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nomadski
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    US ABM Systems

    Singular_Transform
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    Post  Singular_Transform Sun Dec 11, 2016 11:49 am

    Austin wrote:Interesting concept to kill MIRV

    Get Ready Russia, China, Iran and North Korea: America's Missile Defense Program Is Going 'Star Wars'

    The Multi-Object Kill Vehicle can simultaneously destroy ICBMs and decoys with a single interceptor.



    Anyone who designed it is a egomaniac, messianic psychopath.

    It is an attacking system, target of it is to be able to deliver a nuclear strike without any fear of the retaliation.


    It is against the nuclear non proliferation treaty as well, because it will increase the number of warheads and delivery vehicles.


    Direct consequence of any kill system like this:
    -cancellation of any arm reduction treaty
    -development and fielding new type of nuclear delivery vehicles
    -Military alliance between china/russia (maybe india?)
    -Scaling up the Chinese nuclear stockpile and delivery capacity
    -Increasing the military spending in chine to 10%, and fielding a military that never been seen in the history ( and making the US military compared to Chinese as big as the UK military is compared the the US )
    -Occupation of Taiwan by china


    The bare minimum that it will cause is new generation of icbms with multiple bus systems, and increasing the number of ballistic missiles/warheads.

    JohninMK
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    Post  JohninMK Sun Dec 11, 2016 12:33 pm

    Singular_Transform wrote:
    Austin wrote:Interesting concept to kill MIRV

    Get Ready Russia, China, Iran and North Korea: America's Missile Defense Program Is Going 'Star Wars'

    The Multi-Object Kill Vehicle can simultaneously destroy ICBMs and decoys with a single interceptor.



    Anyone who designed it is a egomaniac, messianic psychopath.

    It is an attacking system, target of it is to be able to deliver a nuclear strike without any fear of the retaliation.

    It is against the nuclear non proliferation treaty as well, because it will increase the number of warheads and delivery vehicles.

    Direct consequence of any kill system like this:
    -cancellation of any arm reduction treaty
    -development and fielding new type of nuclear delivery vehicles
    -Military alliance between china/russia (maybe india?)
    -Scaling up the Chinese nuclear stockpile and delivery capacity
    -Increasing the military spending in chine to 10%, and fielding a military that never been seen in the history ( and making the US military compared to Chinese as big as the UK military is compared the the US )
    -Occupation of Taiwan by china

    The bare minimum that it will cause is new generation of icbms with multiple bus systems, and increasing the number of ballistic missiles/warheads.
    Think you might be missing the point of all this puff. It is creating a scenario to generate more profit opportunities for the MIC. They already have upgrade contracts for the existing systems that need sorting, their need now is for the R&D to start on the next generation of profit creators.

    Don't forget that the MIC really don't care how well their products actually work and the militaries plan round the reality. In the situation where it did actually matter then the world would have been destroyed and no-one would be left to be held to account.
    Singular_Transform
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    Post  Singular_Transform Sun Dec 11, 2016 1:31 pm

    JohninMK wrote:
    Think you might be missing the point of all this puff. It is creating a scenario to generate more profit opportunities for the MIC. They already have upgrade contracts for the existing systems that need sorting, their need now is for the R&D to start on the next generation of profit creators.

    Don't forget that the MIC really don't care how well their products actually work and the militaries plan round the reality. In the situation where it did actually matter then the world would have been destroyed and no-one would be left to be held to account.

    Doesn't matter.

    Even if the Raytheon ship empty containers ,and making false claims the Chinese/Russian/_Indian political / military planners will be prompted to react , and to start to pump out new warheads and rocket systems.
    miketheterrible
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    Post  miketheterrible Sun Dec 11, 2016 2:18 pm

    Pretty much. Russia will end up researching ways to bypass such systems or render them useless and China will build up their arsenal so that if 10 - 40% of their arsenal can be destroyed, then they can still cause enough damage to end the world.

    It is just another nuclear arms race, but with anti ballistic missile defense systems added to the equation.
    GarryB
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    Post  GarryB Mon Dec 12, 2016 7:26 am

    Yes... the whole point of the ABM treaty was to KEEP MAD.

    Without mutually assured destruction you need trust... ahahahahahahahahahaha and that is worth exactly nothing.

    It does not matter if it works or not... if the users think it works the result will be they will think they are working from a position of strength... the fact that they will be destroyed too will come as little consolation when they start a war and everyone loses.

    Multiple intercept ABM systems have been on the agenda since day one... they tended to be third stage upgrades set for the early 2020s.

    The first stage is basic, while the final stages are supposed to offer comprehensive protection from all ICBM and SLBM threats.

    In other words INF treaty and new START go out the window and simple overwhelming the enemy becomes the easy option.

    Of course a nuclear powered jet motor powering large unlimited cruise missiles becomes another option too.
    miketheterrible
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    Post  miketheterrible Mon Dec 12, 2016 7:38 am

    There are multiple of systems capable of dealing with such threats. The technology behind this has been undergoing development since the 60's. Essentially, the systems track and trace standard ballistic paths, especially when they are in space. But what if the missile doesn't fly in a standard trajectory? This is what the Russians have been working on and developing. Quasi-Ballistic missile path. Right now, only known missile capable of this is the Iskander. But future ballistic missiles will be using this concept. Other way is making them faster, and well, that is already happening too. Especially with development of hypersonic systems. Then of course is changing the decoy structure so that it confuses the ABM system. And then there is the idea of striking the ABM sites first and foremost by overwhelming the system with cruise missiles and short range BM's. long range, air launched cruise missiles and even ground launched ones are ideal. But due to silly military agreements, Russia cannot build long range, ground multi-launched cruise missile systems or US and rest of the west cries alot.

    So other method is Russia to simply also to further move its development of Nudol and S-500 system. I have no idea where they currently are with that though. Hopefully we will see it soon.
    George1
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    Post  George1 Tue Feb 07, 2017 12:05 pm

    New US Missile Hits Target in Space

    The US Department of Defense Missile Defense Agency and Raytheon have successfully tested a missile that intercepts enemy missiles in space.

    The SM-3 IIA missile can sense ballistic missile attacks from space and neutralize the threats. The SM-3 made its debut by eliminating a ballistic missile fired from the Navy’s USS John Paul Jones destroyer.

    The idea for the mission was conceived and motivated, in part, by Star Wars, according to Scout Warrior’s Kris Osborn. “Now that technology is getting better,” he said, “exoatmospheric” missiles can intercept short- and medium-range ballistic missiles descending from outer space. The anti-missile technology would come in handy if the medium-range DF-16 missile tested by the Chinese People’s Liberation Army gets deployed.

    The next-generation missile is being developed by both Washington and Tokyo, Scout reported. Further, the US plans to deploy the missile in Poland by 2018. The successful launch took place in the Pacific Ocean off the coast of Hawaii.

    Raytheon said that the 21-inch airframe allows US and Japanese forces to defend a larger area. “Now we have a higher sensitivity—so that is just a better seeker,” Raytheon SM-3 program director Amy Cohen said.

    “The SM-3 Block IIA missile is a larger version of the SM-3 IB in terms of boosters and the kinetic warhead, which allows for increased operating time,” the Missile Defense Agency said in a statement. Other officials asserted that the test was a “critical milestone” and that it was a “vitally important” achievement for preparing against “increasing ballistic missile threats around the world.”
    The first SM-3 interceptor in a double shot missile defense test rockets skyward to strike out a ballistic missile target off the coast of Kauai, Hawaii.

    The administration of US President Donald Trump has made state-of-the-art missile defense a top priority.

    https://sputniknews.com/military/201702071050411099-new-missile-hits-space-target/
    nomadski
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    Post  nomadski Tue Feb 07, 2017 11:28 pm

    This missile defense idea must be thought of , for use against nuclear missiles . But nature of nukes is self limiting . Say by some fluke that a war starts between two nuke armed nations . ( in reality this is very difficult to imagine . Just look at India and Pakistan . Their version of " war " , is a twenty gun salute across the himalayas . Causing avalanches ! Since the fear of nukes keeps them away from even a conventional skirmish ) . And one nation launches a limited strike . Then even the best missile defences can not stop all nuke attacks. Remember other attacks like suitcase nukes ! And say one gets through and kills a million people . Then the nation suffering this attack must retaliate . The choice is then to launch a similar attack or a larger attack . A larger attack will invite even a larger response . Ultimately leading to mutual assured destruction . So the only alternative is to launch and allow the destruction of a similar target , in the other country . So the politicians will allow enemy missile to hit target . To avoid total destruction . They may even do it themselves . After this initial exchange . Both sides will quickly declare peace ! So missile defence is useless and waste of money .
    GarryB
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    Post  GarryB Wed Feb 08, 2017 8:51 am

    Actually the real danger of ABM systems is that over time as they develop some people might get the idea that they are actually effective.

    No one is going to launch a limited strike... that is just western bullshit.

    I think the best analogy is a western gun fight.

    The western belief was gradual escalation... two guys start swearing and cursing each other and then throw bottles and plates at each other... escalating to punches and throwing chairs and tables and eventually one will go for their gun and then so will the other.

    The reality is that no one is going to pick up a chair to throw if the risk is that the other guy will then go for their gun while you have your hands full... you go for your gun first and try to kill the other guy so they don't shoot you.

    Back to countries it takes about 30 minutes for ICBMs to make the trip so even after you launch the other guy has 30 minutes to launch their missiles.

    Once it is confirmed the enemy has launched an attack it can be assumed a primary target is your nuclear capability so you have to launch a full retaliatory strike or let his missiles destroy your missiles before you can use them.

    There wont be any graduated response.

    ABM defences actually make nuclear war more likely because it could lead one side to over confidence... believing they could survive... whether they can or cannot is not important... they just need to think they can for it to be dangerous.
    George1
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    Post  George1 Tue Mar 07, 2017 3:08 pm

    US Deploys THAAD System in South Korea

    The United States military has started deployment of THAAD system in South Korea, US military official stated.

    Lockheed Martin shows the Terminal High Altitude Area Defense system, or THAAD missile being launched from a mobile launcher at Kauai's Pacific Missile Range Facility

    TOKYO (Sputnik) — The United States has started the process of deployment of the Terminal High Altitude Area Defense (THAAD) anti-ballistic missile system in South Korea, media reported Tuesday citing a Defense Ministry official.

    According to the Yonhap News Agency, parts of the system were delivered on Monday to the Osan Air Base in Pyeongtaek, 43 miles south of Seoul.

    The THAAD system has a range of over 200 kilometers (125 miles) and is designed to intercept short, medium and intermediate ballistic missiles at the terminal incoming stage. The agreement on THAAD between South Korea and the United States was reached in July 2016, spurred by North Korea's nuclear program development.

    Earlier, US Department of Defense spokesman Navy Commander Gary Ross told Sputnik that Missile launches by North Korea confirmed that the decision to deploy the THAAD system to South Korea was right.

    On Monday, media reported that North Korea fired four ballistic missiles, and three landed in Japan's exclusive economic zone, triggering a negative reaction from, Seoul, Tokyo and their allies.

    https://sputniknews.com/asia/201703071051327217-usa-deploys-thaad-korea/
    max steel
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    Post  max steel Mon May 01, 2017 10:37 pm

    A flawed missile defense system generates $2 billion in bonuses for Boeing


    While homeland missile defense system faltered, prime contractor Boeing Co. collected $2 billion in bonuses.
    max steel
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    Post  max steel Mon May 01, 2017 10:49 pm

    Can the U.S. defend against a North Korean missile strike?
    max steel
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    Post  max steel Mon May 01, 2017 10:58 pm

    A test of America's homeland missile defense system found a problem. Why did the Pentagon call it a success?
    max steel
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    Post  max steel Mon May 01, 2017 11:03 pm

    U.S. missile defense system is ‘simply unable to protect the public,’ report says


    JohninMK
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    Post  JohninMK Mon May 01, 2017 11:15 pm

    max steel wrote:A test of America's homeland missile defense system found a problem. Why did the Pentagon call it a success?
    Any update since that article Max?
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    Post  max steel Mon May 01, 2017 11:16 pm

    The nation’s missile-defense system has serious flaws. So why is the Pentagon moving to expand it?

    max steel
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    Post  max steel Mon May 01, 2017 11:19 pm

    Troubled Army blimp program faces deep funding cut


    HOW NSA BLIMP SPIED IN THE UNITED STATES
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    Post  max steel Mon May 01, 2017 11:29 pm

    JohninMK wrote:Any update since that article Max?


    Well US Ground based Interceptors are not still reliable. You can read the articles I mentioned in this thread and US SAM thread to update your facts.

    Rest I've few pdf's on US ABMs showing why they are unreliable backed with data and US ASW capabilities . But I can't insert pdf in this forum.
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    Post  JohninMK Mon May 01, 2017 11:38 pm

    max steel wrote:
    JohninMK wrote:Any update since that article Max?


    Well US Ground based Interceptors are not still reliable. You can read the articles I mentioned in this thread and US SAM thread to update your facts.

    Rest I've few pdf's on US ABMs showing why they are unreliable backed with data and US ASW capabilities . But I can't insert pdf in this forum.
    Thanks.
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    Post  George1 Wed May 31, 2017 2:54 am

    American GBI interceptor first intercepts ICBM simulator

    According to the US Department of Defense's US Missile Defense Agency, on May 30, 2017, in the next test of the Ground-based Midcourse Defense (GMD) system of the US national missile defense system, for the first time a successful kinetic interception of the GBI anti-missile target with the intercontinental Ballistic missile (ICBM). This was the first test of the GBI interceptor to intercept an ICBM simulator.

    US ABM Systems - Page 6 4314820_original

    http://bmpd.livejournal.com/2638363.html
    George1
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    Post  George1 Sun Oct 15, 2017 12:08 am

    US to have over 1,000 anti-ballistic missiles by 2022 — Russian Defense Ministry

    Their number is expected to eventually surpass the number of warheads of Russian intercontinental ballistic missiles

    UN, October 12. /TASS/. The number of anti-ballistic missiles of the US missile defense system will top 1,000 by 2022 and will eventually surpass the number of warheads installed on Russian intercontinental ballistic missiles, a Russian Defense Ministry spokesman said on Thursday.

    "According to our estimates, by 2022 the number of anti-ballistic missiles of the missile defense system will exceed 1,000, and will eventually surpass the number of warheads of Russian intercontinental ballistic missiles," Defense Ministry spokesman Alexander Yemelyanov said during the Russian-Chinese briefing on missile shield issues on the sidelines of the first committee of the UN General Assembly.

    He added that this number "poses a threat for Russian deterrence capabilities, especially in the light of continuous work to modernize ABM defense systems."

    He said tha the US missile defense system at the moment includes over 30 Ground-Based Interceptors (GBI), 130 RIM-161 Standard Missile 3 (SM-3) ship-based interceptor missile systems and 150 missile defense systems.

    "I would like to note that over 60 interceptor missile are deployed in Europe, about 150% - as part of the Asia Pacific regional segment of missile defense," he added.


    More:
    http://tass.com/defense/970396
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    Post  George1 Fri Nov 10, 2017 10:46 am

    In the US, the last 44th planned GBI anti-missile is deployed, another 20

    As reported on November 7, 2017 by the American corporation Boeing, ahead of schedule, by the end of the year the US Defense Missile Defense Agency (MDA) of the US Department of Defense was included in the national missile defense system of the United States the last of the 44 planned ground-based GBI interceptor missiles Midcourse Defense (GMD).

    US ABM Systems - Page 6 4883189_original

    https://bmpd.livejournal.com/2938070.html
    George1
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    Post  George1 Sun Mar 03, 2019 1:17 am

    This is an interesting article about the future deployment of the GBI long range ABM system.
    https://missilethreat.csis.org/future-options/

    The fourth missile field at Ft Greely is already seen on Planet Labs. The construction shall be ready in Sept 2021, acc. to
    https://t.co/S9WHWN17D7

    US ABM Systems - Page 6 D0pXXBvXgAApkH8

    https://twitter.com/reutersanders/status/1101790388627689472
    George1
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    Post  George1 Tue Mar 26, 2019 1:41 am

    The Pentagon is about to attempt what’s likely to be the most challenging test yet of the U.S. military’s ability to shoot down an incoming missile from an adversary such as North Korea or Iran

    https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2019-03-24/trickiest-u-s-missile-defense-test-is-finally-ready-to-launch


    The GMD system is the sole US system designed to defend the US homeland against long-range missiles. Despite it being declared operational in 2004 and the capability accepted by Northern Command, this test, FTG-11, will be the first operational test of the system.

    https://twitter.com/LauraEGrego/status/1109986042076123137
    George1
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    Post  George1 Tue Mar 26, 2019 1:43 am

    George Lewis' Mostly Missile Defense blog has lots of useful information and analysis:

    https://mostlymissiledefense.com/2016/04/20/update-on-future-ground-based-midcourse-gmd-flight-tests-april-20-2016/


    Summary of test intercepts
    US ABM Systems - Page 6 D2d5CRSW0AIjVe7

    https://www.ucsusa.org/nuclear-weapons/us-missile-defense/missile-defense-timeline#intercepts

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