Talking bollocks thread #2

Australians and New Zealanders never even fought each other.

Have you never seen an ANZAC Rugby League game or an ANZAC Rugby game?

I don't like Russia's approach

It's all about making money, maintaining leverage and trying to balance power in a sensitive area. Which is fair enough.

But Russia can't treat it's allies like shit, like it's doing with Armenia, even if it's not turning their back on them.

Now Russia is shitting a brick over Lukashenko flirting with the West, even though it likes to pretend it isn't. But what's the surprise here. Lukashenko offered full integration, with opportunities for Russian defense industry contracts for Belarussian companies. Russia didn't like that, it insisted that Kamaz must own MZKT and so on.
Then Lukashenko proposed equal energy prices for Russia and Belarus. Again it's a fair proposal, if both countries want to form some sort of confederation. But Russia looked to maximize profit and avoid handouts. Under Putin, who has been stating publically that Lenin's division of the Russian Empire into seperate union republics and autonomous republics within larger ones - was a mistake - Russia seems to be insisting that the only way Belarus can get such conditions is that if it becomes part of Russia. But that's completely unreasonable; they're their own large sovereign people with their own country. Why should they accept provincial status in Russia?

This is also the reason Russia lost the Ukraine. It didn't even pay any attention to it, until the EU started to make a move. It had 20 years to deepen ties with the Ukraine, pursue integration projects, rather than constantly squabbling with the Ukraine over gas prices and offering to buy the Slava cruiser for $0. Completely ridiculous.

Russia with this attitude will lose Belarus, and it will lose Armenia. It acts like these countries have no other options; but that's true only for the time being.

Why should they accept provincial status in Russia?

It's a shithole country with poor people anf a paria dictator. They can turn to EU as much they want, they won't be helped. The only considaration westerns can think about them is to destroy them like they did in Ukraine to harm russian sphere of influence.

Forming a big country with Russia will help both parties since the bigger you are the better is you situation and the safer you are.

Is there really a difference btw belorussians and russians ?

flamming_python wrote:I don't like...

What Russia needs to do with Lukashenko is to have him used as decoration for lamppost in downtown Minsk and to arrange for someone more cooperative to get into the office

It's a tried and true solution that always gets results and which Russian Western partners have been using successfully for ages

Russia had been pussyfooting around him (and others) way too much

As for the Ukraine have you missed the part where for better half of the century the Ukrainians have been worshipping Nazis and prefered to starve to death rather than to have anything to do with Russia?

They have despised you all since forever and while they would not say no to free stuff you have been giving them all this time they would never reduce themselves to voluntarily be part of anything that involves you


It was clear as day to anyone except Russians apparently...

flamming_python wrote:I don't like Russia's approach

It's all about making money, maintaining leverage and trying to balance power in a sensitive area. Which is fair enough.

But Russia can't treat it's allies like shit, like it's doing with Armenia, even if it's not turning their back on them.

Now Russia is shitting a brick over Lukashenko flirting with the West, even though it likes to pretend it isn't. But what's the surprise here. Lukashenko offered full integration, with opportunities for Russian defense industry contracts for Belarussian companies. Russia didn't like that, it insisted that Kamaz must own MZKT and so on.
Then Lukashenko proposed equal energy prices for Russia and Belarus. Again it's a fair proposal, if both countries want to form some sort of confederation. But Russia looked to maximize profit and avoid handouts. Under Putin, who has been stating publically that Lenin's division of the Russian Empire into seperate union republics and autonomous republics within larger ones - was a mistake - Russia seems to be insisting that the only way Belarus can get such conditions is that if it becomes part of Russia. But that's completely unreasonable; they're their own large sovereign people with their own country. Why should they accept provincial status in Russia?

This is also the reason Russia lost the Ukraine. It didn't even pay any attention to it, until the EU started to make a move. It had 20 years to deepen ties with the Ukraine, pursue integration projects, rather than constantly squabbling with the Ukraine over gas prices and offering to buy the Slava cruiser for $0. Completely ridiculous.

Russia with this attitude will lose Belarus, and it will lose Armenia. It acts like these countries have no other options; but that's true only for the time being.

If they feel that way, then Belarussian can also pay foreign prices on gas. So you are OK giving them prices that Russians regions get, yet also ok they want to be independent?  There is a lot of self contradict right there.

Lukashenko is fucking up badly. Ukraine is gone as Papa said. Russia's best case is to support seperation in Ukraine to get allied regions and rest of shit hole Ukraine can go beat off American dicks for the cream filling to feed them.

Russia has a base in Armenia. Azerbaijan won't attack directly because of that.

calripson wrote:Lukashenko was against the break up of the Soviet Union in 1991. He had nostalgia for the USSR and when integration was first proposed in 1999 he saw himself as a successor to Yeltsin. Putin saw him as a threat as did the oligarchs and liberals who rejected any kind of faux USSR. On a personal level, there has never been good chemistry between Putin and Lukashenko. Fast forward 20 years and an entire generation has come of age in Belarus with no particular affinity to Russia other than language. It is too late for integration. Post Lukashenko Belarus will drift to the West.

People see how anti-Russian Ukraine is today, but 50 years ago Kiev and Kharkov were almost 100% Russian speaking and politically pretty neutral. Much like  Belarus today.

If one is smart, which most are not obviously, they would also see how Ukraine ended up when it became anti Russian.

Western countries hate slavs. Germans hate us, Americans hate us, French hate us, etc. Yet they managed to get our people to hate each other. Pretty impressive. They dont even do well in helping the eastern countries actually become decent nations. But instead, they manage to convince the population to hate Russia and thats all they get.

But Russia is also at fault. Instead of being more aggressive and keeping its foot down, they instead pander to the west that is doing what it can to split the country apart and stir trouble. As Flaming mentioned, Germany is one of said nations doing this to Russia. Yet Russian leadership is fine in trying to pander to them.

calripson wrote:Lukashenko was against the break up of the Soviet Union in 1991. He had nostalgia for the USSR and when integration was first proposed in 1999 he saw himself as a successor to Yeltsin. Putin saw him as a threat as did the oligarchs and liberals who rejected any kind of faux USSR. On a personal level, there has never been good chemistry between Putin and Lukashenko.

Fast forward 20 years and an entire generation has come of age in Belarus with no particular affinity to Russia other than language. It is too late for integration. Post Lukashenko Belarus will drift to the West.

Russia #1 problem , is Russia poor influence over its former soviet republics.. the culture of russia ends
at russian borders. and american and european culture start after that.. in fact even inside russia
in most major cities.. a big part of the population is also influenced heavily by american culture..
by american music , american movies , american entertainment and video games. american iphones
american computers, american internet ,american space exploration program , american this and that..

and this is all about US total domination of their ,modern era business vs soviet era russian business..
Putin development of Russia ,how he invest and develop russia economy , is to blame for this.. he have
spend his entire political carreer and energies.. in trying to turn russia into a gas station , a saudi arabia of asia..
that is a complete lazy economy.. that takes very little risk.. and allows Russia enemies to dominate and lead in the world in most popular business..

so Russia don't influence belarus or ukrainians.. because of how mediocre is putin.. he don't see the connection
of his outdated vision of russia development ,with the lack of influence of russia vs us..
So Putin and his sport and religion and attachment for soviet old days , will have to go ,in order for russia
to expand and grow and develop a new identity and a modern culture too..  without abandoning
family values..and public order.

young generations feel more attracted in russia for american culture ,than russian one..
and this happens when a country government focus in the past so much , on their good old days..
instead of reinventing Russia in a new way ,in a more future looking business economy .

https://www.rt.com/news/212527-eye-sauron-moscow-scyscraper/

in ukraine they removed russian heroes statues of world war 2 ..and replaced them with
american movies film characters.. so putin in my opinion have done more harm ,to russia ,that the good.
russia needs a young generation leadership in charge of russia.. that looks to the future . and not to the past
as putin does all the time.

what american culture promote.. is liked by all russians..

Comic Con Russia


what Putin's Russia promote.. the "great" old russian traditions.



is not wonder the image of russia is of the like of a third world nation in terms of identity and culture..
with cheap gas and nukes.. and why russia not taken seriously by the west and disrespected so much..

only rejected nations like iran ,north korea , and those in middle east that depends
on russia for its existence , follow russia.

What the moron Putin don't understand is that traditions = forms of entertainment
that society use to not die of boringness.. and all that entertainment is limited by the
business development of the country..

because putin's vision of russia is not focused in innovative modern business.. but instead in the old
low risk ,bananas and food exports republic with cheap gas station..sports and tanks.. then russian business don't inspire much the russian culture at all.. so young generations ,need to look either elsewhere ,for the west ,for entertainment, or look at the mediocre past... had russia economy was based on innovative business..
in high tech and space exploration.. and not on third world nation style economies , in africa ,that depends on mining and oil..most of their economy.. had russia was a leader in world development and innovation.. then things will have been completely different in russia.. and ukraine and belarus will be doing protest.. not to split from russia.. but to re-join it.. again..   So effectively Putin's mediocre development of russia economy and business ,hold back the potential of russia to become a very influential nation.. among the most developed nations.

Vann7 wrote:

calripson wrote:Lukashenko was against the break up of the Soviet Union in 1991. He had nostalgia for the USSR and when integration was first proposed in 1999 he saw himself as a successor to Yeltsin. Putin saw him as a threat as did the oligarchs and liberals who rejected any kind of faux USSR. On a personal level, there has never been good chemistry between Putin and Lukashenko.

Fast forward 20 years and an entire generation has come of age in Belarus with no particular affinity to Russia other than language. It is too late for integration. Post Lukashenko Belarus will drift to the West.

Russia #1 problem , is Russia poor influence over its former soviet republics.. the culture of russia ends
at russian borders. and american and european culture start after that.. in fact even inside russia
in most major cities.. a big part of the population is also influenced heavily by american culture..
by american music , american movies , american entertainment and video games. american iphones
american computers, american internet ,american space exploration program , american this and that..

and this is all about US total domination of their ,modern era business vs soviet era russian business..
Putin development of Russia ,how he invest and develop russia economy , is to blame for this.. he have
spend his entire political carreer and energies.. in trying to turn russia into a gas station , a saudi arabia of asia..
that is a complete lazy economy.. that takes very little risk.. and allows Russia enemies to dominate and lead in the world in most popular business..

so Russia don't influence belarus or ukrainians.. because of how mediocre is putin.. he don't see the connection
of his outdated vision of russia development ,with the lack of influence of russia vs us..
So Putin and his sport and religion and attachment for soviet old days , will have to go ,in order for russia
to expand and grow and develop a new identity and a modern culture too..  without abandoning
family values..and public order.

young generations feel more attracted in russia for american culture ,than russian one..
and this happens when a country government focus in the past so much , on their good old days..
instead of reinventing Russia in a new way ,in a more future looking business economy .

https://www.rt.com/news/212527-eye-sauron-moscow-scyscraper/

in ukraine they removed russian heroes statues of world war 2 ..and replaced them with
american movies film characters.. so putin in my opinion have done more harm ,to russia ,that the good.
russia needs a young generation leadership in charge of russia.. that looks to the future . and not to the past
as putin does all the time.

what american culture promote.. is liked by all russians..

Comic Con Russia


what Putin's Russia promote.. the "great" old russian traditions.



is not wonder the image of russia is of the like of a third world nation in terms of identity and culture..
with cheap gas and nukes.. and why russia not taken seriously by the west and disrespected so much..

only rejected nations like iran ,north korea , and those in middle east that depends
on russia for its existence , follow russia.  

What the moron Putin don't understand is that traditions = forms of entertainment
that society use to not die of boringness.. and all that entertainment is limited by the
business development of the country..

because putin's vision of russia is not focused in innovative modern business.. but instead in the old
low risk ,bananas and food exports republic with cheap gas station..sports and tanks.. then russian business don't inspire much the russian culture at all.. so young generations ,need to look either elsewhere ,for the west ,for entertainment, or look at the mediocre past... had russia economy was based on innovative business..
in high tech and space exploration.. and not on third world nation style economies , in africa ,that depends on mining and oil..most of their economy.. had russia was a leader in world development and innovation.. then things will have been completely different in russia.. and ukraine and belarus will be doing protest.. not to split from russia.. but to re-join it.. again..   So effectively Putin's mediocre development of russia economy and business ,hold back the potential of russia to become a very influential nation.. among the most developed nations.

Vann, what has to do what you wrote with the Su-57?

Anyway, I agree that Russia has not yet developed the same soft power and influence as USA, but they are slowly moving in the right direction.

Concerning their influence on other nation,  I would not use the DC and Marvel comic as a great example of culture. Yes people watch them, and they probably are useful in their propaganda, (as other Hollywood productions where the military might of the USA shines and it's perfect).

However I would call it being totally detached from reality.

A big chunk of the western adult population is composed by immature men and women that have no concept of responsibility,  respect and consequences for their own actions. And this phenomenon has expanded also to other nations. Sooner or later there will be a (very painful) wake call.

And about American culture... in the last year of the soviet union, even in Moscow many people were loving everything American, because they really believed and wanted to believe in all the american propaganda, hoping that emulating the american would bring them to a better life and with a western style democracy they would be all rich.

History proved them wrong. Nevertheless other ex soviet nation are still today in the path of trying to be good dogs for the americans ... we will see how long this will last

Edit: Garry, I saw that you moved a few posts in the talking bollock thread. Please feel free to move also this post accordingly, since it was a response to Vann and has nothing to do with the Su57

Rodion_Romanovic wrote:
Anyway, I agree that Russia has not yet developed the same soft power and influence as USA, but they are slowly moving in the right direction.

Concerning their influence on other nation,  I would not use the DC and Marvel comic as a great example of culture. Yes people watch them, and they probably are useful in their propaganda, (as other Hollywood productions where the military might of the USA shines and it's perfect).

However I would call it being totally detached from reality.

A big chunk of the western adult population is composed by immature men and women that have no concept of responsibility,  respect and consequences for their own actions. And this phenomenon has expanded also to other nations. Sooner or later there will be a (very painful) wake call.

And about American culture... in the last year of the soviet union, even in Moscow many people were loving everything American, because they really believed and wanted to believe in all the american propaganda, hoping that emulating the american would bring them to a better life and with a western style democracy they would be all rich.

You are mixing subjects... american media and  american politics IS propaganda...  there is no question
about it.. but entertainment is entertainment..  is neither good or bad .. true or false.. is just what is entertainment. So the failure of american empire of taking the entire world. .absolute control of it..
after being so close.. in the 90s..  have nothing to do with american culture.. but with american politics
instead..  their greed and arrogance growth so much ,that began to make major big mistakes ..in trying to control the last remaining part of the world by force.. by financing terrorism ,by sanctions , by invading nations after nations.. by disconnecting from the american society..by going to far to the left and promoting anti family values and abandoning their christian roots and becoming only  a government for the interest of the jews super rich and for israel..  Putin is the Architech of the Russia development direction and he have invested from the russian budget trillions and trillions of americans dollars building pipelines ,to transform russia into a monopoly in energy , in sport events and in military parades and promoting the past... in total foolishness.. in making alliances with third world nations ,have to feed them  and later have to forgive their debt..  so putin policy in russia  and his popularity will have been completely the opposite today... and become the most rejected politician.. had the european union (germany and france) did not saved russia ass in ukraine.. and blocked americans from using ukraine as a vietnam for russia.. and saved also when clinton lost the election.. because
she was promoting to shot down russian planes... if american +uk+france+ israel + turkey+jordan.. basically almost the entire border nations with syria..  goes full scale war against syria , it will have been a total disaster for putin.. it will have been an unwinable war ..their base over run and he forced to admit defeat.. and syria totally over run..  in other words.. Putin is not history today ,and probably not in a jail ,
for incompetent after losing thousands of soldiers in syria.. only by luck..  

but luck is not strategy.. Russia needs a real foreign policy , with clear objectives.. to end the influence
of american system .. by having better business ,a better culture that directly compete with the west..
to transform russia economic dependence in space exploration business and not in bananas or olympics foolishness.  but he is doing absolutely zero.. NOTHING. to counter the soft power ,the us superior influence by staying as a gas station focused economy.
.
garryb did not understood why europe is important.. and i told him , because thats where nato is.. and if russia wants to end the siege of the west on russian borders.. end the stocking of nukes and missiles aiming at russia in europe.. then putin need to break NATO in a million of pieces...and using nukes will be not ideal way to do it.. because of the consequences.. so the other only way with with Business Leadership in the things society ,young and adults consider more valuable for them..  If putin understood clearly what he is doing.. his mistakes.. he will be taking extremely seriously , to defeat american business influence in the world ,to take away their lead.. and get the world.. specially europe and asian high tech giants to follow Russia orbit and not NATO.

This is yet another bad example. It is totally out of the context.


This is a reply to GarryB's posts, originally on another thread, but since he moved my post here, it sounds kind of out of context here.

Clever Garry.

The US fought the English in their war of independence, Americans fought one another in their civil war, the British and French have had an enormous number of wars over the centuries and the Germans have fought all those countries too, Japan has fought Russia and the Soviet Union and Korea and China and the US and the British and French... what are you trying to say... that countries that have fought each other can never be friends or that countries that have never fought each other can be friends?

New Zealand hasn't had a war with the UK, but despite us being a fairly critical source of wool and meat for them during WWI and WWII they pretty much ditched us as allies and friends when they joined the EU and basically stepped behind a wall and stopped trading with us and started trading through the EU with the outside world including us.

The fact that we sent troops to help them in many of their wars that we would otherwise have very little to do with like the Boer war, WWI, WWII, etc etc they dropped us like a used tea bag...

We were no longer useful to them and stood in the way of them joining an economic union that would make them more money so they dropped us like a hot rock.

For Georgia, they need to decide whether they want these two regions back with the people currently living there together in the same deal because you can't separate them.... that is what the Serbs allegedly tried to do in Kosovo and that is a war crime according to Europe... or do they join NATO and the EU and become fabulously wealthy and powerful and be able to dictate terms to their tiny neighbour to the north.... Russia...

Yeah, seems like some in Georgia are drinking the kool aide, but either way they are not going to be happy...

GarryB wrote: We were no longer useful to them and stood in the way of them joining an economic union that would make them more money so they dropped us like a hot rock.

But even today there is a groundswell of support for UK in New Zealand and vice versa. The people that the Brits, Aussies Kiwis tend to dislike are Asians and Africans. Probably for all the right reason but there is no animosity towards Britain in New Zealand and Australia. I meet a whole lot of Aussies, Kiwis in both UK and US and they have mutual admiration for one another.

It is easier to like the UK when you don't do an enormous amount of trade with them on their terms like we used to...

It is a bit of a tradition for New Zealanders to head to London for an overseas experience... ie OE... and when they get there they often end up in the same shit pubs and hostels as other kiwis and aussies so it often feels like a home away from home.

I think with the UK cutting itself off from the EU that things might be going to change quite a bit, and not for the better, and I suspect a lot of Brits might think they can re-establish the old commonwealth ties where we supplied resources and they paid us peanuts.

I think they are in for a bit of a shock... of course we will trade with them, but I suspect they will need enormous tariffs and mechanisms to protect their farmers because a tiny farm in the UK with 50 sheep where the farmer takes the sheep inside every night so they don't get too cold really can't compete with a New Zealand farmer with 5,000 sheep that don't need to be coddled like a baby, let alone an Aussie farmer who... even though they have problems with draught and also with bush fires still maintain farms bigger than the country of Wales with a few million sheep.

If you want to know how close relations are do a search on Jeremy Clarksons recent discussion about Australia in the UK papers... what a dick.

Most people in cities in Aussie look to the US for leadership, but I can tell you that their farmers and their miners are looking more to China because that is where their income is coming from.

The huge bush fires are all getting blamed on climate change in all the western media... what they don't say is that the greenies have been stopping the locals from having controlled burn offs and removing dead wood... something they have been doing for centuries... even the abos knew that controlled burn offs were needed... lightning often starts them anyway, but this time they have arrested quite a few people for setting these fires too.

This is happening because of nature and the fact that greenies don't actually understand nature... greenies are not interested in the planet or nature.... they want to save stuff... animals and plants... don't burn that area of scrub you might kill a dozen rare and endangered yellow tailed geckos.... don't take away that dead wood, there are rare snails that live in there.... so now they estimate the fires there have killed half a billion animals... but climate change will get the blame it is like here in NZ they had an agenda to get rid of guns and a shocking incident allowed them to push through their agenda without proper scrutiny. The agenda of the greenies in Oz is anti coal and anti oil... and the knee jerk response from most people who have nothing to do with either is that it is probably a good thing anyway... but don't think about it... it will probably end up making things much much worse... with 3D printers and modern CNC cutting machines making your own guns is going to be a reality pretty soon and if China can't get Aussie coal they will just buy it from somewhere else... the coal will still burn, but Australia wont make any money from it...

GarryB wrote:Most people in cities in Aussie look to the US for leadership, but I can tell you that their farmers and their miners are looking more to China because that is where their income is coming from.

Have you been to Australia lately?

Farmers, miners too look upto US for leadership. They will invariably tell you that there is a tremendous amount of synergy between US and Australia/NZ. Not to forget that they both come from the same Anglo-Saxon stock. Several Australian/NZ leaders acquire their educational degrees from US and UK. They even undertake programs run by US State department.

While China is an important market there is also a tremendous amount of fear of China in Australia coupled with the large influx of Chinese, Indians, Vietnamese into Australia. Most Australians fear that soon Whites will become a minority. This fear will keep Australia deeply connected to the US and UK for generations.

Yeah, I know deep down Aussies are racist bastards... they only stopped counting aboriginals as flora and fauna in the 1967 census...

Most white people down here believe the hollywood bullshit... you know... America saved our asses in WWII and all that bullshit... completely ignoring the facts that they created the situation in the first place with sanctions and blockades of Japan... not that Japan is innocent of course, but they didn't really do much until Japan attacked them and then they helped "us".

In western society these days you stay quiet till you know the leanings of the people around you and then you either join in or stay quiet.

If someone makes a racist or sexist joke and everyone laughs then people will become more open and honest about their beliefs, but most of the time they get dirty looks often from the most sexist and most racist there and the lie continues.

Many aussies and kiwis get their news from TV and don't try to find alternative views, so they are not really properly informed about what is really happening and honestly really don't care. The Aussies wouldn't really care about US bush fires... they never mentioned the big fires in Russia recently... if it doesn't effect them they don't care... it is not an Aussie thing... it is a western thing... the agenda is climate change not the suffering of individuals in other countries.

Ironically the reasons they are having such problems with bush fires at the moment is because of the power of the greenies who wont let small burn offs take place and wont let wood on the ground be taken away and used in wood burners... small burn offs do kill a lot of native animals... it can't be helped... collecting up all the different animal types from insects to birds and mammals and other animals would be impossible, so they banned burnoffs... they have had controlled fires for thousands of years... even the natives burned off areas of bush... they actually have a few plants that actually require a fire to survive... in fact the Californian Red Wood needs a fire to clear an open space but also to release the seeds so they can grow... no animal can break open a red wood seed it can only be released by a fire to grow new red wood trees.

Greenies don't understand balance and don't want anything to die at all... they were clearly brought up on Disney cartoons.

Anyway most of this is off topic so I will be moving it to the talking bollocks section soon.

GarryB wrote:
Werner Von Braun was a Nazi War Criminal... who looked after him and gave him a nice house and a very good paying job and all the resources he needed and brought all his mates over to the US too?

Majority of Jews killed by Nazis during WW-II were jews of color. Not White Jews.

jhelb wrote:

GarryB wrote:
Werner Von Braun was a Nazi War Criminal... who looked after him and gave him a nice house and a very good paying job and all the resources he needed and brought all his mates over to the US too?

Majority of Jews killed by Nazis during WW-II were jews of color. Not White Jews.

Wut?

Jews of what color? Light beige?

GTFOH

PapaDragon wrote:

Wut?

Jews of what color? Light beige?

GTFOH

https://www.haaretz.com/israel-news/.premium-why-north-african-jews-are-missing-from-the-holocaust-narrative-1.5629410

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jews_outside_Europe_under_Axis_occupation

jhelb wrote:

PapaDragon wrote:

Wut?

Jews of what color? Light beige?

GTFOH

https://www.haaretz.com/israel-news/.premium-why-north-african-jews-are-missing-from-the-holocaust-narrative-1.5629410
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jews_outside_Europe_under_Axis_occupation

Nazis didn't reach Central Africa, what of it?

jhelb wrote:

GarryB wrote:
Werner Von Braun was a Nazi War Criminal... who looked after him and gave him a nice house and a very good paying job and all the resources he needed and brought all his mates over to the US too?

Majority of Jews killed by Nazis during WW-II were jews of color. Not White Jews.

Sadly, there are plenty of photos of Jews being slaughtered or after slaughter. Kindly provide one image of a 'Jew of colour'.

auslander wrote:Kindly provide one image of a 'Jew of colour'.

Already provided the links in my previous post

jhelb wrote:

auslander wrote:Kindly provide one image of a 'Jew of colour'.

Already provided the links in my previous post

Link to verified images? Wikipedia is, ummm, not a totally reliable source.