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    21st Asian Youth Physics Olympiad

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    calripson

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    Post  calripson Tue May 25, 2021 11:28 pm

    Students in high school from 23 Asian countries competed in Taiwan in the 21st Physics Olympiad. All 8 gold medals were won by students from Russia. The legacy of Soviet math/science education lives on.

    https://translate.google.com/translate?hl=en&sl=ru&u=https://sdelanounas.ru/blogs/&prev=search&pto=aue

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    Post  GarryB Wed May 26, 2021 6:56 am

    Russian Universities should use this to boost scholarships in Asian countries to get more Asian students to choose Russia to learn their skills...

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    Post  jhelb Thu May 27, 2021 10:22 am

    GarryB wrote:Russian Universities should use this to boost scholarships in Asian countries to get more Asian students to choose Russia to learn their skills...
    For what????? There are enough talented Russian students. Russian government should invest in them and not in youths from Asian and African countries.

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    Post  kvs Thu May 27, 2021 2:41 pm

    Given limited resources (no printing press world reserve currency cheats) Russia needs to focus on its own youth and not import foreign ones.
    The US does this because it does not have the domestic culture where Americans want to go into STEM. Russia clearly does not have this
    problem, so why would it need to import STEM talent?

    I am not saying to discriminate against any foreign students, I am saying not to engage in deliberate import of such students, which is
    not needed. In spite of what PC zealots think, there is a zero sum phase with such social engineered migrations. Capacity in the
    system does not adapt in minutes and hours but in years. For example, the number of unemployed Syrian refugees in Germany after
    Erdogan's bold move was over 97% two years after arrival. So even with government pushed employment for such refugees
    (just like in Canada) the system could still not absorb them. And that is the key aspect, the absorption rate for immigrants or any
    other migrants into any society. It is rather small and not infinite.

    If we are talking about generating a sympathetic cohort of professionals in Asia who studied in Russia, then that is not a guaranteed
    win. The USSR did this and it has not really made any difference for international politics and Russian relations with the origin countries
    of those students.

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    Post  flamming_python Thu May 27, 2021 8:50 pm

    Russia is not only geared towards attracting foreign students (albeit, still mostly from post-Soviet countries thus far), but in providing them work opportunities after studies in co-operation with leading companies, and opening a fast-track for citizenship for graduates.

    At the moment Russia is redeveloping several of its universities into a Western-style campus model that aims to provide an attractive and familiar model to students from the far-abroad countries as well.

    In my mind this is an excellent strategy for attracting skilled immigration into the country. But if they return home instead after studies, that's also great, they often find work in Russian companies such as Lukoil or whichever else that has projects in the Middle East, Africa, etc...
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    Post  calripson Thu May 27, 2021 8:56 pm

    Russia clearly offers the best value per dollar in world class STEM education anywhere. I see no reason why Russian universities and even high schools can't offer some spots to foreigners paying (by Russian standards) big tuition. Helps fund the schools and professors' and teachers' salaries. Also encourages foreigners to learn Russian. Pro-Russian attitudes in my experience are closely correlated with Russian language and culture familiarity.

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    Post  flamming_python Thu May 27, 2021 9:04 pm

    Education is a business. Foreign students bring in the dough. This is in addition to any benefits they may give the country after graduation.

    At the moment Russia is something like 6th-7th in the world by number of foreign students, hosting about 6% of the world's international students. Most of them are from former Soviet countries, albeit with a growing Asian, African and Latin American contingent.

    A number of leading Russian universities are being expanded and modernized as I mentioned, with a focus on increasing the amount of places for foreign students and creating a modern environment for them.

    Currently some 9% of students in Russian institutes are foreign. In leading education export countries the figure is closer to 20%, so there's a lot of room for Russia to grow here. The countries who have been growing fastest here over the last 20 years are exactly Russia, Canada and Australia.
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    Post  Sujoy Fri May 28, 2021 1:20 pm

    flamming_python wrote:Education is a business. Foreign students bring in the dough. This is in addition to any benefits they may give the country after graduation.

    At the moment Russia is something like 6th-7th in the world by number of foreign students, hosting about 6% of the world's international students. Most of them are from former Soviet countries, albeit with a growing Asian, African and Latin American contingent.

    A number of leading Russian universities are being expanded and modernized as I mentioned, with a focus on increasing the amount of places for foreign students and creating a modern environment for them.

    Currently some 9% of students in Russian institutes are foreign. In leading education export countries the figure is closer to 20%, so there's a lot of room for Russia to grow here. The countries who have been growing fastest here over the last 20 years are exactly Russia, Canada and Australia.
    I'm not sure about European students but students from Asia, Africa (most not all) go to western countries to pursue higher education because they intend to get a job after graduation in that country.

    That's a call that the Kremlin and Russian civil society will have to take. Will they allow Asian, African students to settle down in Russia once they complete their education.

    Then there is also the factor of job availability. Are there enough jobs available for skilled migrants (engineers, doctors, lawyers etc) in Russia.

    Countries like U.K, U.S for instance do not quite like the idea of importing students of color. For example look at this link - the professor of this prominent UK university says that British students may feel increasingly uncomfortable at universities dominated by Chinese and Indian students

    Professor Alan Smithers, of Buckingham University, told the newspaper that British students may feel increasingly uncomfortable at universities dominated by Chinese and Indian students.
    https://www.business-standard.com/article/international/brexit-hit-uk-universities-to-recruit-more-indian-chinese-students-119010600427_1.html
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    Post  kvs Fri May 28, 2021 1:51 pm

    Russia is an old world country and not an immigrant country like the USA and Canada. The UK is peculiar because it decided to become
    a haven for its Commonwealth former colonies. They are probably trying to emulate America.

    Russia has immigrants settling down but that is happening at a rate much smaller than in the west. There is nothing wrong with this.
    This whole topic is a bit nonsensical. Russia does not need to actively import people to fill in its pool of professional talent. Organic
    growth and repatriation of the Russian near-abroad diaspora being oppressed in ethno-nationalist limitrophe failed states is good enough.

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    Post  flamming_python Fri May 28, 2021 6:02 pm

    Sujoy wrote:I'm not sure about European students but students from Asia, Africa (most not all) go to western countries to pursue higher education because they intend to get a job after graduation in that country.

    That's a call that the Kremlin and Russian civil society will have to take. Will they allow Asian, African students to settle down in Russia once they complete their education.

    Yes they do and yes they are. There are no issues with that. We have some African, South American doctors in the country who work here and graduated all the way back in the 90s. It's not a large number, but they're there.
    Russia does not a follow an immigration-based model like Canada, Australia or the US. It's geared towards advancing its native-born population.
    But it can be compared to Western European states, in terms of how many immigrants it attracts and allows in; albeit that's mostly restricted to immigrants from ex-Soviet countries. But if the immigrants in question hold Russian diplomas according to Russian standards, and can land a job requiring specialist skills - then there's no issue in them being from any corner of the globe or applying for citizenship. That's essentially the Russian system currently.

    Then there is also the factor of job availability. Are there enough jobs available for skilled migrants (engineers, doctors, lawyers etc) in Russia.

    I'd say there's a dearth of qualified specialists in all fields, given the investments being made into social services, hydrocarbon processing, industry, primary extraction and so on. Lawyers though we definitely have enough of. Accountants too.

    Countries like U.K, U.S for instance do not quite like the idea of importing students of color. For example look at this link - the professor of this prominent UK university says that British students may feel increasingly uncomfortable at universities dominated by Chinese and Indian students

    Professor Alan Smithers, of Buckingham University, told the newspaper that British students may feel increasingly uncomfortable at universities dominated by Chinese and Indian students.
    https://www.business-standard.com/article/international/brexit-hit-uk-universities-to-recruit-more-indian-chinese-students-119010600427_1.html

    I wouldn't accuse them of that, they invite more students of color than anyone else after all.

    But to have foreign students outright dominate your universities isn't desirable either. The institutions are there first and foremost to serve your own population and provide opportunities for them to master an academic or technical field. Any given educational institution shouldn't have more than 15-20% foreigners. Maybe 30%, if we take into account that most foreign-students will be from the ex-USSR anyway and speak Russian fine.
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    Post  jhelb Sat May 29, 2021 6:17 am

    The influx of people of colour has cause widespread damage to society as a whole in Europe.

    Already the population of Central Asians is increasing rapidly across Russia. Therefore, the last thing that Russia needs is to invite more people of colour from Asia, Africa be it for education or for jobs.

    Besides Russian universities, colleges are funded by the government, so unlike US and EU colleges/universities Russia doesn't need foreign students who will pay a higher tuition fee that will be used to subsidize tuition fee of local students.  

    Ideally, Russia should only allow Slavs from Serbia, Belarus, Ukraine to enter Russia either for education or for jobs. However, Slavs from other European countries as well as other European communities can also be provide similar privileges. This will go a long way in improving Russia's image across Europe.
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    Post  flamming_python Sat May 29, 2021 8:17 am

    jhelb wrote:The influx of people of colour has cause widespread damage to society as a whole in Europe.

    Already the population of Central Asians is increasing rapidly across Russia. Therefore, the last thing that Russia needs is to invite more people of colour from Asia, Africa be it for education or for jobs.

    Russia always had people of colour so its nothing new. I mean from Central Asia and the Caucasus.

    As for Asians and Africans, they've been studying in the country since the 50s/60s, although typically they were sent to study on the basis of government-to-government agreements or USSR-funded scholarships and would return home to take up jobs after studies in the USSR were complete.

    Since about the 80s/90s, they started to have the opportunity to enter institutions in Russia on their own accord and then stay on in the country if they want afterwards.

    Besides Russian universities, colleges are funded by the government, so unlike US and EU colleges/universities Russia doesn't need foreign students who will pay a higher tuition fee that will be used to subsidize tuition fee of local students.

    Well the Russian government wants to move to a Western system, where universities and institutions will attempt to pay for themselves - albeit all the initial investment into their campuses, facilities, etc... are done with federal and regional funds.

    But it should not reach the extreme of say British universities on this I agree. Paying for themselves at least partially is certainly desireable, as are a certain amount of international students. International students increase a university's prestige, spread of alumni around the world, and ultimately Russia's soft-power. They also offer foreign perspectives and viewpoints to the Russian students that they study with and this also benefits them I would say.
    However the primary focus should still be on reserving slots for Russian prospective students themselves, of which there are plenty, and allowing them to achieve qualifications that are in demand in Russia. Else we will find that it is Russian students that start to turn to universities abroad, and then stay there afterwards.

    Ideally, Russia should only allow Slavs from Serbia, Belarus, Ukraine to enter Russia either for education or for jobs. However, Slavs from other European countries as well as other European communities can also be provide similar privileges. This will go a long way in improving Russia's image across Europe.

    I have no problem with allowing Slavs into Russia for exactly the same reasons as anyone else. Actually it would be great if there were more, as their immigration to Russia would not increase any social contradictions based on ethnicity or religion.

    However in Eastern Europe, Russophobia and the portrayal of Russia as an outdated decrepit country with nothing to offer the world technologically, culturally, socially, academically, etc... is a matter of state policy, and it should be noted - quite an effective one.
    I'm sure that more Western Europeans would put Tchaikovsky on the list of the world's greatest composers, Tolstoy on the list of the most renowned writers, and Repin as one of the finest European artists - than would their counterparts from Poland, the Czech Republic, etc...

    So what Slavs exactly are rushing to Russian institutes of higher learning? In practice, only those from Belarus and the Ukraine. Maybe a little from Serbia. The rest (well actually, those too) would prefer European and American institutes.
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    Post  kvs Sat May 29, 2021 1:18 pm

    jhelb wrote:The influx of people of colour has cause widespread damage to society as a whole in Europe.

    Already the population of Central Asians is increasing rapidly across Russia. Therefore, the last thing that Russia needs is to invite more people of colour from Asia, Africa be it for education or for jobs.

    Besides Russian universities, colleges are funded by the government, so unlike US and EU colleges/universities Russia doesn't need foreign students who will pay a higher tuition fee that will be used to subsidize tuition fee of local students.  

    Ideally, Russia should only allow Slavs from Serbia, Belarus, Ukraine to enter Russia either for education or for jobs. However, Slavs from other European countries as well as other European communities can also be provide similar privileges. This will go a long way in improving Russia's image across Europe.

    The point about Russian education costs is very relevant. Foreign students will not be self-financing. Even if they pay the tuition to some extent, they will still
    need accommodations. They can't have full time jobs and be students. There is not enough capacity in Russia to bring in hordes of any foreigners. Full stop.
    That is regardless of origin.

    The subject of cultural effects of migrants is clearly a minefield having been radicalized by PC rot. Nobody can criticize immigration because they are
    fobbed off as racists. This is patent BS. If several million whites parachuted into parts of Africa, you can bet your azz that there would be strife.
    And that would occur without any apartheid dictatorship first. Human societies and countries are not sponges if they were then the Rwanda slaughter
    would never have happened.

    Even posturing PC toilets like Canada and the UK have been importing people at controlled rates. Of course, over the last 40 years they have been
    fundamentally changed as a result. This is what the elite deciders want. Divide, assimilate and control.

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    Post  Sujoy Sat May 29, 2021 2:19 pm

    flamming_python wrote:I wouldn't accuse them of that, they invite more students of color than anyone else after all.
    Mostly in Tier 2 and Tier 3 universities. They have opened too many universities and to run them the management needs foreign students because locals are not interested in them. However, these actions (of bringing students of color) has not gone down well with locals in US, UK or Australia. In fact sensing the pulse of the electorate one of the very first thing that Trump did was reducing the number of education visas being issued to foreign students drastically.

    The thing is, given the very high tuition fees in Western Tier 1 universities locals can't afford to graduate college. Even the migrants coming from India, China, Middle East and Africa are just a minuscule percentage (>1%) of the total population of students of those countries because as you would imagine if locals can't afford it obviously students from countries where per capita income is much lower can't afford it either.

    Germany I understand provides almost free education as does a few Scandinavian countries. Affordable education is therefore Russia's USP. And eventually whether entry into Russia should be based on ethnicity or not should be decided by Russian civil society.
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    Post  flamming_python Sat May 29, 2021 6:30 pm

    Sujoy wrote:
    flamming_python wrote:I wouldn't accuse them of that, they invite more students of color than anyone else after all.
    Mostly in Tier 2 and Tier 3 universities. They have opened too many universities and to run them the management needs foreign students because locals are not interested in them. However, these actions (of bringing students of color) has not gone down well with locals in US, UK or Australia. In fact sensing the pulse of the electorate one of the very first thing that Trump did was reducing the number of education visas being issued to foreign students drastically.

    The article you yourself linked talks about UCL upping their quota to up to 50% foreign students. And that's definately a Tier 1 university.

    Sujoy wrote:Germany I understand provides almost free education as does a few Scandinavian countries. Affordable education is therefore Russia's USP. And eventually whether entry into Russia should be based on ethnicity or not should be decided by Russian civil society.

    It's not a matter of ethnicity. It's no more than a few ten thousand foreign graduates per year in any case, and they are naturally well-rounded, educated people who will have no problem following the law and integrating into society, if that's what they want.

    It's a matter of prioritizing your own population in access to finite resources. In this case higher education slots. The more you set aside for foreign students, the more your own population will have to compete amongst yourselves to get into their institution of choice. If it's hard for your own population, then they in turn, might decide to apply for foreign universities themselves.

    And after graduation, is it more likely that your own students will stay on in Russia and apply for jobs here, or more likely that foreign students will stay and fulfill vacancies in Russian companies? Probably the former.

    I think 25-30% foreign students is a good cap for any institution.

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    Post  jhelb Sun May 30, 2021 2:20 pm

    flamming_python wrote:
    It's a matter of prioritizing your own population in access to finite resources. In this case higher education slots. The more you set aside for foreign students, the more your own population will have to compete amongst yourselves to get into their institution of choice.
    And that's exactly why there is NO need to import students into Russia and that too from murky places like Asia and Africa.

    flamming_python wrote:And after graduation, is it more likely that your own students will stay on in Russia and apply for jobs here, or more likely that foreign students will stay and fulfill vacancies in Russian companies? Probably the former.
    Actually the latter if students from third world countries are imported. Because the possibility of them finding jobs in their third world countries is almost zero.

    flamming_python wrote:I think 25-30% foreign students is a good cap for any institution.
    And Slavs/European students only. To maintain order and harmony in society and more importantly to prevent the large scale spread of contagious diseases that is prevalent in third world societies. COVID 19 should ideally be an eye opener.

    kvs wrote:The subject of cultural effects of migrants is clearly a minefield having been radicalized by PC rot. Nobody can criticize immigration because they are
    fobbed off as racists. This is patent BS. If several million whites parachuted into parts of Africa, you can bet your azz that there would be strife.
    Precisely. And that's the reason why I advocate a complete ban on the entry of colored people into Russia. This super spread of Corona in Russia, EU and US should legitimately be considered a contribution of third world countries.

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    Post  kvs Sun May 30, 2021 2:44 pm

    Russia's first wave was due to import from Italy and other parts of Europe where the local governments were grossly incompetent
    at handling the spread in February and March of 2020 by allowing unhindered air traffic from China. We had clowns in Italy telling
    people to hug a Chinese (why?) and in the USA to party it up in Chinatown. The second wave in Russia was not the result of
    import of strains from the 3rd world. It was domestic. Many people ignore the warnings but even so Russia has a very low rate
    of infections and deaths per capita when compared to the USA and other western states.

    Not even now can the Corona virus spread be considered any sort of African, South American and South Asian migration spread
    event. The Indian strain, the UK strain, the South African strain are not pivot points accounting for the progression of this
    disease in Russia, EU, USA and Canada. Corona virus did originate in China (in whatever fashion) and it affected old Europe
    the hardest first. PC inanity accounts for this and not black people.

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    Post  thegopnik Sun May 30, 2021 4:50 pm

    calripson wrote:Students in high school from 23 Asian countries competed in Taiwan in the 21st Physics Olympiad. All 8 gold medals were won by students from Russia. The legacy of Soviet math/science education lives on.

    https://translate.google.com/translate?hl=en&sl=ru&u=https://sdelanounas.ru/blogs/&prev=search&pto=aue

    actual source than me skimming down through pages to find it?
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    Post  miketheterrible Sun May 30, 2021 5:21 pm

    https://hncfdemx4x7omswoit6vtnzhpa-achv5f5yelsuduq-sdelanounas-ru.translate.goog/blogs/141516/

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    Post  flamming_python Sun May 30, 2021 7:57 pm

    jhelb wrote:And that's exactly why there is NO need to import students into Russia and that too from murky places like Asia and Africa.

    Well a certain proportion of international students is certainly desirable for reasons I mentioned in a post above.

    I'd also add that in terms of third-world countries, students who graduated from Western, and in the Soviet times - Soviet universities; landed top and influential jobs back in their home countries. There were even several presidents of African states that were graduates of Soviet universities. I think Mahmud Abbas of the Palestinian Authority studied in the USSR too, if memory serves.
    So there is the angle of political influence and molding the future governing elites of poorer countries who turn to you for support as well.

    flamming_python wrote:Actually the latter if students from third world countries are imported. Because the possibility of them finding jobs in their third world countries is almost zero.

    No, not necessarily. The governments of poorer countries often pay for the scholarships of students they send to Russia themselves, or else Russia gives them a discount, and jobs are typically waiting for them back home upon successful graduation in that instance too.

    But more and more Russia has been receiving students who pay for themselves or are otherwise free to choose their own fate after graduation. A lot of them stay on in Russia afterwards, but not nearly as much as Russian students who graduate. Western companies and employers are not particularly accepting of Russian diplomas and of people who only know the Russian language.

    flamming_python wrote:And Slavs/European students only. To maintain order and harmony in society and more importantly to prevent the large scale spread of contagious diseases that is prevalent in third world societies. COVID 19 should ideally be an eye opener.

    COVID I believe reached around the world. You won't get rid of any diseases by banning people from the 3rd world. I think people are required to take medical examinations after coming from countries with endemic diseases. This is typically enough.

    As for order and harmony, we're not talking about huge numbers here. And it rather depends on how a country and society defines itself. Russia does not define itself as a purely European or purely Christian country; this is just it's majority character.

    Europeans, Slavs are welcome to apply as well. But they're not, not in large numbers anyway.

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