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    VVS Russian Air Force: News #1

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    Kimppis

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    Re: VVS Russian Air Force: News #1

    Post  Kimppis on Tue Feb 17, 2015 7:56 pm

    TR1 wrote:1.) I should be clearer, I meant serial T-50s. I would bet my savings those announcements regarding 2016 production are baloney. But that is just me.

    Ok, now I get it. That's certainly possible but did they actually say that they are going to deliver 12 in 2016? Or did they only mention that the deliveries are going to number at around 12 on average per year, or something along those lines? So let's say that they build 6 Su-50s in 2016 and 12 beginning from 2017 -> 54 delivered by the end of 2020.

    Btw, I think Russian fighter inventory is closer to 800 aircraft - not 500 - and I think that is an excellent number and enough for Russia. Around 550 newly built by 2020, that is pretty much 70% of 800. And then we can add the remaining Su-24's and Su-25's (and strategic bombers of course) -> over 1000 "combat aircraft" (or whatever the term is).  

    nemrod wrote:
    They've already ordered 24 SU-35, and has options for others, not only buying, but China could produce its own SU-35, with their new thrust vector engine WS-10G, waiting for their WS-15. US won't be able to attack China.

    No orders have been placed. Only rumours.

    Kimppis wrote:
    China is going to have around 1000 4th and 5th gen fighters by 2020 (or 2021) and that is going to increase close to 1500 by 2025. They already have around 700. And that doesn't even include 200+ JH-7s. Also the European context is important: France and UK each have only something like 200+ fighters. And we must not forget the Russian IADS.
    nemrod wrote:Very interresting.
    Could you please give us your sources.

    It's impossible to get any "official" numbers, but the Chinese have atleast 260 J-10A's and 270 J-11's. Now J-10B is coming online and atleast 24 have already been built. And they have around 100 Su-30MKK's. So that's 654 and I'm not even including their old SU-27's. In addition, they have around dozen (atleast) J-15's (for the carrier) and some new J-16's (strike fighter)... So that's roughly 700 aircraft.

    Also, it seems that J-20 is moving forward nicely, so it's probably going to enter service in 2017 at the latest, not 2019. Something like 3 new prototypes flew last year and some posters on Sinodefence forum are saying that J-20 has already entered LRIP due to the impressive progress. I think globalsecurity.org forecasted around 24 J-20's in 2020, but that number was probably based on 2019 service entry, so the numbers are likely to be higher, maybe 50 in 2020.

    So overall, it's pretty much inevitable that they will have around 1000 4th and 5th fighters in 2020, even with a reasonably modest production rate. We must also remember that they should have 200+ billion - even nominally that is - military budget in 2020. And they really need to get rid of their J-7's and J-8's as soon as possible, so it all makes sense.

    And as I already mentioned, that doesn't even include the 200+ already built JH-7s. Also, the Chinese have an impressive IADS and land-based missile force. And their navy in 2020: 2-3 CV's, 6 052C DDG's, atleast 8 (it could be 12) 052D DDG's and atleast 2 055 DDG's (around 120 VLS, 12 000 tons), not to mention 4 Sovs, atleast 40+ modern SSK's, 10+ nuclear submarines, 24+ new frigates, 24+ new corvettes... They are going to be a force to be reckoned with in the western Pacific. We are living interesting times.


    Last edited by Kimppis on Tue Feb 17, 2015 8:13 pm; edited 1 time in total

    Firebird

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    plane numbers

    Post  Firebird on Tue Feb 17, 2015 8:10 pm

    Its interesting to look at plane numbers.
    Russia is producing at quite a high rate currently.

    The downside is that many older planes are coming up to retirement age.
    AND there was a lull in production or new devlts from the 1990s thro to around the mid/late 2000s.

    The other issue is that there are numerous replacement planes in development or recently commenced production.

    In the 4/4.5th G there's the Mig 35 and the Su 34 and 35.
    And there are PAK prospective variants of the T50, a Mig 31 replacement, an Su 25 replacement, the Mig LMFS etc.

    Ideally, these would all be in mass production by now or sooner.

    America produces vast amts of equipment not to defend its own borders, but its own meddling interests around the World. Thats why it can afford it.

    To me, the solution for Russia is to find a way to make equipment pay for itself when there ISNT the threat of a war. So for me, that means Russian bases abroad, for the benefit of friends/partners/allies etc.

    If Russia can tighten and enlarge the Eurasian Union, and enhance ties with countries like India, Venezuela, perhaps Vietnam etc, then it can afford a much larger air force that isn't there mostly for the biggest and most unthinkable wars.

    -------

    http://www.russiadefence.net/viewtopic.forum?t=7007
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    George1

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    VVS Russian Air Force: News #1

    Post  George1 on Fri Feb 27, 2015 3:40 pm

    Irkut Corporation prepared documents related to development of a light strike-fighter
    Russian Aviaton » Friday February 27, 2015 14:14 MSK

    Irkut Corporation prepared documents related to development of a light strike-fighter derived from Yak-130 operational trainer for Russian Ministry of Defense, RIA Novosti reports with reference to the Senior Vice-President of Irkut Corporation, Vitaly Borodich.

    “We have prepared documentation and we are going to submit it to the Ministry of Defense. The rest is up to the customer,” Borodich said at Aero India 2015 airshow.

    Information about the possibility of developing this jet was first unveiled in 2013, it was stated that Yakovlev design bureau is considering the matter. At that Russian Ministry of Defense said earlier that a decision to abandon the project was made.

    Yak-130 is an operational trainer developed by Yakovlev design bureau. It is fitted with integrated digital control system, which provides manual and automatic flight control. The jet is also equipped with active flight safety system, which allows changing parameters of the jet’s stability and controllability during training. Yak-130 is designed for training of future pilots of fourth- and fifth-generation aircraft.

    Firebird

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    VVS Russian Air Force: News #1

    Post  Firebird on Thu Mar 19, 2015 3:44 pm

    http://rt.com/news/242097-pak-ta-russian-army/

    OK to this does look a bit like fan art. But I'm sure it CAN be done.
    The question is whether Russia and its partners will want to.

    Either way, its a seriously impressive piece of kit.

    I suppose you could do civilian variants too.

    Maybe this is Russia's way of telling America to start growing up?

    EDIT:
    They say the devil is in the detail.
    The initial plan is a 900kph aircraft, then there is talk of a 2000kph, then "probably hypersonic".

    It would be intreresting to see the planned timeframes for all 3.
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    magnumcromagnon

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    Re: VVS Russian Air Force: News #1

    Post  magnumcromagnon on Thu Mar 19, 2015 4:55 pm

    Firebird wrote:http://rt.com/news/242097-pak-ta-russian-army/

    OK to this does look a bit like fan art. But I'm sure it CAN be done.
    The question is whether Russia and its partners will want to.

    Either way, its a seriously impressive piece of kit.

    I suppose you could do civilian variants too.

    Maybe this is Russia's way of telling America to start growing up?

    EDIT:
    They say the devil is in the detail.
    The initial plan is a 900kph aircraft, then there is talk of a 2000kph, then "probably hypersonic".

    It would be intreresting to see the planned timeframes for all 3.

    Yes I reported on the PAK TA project some 6 months ago but their wasn't any specifics. My thoughts are that the project seems too optimistic, 200 ton payload capability is possible, so is supersonic speed, but both 200 ton payload and supersonic speed? I think it isn't impossible, but is it probable? It can possibly be done, however what if it turns out to be extremely expensive? Like $1 or 2 billion a piece? Surely that wouldn't be worth the cost? 200 ton payload at 'sub-sonic' speed seems like it's a more cost-effective a viable target/option, but here's a case where I would love nothing more than to be proven wrong, but I have to see it before I can believe it...as in it leaves the drawing board stage, and with actual flying prototypes that meet the advertised requirements.
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    AlfaT8

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    Re: VVS Russian Air Force: News #1

    Post  AlfaT8 on Thu Mar 19, 2015 6:39 pm

    The PAK-TA (couldn't find any vids right now as good as the one on vimeo(https://vimeo.com/103542677))


    Firebird

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    Re: VVS Russian Air Force: News #1

    Post  Firebird on Thu Mar 19, 2015 9:49 pm

    magnumcromagnon wrote:
    Firebird wrote:http://rt.com/news/242097-pak-ta-russian-army/

    OK to this does look a bit like fan art. But I'm sure it CAN be done.
    The question is whether Russia and its partners will want to.

    Either way, its a seriously impressive piece of kit.

    I suppose you could do civilian variants too.

    Maybe this is Russia's way of telling America to start growing up?

    EDIT:
    They say the devil is in the detail.
    The initial plan is a 900kph aircraft, then there is talk of a 2000kph, then "probably hypersonic".

    It would be intreresting to see the planned timeframes for all 3.

    Yes I reported on the PAK TA project some 6 months ago but their wasn't any specifics. My thoughts are that the project seems too optimistic, 200 ton payload capability is possible, so is supersonic speed, but both 200 ton payload and supersonic speed? I think it isn't impossible, but is it probable? It can possibly be done, however what if it turns out to be extremely expensive? Like $1 or 2 billion a piece? Surely that wouldn't be worth the cost? 200 ton payload at 'sub-sonic' speed seems like it's a more cost-effective a viable target/option, but here's a case where I would love nothing more than to be proven wrong, but I have to see it before I can believe it...as in it leaves the drawing board stage, and with actual flying prototypes that meet the advertised requirements.


    I was thinking, this could be a HUGE development, so I set up a separate thread for it.
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    GarryB

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    Re: VVS Russian Air Force: News #1

    Post  GarryB on Fri Mar 20, 2015 11:11 am

    Interesting stealthy design, but that single engine would have to be enormously powerful and I rather suspect it will be sub sonic or transonic rather than highly supersonic as depicted.

    Just looking at the vid I suspect the three versions are 80, 120, and 200 ton payload capacity aircraft that will be subsonic. The wing angle suggests subsonic speeds. I rather doubt it would be swing wing.

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    collegeboy16

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    Re: VVS Russian Air Force: News #1

    Post  collegeboy16 on Fri Mar 20, 2015 12:54 pm

    noice- heavy armour on demand is fckin awesome. not to mention the graphics look like one of the x-com skyranger concept grown biggur- preparing for alien invasion perhaps?
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    collegeboy16

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    Re: VVS Russian Air Force: News #1

    Post  collegeboy16 on Fri Mar 20, 2015 12:54 pm

    noice- heavy armour on demand is fckin awesome. not to mention the graphics look like one of the x-com skyranger concept grown biggur- preparing for alien invasion perhaps?
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    collegeboy16

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    Re: VVS Russian Air Force: News #1

    Post  collegeboy16 on Fri Mar 20, 2015 12:55 pm

    noice- heavy armour on demand is fckin awesome. not to mention the graphics look like one of the x-com skyranger concept grown biggur- preparing for alien invasion perhaps?
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    Cyberspec

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    Re: VVS Russian Air Force: News #1

    Post  Cyberspec on Sat Mar 21, 2015 11:04 pm

    They're building an airstrip on Franz Jozef land.

    http://www.aviaport.ru/digest/2015/03/18/331497.html

    Apparently, 2 x Il-78's + 4 x Su-34's will be based there, as well as 150 maintenance and security personell.

    Not far from the North Pole....
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    George1

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    Re: VVS Russian Air Force: News #1

    Post  George1 on Sat Mar 21, 2015 11:12 pm

    Cyberspec wrote:They're building an airstrip on Franz Jozef land.

    http://www.aviaport.ru/digest/2015/03/18/331497.html

    Apparently, 2 x Il-78's + 4 x Su-34's will be based there, as well as 150 maintenance and security personell.

    Not far from the North Pole....

    Su-34 for Naval Strike??
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    Cyberspec

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    Re: VVS Russian Air Force: News #1

    Post  Cyberspec on Sat Mar 21, 2015 11:29 pm

    George1 wrote:Su-34 for Naval Strike??

    Land and naval I would guess.....it would also be a good place for refueling heavy bombers for over the North Pole missions, which is why the Il-78's will be there for I presume
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    TheSentinel

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    Russia starts new drills in Southern Siberia

    Post  TheSentinel on Wed Mar 25, 2015 1:44 pm

    Russia has confirmed that the Eastern Military District will start new military drills in the Republic of Buryatia.

    S-300 SAM, Su-30 Flanker and Su-25 Frogfoot aircrafts to take part in the drills.

    Wrote something on my blog about it. I can'T wait to be able to post my links Razz

    Have a great day all!
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    Cyberspec

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    Re: VVS Russian Air Force: News #1

    Post  Cyberspec on Thu Mar 26, 2015 8:55 am

    Nice...


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