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    UAVs in Russian Armed Forces: News

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    Post  GarryB Sat Jun 26, 2010 2:40 am

    I personally think the ability to make excellent UAVs in Russia is there, and now that the Russian Armed forces have actually shown they are prepared to put their money where their mouth is and actually pay money for such things (the Russian AF didn't seem interested before the conflict in Georgia) I would probably start looking at Russian companies to find out what needs to be imported to make these things and what can be made in Russia. Money should then be spent on developing Russian companies that will make the components that are imported like high quality cameras and high speed encrypted datalinks etc.
    Also a drive to make sure the technology can be used in consumer items as well so that production can be quite large scale to make it efficient and even profitable.
    High quality cameras in shock proof stabilised mounts can be used in all sorts of situations from UAVs to APCs and Tanks and even house hold security and sports cameras etc etc.
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    Post  NationalRus Wed Jun 30, 2010 12:26 pm

    pathetic that we can't even produce a up to date UAV, i saw on a russian arms exhibition a lo of russin made UAV's and that was i think 2009, if we today haven't still a domestic up to date UAV then this is just a big shame, parts of russian arms industry are outdated as same as ther engineers who can't keep up with up to date designs and technology
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    Post  GarryB Wed Jun 30, 2010 1:10 pm

    Well you could blame the Russian AF for the same thing... they were never really interested in UAVs till the conflict in South Ossetia, and no interest means no money.
    If you want expensive and complicated and very capable UAVs then you need to invest the money to develop them.
    Such things do not fall from the sky.
    Now it is clear the Russian Armed forces are not only interested but are actually also ready to spend money on UAVs you will find lots of Russian UAVs going beyond prototype stage.
    A modern large and capable UAV is not cheap, no one is going to make one for fun on the off chance the local military will buy some.
    There are lots of Russian designed UAVs operating right now for Civilian companies like oil companies to monitor pipelines and for border patrol.
    The real problem is that long range datalinks that can handle live video and other data need to be bought from overseas.
    A UAV is simply an aircraft that flys for the most part in an autopilot mode where the operator plots navigation points for it to fly to. It can be manually flown but most of the time it is the cameras that are manually aimed and directed. If something of interest is spotted the UAV is simply commanded to orbit till given new nav points or to return to former path.
    This sort of thing the Russian plane makers already do, the problem and cost is the expensive datalink equipment that can be used over very large distances, including satellite links etc.
    Once Russian engineers start producing stuff either Russian developed or licence produced they can get some real experience and start pushing the state of the art in technology and engineering. Expecting them to go from no work to experts in the field with the latest tooling ready for mass production is a little unreasonable.
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    Post  NationalRus Wed Jun 30, 2010 5:02 pm

    Well you could blame the Russian AF for the same thing
    hell yes i blame them!

    same as i blame the goverment by not providing enough money and the highcommand that don't put any money and strategy for UAV devolopment and use

    and still this is not a excuse, the design/devolopment arms industry have to invest themselfs and atrackt civilian customrs on the globe to invest in them and come up with new design and developments, and actaully this problemm is trhugh out the russian arms industriy which is totaly outdatet and fails to come up with just somthing innovative...
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    Post  Russian Patriot Wed Jun 30, 2010 8:48 pm

    NationalRus wrote:
    Well you could blame the Russian AF for the same thing
    hell yes i blame them!

    same as i blame the goverment by not providing enough money and the highcommand that don't put any money and strategy for UAV devolopment and use

    and still this is not a excuse, the design/devolopment arms industry have to invest themselfs and atrackt civilian customrs on the globe to invest in them and come up with new design and developments, and actaully this problemm is trhugh out the russian arms industriy which is totaly outdatet and fails to come up with just somthing innovative...

    Agree with you on this issue . Where the hell is inovations? We are basically copying Israeli tech ( most countries do) but want them to lower thier prices. Is this Logical? My answer is no!
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    Post  Admin Thu Jul 01, 2010 12:58 am

    This deal will go through if Lavrov's list of banned items includes S-300 to Iran. Israel is also looking for some stoppage to Syria.

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    Post  GarryB Thu Jul 01, 2010 4:00 am

    Innovation?

    There is no problem with innovation in Russian UAVs.

    look at this page for a first list of UAV designers and designs in Russia:

    http://igorrgroup.blogspot.com/2010/05/russia-uavs-part-1.html

    The first UAV at the top of the page above is the T90 drone launched directly from a Smerch rocket that is fired towards the expected target area (as found by the Pchelka UAV) where it will loiter for an hour and a half so the target can be properly identified, an attack launched by the Smerch unit and assessment of the battle damage can be performed by the T90 itself.
    I'd call that innovative, but if that isn't innovative enough how about the Zala 421-08 which is a flying wing UAV that is carried in a large box in packs of about 4 under the wing of the Ka-50 and Ka-52 helicopter series that can be released and flown past cover toward a concealed enemy to find and mark targets for the helo so it doesn't have to expose itself to enemy ground fire.

    Look at the animation at the bottom of this page:

    http://www.zala.aero/en/

    to see how it works in theory.

    The main problem I see is a lack of a very large UAV in the predator class, but that is a very expensive aircraft that is hardly going to be developed on the off chance someone might buy it... that is how companies go bankrupt.

    Here is a good example of the issue at hand... for the Border patrol or an oil company many existing Russian UAVs are already perfect for the job, but for the Russian AF they will look at a UAV like this:

    http://www.okb-sokol.ru/cgi-bin/go.pl?i=43

    And they will look at the specs and say the flight speed of 120-240km/h is far too slow if we need to get this UAV to a particular place quickly. The flight altitude of 6km is probably too low as it cannot fly above MANPADs range. The flight time of up to 15 hours is good, especially with the armed version but they might want to carry more than 100kgs of stuff in it. The flight range of 2,400km is probably adequate for some roles and too short for others.
    The problem is that fitting a new engine to allow higher and faster flight might shorten endurance and range. It might also need better cameras to see properly from higher up.

    There are probably hundreds of Russian drone designs ranging from operational and flying to drawings. Some could do the job but just need small changes, while some are ready to do the job but need to get off the drawing board and into mass production.

    Remember the whole purpose of purchasing the Israeli UAVs was so a UAV training facility could be built and UAVs tested and experimented with so a range of UAV sizes from hand held through to size and weight of a small fighter aircraft and bigger can be evaluated and requirements set for Russian makers to start making UAVs and UCAVs for. They need to know what can be done with drones and what is useful to them and then they can set down requirements for the designers and makers.

    All this whining about no one in Russia being able to make decent UAVs is just BS.
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    Post  NationalRus Thu Jul 01, 2010 3:28 pm

    yes im very happy that now in 2010 the arms industry somehow maneges to come up with at last somthing, at last in the UAV business when its finaly heared the need for such systems and now smell some profit

    that nothing or nearly nothing of it is in use or that probably the army will not get nearly enough of such equipment or in a period of maybe far over a decade is surly mollifyingly Rolling Eyes

    still waitng when ther will be our counterpart to such a threatening and same time just awesome syste like the fire and forgot FGM-148? 16 years has passed
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    Post  Russian Patriot Fri Jul 02, 2010 1:07 am

    GarryB wrote:Innovation?

    There is no problem with innovation in Russian UAVs.

    look at this page for a first list of UAV designers and designs in Russia:

    http://igorrgroup.blogspot.com/2010/05/russia-uavs-part-1.html

    The first UAV at the top of the page above is the T90 drone launched directly from a Smerch rocket that is fired towards the expected target area (as found by the Pchelka UAV) where it will loiter for an hour and a half so the target can be properly identified, an attack launched by the Smerch unit and assessment of the battle damage can be performed by the T90 itself.
    I'd call that innovative, but if that isn't innovative enough how about the Zala 421-08 which is a flying wing UAV that is carried in a large box in packs of about 4 under the wing of the Ka-50 and Ka-52 helicopter series that can be released and flown past cover toward a concealed enemy to find and mark targets for the helo so it doesn't have to expose itself to enemy ground fire.

    Look at the animation at the bottom of this page:

    http://www.zala.aero/en/

    to see how it works in theory.

    The main problem I see is a lack of a very large UAV in the predator class, but that is a very expensive aircraft that is hardly going to be developed on the off chance someone might buy it... that is how companies go bankrupt.

    Here is a good example of the issue at hand... for the Border patrol or an oil company many existing Russian UAVs are already perfect for the job, but for the Russian AF they will look at a UAV like this:

    http://www.okb-sokol.ru/cgi-bin/go.pl?i=43

    And they will look at the specs and say the flight speed of 120-240km/h is far too slow if we need to get this UAV to a particular place quickly. The flight altitude of 6km is probably too low as it cannot fly above MANPADs range. The flight time of up to 15 hours is good, especially with the armed version but they might want to carry more than 100kgs of stuff in it. The flight range of 2,400km is probably adequate for some roles and too short for others.
    The problem is that fitting a new engine to allow higher and faster flight might shorten endurance and range. It might also need better cameras to see properly from higher up.

    There are probably hundreds of Russian drone designs ranging from operational and flying to drawings. Some could do the job but just need small changes, while some are ready to do the job but need to get off the drawing board and into mass production.

    Remember the whole purpose of purchasing the Israeli UAVs was so a UAV training facility could be built and UAVs tested and experimented with so a range of UAV sizes from hand held through to size and weight of a small fighter aircraft and bigger can be evaluated and requirements set for Russian makers to start making UAVs and UCAVs for. They need to know what can be done with drones and what is useful to them and then they can set down requirements for the designers and makers.

    All this whining about no one in Russia being able to make decent UAVs is just BS.

    Well Garry , we been hearing this so called BS until now.. thanks for links
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    Post  GarryB Fri Jul 02, 2010 4:36 am

    I think the real problem was that the military was put in a position where they realised they were well behind in the game.
    Militarys' around the world have always been caught with their pants down at the start of a conflict they were really not ready for... it is part of war that you surprise your enemy.
    The military was put in the uncomfortable position where they realised they needed better C4IR capabilities and they looked at what the best equipped armed forces around the place were using, and it was UAVs... little remote control planes that seem so simple they don't even have pilots.
    The problem was that their own MIC had only dabbled in that technology because in the past they just looked at those model aircraft and scoffed at airshows and exhibitions.
    Now they needed to incorporate them into their armoury and they really knew very little about them.
    They didn't know what they could or couldn't do and they didn't really know what they wanted.
    As Vlad has mentioned some of the early Russian UAVs used cheap unstabilised cameras that couldn't give a good view and so were useless.
    Replacing the camera with a much better quality camera and putting a stabilisation system in the craft or using digital stabilisation on the camera is not hard, but it is also not cheap.
    Also the fact that GLONASS was not 100% even 2 years ago and isn't even perfected yet, and just as bad commercial GLONASS receivers are not easy to come by and are not cheap either is another problem that can only be solved with time and money.
    Money which is being spent, but the fact is that if you had Russian UAVs operating 5 years ago that were as good as the Israeli UAVs they would be using GPS, which I doubt the Russian military would be happy with.

    At the end of the day it is hard to point the finger and place blame anywhere because it was everywhere and given the situation understandible.
    Without the conflict in South Ossetia the Russian AF might still not care about UAVs and there would be no emergency purchase of Israeli UAVs or centres set up to test and evaluation and create manuals and training documentation for UAV use within the RuAF. In a way the Russian AF should be thankful for that impulsive idiot in Georgia.

    The simple facts of the matter is that an area of technology that was lacking before in the Russian military, with only the Russian Army artillery regiments really using them for spotting, which is quite understandable as the Russian Army has often expected to fight without air support... hense they have tactical rockets like Tochka-U and Iskander-M (Tender-M) to do the work that in the west would probably be achieved with an F-16 with a LGB.
    Adding UAVs to the airforce, army and no doubt navy as well will expand their capabilities and reduce the danger to personel in dangerous airspace.

    @Russian Patriot, things are not perfect with Russian UAVs of course, just because a company has a website and a design with pictures and video of it flying doesn't mean the SYSTEM is OK. It might have a really badly designed control system that is hard for the average soldier to use properly. If it works OK there is still the problem of production and even deployment. Some little 5 man company sets up a website, puts a plane one of them has made together with some cameras and a computer system to back it up and then offers the final product to the military... if the military want it then you have the problem of... we want 500 complete systems please. Then even if you can deliver that number of systems, you get the call that says that some Siberian unit is having trouble using your UAV design, can you send some specialists to go and have a look. For the next 5 days you get 400 calls wanting support and problem solving.
    Getting something that works is the start of the problem... Smile

    Of course if the design is simple enough then it should be easy for other technical specialists to fix and for any factory making small aircraft to build in large numbers.
    Needless to say now there is money and where there is money there will be products.

    The only blame I would direct would be at the General or whatever that stated that they had to get Israeli UAVs because Russian ones were all rubbish.
    They had only just decided they needed UAVs and they had looked at what was available and didn't like what they saw.
    That is fine, but what he should have said was that UAV development in Russia was not mature and that the Russian Armed forces will train and learn to use UAVs using Israeli UAVs because in Israel a UAV is a functioning part of their military so their designs meet the needs of a military. Russian UAVs are generally scratch built model aeroplanes designed for what the designers think the military might need, whereas the Israeli designs are designed to meet Israeli military needs.

    The real difference is that the Israeli military has experience with UAVs and knows what it needs and what it doesn't and there has been time and communication and no doubt dead ends and mistakes and other experiences on the part of the designers and the military to get the military what it needs.
    Russia has largely skipped that phase and there is no need to apportion blame for not having to skip that phase.
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    Post  Admin Tue Jul 06, 2010 1:50 am

    Russia will not buy anymore Israeli UAVs

    The largest forum of the Russian defense showed why we can not do without the purchase of foreign weapons

    In Zhukovsky near Moscow yesterday, finished the 1 st International Forum " Technology in Mechanical Engineering - 2010 " . His leitmotif was the controversy on the subject , to buy or not to buy Russian foreign arms.

    The Forum brought together four previously separate specialized exhibitions - International Exhibition of Technology in Mechanical Engineering " Intermash -2010 " Salon of weapons and military equipment of ground forces IDELF -2010 , as well as the exhibition " Aerospace 2010 "and" Unmanned multipurpose complex UVS-TECH- 2010 " . Platform for large-scale event was selected airfield Gromov Flight Research Institute , home of the Aviation and Space Salon MAKS.

    The exhibition program involved 314 companies in 28 events on the program - more than 1500 delegates from the Russian and 42 foreign companies from 18 countries . They presented their products at private displays an area of over 6 thousand square meters and the outdoor area of more than 3,5 thousand square meters From the VIP-persons appeared at the forum , Prime Minister Vladimir Putin, who met with President of Yemen Ali Abdullah Saleh and Chairman of the Board of Siemens AG , Peter Loescher , the head of Russian Technologies Chemezov , director of the FA PTS Mikhail Dmitriev , President Alexei Fyodorov, UAC .

    The forum Roscosmos and the State Military Industrial Committee of Belarus signed a memorandum on cooperation in space technology. Expected to create a unified navigation and information space in the two states , the development of joint legal and regulatory framework for the establishment and use of space technology and satellite navigation system GLONASS, the regulation of network operators , the creation of optoelectronic devices for high resolution digital mapping of the complex.

    At the exhibition , it was announced that Jordan started the construction of assembly plant launcher complexes " Hashim " . scheduled to begin production within 18 months , and it will be purely assembly : Russian military technology will not give Jordan .

    Set the demonstrated military equipment and weapons in Zhukovsky was traditional, but not without innovations . For the first time were shown some examples of communications and signal monitoring . This radar ground reconnaissance CHAR - 10M , space-saving radar 1L122E Concern PVO Almaz- Antey " radar " Vitim NPK NIIDAR , the R -168 - 1KE Yaroslavl Radio Plant , multi-channel radio microwave and portable VHF concern "Constellation " , Mobile radio monitoring complex HF- band " Onslaught -1 " ON "Quantum ", a mobile communication system MIC - ISS scientific -industrial firm " Micran " , automated control system for ground troops " Acacia - E " concern " Systemprom . The latter is designed to provide communication between the General Staff and the operational headquarters for the calculation of the forces for combat operations , processing of information received from intelligence. The system has already been used in the exercises Kavkaz - 2009 " .

    The first demonstration of an armored car "Wolf " , developed by the Military- Industrial Company ( part of the holding company , Russian Machines " ) - continued well -proven family of military vehicles "Tiger " . However , as already reported, the Russian Defense Ministry intends to buy armored LMV Italian company Iveco. They plan to collect the license for Kamaz.

    Holding "Helicopters of Russia " ( a subsidiary of OPK Oboronprom , which is part of Rostekhnologii ) unveiled two new unmanned aircraft helicopter type - " Kite " and Ka -135 . UAV helicopter type - a new direction in the world of unmanned aircraft, are actively developing in the last decade . As a platform for the creation of unmanned systems may be considered Russian manned helicopters Mi- 34, Ka- 226 , " Patrol ", " Ansat " , " act ".

    It was first shown 120 - mm rifled towed mortar semi Nona -M2 . He established the Central Research Institute of Precision Engineering. Mortar is universal and can use all the world's 120 -mm mortar shells and with ready rifling .

    The Forum was the scene of controversy surrounding the procurement of foreign weapons Russia . The Ministry of Defence and the French company Sagem Defense Securite ( group of companies SAFRAN) held talks on a possible purchase of the fire control system "Sigma -30 " for the modernization of the Russian artillery and multiple rocket launching systems ( MLRS ). Sagem is now supplying these systems virtually the entire range of Russian weapons export products, including the "Sigma -95 " for " dry " . The same system equipped with MLRS Germany and Italy , modernized armored Norway and Sweden.

    MOD in talks about buying a French limited edition gear " soldier of the future "FELIN - for the special forces of the GRU . The cost of an order of magnitude lower than similar developments in Germany and the U.S., where it is 50-60 thousand Euro .

    According to general director of the corporation Rostekhnologii Chemezov , buying abroad today is inevitable, because the share of Russian companies that are developing and deploying technological innovations , yet does not exceed 10 % and the share of innovative products of 5,5%.

    But the Russian developers of drones have a chance to contract with the Defense Ministry, because plans additional purchases of foreign UAV after Israel no. Said first deputy defense minister Vladimir Popovkin . Defense plans this summer to choose the Russian developer drones , which will supply the Army aircraft in the class scout or target designator.

    Research has shown steel materials and protective structure for local and individual reservations . In particular , helmets for the military are the easiest in the world , unique to them yet. Helmet withstand a shot from 5 meters from the Makarov pistol. Was presented and a new kind of armor from nanomaterials . So, perhaps , from the acquisition plans were in Germany , our military authorities refused.

    Russian Corporation of communication " , part of the state corporation Russian Technologies , and the company " CELEX The system is integrative SpA (Included in the Italian group Finmeccanica ) signed an agreement on modalities for establishing joint venture in Russia to design and manufacture of complex automated systems security of protected objects and events .

    On the ground in 5 hectares of land , specially built for the forum , together with the demonstration of the technology was conducted military - sports show involving DOSAAF and riot Interior , Ministry of Emergencies of Russia, GRU, the General Staff , the FSB . In preparing the demonstration program involved not only military specialists , but " civil " director of the Bolshoi Theatre Andrei Melanin . During a demonstration of military equipment in action there was almost no crowd . The fact that the organizers of the show for visitors to sell some tickets , and for the entrance to the exhibition - other . Guests are usually bought only a ticket for entrance. Moreover, instead of the planned two hits armor and special weapons have decided to hold three , but the third was scheduled for 18.00 , when none of the visitors to the airfield was no longer allowed .

    Nicholas Poroskov
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    Post  GarryB Fri Jul 30, 2010 1:28 pm

    I have read on a website that Tupolev are working on a medium range UAV for the Russian AF... anybody heard anything more?
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    Post  Austin Mon Aug 09, 2010 10:55 am

    What happened with Skat UCAV ?
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    Post  NationalRus Mon Aug 09, 2010 5:03 pm

    Austin wrote:What happened with Skat UCAV ?

    no info, it coul be anything, it could fly by now as a prototype or its mockup could be rotting in some hall
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    Post  GarryB Tue Aug 10, 2010 3:56 am

    I have also read that due to pretty much all the aircraft design bureaus now all being part of the UAC that they will have a department that focuses on UAV and UCAV development and that it wont be one design bureau or another project.

    However in contradiction to that I have also read that the HALE UAV/UCAV will be made by Sukhoi and is called S-62 and the MALE UAV/UCAV will be made by Tupolev and is called TANK-SD or something and will not be related to Tupolevs previous UAV designs like the Reis and other recon drone families they made in the past.
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    Post  Austin Thu Aug 12, 2010 7:31 pm

    The Sukhoi S-62 family of UAV looks promising hope it gets the desired funding.

    Hope they operationalise a UCAV like Skat soon , US has already operationalise a classified UCAV ( Boeing ) and Brits are not far behind now with strategic ucav Taranis in the make
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    Post  GarryB Fri Aug 13, 2010 2:20 am

    AFAIK the Russian officials constantly talk about a super high altitude recon platform and about the urgency of such things in their inventory.
    This makes me think of the M-55 and M-17 in manned platforms and the S-62 in unmanned platforms, though I think there also might be platforms based on airships too.
    There was a prototype shown a while back of what looked like a flying saucer which was an airship with a saucer shape to help it cope with high altitude winds.
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    Post  Austin Fri Aug 13, 2010 3:49 am

    GarryB wrote:AFAIK the Russian officials constantly talk about a super high altitude recon platform and about the urgency of such things in their inventory.
    This makes me think of the M-55 and M-17 in manned platforms and the S-62 in unmanned platforms, though I think there also might be platforms based on airships too.
    There was a prototype shown a while back of what looked like a flying saucer which was an airship with a saucer shape to help it cope with high altitude winds.

    Well they talk about lot of things Hypersonic Aircraft , High Altitude Stratosphere Aircraft , UCAV , UAV but nothing concrete has shown up yet , may be more talks less action ?

    Hopefully MAKS 2011 should have some info on these.
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    Post  nightcrawler Fri Aug 20, 2010 3:53 am

    Can anybody provide a pdf file representing Russian advancement in UCAVS
    After Georgian war much westerners do still think Russ is behind in this particular warfare because they hadn't used it then
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    Post  Austin Fri Aug 20, 2010 7:07 am

    Russian UAV is as worst as it gets and even the Russian Air Force chief says he prefers joint devl/lic manf of UAV from Israel rather then buying it locally as they are not upto the mark.

    UCAV nothing much is known probably they are no better off then the UAV
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    Post  Viktor Sat Aug 21, 2010 9:31 am

    Just until recently Russia did not have UAV/UCAV in its military planing budget. Only 2008 war triggered interest in it and Russia moved to its design late but strong. We see numerous projects witch still does not satisfy military but in time those problem will get solved.
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    Post  Admin Tue Nov 02, 2010 10:58 am

    The first unmanned system "Spectrum 301" will be delivered in November this year

    Moscow. November 1. Airports - air unmanned systems for monitoring, surveillance and reconnaissance, "Spectrum 301" development company "Scientific-Production Center Firm NELK" will be delivered to the buyer in October-November this year, told AviaPort "the Head of Development firm Gaidar, Boris.

    Interviewee refused to talk about the number of delivered systems and unmanned aerial vehicles, "Spectrum 301", as they are available for law enforcement agencies.

    "Unmanned systems with UAV aircraft type Spektr-301 has successfully passed flight tests and is now made to order as civilian customers, and security structures of Russia", - he said.

    B. Gaidar also refuted appeared in media reports about the possible sale of 500 thousand rubles unmanned helicopter-type complex on the order of the Government of Moscow. According to him, the Moscow city government has not appealed to us and talks on this topic were not conducted.

    Unmanned aerial vehicle "Spectrum 301" made by airplane-type scheme "flying wing" with swept trailing edge of the wing. The power plant of the same engine with a pusher propeller located in the rear of the unit.

    UAV Spektr-301 has a starting weight of 7 kg in weight payload of up to 1 kg. The flight speed is between 55 km / h to 150 km / h at the operating altitude of 50 m to 500 m. Range - at least 160 km and a maximum flight duration - up to 120 min. UAV flies in the automatic mode and semi-automatic.

    UAV can be equipped with a wide range of specialized equipment and instrumentation. In particular, it can be set:

    * thermal imaging camera with a resolution of at least 640h512 pixels and detection range human up to 5 km, the truck up to 12,5 km;
    * TV camera with a magnification of 25-300, with a range of human recognition of 4-6 km, 6-8 km passenger car;
    * Station radar reconnaissance with a range of detection of human 5 km, the truck 12 km, with an error range of up to five meters;
    * laser rangefinder with a limit ranging from 5 to 15 km and an accuracy of up to 5 m;
    * complex radio and electronic intelligence.


    Dmitry Kozlov
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    Post  GarryB Tue Nov 02, 2010 11:34 am

    Actually re-reading this page I am reminded of a drawing I saw of a small stealthy looking body with enormous wings.
    At the time I though it was just fantasy art because it had no tail surfaces and square intakes and presumably exhausts.

    However word that the final T-50 will have square exhausts for stealth purposes makes me think that perhaps this is more important than it looked.

    Based on the name of the file (I found it a while ago... can't remember when or where) I think this aircraft is the M-63 multi-purpose high-flying version of a Myasishchev design. There is also the M-67 early-warning high-flying design mentioned that might be related.

    UAVs in Russian Armed Forces: News - Page 2 M63var10
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    Post  Austin Mon Nov 29, 2010 3:07 pm

    Red Star Volume 20 - Soviet/Russian Unmanned Aerial Vehicals

    Download
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    Post  GarryB Tue Nov 30, 2010 5:11 am

    Thanks Austin, downloading now.

    Can anybody provide a pdf file representing Russian advancement in UCAVS
    After Georgian war much westerners do still think Russ is behind in this particular warfare because they hadn't used it then

    Before the Georgian war the Russian military only dabbled in UAV technology.

    It is not an accident that modern capable UAV systems cost millions of dollars to buy. They are not just simple remote control toys.

    The thing is that you need high quality video systems that might cost over $100,000 dollars for the video system alone. Then you need to add a modern efficient engine, plus electronics and a good basic aerodynamic shape to fit everything into.
    You also need to make the system easy to use and soldier proof.

    Before 2008 the Russian military weren't even looking at UAVs so there were plenty at air shows but without any being bought there is no way a capable system could be funded so most of what was shown was one off prototypes.

    After the conflict in Georgia the Armed forces wanted a capable tested mature system to buy and all they saw were prototypes.

    In fact worse than that they saw cost cutting with cheap unstabilised cameras and low powered engines that couldn't fly high or fast and the image they captured was poor quality.

    Their response was to buy Israeli UAVs for testing so they knew what to demand and what to expect. Remember an Air force will have different needs and wants from an Army. An Army will want UAVs for artillery spotting to find targets and to report back the effect of an artillery attack. For front line use an Army will want small compact systems a man can operate to see what is over the next hill or behind the trees in front of his troops position so they need to be small, and don't need to fly high or fast.
    An airforce UAV on the other hand needs to be able to fly very high and may need to fly fast to get to an operational area but then loiter for hours or perhaps even days.
    Flying high means powerful zoom cameras of very high quality with good stabilisation systems etc etc.

    I would expect in the next few years that Russian companies will come up with much better UAVs and that if those UAVs are bought and the companies supported by the Military that in 10 years time the best available UAVs will include Russian models.

    Regarding UCAVs I have posted this photo

    UAVs in Russian Armed Forces: News - Page 2 Dt110110

    Here is the Tu-300 UCAV.

    The nose thimble is the guidance antenna for the ATAKA and SHTURM ATGMs. Fired from helicopters its range is 6km and 5km respectively but from 5-6km up that flight range might be 7-8km perhaps though I rather doubt they would glide very well.
    ATAKA and SHTURM are popular because they are accurate enough to hit a vehicle at max range but are cheap because they contain no guidance systems or seekers.
    The Russian Army will have enormous numbers of these missiles in stock though I would expect their use by dates will not allow them to be kept in storage forever.

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