2019–20 Hong Kong protests

GarryB wrote:

The hell is this "the Brits are just as bad" nonsense.

It matches the theme... if the Soviets were just as bad as the Nazis and Imperial Japan is goes as read that Imperial Britain and Imperial France and Imperial Europe and Imperial America are also bad too doesn't it?

At the end of the day China is an Authoritarian country, period.
Don't give me this "their all just as bad" Koolaid.

But does it have military bases on over 800 countries... does it bomb countries that do not bend to its will?

Previously it was Russia was bad... now it is China and they want Russia to help... and they can bugger off.

And yes Taiwan is next, why?.. geography.

Of course Taiwan is next... but not because China is evil... China is happy to wait things out... it is British and US meddling in Hong Kong that is causing the problems there and when that issue is solved by China they will turn to agitate in Taiwan next... they are doing the same to Russia in Georgia and Ukraine and now Belarus and the former Soviet republics like the baltic states.

Are you going to tell me Russia is the problem there?

In France individualism rules. I would never allow anyone to tell me where i can travel or follow some idiotic dogma.

But you are aren't you? You have already said you would rather be in some tropical paradise instead of the shithole that is France... why are you not living the dream?

What?

New Caledonia is France.

Gary whats going on with you?

Garry, i don't give a damn about your apologist and whataboutisms.
At the end of the day China is a sh%t communist country, don't this "merica bad too" crap.

I have enough problems with a government that's getting too much power, but one that can do whatever it pleases like China is even more terrifying.

AlfaT8 wrote:Garry, i don't give a damn about your apologist and whataboutisms.
At the end of the day China is a sh%t communist country, don't this "merica bad too" crap.

I have enough problems with a government that's getting too much power, but one that can do whatever it pleases like China is even more terrifying.

You make the mistake to take him serious. He means it in a satirical way. He once said Venezuela has a better healthcare system then the UK and that Kim Jong Un is a prime example for a good statesmen.

When you read his posts with that knowledge you understand what fine satire it is.

What?

New Caledonia is France.

Gary whats going on with you?

Love the irony... Hong Kong is part of China that was occupied for a long period and partially assimilated... New Caledonia was never part of France till French explorers stumbled upon it and seized ownership...

At the end of the day China is a sh%t communist country, don't this "merica bad too" crap.

It seems there currently more millionaires and billionaires in China than in the US... it was not so not so long ago... does that not suggest that if you want to get rich and live the real American dream of working hard and making your fortune you now forget going to the US and go to China?

It is the US imposing sanctions on countries to extort better trade deals, it is US UCAVs murdering their political opponents without trial around the world... and anyone who gets in the way too of course...

Have never seen the videos of white people getting killed in the streets of China for things that are not even proven to be a crime...

I have enough problems with a government that's getting too much power, but one that can do whatever it pleases like China is even more terrifying.

What do you mean doing what it pleases?

The laws to allow extradition to the US were passed in Hong Kong years ago and noone said a word.... Hong Kong is part of China... why on earth would they leave the situation where a criminal can escape to Hong Kong and not be able to be touched by Chinese authorities?

I realise it is a bit sudden, but waiting 20 years before introducing an extradition law is hardly being a brutal oppressive dictator state.

Stop watching CNN.

He once said Venezuela has a better healthcare system then the UK and that Kim Jong Un is a prime example for a good statesmen.

First of all I never said either, but even Bugs Bunny could do a better job than Micron or Trump or Johnson... is it a coincidence that their names in English mean Tiny, Ass with a T in front, and another name for penis.

The really funny thing is that the leader of North Korea is blamed for famine and poverty but the decisions about sanctions and embargoes come from the west and not from him.

Garry, what part of i don't give a damn do you not understand, they are an authoritarian sh%tshow.

Their millionaire are only so, until the Party deems it.

Everything for the party.
F that.

Such a horrifying thing.

So the west tolerates gays and people who confuse gender with mood, and of course religions cannot be touched, though no criticism of Muslims or jews but you can have a go at christians it seems, but it will not tolerate any variation in government, and you can abuse the Chinese or Russian people to your hearts content.

The real irony is that the anti commies think in a communist country the people get no say and it is all government, while democracy everything happens by the will of the people and bad governments are removed to limit the damage they can cause.

As you get older you have heard the anti commie bullshit long enough you start to question it.

The vast majority of people in the west could care less about who is in government and as long as they have a job and can afford to eventually buy a house and go on the occasional holiday and there are no serious law and order issues so they can go out when they please they could care less about government.

Then there are people with very strong views on exactly how things should be done... but they will only be 20-30 percent of the population.

When I was at school we were taught to worship a woman called Kate Sheppard... a New Zealand woman who fought for and got the vote for women in New Zealand. What we weren't taught was that manual labourers and people who didn't own land didn't have a vote either... but she didn't care... she just wanted the vote for women and that is the problem today... everyone is selfish... they don't want things to be fair... they want an advantage and once they get it they don't care.

The fact that the number of millionaires and billionaires is increasing massively in China and decreasing in the US tells me when it comes to innovation and business sense the Americans are being overtaken...

Nothing horrifying at all...

I am sure your fears for the people of Hong Kong are like the US fears for the Iraqi people or the Iranian people or the people of Venezuela or Bolivia or for that matter Cuba and North Korea... they hate the system and could not care less about the people but want to sound moral and ethical in trying to rock the boat to see how easy it will be to roll and rob and rape.
A woman will fight for equal pay, but not equal pay for equal work... they just want the same amount of money.

People who get in to positions of power for fighting for certain rights for specific groups will skew laws in unfair directions and the rules remain unfair but abused by some other group.

But I would be fascinated to hear exactly what the Chinese government is doing that is so bad for the Chinese people... we see riots in Hong Kong... but we also see them in France and the UK and the US and their governments seem to be capable of even more barbarity than the Chinese are displaying.

How many people in HK blinded by weapons used by police?

I saw a Policeman with an arrow sticking out of his leg, but no mentioned of any protesters killed... and you can bet your ass if one is killed or blinded the western press will ferret them out and parade them to the world.

The fact of the matter is that Hong Kong is Chinese territory and they can do as they please.... I am sure if they want advice from the west they will ask for it... but US and French responses to advice as to how to treat their protesters and rioters didn't seem to be appreciated at all.

My god, the hamster wheel is spinning hard here, the Chinese are a garbage authoritarian country, no matter of swiveling is gonna change this.

What does that even mean?

And China seems to be growing and developing rather better than any other country on the planet... if the west is so damn fantastic and wonderful why is there still poverty and hunger... even in western countries.

Please list the crimes of the chinese government and lets compare that with the list for the US and UK and France.

People in China don't get a vote... if they want to vote and become political they are free to join the communist party which will give them a vote... in most communist countries communist party membership is about 30%, but I am sure you will suggest communist party members are corrupt and have more wealth and more land than everyone else. Well how can you say the US is better with 90 percent of the money and land and wealth is in the hands of 1% of the population?

When there is only a democrat and a republican and both are rich white old men who openly take bribes called campaign funds... they don't even hide the fact that their biggest contributors get jobs normally given to diplomats because of their contributions... it is blatant out right corruption but they openly admit it because everyone knows voters don't mean shit once you are in office... all the power is with the rich people who throw money at the dancing strippers... sorry... presidential candidates.

As Trump as shown... even if you can fool the voters into voting you into power you still can't do as you please... or even what you promised... they have a senate and a congress of more old white men who get bribed by different people to make sure certain things happen or certain things get blocked and never happen... America is not even nearly a democracy and it is no different here in New Zealand or in Australia or the UK... effectively there are two parties... different names but basically both pretending to be slightly left and slightly right but both basically occupying the middle of the road to get votes... they get a fixed period to make lots of mistakes and then there is a chance to vote them out.

It is so pathetic when the government are a bunch of idiots that make mistake after mistake but get reelected because the opposition and only alternative looks worse. It worked for Tony B-liar and Bush, and several other western politicians and is Trumps best chance of reelection.... but his screwing up the US response to Covid 19 suggests he is going to need a war real quick... Iran is too strong so I would expect an invasion of Venezuela might become a topic of serious discussion in the White house.

Politics in the west is pathetic and very undemocratic because they earn too much money on bribes and don't want to fix that... it would be like getting underpaid workers serving tables in restaurants to refuse tips because they are immoral.... wouldn't happen... even if they got proper wages...

But no... the Chinese government is bad because CNN and the BBC and Fox News tells you so... isn't that an immediate hint that the Chinese government is not only not bad but also a real threat to the American way of life? Chinese politicians caught taking bribes are often executed... they are a country that takes corruption in government seriously. Not to say there is no corruption, but it is a different mentality.

It is like the Russian MIC vs the US MIC... the Russian MIC is working to make Russia safe... the US MIC thinks the US is safe and just wants to make outrageous profits in a system well known for throwing money at problems without keeping track...

Why do i even bother.

Hamfisted authoritarianism is no worse than the insidious western variety engineered to bypass human reaction. I have no
more say in the actions of the deciders here in Canada than the Chinese get about theirs in China. And if you live a normal
life and are not a seditionist maggot, the system will not be oppressing you. It is absurd to evaluate the lives of hundreds of
millions of people based by the cherry picked experience of a few foreign sponsored agitators and useful idiots.

After learning about the depravity exhibited by the poor dear Tiananmen Square "protestors" (e.g. burning cops alive) I cannot
view these "martyrs" as any sort of representatives of the silent majority. They represent only themselves and their experiences
are fully their own responsibility. If you look at history, the rampaging "revolutionary" mobs have always lubricated the installation
of real oppressors and onset of real misery. This includes Ukraine in 2014. This also includes the USSR since it took until the 1950s
for things to normalize. There was no caste system in Russia to fight against in 1917 and the silent majority were not trying to break
free. The revolution was a regime change operation. Credit must go to the silent Russian majority for bending the system to their will.

China has gone through a massive transition in the last few decades... any Chinese city as little as 30 years ago and there were very few cars, most people rode bikes, their streets were full of people on bikes... then western investment and influence arrived and now they are all driving cars. Not a huge improvement for the planet actually... if 1.5 billion Chinese people start wasting resources and energy at the rate the US does the planet is fucked.

China has gone from a relatively poor country with too many people to a growing and more prosperous country with a lot of people.
And good on them... this is a case of them being clever and taking advantage of the situation the slave system(outsourcing production to places with no labour laws and cheap labour) in the west put them in.

I am glad China is doing so well and if the west wasn't so fucked up they would be looking for ways to emulate their success as best they could, but the colonial mentality means there can be only one so they seek to destroy them...

Ironically over the same time period in the US things have gotten worse more poverty and the rich 1% becoming the rich 0.1% and everyone else being poorer.

I started watching that video... what a load of bollocks... the Chinese silk road is land, sea, and air and goes in about three directions from Asia as a whole to Europe... it goes through Russia via their train network and their new north sea route by ship and presumably eventually via air because flying over one country to get to Europe is easier and simpler than trying to fly over dozens of different countries. China is negotiating with Iran for a silk route too... if it just goes the route depicted in the video why would they need to talk to Iran?

The silk road is a trade complex not just a single bridge... and everyone will benefit from it except the US and the UK now. Making trade between Europe and Asia cheaper is not useful for the US... it runs counter to their interests.

BTW poor innocent Muslims fighting evil commies... isn't that Rambo III?

Besides, with illegal death camps and rendition sites throughout Europe and the Middle East and Africa and central and south america, how does the CIA compare with the Chinese?

There are now more Chinese millionaires and billionaires than there are american ones and the difference is growing...

Oh, I hear you reply... that is the commies abusing the masses... you mean like the rich do it in the US and the west?

The difference is that anyone can join the communist party...