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    Iran Air Force (IRIAF) | News and Discussions

    Backman
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    Post  Backman Fri May 27, 2022 4:18 am

    Just when it looks like Russia Israel relations are breaking down for real , they patch it up.

    Israel vetoed sending anti tank mines to Ukraine.

    I wouldn't say that relations with the Jews is the only thing standing between Russia and Iran making deals. Iran just hasn't made an offer that is worth risking relations with Israel.

    Irans govt is stubborn af. Russia would probably give them a sweet deal on Mig 35's to get things going. But nope.
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    Post  GarryB Fri May 27, 2022 5:32 am

    Anti tank mines?

    The story I read it was Spike ATGMs...

    Part of the problem with Iran and Russian relations is that they are not the west so they don't automatically assume the enemy of my enemy is my friend.

    There were Iranian factions in Afghanistan fighting the Soviet occupation in the 1980s and lots of other incidents where relations would be strained... they have never been best buddies even if current conditions lead them to both rejecting the west primarily because the west is only screwing with them and wont accept them as an equal and neither are interested in being the wests bitch like the UK and France and other pretend countries are.

    With that AN-140 copy... I hope the engines are not made by Motor Sich...
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    Post  Werewolf Fri May 27, 2022 10:41 am

    Backman wrote:Just when it looks like Russia Israel relations are breaking down for real , they patch it up.

    Israel vetoed sending anti tank mines to Ukraine.

    I wouldn't say that relations with the Jews is the only thing standing between Russia and Iran making deals. Iran just hasn't made an offer that is worth risking relations with Israel.

    Irans govt is stubborn af. Russia would probably give them a sweet deal on Mig 35's to get things going. But nope.

    What can any nation gain from having any relationships with Israel?

    The only one who gains anything is Israel, as it can not sustain itself without input from financial or brain capacity from countries like Russia, US, Germany and a huge list of more countries.

    Any kind of technology Israel has or has developed is direct engineering know-how from Soviet/Russian education system or from the US.

    There is no gain for any country having relationships with this National Socialistic state that sets itself up above every other nation and continues its lies about Iran finishing tomorrow its nuclear weapon and whipping out all of Israel, which this clowns have told every single day since 40 years.

    Embargo those fuckers and put high fees on export goods if they are going through other countries. Dry them up so they stfu for once. No more nice guys with Nazi nations.

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    Post  d_taddei2 Fri May 27, 2022 11:33 am

    Read an article today stating Russian S-300 in Syria fired at Israeli missiles as a warning that their patience is running thin.

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    Post  Mig-31BM2 Super Irbis-E Mon May 30, 2022 10:57 am

    Iran Air Force (IRIAF) | News and Discussions - Page 12 Hokjn
    Iran Air Force (IRIAF) | News and Discussions - Page 12 Hokjn
    Iran Air Force (IRIAF) | News and Discussions - Page 12 0ok4i
    An-140 to Simorgh
    The first Transport Version from An-140!

    PS: Backside with Radar Random?

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    Post  Backman Tue May 31, 2022 4:54 am

    GarryB wrote:Anti tank mines?

    The story I read it was Spike ATGMs...

    Part of the problem with Iran and Russian relations is that they are not the west so they don't automatically assume the enemy of my enemy is my friend.

    There were Iranian factions in Afghanistan fighting the Soviet occupation in the 1980s and lots of other incidents where relations would be strained... they have never been best buddies even if current conditions lead them to both rejecting the west primarily because the west is only screwing with them and wont accept them as an equal and neither are interested in being the wests bitch like the UK and France and other pretend countries are.

    With that AN-140 copy... I hope the engines are not made by Motor Sich...

    Iran also sent fighters to Serbia in the 1990's.

    This AN-140 is all a collaboration/copy with Ukraine.  Which means Iran was more willing to do business with Ukraine than Russia. That does it for Iran. Let them rot

    Half of the fuselage, wings and a number of other components and parts were made in Kharkiv, and only its assembly and conversion from a passenger plane to a light transport aircraft was carried out by HESA engineers.

    https://myukraineis.org/news/a_prototype_of_the_simorgh_an_140_military_transport_aircraft_was_shown_in_iran-342.html
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    Post  lancelot Tue May 31, 2022 5:18 am

    Backman wrote:Iran also sent fighters to Serbia in the 1990's.
    This AN-140 is all a collaboration/copy with Ukraine.  Which means Iran was more willing to do business with Ukraine than Russia. That does it for Iran. Let them rot
    A lot of countries had relations with Ukraine's industry. They were willing to provide technical assistance back then that no one else would and for real cheap. That is where the North Koreans got their rocket engines for their ICBM with range to hit the US for example. Ukraine. China got technical assistance from Antonov to design the wings of the CR919 and Y-20. Heck even Belarus co-designed the Shershen ATGM with them. Most of this predates 2014 of course. Because do you think the US would allow these programs to continue? After the US sponsored coup in 2014 they had to break most of these contracts and tried to negotiate new contracts with US aligned countries like Turkey or Israel.

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    Post  sepheronx Tue May 31, 2022 5:23 am

    lancelot wrote:
    Backman wrote:Iran also sent fighters to Serbia in the 1990's.
    This AN-140 is all a collaboration/copy with Ukraine.  Which means Iran was more willing to do business with Ukraine than Russia. That does it for Iran. Let them rot
    A lot of countries had relations with Ukraine's industry. They were willing to provide technical assistance back then that no one else would and for real cheap. That is where the North Koreans got their rocket engines for their ICBM with range to hit the US for example. Ukraine. China got technical assistance from Antonov to design the wings of the CR919 and Y-20. Heck even Belarus co-designed the Shershen ATGM with them. Most of this predates 2014 of course. Because do you think the US would allow these programs to continue? After the US sponsored coup in 2014 they had to break most of these contracts and tried to negotiate new contracts with US aligned countries like Turkey or Israel.

    Al Khalid is technically a T-80 much like China's MBT-2000
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    Post  lancelot Tue May 31, 2022 5:31 am

    sepheronx wrote:Al Khalid is technically a T-80 much like China's MBT-2000
    Not really. Al Khalid is basically a Type 90 tank with the Ukrainian diesel engine from the T-80UD. Plus some Western tech. It is a mishmash built for Pakistan. The Pakistanis didn't like the tank all that much, and Ukraine was not a reliable supplier especially after 2014, so Pakistan is now building the Chinese VT-4 tank out of kits to replace it.

    I personally think Iran should have just bought the Su-30. Perhaps even license produce it to the extent they can.

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    Post  GarryB Tue May 31, 2022 8:45 am

    Which means Iran was more willing to do business with Ukraine than Russia. That does it for Iran. Let them rot

    I would say Ukraine was desperate for business and offered the best possible terms, so why not take the offer from an Iranian perspective.

    Of course now that relationship is a bit problematic... but there was nothing Ukraine could offer than Russia or China can't step in and offer as a replacement before too much is set in stone.

    PS: Backside with Radar Random?

    Not necessarily an actual radar... more likely antenna and communications equipment under radome fairings (radar transparent material).

    I personally think Iran should have just bought the Su-30. Perhaps even license produce it to the extent they can.

    Yeah, being biased myself I think they could get a licence to produce Su-30s to replace their F-14s and licence production of MiG-29Ms would be a good platform to replace their F-4s and upgrade their existing MiG-29s to.

    The MiG-29Ms are cheap enough to fly they could probably drop plans of making F-5 copies and just make a large fleet of MiG-29Ms... and perhaps make some extra for Syria and Iraq maybe if they are interested.

    India does not seem interested in buying new MiGs so why not licence produce them in Iran for Pakistan too... would be orders of magnitude better than upgraded MiG-21s...

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    Post  nomadski Tue May 31, 2022 9:21 am


    https://en.mehrnews.com/news/186799/Crisis-in-Ukraine-and-Iran-national-interests


    At the time , when cooperation with Ukraine was done , the war was not an issue . I read some Iranian Aircraft technicians say " ...why should we be anti-Ukrainian , they showed us how to repair aircraft , " this shows Iranians are not anti-ukrainian , but recent events also show that Iranians , through historical experience of relative isolation from Europe and not a participant or victim of Nazism , do not have the correct anti - Nazi stance , as is necessary now . It is not enough to say " ..we want peace between Russia and Ukraine , " and sit on the fence of neutrality . It is necessary to condemn explicitly this Nazism . I , through my family experience of having one of my uncles fight Nazis in WW2 and being commented positively by Zhukov , and another who helped the allied Russian troops in Iran , during WW2 , to transport supplies from Americans from Persian Gulf , and also because I live in Europe , where I met Ukrainian Nazi collaborators refugees , have a different perspective . This article shows that Iran has mostly the correct path with regard to Ukraine .

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    Post  Backman Tue May 31, 2022 9:46 pm

    GarryB wrote:
    Which means Iran was more willing to do business with Ukraine than Russia. That does it for Iran. Let them rot

    I would say Ukraine was desperate for business and offered the best possible terms, so why not take the offer from an Iranian perspective.

    Of course now that relationship is a bit problematic... but there was nothing Ukraine could offer than Russia or China can't step in and offer as a replacement before too much is set in stone.

    PS: Backside with Radar Random?

    Not necessarily an actual radar... more likely antenna and communications equipment under radome fairings (radar transparent material).

    I personally think Iran should have just bought the Su-30. Perhaps even license produce it to the extent they can.

    Yeah, being biased myself I think they could get a licence to produce Su-30s to replace their F-14s and licence production of MiG-29Ms would be a good platform to replace their F-4s and upgrade their existing MiG-29s to.

    The MiG-29Ms are cheap enough to fly they could probably drop plans of making F-5 copies and just make a large fleet of MiG-29Ms... and perhaps make some extra for Syria and Iraq maybe if they are interested.

    India does not seem interested in buying new MiGs so why not licence produce them in Iran for Pakistan too... would be orders of magnitude better than upgraded MiG-21s...

    Iran building F-5's is cringe. What did Russia do to Iran to make them choose the US over Russia even while the US's boot is on their neck. They should build/repair Mig 29's

    Russia bombed the Mig 29 repair plant that was housing some foreign jets. Azerbaijan had some Mig 29's there that got destroyed. Maybe some of Irans were in there too.

    Some countries like this used Ukraine to avoid dealing with Russia. Ukraine was always more neutral and anonymous. They had lower prices too as you say. I think Russia should close this loophole and have a monopoly on all Soviet era sales and service with Belarus and the new republics. Which is another reason to take Motor Sich by force.




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    Post  GarryB Wed Jun 01, 2022 8:33 am

    Iran building F-5's is cringe. What did Russia do to Iran to make them choose the US over Russia even while the US's boot is on their neck.

    Western equipment is what the Shah bought and paid for so it is what they know... essentially it is their equipment... the equipment bought and paid for top dollar I might add... Iran also paid the UK to build them a modern state of the art tank... the UK built the Challenger series but didn't deliver any to Iran because of the fall of the Shah.

    Ironic really because Brits think of the Challenger tank is being all British but was paid for by Iran....

    The point is that if the British had delivered the tank and fully set up production in Russia then that would be Irans tank currently most likely, though possibly with a Chinese 120mm smoothbore gun or something similar.

    The F-5 is the aircraft they are familiar with and have access to, so of course any new light plane design will use its design as a base... so much less risk for a country with no history of aircraft design... it wont be a super plane but it will be something they could make and use themselves... which is more valuable.

    It is not enough to say " ..we want peace between Russia and Ukraine , " and sit on the fence of neutrality . It is necessary to condemn explicitly this Nazism .

    I don't think they will shift views on Nazis so easily... you mention Baba Yaga to a US teenager with no Russian family and they will think they make cartoons or something... Nazis didn't invade Iran... but Russia occupied them during WWII didn't they?

    Once the political reality that the Kiev regime is not going to exist as it currently is and most of their industry will be destroyed in this conflict and Russia pretty much gets to decide what gets rebuilt in most of the Ukraine will lead to Iran realising that getting engines and other bits and bobs will make more sense from Russia or China than unreliable Ukraine with a leash around its neck...

    Interesting family history you have there BTW.

    Some countries like this used Ukraine to avoid dealing with Russia. Ukraine was always more neutral and anonymous. They had lower prices too as you say. I think Russia should close this loophole and have a monopoly on all Soviet era sales and service with Belarus and the new republics. Which is another reason to take Motor Sich by force.

    Lets face it.... any working business like Motor Sich or Salyut will be currently used to make weapons or fix weapons etc etc and should be destroyed outright.

    Ukraine did offer lower prices because once they got your plane for support they could strip good parts and replace them with cheap knockoffs and eventually sell you your own good parts back to you when the knockoffs fail and claim it was shoddy Russian parts that need replacing with good Ukrainian parts that will be the original parts in the first place.

    They could barely keep their own MiG-29s in the air and are only doing so now because Eastern Europe has essentially send them all their stuff and all their spares and support equipment too no doubt... the US has been demanding the get rid of that for years and buy old F-16s or new F-35s... so now they can send them worn out old F-16s and milk them for very expensive parts and service contracts to keep them in the air...
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    Post  Tolstoy Wed Jun 01, 2022 10:18 am

    GarryB wrote:India does not seem interested in buying new MiGs so why not licence produce them in Iran for Pakistan too... would be orders of magnitude better than upgraded MiG-21s...
    Instead, ship the Mig-29s from Russia to Pakistan directly. Cost of producing a Mig-29 in Iran is going to be a lot more than producing it in Russia.
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    Post  Hole Tue Dec 20, 2022 5:43 pm

    Iran is considering the purchase of 64 multipurpose combat aircraft gen. 4++ Su-35SE. The assumption is that the contract is equivalent to about 5 billion US dollars.
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    Post  Isos Tue Dec 20, 2022 6:03 pm

    It would be just the first batch. 24 are already ready to go and they already speculate they are being trained to fly them. Thrir need are more in the 96 heavy su-35.

    Iran need to replace all its fighters. Not only are they old but also they lack spare parts for aln of them even if they produce some parts locally. They are also outdated. Mig-29 were easy targets for NATO in the 1999. Mirge f1 are useless piece of crap. F-14 is a US jet that is 3 generation under f-22 and f-35. Su-24 are good but they have no cover from the fighters so they would also be targets.

    Iran will also need a lighter aircraft. Jf-17 is the very likely solution but j-11 has a chance to since it uses al-31 engine which is the same family as su-35's engine and is not from Pakistan but 100% chinese. Their need for such aircraft is at least 140.

    Too bad sukhoi didn't create the su-75 Checkmate before. Mig again will see a potential client go buy from others because they were dumb enough to not create a single engine semi-stealthy mig-35 instead of just rebrending the mig-29Minto mig-35.
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    Post  GarryB Wed Dec 21, 2022 4:29 am

    MiG have plenty of experience with light single engined fighters... they might be cheaper in some respects, but overall there are extra costs when an engine fails or is damaged.

    The MiG-35 is cheaper to buy but also significantly cheaper to operate than the Su-35... that is the reason the Russian military bought some for testing, but obviously with the timing they might go for a 5th gen light aircraft instead, at this time no one can say what they will go for till they actually decide... Sukhoi have made it clear that the Su-75 has not been ordered by the Russian military and it is aimed at export customers at the moment... obviously the Russian AF will look at it, but as I said before we have only seen a model of MiGs equivalent 5th gen option, and there is a deck based light aircraft to consider too, of which we have seen the MiG model for that.

    Which means MiG has four options... the twin engined model for deck carrier, and for MiG-35 replacement, and single engined light fighter for deck carrier and MiG-35 replacement.

    I actually think the risk of domination of aircraft production domestically will count against the Checkmate, which actually looks rather like a MiG design called article 35... in one of its model variants.

    Aerodynamically there is nothing at all wrong with the MiG-29 which is why the MiG-35 is not that much different externally, the MiG-35 was designed to operate as the light fighter to the Su-35 heavy long range fighter in a combination.

    I really don't think the Jf-17 would be better than the MiG-35 in the light fighter role, the extra engine type is not a problem... they are getting rid of F-5s and F-4s and F-14s, and they already use MiG-29s so it is not even introducing a new engine.

    MiG is under rather more pressure than Sukhoi so local production of parts is rather more likely with the MiG.

    Mig again will see a potential client go buy from others because they were dumb enough to not create a single engine semi-stealthy mig-35 instead of just rebrending the mig-29Minto mig-35.

    As I mentioned above, the Russian military, which are their primary customer, rejected single engined fighters quite some time ago, but even then they have twin and single engined models as shown by the models they displayed at MAKS2021.
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    Post  Isos Wed Dec 21, 2022 3:41 pm

    Mig-35 is a dead project. RuAF bought it in hope to push foreign clients to buy it if they see russian air force considering it. They will never order it. And don't say they are testing it because the aircraft is just a mig-29SMT in a new build body. They already know it. Aesa radar isn't fitted in them. There is nothing new to test.

    Jf-17 isn't better but is a ready design and chinese now offer a far wider range of weapon for them than russians offer for any of their aircraft. Specially for ground attack missiles and glinding bomb as well as precision guided bombs. They also offer a wider range of EO pods. Pl-15 is also much more attractive than the shitty r-77/rvv-ae. Rvv-sd being bought by no one which suggested they are not giving it for export. Russia new weapons have been showed only as models and don't seem to be produced. Even the kh-38 doesn't seem to be produced let alone gliding bombs which are a must have for modern forces.

    Chinese production rate is also higher than russia's and their prices are also less fix...
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    Post  GarryB Thu Dec 22, 2022 3:40 am

    Mig-35 is a dead project.

    You are entitled to your opinion, but I don't agree.

    The Su-35/30 and Su-57 are simply too expensive to buy and to operate to have as your only fighter aircraft... you need a smaller cheaper numbers aircraft, which was the intent and purpose of the MiG-35, and it is also the intent and purpose of the Checkmate and the F-35, although the F-35 was a terrible example that went in the opposite direction because of corruption and politics.

    RuAF bought it in hope to push foreign clients to buy it if they see russian air force considering it. They will never order it.

    Of course they are going to order it, they have ordered some, there are plenty of operations any air force needs to perform that don't require Su-35 or Su-57 level performance or cost, for which a MiG-35 is just fine... flying around with long range AAMs or lots of short range missiles... a MiG-35 can do that cheaper and easier than an Su-35 can... the MiG can carry pretty much all the same weapons and equipment, in a smaller lighter cheaper platform.

    And don't say they are testing it because the aircraft is just a mig-29SMT in a new build body. They already know it. Aesa radar isn't fitted in them. There is nothing new to test.

    All the avionics are upgraded and different, they will test the AESA radar when it is ready for service... if they are going that way... for all we know they might think newer technologies might make more sense and the MiG-35 is a stopgap while they get their 5th gen light fighter ready for testing...

    We really don't know if a 5th gen light fighter that is cheap to operate is even possible... obviously Sukhoi make claims but they are going to claim such things are they not?

    IMHO the light fighter should not be as light as possible... the Gripen shows if you make it too light it is not so capable and you need two or three of them to get the job done... which means you would be better with a single heavy fighter doing the job instead.

    The waters are also muddied by the S-70 type drones that could also be used to add numbers to an air force.

    Jf-17 isn't better but is a ready design and chinese now offer a far wider range of weapon for them than russians offer for any of their aircraft.

    For Iran, surely a better design with twin engines offers much better growth potential if needed, and I am not sure where you got the idea that China has a wider range of weapons for them.... they generally have domestic stuff, which is a small group, the copied Russian and Soviet stuff, which is not complete, and the copied western stuff... the copied stuff is generally not as good as the stuff it is copied from, so perhaps they do have a wider range of weapons, but how many of those weapons are useful?

    Having an enormous range of weapons just complicates your logistics and planning for missions... having 20 different types of unguided rocket pod is not much use unless you want a flight of 20 planes each carrying one type each and even then what sort of advantage would that be in the real world?

    Specially for ground attack missiles and glinding bomb as well as precision guided bombs.

    The Russians have an enormous range of air to ground bombs and missiles...

    They also offer a wider range of EO pods.

    For Iran that is no advantage... they are not so rich as to be able to buy them all, so they will likely try them all and select one or perhaps two for one or two specific roles...

    Pl-15 is also much more attractive than the shitty r-77/rvv-ae. Rvv-sd being bought by no one which suggested they are not giving it for export. Russia new weapons have been showed only as models and don't seem to be produced.

    Russian weapons are being used in combat in Syria and Ukraine and seem to be doing the job they were designed for... can you say the same about Chinese weapons?

    Even the kh-38 doesn't seem to be produced let alone gliding bombs which are a must have for modern forces.

    Seem... you are basing your opinion on an assumption.

    Chinese production rate is also higher than russia's and their prices are also less fix...

    Completely untested... how often do all those ships go to sea?

    China sends troops to its Indian border but does not seem keen to use its stealthy planes...

    And how many tactical weapons are they producing... and what are they doing with them all?
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    Post  Isos Thu Dec 22, 2022 10:02 am

    Well we agree they need a light aircraft. Mig-35 is just a smaller su-35. I don't consider it as a light aircraft frankly. Single engine and light weight is what makes me consider it a light aircraft. And a light aircraft isn't suppose to do as much as a large aircraft, keep in mind it has less load and smaller legs.

    That's the deal: do less but what you can do do it cheaper than bigger aircraft.

    And seeing indians getting ride of their mig-29k which is using all the systems a mig-35 use isn't a good sign for the mig family.

    Russia order it sope for testing but they still lack the AESA. Without the aesa it is just the same aircraft with fancier screens as their mig-29SMT that they wabt to replace with sukhois. They will order for their aerobatic teams and that's it.

    Iran is facing a bigger problem than Russia. It is a big country like Russia but it has much mlre enemies on its borders that are very well armed... On every sides. They need a big airforce and they can't use just the su-35 nor do they have money for it. Jf-17 or j-10 is an obligation for them.

    Russia isn't producing or using that much new air to ground weapons. Some guided kab 500/1500 and that's it. They don't even produce  gliding bombs, neither do they produce guidnace kits for dumb bombs. China has any of this that they copied from the west. Yeh they are copies and may be of lower quality but if they work I see no problem.

    5 guided 100kg bombs can take out much more than a single unguided 500kg bomb. Russia lacks such weapons.
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    Post  GarryB Thu Dec 22, 2022 1:07 pm

    Well we agree they need a light aircraft. Mig-35 is just a smaller su-35. I don't consider it as a light aircraft frankly. Single engine and light weight is what makes me consider it a light aircraft. And a light aircraft isn't suppose to do as much as a large aircraft, keep in mind it has less load and smaller legs

    You are focussing on the wrong thing... the light plane could be the same weight as the heavy plane... it is not about weight as such, it is about price and cost of ownership.

    The light in this case would be better spelled lite... reduced performance over a smaller volume of airspace, but still modern and capable... whether it does that with one engine or two does not matter, because you take the engines out to overhaul them so you have a team per engine, those teams are in the AF so they are not paid per engine, so the costs don't go up, they get a salary so whether they are sitting around doing nothing or working on an aircraft engine doesn't matter.

    The important point is that the MiG-35 is a cheaper Su-35 and that is what they need.

    That's the deal: do less but what you can do do it cheaper than bigger aircraft.

    So you are saying 100 million dollar F-16s or 120 million dollar F-35s would be a good light fighter for Russia because they have single engines?

    The size or engine number is not important... the purchase costs and operational costs are what matter because the lite aircraft is a numbers aircraft.

    A single engined drone that costs 80 million per airframe, crashes a lot, and needs expensive stealth coatings sprayed on it twice a day whether it flys anywhere or not is a bad solution no matter what its weight is or the number of engines it uses.

    We are talking about lite numbers aircraft... a plane that might carry lots of dumb bombs and unguided rockets but use a Gefest & T system to be able to place those weapons on target accurately in free flight, being able to manouver and still release bombs accurately on target... they could be used as bomb trucks... it is the sort of role the US intended for the F-16 as a simple day fighter with a good radar and modern Avionics and then they turned it into a mini F-15 and instead of a 20 million dollar fighter it became a 100 million dollar fighter bomber.

    And seeing indians getting ride of their mig-29k which is using all the systems a mig-35 use isn't a good sign for the mig family.

    Yes, the Indians are renowned for making sensible decisions when it comes to buying aircraft... they spent more on 36 Rafales than they did on 300 odd Su-30MKIs.

    When they get some experience with the carrier based alternatives in the world it will be interesting... F-18 and Rafale... they are going to get a lesson in how much things in the west cost to buy and to operate and they will look back at the MiG-29K with nostalgia.

    Russia order it sope for testing but they still lack the AESA.

    So?

    That is like complaining that UKSK launch tubes for Russian ships are stupid because they wont have hypersonic missiles ready to load into them till next year.

    By the time the AESA radars are ready you want to have decent numbers of aircraft in service that can carry them... a repeat of the Su-27... they made huge numbers of airframes but the avionics and radars were not so easy to make so they had airframes sitting doing nothing waiting for radar and equipment to be produced for them.

    The MiG-35 have systems and equipment and can be put into service and when AESA radars are ready they can install them then.

    Without the aesa it is just the same aircraft with fancier screens as their mig-29SMT that they wabt to replace with sukhois.

    MiG-29SMT are older technology with a different airframe.

    They didn't change the external shape because the external shape was excellent, but the difference between a MiG-29SMT and the MiG-29M/29K/35 is like the difference between the Mirage 2000 and the Rafale.

    Iran is facing a bigger problem than Russia. It is a big country like Russia but it has much mlre enemies on its borders that are very well armed... On every sides. They need a big airforce and they can't use just the su-35 nor do they have money for it. Jf-17 or j-10 is an obligation for them.

    I don't agree, I think Iran could probably buy a licence for the MiG-29M and make most of the parts for themselves with Russia sending them engines... if they buy enough they could probably set up an engine overhaul facility that Syria and perhaps Iraq could send their aircraft for upgrades and overhauls...

    Russia isn't producing or using that much new air to ground weapons.

    An assumption by you. Why do you believe that to be true?

    They don't even produce gliding bombs, neither do they produce guidnace kits for dumb bombs.

    Guidance kits for dumb bombs are a scam, and who said they don't have glide bombs... but more importantly why do you think glide bombs are so special?

    You do understand that to get decent range with a glide bomb it needs to be released at speed and at altitude, which makes it horribly vulnerable to the launch aircraft being shot down by BUK or S-300s operating in the area.

    For HATO glide bombs are going to be horrendous because flying high and fast to use them makes you horribly vulnerable to BUK-M3 and S-350 and S-400 and a range of other systems... and even if you release a dozen bombs TOR can easily destroy those in flight as can Pantsir... so it is all for nothing unless you target unprotected civilian targets like the Orcs do, which makes them pretty useless.

    China has any of this that they copied from the west. Yeh they are copies and may be of lower quality but if they work I see no problem.

    And if they don't work then they are meaningless fluff of no interest.


    5 guided 100kg bombs can take out much more than a single unguided 500kg bomb. Russia lacks such weapons.

    You have to find 5 targets to use 5 guided bombs and you might not see any on your first pass because the targets you are after will be hiding.

    Russia has plenty of different guided bombs from about 20kgs in weight upwards... many of which appear to be intended for use by drones.

    A lot of the time western weapons are not so effective because they took their accuracy for granted and reduced to payload weight too far.

    What we should be agreeing is that they need a cheaper numbers aircraft that can do most of the things the heavier aircraft can do but over a shorter range with less ordinance, but in much larger numbers.

    That is what the MiG-35 is... and they have a fifth gen light fighter model that is single engined and a carrier based light fighter with two engines too... and an unmanned drone that operates as a wingman type drone... the lack of information about them suggests the customer (Russian AF) wants to keep them secret, while the unwanted offer from Sukhoi Su-75 has been revealed to get export customers.

    That is what happened to the Mi-28 Havoc when the Army decided they wanted the single seat Ka-50, so the Hokum remained secret and the Havoc was shown to stir up some export interest.

    Eventually it was realised that attack helicopters work best at night... harder to shoot down... and a single seat attack helicopter is at a disadvantage flying at night because flying at night is a full time job at low altitude so finding and attacking targets requires an extra crew.

    In the end they decided on taking both as they were different enough to both be considered useful...

    That might happen with these fighters too of course.
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    Post  yavar Wed Feb 08, 2023 12:06 pm

    Iran Army Air Force underground air force base Eagle 44 It is one of the army's most important air force bases, with fighters built in the depths of the Earth,"

    "Asif" long-range cruise missile & Sukhoi 24


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    Post  GarryB Thu Feb 09, 2023 7:28 am

    F-4 phantoms have a wingspan of about 12 metres, MiG-29/35s have very comparable wingspans.

    Flankers won't fit in such underground bunker hangers.
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    Post  T-47 Sat Sep 02, 2023 1:00 pm

    First batch of the unknown number has been delivered


    Iran Air Force (IRIAF) | News and Discussions - Page 12 F5a2dp10

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    Post  d_taddei2 Sat Sep 02, 2023 10:18 pm

    More Yak-130 pics

    Iran Air Force (IRIAF) | News and Discussions - Page 12 Img_2061


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