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    Russia and economic war by the west

    miketheterrible
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    Post  miketheterrible Fri Mar 04, 2022 11:50 am

    Most of the equipment at both GS nanotech and angstrom are maintained and as such works fine and didn't need much help if any foreign parts. Their production for 200mm wafers is now down to 45nm which can, in theory with higher failure rate potential, to 28nm at GS nanotech and sitronics doing about 65nm.  China has completely developed their own fabrication technology to 14nm which may be purchased for a high price or contracted to work out making chips.

    I asked my coworker who worked in Taiwan at a Fab plant and said most of the equipment is daily maintained so there isn't any failures during operation.

    There hasn't been complaints or the expert would have mentioned which ones. He didn't which means he made it up.

    Edit: they may end up just going back to SPARC based processors in local development for easier and less demanding tasks and their Elbrus for more advanced tasks. And for every day, they will still get Intels and others. Just like Iran and rest lol.
    lancelot
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    Post  lancelot Fri Mar 04, 2022 12:02 pm

    It is a good thing Russian semi industry never bothered upgrading their tools to most recent Western ones. This means it will be easier to smuggle parts.
    Even if the RF cannot smuggle parts the Chinese semi industry has already replicated all the tools and materials used to make chips up to 65nm.

    The Chinese are currently in the process of replicating the entire tools and materials chain up to 28nm. They are in a highly advanced stage of this process.

    About Chinese 14nm process just forget about it. The fabs which can achieve this use Western tools and would themselves get sanctioned. US threatened sanctions on Chinese SMIC for making smartphone SoCs for Chinese Huawei and made them stop supply. And this is Chinese Huawei a civilian telecoms company. Russia's Baikal is also a company which does not supply chips for the military at all, they make chips for set-top boxes and web servers, both corporate and government civilian contractor functions, and they still got sanctioned.

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    miketheterrible
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    Post  miketheterrible Fri Mar 04, 2022 12:33 pm

    lancelot wrote:It is a good thing Russian semi industry never bothered upgrading their tools to most recent Western ones. This means it will be easier to smuggle parts.
    Even if the RF cannot smuggle parts the Chinese semi industry has already replicated all the tools and materials used to make chips up to 65nm.

    The Chinese are currently in the process of replicating the entire tools and materials chain up to 28nm. They are in a highly advanced stage of this process.

    About Chinese 14nm process just forget about it. The fabs which can achieve this use Western tools and would themselves get sanctioned. US threatened sanctions on Chinese SMIC for making smartphone SoCs for Chinese Huawei and made them stop supply. And this is Chinese Huawei a civilian telecoms company. Russia's Baikal is also a company which does not supply chips for the military at all, they make chips for set-top boxes and web servers, both corporate and government civilian contractor functions, and they still got sanctioned.

    Russia for first while will be paying big money for gpus, cpus,  and Motherboards for the next while from China through third parties.

    I think they may have already figured it out and got sources.

    The new payment system would also prevent US and others seeing what China sold to Russia.

    As well, this is opportunity for Russian universities to build the Fab equipment. That's what they used to do.

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    kvs
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    Post  kvs Fri Mar 04, 2022 1:52 pm

    It does not matter for the specific issue brought up in the journalistic hit piece. China manufactures actual Intel licensed x86 CPUs
    that can fully substitute whatever they use for the main ship computer. The US and its minions have no control of China's CPU
    production.

    Also, it is false to claim that Russian cannot manufacture Elbrus CPUs. It has the ability to manufacture them on the 65 nm process
    with the only issue being less clock speed and possibly narrower SIMD pipe. These "coarse" Elbrus CPUs would still be good enough
    to run a ship computer system. Even with binary translated software.

    miketheterrible
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    Post  miketheterrible Fri Mar 04, 2022 2:04 pm

    If the cpus are good enough for advanced Russian aesa radar and computers for military use, I'm certain they will be sufficient for ships and other day to day stuff.

    It's actually gonna be the main consumer that will be hit hard from this. So far Nvidia didn't sanction their gpus to be sold, neither I guess their Tegra processes.  But neither AMD or Intel will sell to russia.

    So my guess is, for basic consumer base, they will rely on imports of black market cpu and gpu.

    I'm thinking there will be a big push and money to develop newer fabrication plant using either domestic equipment or get something from China. Best bet is buy equipment from China.

    Edit: they may seek out GS Nanotech to see if their fabs can do 45nm processors for their own needs. Don't forget, they make SSD's to a certain degree.
    lancelot
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    Post  lancelot Fri Mar 04, 2022 3:45 pm

    For the Russian fabs to run at top efficiency AFAIK they must use 90nm process. But 90nm chip more than enough to use for military applications.
    Even Su-57's avionics chips AFAIK are 90nm at best. The problem is the civilian government and corporate functions. As well as ordinary people.
    I am sure prices will rise but someone will figure out a way to smuggle everything through a huge network of sources and not just those in China.
    Russian government needs to figure out a way to make this trade part of the legit market in Russia and extract rent on this activity to sponsor growth of substitutes.
    miketheterrible
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    Post  miketheterrible Fri Mar 04, 2022 3:59 pm

    lancelot wrote:For the Russian fabs to run at top efficiency AFAIK they must use 90nm process. But 90nm chip more than enough to use for military applications.
    Even Su-57's avionics chips AFAIK are 90nm at best. The problem is the civilian government and corporate functions. As well as ordinary people.
    I am sure prices will rise but someone will figure out a way to smuggle everything through a huge network of sources and not just those in China.
    Russian government needs to figure out a way to make this trade part of the legit market in Russia and extract rent on this activity to sponsor growth of substitutes.

    Thats factually incorrect.  Unless you mean in a massive order vs smaller one, then you are correct.

    Mikron Plant for instance is 65nm, not 90nm.  You are mistaken and thinking its Angstrom and Angstrom T (Zelenograd) which is different FAB, which is 130nm and 90nm.  And I have no update on that plant.

    GS Nanogroup is actually 45nm as well.  This was a few years ago I posted about it.  Unfortunately that post of mine would be far too back for me to remember exactly which page and what not.  But very limited, not entirely sure.

    I believe it was Niisi that was the one that made Russia's, or should I say USSR's, FAB equipment.  There is nothing stopping them from doing it again.  Improving the devices that exist now.

    I believe they were looking to localize Elbrus 4S in Russia but dont know.

    But now, they will be more active to resolve this issue, and I believe they can do it.

    But in time being, they will end up buying Chinese chips and Intel Xeons of the yesteryears for cheap. I mean those chips are perfectly functional for everything. Still play video games with a Gen 1 of the 2011 socket 1650. Now mass buy these as they are at best $20 per chip and full used systems at best for $80.

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    kvs
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    Post  kvs Fri Mar 04, 2022 4:35 pm

    Russia has been in war preparation mode since before 2014.   The idea being spread by liberasts and other NATzO
    shills that it cannot manufacture CPUs is pure BS.   This is the usual case of Russia not trumpeting its ace cards
    and various clowns thinking there is nothing there.   They are used to Elon Musk style showboating fakery that
    they think makes the west "great".

    I have years of experience running large atmospheric models on HPC systems. No frelling ship computer needs
    HPC levels of performance. I am confident in claiming that the MCST Sparc derivatives are more than enough
    for the job.

    Control system bottlenecks are from sensor output processing limits. Ships do not have such a vast burden
    of sensor inputs. Such systems are not centered on consumer general purpose CPUs. They have custom
    designs revolving around DACs and associated ASICs.

    miketheterrible
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    Post  miketheterrible Fri Mar 04, 2022 5:21 pm

    kvs wrote:Russia has been in war preparation mode since before 2014.   The idea being spread by liberasts and other NATzO
    shills that it cannot manufacture CPUs is pure BS.   This is the usual case of Russia not trumpeting its ace cards
    and various clowns thinking there is nothing there.   They are used to Elon Musk style showboating fakery that
    they think makes the west "great".

    I have years of experience running large atmospheric models on HPC systems.   No frelling ship computer needs
    HPC levels of performance.   I am confident in claiming that the MCST Sparc derivatives are more than enough
    for the job.

    Control system bottlenecks are from sensor output processing limits.   Ships do not have such a vast burden
    of sensor inputs.   Such systems are not centered on consumer general purpose CPUs.   They have custom
    designs revolving around DACs and associated ASICs.  


    Komdiv 32 and 64 are rather popular MIPS for control systems.  SPARC processors still made in Russia are more than enough for computers for standard....anything.  But instead of using Windows, they will be limited to either BSD or KNE.

    Elbrus 2SM and alike are overkill for most of these.  Hell, most of our massive industrial equipment at work (a large company, multibillion dollar) still uses Pentium 3 and 4.  Only recently replaced since parts are impossible to find.  But they still worked just fine.  7 year old Xeons are still overkill.  Buddy of mine runs a company that rents out server space for remote access or storage (so creating nodes and what not) and he still uses Woodcrest in a lot of them.  He has recently upgraded to Sandybridge lol.  Big companies rent this for day to day use.

    I am not concerned with industries. They will get through this rather easy. I am more concerned for general population who want or need these CPU's and GPU's.

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    JohninMK
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    Post  JohninMK Fri Mar 04, 2022 5:32 pm

    Sorry, can't help smiling, west meets east

    Russia and economic war by the west - Page 2 FM_GaMMXEAAw0Xi?format=jpg&name=small

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    Yugo90


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    Post  Yugo90 Fri Mar 04, 2022 5:38 pm

    JohninMK wrote:Sorry, can't help smiling, west meets east

    Russia and economic war by the west - Page 2 FM_GaMMXEAAw0Xi?format=jpg&name=small
    Thats epiic 😂

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    miketheterrible
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    Post  miketheterrible Fri Mar 04, 2022 5:39 pm

    JohninMK wrote:Sorry, can't help smiling, west meets east

    Russia and economic war by the west - Page 2 FM_GaMMXEAAw0Xi?format=jpg&name=small

    Oh man this is great.

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    rigoletto
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    Post  rigoletto Fri Mar 04, 2022 5:42 pm

    Freezing Moscow’s forex reserves may dethrone greenback, strategist says

    Credit Suisse strategist says US dollar has now reached critical inflection point

    “IImagine a response on the back of this, where a lot of exporters of whatever
    commodities and widgets decide to invoice things in a different currency,”


    “Because all these dollars you’re earning and all this money you keep in the West is at risk,”
    the expert said, adding that nations that have joined the China-led Belt and Road Initiative (BRI)
    may invoice the goods in yuan.

    “You can see new financial centers by invoicing a bunch of trade in a different dominant
    currency and there’s all sorts of reasons to that now,”
    Pozsar said.


    https://www.rt.com/business/551199-us-dollar-dominance-russia-sanctions/

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    Firebird


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    Post  Firebird Fri Mar 04, 2022 5:53 pm

    Yugo90 wrote:
    JohninMK wrote:Sorry, can't help smiling, west meets east

    Russia and economic war by the west - Page 2 FM_GaMMXEAAw0Xi?format=jpg&name=small
    Thats epiic 😂

    Peak Faggotry gets even higher.
    .. or lower ! 🤮🤮🤮🤣

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    magnumcromagnon
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    Post  magnumcromagnon Fri Mar 04, 2022 6:31 pm

    Werewolf and kvs like this post

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    Post  Hole Fri Mar 04, 2022 6:42 pm

    Russia and economic war by the west - Page 2 Wheat10
    Which country is the largest exporter??? Very Happy

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    Post  Hole Fri Mar 04, 2022 9:15 pm

    Russia and economic war by the west - Page 2 Fnayyx10
    Russia and economic war by the west - Page 2 Fnb8zf10
    Ooops. Very Happy

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    Post  magnumcromagnon Sat Mar 05, 2022 12:06 am

    Razz Embarassed lol1 clown pwnd

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    Post  magnumcromagnon Sat Mar 05, 2022 12:09 am

    pwnd pwnd pwnd

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    kvs
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    Post  kvs Sat Mar 05, 2022 12:47 am

    I really hope that Bidet does ban Russian oil imports.   That would be an epic self-snookering of Biblical proportions.
    Justin Turdeau has already pulled this loser move not understanding that eastern Canada does not use oil produced
    in western Canada (e.g. Alberta tar sands).   Gasoline prices are already shooting up in eastern Canada.   Levels
    much higher compared to what they were when oil was over $100 several years ago.

    These retarded haters need to be made to eat their own shit and savour the flavour.

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    Post  GarryB Sat Mar 05, 2022 2:15 am

    Sorry, can't help smiling, west meets east

    Funny thing is it puts them in an awkward position, because any feminist will tell you men and women are equal, so they should be complaining that women are not being called up on the draft too, but they wont say a word.

    Transgender groups will also have a problem because whether they are men or women then they should be treated equally and all go to the front...

    But these transgender men are weeping for sympathy... what will actual women think?

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    kvs
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    Post  kvs Sat Mar 05, 2022 3:43 am

    The head of Aeroflot, Mikhail Poluboyarinov, has quite and run off to the west. A maggot has been squeezed out. Aeroflot was
    wasting money on NATzO aircraft instead of domestic.

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    miketheterrible
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    Post  miketheterrible Sat Mar 05, 2022 4:23 am

    kvs wrote:The head of Aeroflot, Mikhail Poluboyarinov, has quite and run off to the west.   A maggot has been squeezed out.   Aeroflot was
    wasting money on NATzO aircraft instead of domestic.


    That doesn't surprise me at all. With all the shit aeroflot would do and bribes they took? Good riddance.

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    Post  mnrck Sat Mar 05, 2022 5:16 am

    In another move, the empire of lies propaganda column in Russia is shut off after the ban of fake news.

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    Post  rigoletto Sat Mar 05, 2022 6:05 pm

    Russia will put an end to the US dollar as a reserve currency

    An act of economic warfare by the West against foreign exchange assets of the
    Central Bank of Russia threatens the status of the dollar as the world's reserve currency


    https://russtrat-ru.translate.goog/comments/4-marta-2022-1455-9156?_x_tr_sl=auto&_x_tr_tl=en&_x_tr_hl=en-US&_x_tr_pto=wapp

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