She just regurgitates rumors and seldom quotes the source. I read that same shit of an argument on Topwar.ru weeks ago. From what I understand the shells in Coalition are basically the same as in older ammo it is just the propellant charges are different. They would need to transport those separately, but compared with the logistical issues that Ukraine is having this would be no big deal.
sepheronx, Regular, thegopnik, Broski and Belisarius like this post
lancelot wrote:She just regurgitates rumors and seldom quotes the source. I read that same shit of an argument on Topwar.ru weeks ago. From what I understand the shells in Coalition are basically the same as in older ammo it is just the propellant charges are different. They would need to transport those separately, but compared with the logistical issues that Ukraine is having this would be no big deal.
She also used chatgpt to write her posts (by self admition)… whats the point to even read “her”
GarryB, Sprut-B, lancelot and Broski like this post
Someone needs to build an autoloader for self-propelled mortars.
The weapon on the Vena is a gun mortar that can fire shells and mortar bombs, any automatic feed system would be incredibly complicated to allow a variety of rounds to be fired as needed.
Not impossible of course, but not easy either.
Mortar model on Armata or Kurganets or Boomerang or Typhoon or DT-30 chassis will need it to retain their unmanned turret design.
Is Patricia quoting russian or Ukrainian sources or is limb being retarded again like on the t-90 thread?
Patti sounds like a pro Ukraine pro nazi bitch that someone pretending to be pro Russia from the Baltic states might be paid to post to poison the waters.
No one here knows about the ammo situation in Russia but this cow does?
Yeah right.
She just regurgitates rumors and seldom quotes the source. I read that same shit of an argument on Topwar.ru weeks ago. From what I understand the shells in Coalition are basically the same as in older ammo it is just the propellant charges are different. They would need to transport those separately, but compared with the logistical issues that Ukraine is having this would be no big deal.
Which is probably true but also largely ignores the point that Russia does not need to replace all of its artillery with Coalition... they could use it in some select locations where its extra range and performance would be useful and continue to chew up Ukrainian forces with the artillery already in place.
The very idea that Russia needs Coalition or it will have no artillery at all is an obvious shot at Russia and anyone stupid enough to believe that... well I have a bridge to sell you.
The weapon on the Vena is a gun mortar that can fire shells and mortar bombs, any automatic feed system would be incredibly complicated to allow a variety of rounds to be fired as needed.
Not impossible of course, but not easy either.
Honestly, All you would need is a miniaturised version of the Koalitsiya's or Msta-SM2's autoloader.
With gun-mortars being much lighter than howitzers and their ammunition being rather small, it would make sense to have two of them and add a version of the Koalitsiya's cooling system.
Rostec began supplying new Phlox artillery guns, 10.05.2023.
Rostec began supplying the first batch of Phlox artillery guns to the troops.
MOSCOW, October 5 – RIA Novosti. Rostec has begun deliveries to the troops of the first batch of new self-propelled artillery units (SPG) Phlox on a wheelbase of 120 millimeters, the state corporation reported.
Rostec has begun transferring a batch of 120-mm Phlox self-propelled artillery guns to the troops. The gun is built on the chassis of a protected all-terrain vehicle, which allows it to quickly change its firing position after several shots,” the corporation explained.
As Bekhan Ozdoev, industrial director of the Rostec complex of conventional weapons, ammunition and special chemicals, noted, the new weapon is both a cannon and a mortar, as it can fire both shells and mines without slowing down. Phlox has improved mobility and security, it rationally balances manual and automated operations, and makes the work of the crew as easy as possible. Combined with a relatively low price, all this makes the weapon accessible and in demand among the troops,” Ozdoev added.
The rate of fire allows the self-propelled gun to fire in simultaneous fire attack mode - when several shells fired sequentially at different elevation angles simultaneously reach the target. Transferring the gun from the traveling position to the combat position takes less than one minute, and the load on the chassis when fired is reduced.
"Phlox" is designed to equip artillery batteries with the aim of destroying enemy personnel, weapons and equipment in the battalion's area of responsibility. The weapon is unified in terms of the ammunition used with "Vena" type guns, which makes it possible to use ammunition of increased power and increase the firing range. The self-propelled gun has an armored cabin and ammunition compartments, which provides increased protection for the crew and ammunition while on the move and when changing position.
Honestly, All you would need is a miniaturised version of the Koalitsiya's or Msta-SM2's autoloader.
With 82mm mortar vehicles we are talking about rounds in the 4-5kg range which can easily be hand loaded, but the 120mm rounds are 16kg plus.
They have clearly shown they know how to make automatic loaders for their gun systems... they have them for their new 57mm guns and 57mm grenade launchers in their unmanned turrets and also for their 125mm tank guns and now 152mm artillery systems, so of course they can do it.
That they choose not to suggests an issue or good reason to that we don't know.
They already have the 82mm Vasilek automatic mortar that uses a 4 bomb clip feed mechanism... modifying that into a belt system with perhaps two or three separate belts for the different ammo options should not be that hard, yet they have clearly not gone that way.
Just to go over it again for clarity, an automatic loading system is more than just a system to feed ammo into the gun automatically.
On a T-72/90 series tank the autoloading system only has the capacity for 22 rounds. Any extra rounds are stored elsewhere in the vehicle and have to be manually loaded into the under floor autoloader before they can be used or very very slowly manually hand loaded into the gun... and because there is no human loader that means the commander has to load the gun while the gunner concentrates on hitting the target... that is early WWII BS where the tank is blind because the commander can't look for new targets or for threats to their tank because he is loading and sometimes firing the gun himself.
To have an 82mm or 120mm autoloading mortar/gun system would would need to mechanise the entire ammo rack so ammo can be taken from where it is stored to a position where it can be loaded... but also put back in the rack if the gunner changes their mind about the target type.
A two piece round like the 125mm means you can extract the propellent case but not the shell/projectile so if you change you mind it is often just quicker to rotate the autoloader to the round you want to fire and then fire the round in the chamber and load the new round... you of course lose the element of surprise, but it is something you would do on the spur of the moment.
Hand loading with a human loader is cheaper and simpler and makes sense if your turret is manned anyway.
With their new vehicles with unmanned turrets then autoloading guns and mechanised ammo racks will become essential.
We know the Au-220 turret for the PT-57 has a ready to fire autoloader of 20 rounds so presumably the main stock of ammo can be loaded perhaps manually or automatically from the main ammo store into this ready to use autoloader, which means 20 rounds can be fired rapidly but then it has to reload the autoloader.
Presumably you would fire a few shells at targets and then reload the autoloader to keep it topped up... very few targets would require more than a 20 round burst...
Home
Latest images
Register
Log in
lancelot
