important state programmes, including in the social sector.

    Furthermore, our companies, Russia’s producers, have proven that they are capable of developing in tough conditions, finding new partners, and entering new markets at home and abroad. This can be seen in the rapid growth of our agriculture sector.

    Colleagues, recent events show that we cannot hope that some of our geopolitical OPPONENTS........

    Not partners, now opponents.

    I recommend to listen to this discussion between renowned Russia-expert Stephen F. Cohen and John Batchelor. This meeting and its importance are addressed and explained.

    whir wrote:
    ExBeobachter1987 wrote:Kiev has little to gain from a risky new offensive. The status quo suits it far more.
    Then why amass such amount of equipment and manpower along the frontline?

    I can think of several reasons like deterring the NAF and showing that they are doing something.

    Erk wrote:
    ExBeobachter1987 wrote:
    Kiev has little to gain from a risky new offensive. The status quo suits it far more.

    Kiev has little to gain from most of the crazy things it does like censorship, destroying the Ukrainian economy, not paying pensions, workers, but it still does them, Kiev is no strange at doing things that have little gain or even absolute loss.

    What's crazy about that? Censorship is a normal political tool and the rest does not matter if you don't care about it.
    And the ruling elite in Kiev does not. Just like the Russian elites, especially during the 1990s.
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    The Situation in the Ukraine. #17 - Page 10 Empty Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #17

    Post  PapaDragon Fri Jul 10, 2015 11:09 pm

    Monarchist wrote:It's good that "Rusich" left, enough russian nationalists have died so khazars like Plotnitskiy can rule and make money out of the blood of innocent russian children. I hope all russian nationalist volunteers leave Novorussia it's not worth dying for, it's not worth dying so khazars can rule.

    As I have suspected, closeted neo-nazi anti Semite. Would you please PM me your adress so I can call the cops?
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    Post  sepheronx Fri Jul 10, 2015 11:18 pm

    Flagship Victory wrote:Rusich left Donbas in protest of Minsk agreement and unilateral release of Maidan prisoners.

    http://www.interpretermag.com/ukraine-live-day-508-sentsov-and-kolchenko-to-be-detained-for-another-6-months/

    Stop posting that site.
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    Post  sepheronx Fri Jul 10, 2015 11:22 pm

    ExBeobachter1987 wrote:
    Vann7 wrote:here this chart shows US economy is negative in first quarter of 2015..

    I wish the Russian economy was that "bad".

    Russian economy on a whole is real economy, compared to USA. So when even banking gimmicks have failed and their QE has failed to really improve things, then you know a real problem is starting to occur. Russian economy always swings around but at least it is real and there have been no real banking gimmicks and absolutely no QE involved.
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    Post  Cowboy's daughter Sat Jul 11, 2015 1:16 am

    [quote="ExBeobachter1987"]
    auslander wrote:Now isn't this interesting. 03 July publication of Mr. Putin's remarks to the Russian Security council.

    Transcript of Putin's address, from Kremlin.ru, to the Russian Security Council:

    http://fortruss.blogspot.com/2015/07/partners-no-more-its-official-putin.html

    President of Russia Vladimir Putin: "Good afternoon, colleagues,

    Our agenda today includes a range of issues concerning protection of our national interests in the face of the restrictive measures that some countries have imposed on Russia.

    We know the reasons for the pressure being put on Russia. We follow an independent domestic and foreign policy and our sovereignty is not up for sale. This does not go down well in some quarters, but this is inevitable.

    It is clear today that attempts to split and divide our society, play on our problems, and seek out our vulnerable spots and weak links have not produced the results hoped for by those who imposed these restrictive measures on our country and continue to support them.


    Our people, our key political forces, and our business community understand what is happening and know what to do. The timely measures we took have stabilised the economic and financial situation and the labour market and ensured the stable functioning of all strategically important economic sectors. We continue implementing our most important state programmes, including in the social sector.

    Furthermore, our companies, Russia’s producers, have proven that they are capable of developing in tough conditions, finding new partners, and entering new markets at home and abroad. This can be seen in the rapid growth of our agriculture sector.

    Colleagues, recent events show that we cannot hope that some of our geopolitical OPPONENTS........

    Not partners, now opponents.

    I recommend to listen to this discussion between renowned Russia-expert Stephen F. Cohen and John Batchelor. This meeting and its importance are addressed and explained.

    whir wrote:
    ExBeobachter1987 wrote:Kiev has little to gain from a risky new offensive. The status quo suits it far more.
    Then why amass such amount of equipment and manpower along the frontline?

    I can think of several reasons like deterring the NAF and showing that they are doing something.

    Erk wrote:
    ExBeobachter1987 wrote:
    Kiev has little to gain from a risky new offensive. The status quo suits it far more.

    Kiev has little to gain from most of the crazy things it does like censorship, destroying the Ukrainian economy, not paying pensions, workers, but it still does them, Kiev is no strange at doing things that have little gain or even absolute loss.

    What's crazy about that? Censorship is a normal political tool and the rest does not matter if you don't care about it.
    And the ruling elite in Kiev does not. Just like the Russian elites, especially during the 1990s.[/quote

    Good posts! I'll attempt to listen to the Cohen etc. in the morning when my brain isn't fried. Thank you for posting it. I'll share it.
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    Post  Cowboy's daughter Sat Jul 11, 2015 1:21 am

    Khepesh wrote:"Rusich" returning to Russia and comments made by Enot Corps, who supply them, have caused me to change the timeframe I forecast for war resuming. Instead of late July to early August, I now forecast mid August to mid September. I'm not Nostradamus and am likely totaly wrong because "stuff" happens. So not much plenty of time to take a vacation and stock up on The Situation in the Ukraine. #17 - Page 10 40e134085cf5

    Isn't that the same time many negative things are forecast to be happening in Ukraine?

    There certainly doesn't seem to be much information online (that I can find, & I'm limited in knowledge), but shelling continues.

    Alice Pavlovich ‏@algator2 3h3 hours ago

    Night "truce" in Donetsk. Kievsky district. Footage from the scene. The shelling! 10.07.2015 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kIq8b9Myna4 … via @EgoRZemtsoV
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    Post  Cowboy's daughter Sat Jul 11, 2015 1:35 am


    Is this legit??

    In the 17th Tank Brigade (2nd Battalion) rebellion is brewing!


    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MTQ2ogDKYHo
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    Post  Cowboy's daughter Sat Jul 11, 2015 1:52 am


    I can't think of the other name for "Happiness".
    Oh, okay__
    SHCHASTYA, Ukraine
    Ukrainians control it???

    I was trying to figure out if the soldier in the beginning of the film, wearing shoes and not boots, was Ukrainian, and I guess he is.
    You can see him out the bus window.

    Happiness - the exchange of prisoners of war. LC "10 to 10"


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    Post  Cowboy's daughter Sat Jul 11, 2015 2:04 am

    Ситуация Новороссии ‏@EgoRZemtsoV Jul 9

    Украинская армия:

    Ukrainian Army

    The Situation in the Ukraine. #17 - Page 10 CJeP_J6UkAAKmFp

    The Situation in the Ukraine. #17 - Page 10 CJeP-CvVEAEblv8
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    Post  sepheronx Sat Jul 11, 2015 2:34 am

    Cowboy's daughter wrote:
    Is this legit??

    In the 17th Tank Brigade (2nd Battalion) rebellion is brewing!


    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MTQ2ogDKYHo

    A Ukrainian tank brigade rebelling? That would be interesting.
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    Post  Cowboy's daughter Sat Jul 11, 2015 3:42 am

    sepheronx wrote:
    Cowboy's daughter wrote:
    Is this legit??

    In the 17th Tank Brigade (2nd Battalion) rebellion is brewing!


    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MTQ2ogDKYHo

    A Ukrainian tank brigade rebelling?  That would be interesting.

    sepheronx, I'm beginning to think that the Ukraine Armed forces are like streets in small towns in Texas: main street looks great, but get off of main street and the potholes will jar your teeth out. Shocked
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    Post  whir Sat Jul 11, 2015 6:24 am

    ExBeobachter1987 wrote:I can think of several reasons like deterring the NAF and showing that they are doing something.
    Peonies aren't needed to arrange the smuggling bucket for maximum profit.
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    Post  Neutrality Sat Jul 11, 2015 9:41 am

    Cowboy's daughter wrote:
    I can't think of the other name for "Happiness".
    Oh, okay__
    SHCHASTYA, Ukraine
    Ukrainians control it???

    I was trying to figure out if the soldier in the beginning of the film, wearing shoes and not boots, was Ukrainian, and I guess he is.
    You can see him out the bus window.

    Happiness - the exchange of prisoners of war. LC "10 to 10"



    Watched the same video on News-Front yesterday. What the fuck is that Georgian official doing over there? So not only do they have their own mayor, they are also in charge of exchange of PoWs? What a fucking disgrace. Just as I thought the Ukrainian military couldn't go any lower.
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    Post  franco Sat Jul 11, 2015 10:58 am

    sepheronx wrote:
    Cowboy's daughter wrote:
    Is this legit??

    In the 17th Tank Brigade (2nd Battalion) rebellion is brewing!


    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MTQ2ogDKYHo

    A Ukrainian tank brigade rebelling?  That would be interesting.

    Protesting is more like it but as per our conversation on the NAF. How well do you think these guys are going to fight?
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    Post  PapaDragon Sat Jul 11, 2015 11:05 am

    sepheronx wrote:
    Cowboy's daughter wrote:
    Is this legit??

    In the 17th Tank Brigade (2nd Battalion) rebellion is brewing!


    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MTQ2ogDKYHo

    A Ukrainian tank brigade rebelling?  That would be interesting.

    Once SBU and Azov give them good old ass-rape these clowns will quickly go back to being obedient little female K9s... lol1
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    Post  Regular Sat Jul 11, 2015 11:56 am

    PapaDragon wrote:
    sepheronx wrote:
    Cowboy's daughter wrote:
    Is this legit??

    In the 17th Tank Brigade (2nd Battalion) rebellion is brewing!


    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MTQ2ogDKYHo

    A Ukrainian tank brigade rebelling?  That would be interesting.

    Once SBU and Azov give them good old ass-rape these clowns will quickly go back to being obedient little female K9s... lol1  

    There is already much hate between volunteers and army. I know UA is mostly to blame for civilian deaths thanks to their incompetency, but I will be cheering for them when they will turn on Kiev.
    But You are right about SBU. They were ruthless with Januk in power, and they are ruthless now. KGB type guys. Tho very bad at making propaganda material.
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    Post  Cowboy's daughter Sat Jul 11, 2015 12:32 pm

    Neutrality wrote:
    Cowboy's daughter wrote:
    I can't think of the other name for "Happiness".
    Oh, okay__
    SHCHASTYA, Ukraine
    Ukrainians control it???

    I was trying to figure out if the soldier in the beginning of the film, wearing shoes and not boots, was Ukrainian, and I guess he is.
    You can see him out the bus window.

    Happiness - the exchange of prisoners of war. LC "10 to 10"



    Watched the same video on News-Front yesterday. What the fuck is that Georgian official doing over there? So not only do they have their own mayor, they are also in charge of exchange of PoWs? What a fucking disgrace. Just as I thought the Ukrainian military couldn't go any lower.

    I wondered who that guy was!!!
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    Post  higurashihougi Sat Jul 11, 2015 12:44 pm

    sepheronx wrote:http://sputniknews.com/europe/20150707/1024337315.html

    Oh great. Yeah, no Nazi's.

    Sorry to dig up old posts but I happenned to see the original article

    http://www.svoboda.org/content/article/27105785.html

    GG translate is bullshit so could you help me see whether that man really want to eradicate all Russian elements in Ukraine or not ?

    @min mod: if it has been posted somewhere before, I am sorry and please delete my post.
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    Post  flamming_python Sat Jul 11, 2015 12:46 pm

    Regular wrote:
    PapaDragon wrote:
    sepheronx wrote:
    Cowboy's daughter wrote:
    Is this legit??

    In the 17th Tank Brigade (2nd Battalion) rebellion is brewing!


    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MTQ2ogDKYHo

    A Ukrainian tank brigade rebelling?  That would be interesting.

    Once SBU and Azov give them good old ass-rape these clowns will quickly go back to being obedient little female K9s... lol1  

    There is already much hate between volunteers and army. I know UA is mostly to blame for civilian deaths thanks to their incompetency, but I will be cheering for them when they will turn on Kiev.
    But You are right about SBU. They were ruthless with Januk in power, and they are ruthless now. KGB type guys. Tho very bad at making propaganda material.

    Yeah, incompetency - these orcs just shell the city at random. No targets in particular; or even if there are - they could care less about the accuracy; just levelling entire towns and villages; shelling Donetsk and Lugansk day & night.

    Nothing to do with incompetency; they know what they're doing.

    Hope Pravyj Sektor makes an example out of them - and Pravyj Sektor can be dealt with later by hanging at high dawn.
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    Post  Werewolf Sat Jul 11, 2015 12:49 pm

    Of course they know what they are doing. They have done it on purpose with the goal to kill civilians. This strategy was made by US, to provocate Russia to get its forces into ukraine so they could achieve their goal to drag russia into a decade+ long war with its own people, while showing the entire world that russia is the aggressor, right now the only thing they can do is pull crap out of their arses to try and attempt to portray russia as some empire that wants to claw everything.
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    Post  Cowboy's daughter Sat Jul 11, 2015 12:54 pm

    Video on Liveleak

    Graphic, NSFW

    Killing of three postal in Kharkiv

    Added: 21 hours ago Occurred On: Jul-10-2015
    Read more at http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=af8_1436540694#hHumkCeFtTerD237.99


    comments:

    That former country , now washington's colony , is like Wild West 200 years ago , anarchy , complete absence of law , shooting , killings on daily bases . Poor post man , delivering mail and from the story , pension pay to old people get killed for pity money by Chechen scum (probably Azov or Right Sector members on their day off )


    Yap. Windshield pierced by a half-dozen rounds followed by blasts to the side glass. When the wounded crawled out, they were summarily finished off and left where they lay. Classic hit.


    Background story:
    (translated in English)

    https://z5h64q92x9.net/proxy_u/uk-en.en/112.ua/statji/v-harkove-rasstrelyali-troih-sotrudnikov-pochty-poslednyaya-informaciya-243800.html

    Comments:
    Two robbers as it seems, one stayed in the car, the other killed the three postmen. I wouldn't be surprised if the robbers are rightwing ex-ATO fighters.


    Killing 3 hard working guys, stealing soldiers pay,

    What were postal workers doing carrying $113,000?

    1) It's 2.5 million in the local currency.
    2) I don't beleive postal service would carry 115.000 USD without any security. I don't belieive they carried any money. There was something else in that car which was worth shooting them for.
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    Post  Cowboy's daughter Sat Jul 11, 2015 1:00 pm

    Chechen Gunmen Kill Three Postal Workers Steal $2.5m Hryvnas in Kharkov


    A spokesman from the Ukrainian SBU has stated that Chechen gunman from an armed wing of the Imarat Kavkaz have killed three postal workers that were transporting $2.5m Hryvnas worth of soldiers pay and pensions in the Russian speaking city of Kharkov.

    http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=673_1436535955
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    Post  Cowboy's daughter Sat Jul 11, 2015 1:18 pm

    Good Lord, they marched for an hour on July 3? None of this stuff makes any news.
    ..haven't watched it yet...


    US Allies- Full Version Right Sector Fascist Nazi March Through Kiev - July 3, 2015

    http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=07e_1436507393

    Full one hour and seven minute video of Right Sector march through Kiev on July 3rd, 2015. Happy 4th of July USA. This is who your country has chosen as a dance partner.

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    Post  whir Sat Jul 11, 2015 1:33 pm

    Cowboy's daughter wrote:What were postal workers doing carrying $113,000?
    1) It's 2.5 million in the local currency.
    2) I don't beleive postal service would carry 115.000 USD without any security. I don't belieive they carried any money. There was something else in that car which was worth shooting them for.
    In a lot of countries post offices are used as payment offices by many business and institutions with financial problems that need an alternative to conventional banks so it's not that far fetched. This type of payment generally comes as individual envelopes containing a small amount of money in form of bills that look and are transported like conventional mail to simplify the process so obviously robbers had to know in advance when and where the money was going to be delivered because once the envelopes are shorted out it's nearly impossible to steal them among all the ordinary mail and parcels.

    Sponsored content


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