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    Russian military intervention and aid to Syria #2

    JohninMK
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    Russian military intervention and aid to Syria #2 - Page 18 Empty Re: Russian military intervention and aid to Syria #2

    Post  JohninMK Wed Oct 07, 2015 12:48 am

    A different view on RuAF targeting from the Independent in London, via Fortrus. This is an excerpt. From memory Position 451 was the one where the walls were covered with lots of documents in Russian, implying the presence of advisers.

    So now a few harsh factoids. The Syrian army are drawing up the operational target lists for the Russian air force. But Vladimir Putin has his own enemies in Syria.

    The first strikes – far from being aimed at the “moderates” whom the US had long ago dismissed – were directed at the large number of Turkmen villages in the far north-west of Syria which have for many months been occupied by hundreds of Chechen fighters – the very same Chechens whom Putin had been trying to liquidate in Chechnya itself. These Chechen forces assaulted and destroyed Syria’s strategic hilltop military Position 451 north of Latakia last year. No wonder Bashar’s army put them on the target list.

    Other strikes were directed not at Isis but at Islamist Jaish al-Shams force targets in the same area. But in the first 24 hours, Russian bombs were also dropped on the Isis supply line through the mountains above Palmyra. The Russians specifically attacked desert roads around the town of Salamia – the same tracks used by Isis suicide convoys to defeat Syrian troops in the ancient Roman city of Palmyra last May.

    They also bombed areas around Hassakeh and the Isis-held Raqqa air base where Syrian troops have fought Islamists over the past year (and were beheaded when they surrendered).


    http://fortruss.blogspot.no/2015/10/the-independent-syrias-moderates-have.html
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    Post  Guest Wed Oct 07, 2015 12:48 am

    Neudorfor wrote:
    Thomas van Linge, the source of the maps, seems to be a respected 19 year old cartographer. Goodness only knows where he got the data from

    He is far from being just "cartographer", he is using already prepared template maps he is just adding features, it can be whatever from airstrikes to gas stations. However he seems to be hardcore supporter of "FSA" and White Helmets, retweets them always even open supporters and members of Nusra are not rare on his TL.
    Thanks to you and Iraqidabad for the clarification. Wonder if the maps are accurate, not sure what propaganda is in them.

    >There is a Youtube video of him explaining the sources he uses. The video is from a Dutch TV programme. He says that he has built up a "network of sources" since 2011 consisting of activist Youtube channels and Facebook pages as well as (activist) people he knows personally in the area.

    It is quite interesting to see what kind of reach his maps have since his drawing is based purely on speculation, hear say and self-translated Arabic.

    Since I'm a new member I can't link the video, sadly<

    I am less interested in his sources, since we all know that he is using youtube and twitter as main sources of info, he finds people that are in the vicinity of area of interest and he tracks their posts etc, also big media hubs help there. However his...point of view and his personal opinion on the matter is the one i do not like nor i support.
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    Post  Guest Wed Oct 07, 2015 12:54 am

    Russian military intervention and aid to Syria #2 - Page 18 CQqvmTyXAAUI3hy

    I just love how this Higgins imbecile is leeching money from people. First for those famous satelite images of Buk, then his new site, now this... he is constantly asking for money lol...
    KoTeMoRe
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    Post  KoTeMoRe Wed Oct 07, 2015 12:55 am

    Erk wrote:

    South Front military update in English.

    Russian Air force, F-15 profile...Ya allah. clown
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    Vann7


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    Post  Vann7 Wed Oct 07, 2015 1:03 am

    Honestly if Russia was able to defeat nazis ,after losing millions of soldiers ,losing Belarus ,Ukraine ,Crimea , and after being their most important cities under siege for 2 years ,with people starving to death.. it was a real miracle ,that Russia came on top with their determination and
    reinforcements that came from far east  and a new wave of planes and tanks. Was able to reverse the tide after a near defeat.

    So as bad as the Syrian war looks.. is not anywhere as bad as the Russian vs Nazis war..
    the only advantage however here is that soviets have much more unity than Syrians people..
    you cannot win difficult wars with a divided nation and even though Assad have the majority
    support.. there is a radical opposition that is in the 10% to 15% of the population that cannot be
    ignored and could pose a major threat for Syrian Army operations.. the easyness in how at least
    10% of civilians population choose to Support Alqaeda or FSA or ISIS.  So this is the Elephant
    in the room.. that is the massive support the terrorist receive in Syria from a minority that is not insignificant.

    About 1,000 Syrian citizens gave their weapons in Souther Syria Daraa.. after Russia began bombing to "reintegrate " in the society. What guarantees the Syrian Government have this people will not continue helping ISIS or ALqaeda and providing intelligence to enemies of Syria ?
    or worse that will not take weapons again?  So there is a dynamic in Syria..specially in Homs
    were the Syrian Army liberate a major zone and later the terrorist take it back again.. also a problem with traitors.. in the Syrian ARmy. is a sectarian war.. and only force will get even the minority anti Assad aligned with the Syrian government.


    is very likely that even if Russia defeat in a week all the terrorist ,ISIS ,ALqaeda and FSA..
    that United States will still have another card.. is called Kurds.. who wants their independence
    and their own state.. and will take most of Norther Syria territory. Which points into question
    the risk of Turkey that could end split too.. for the support he give to the American proxy war..
    since he have big zones of kurds inside Turkey that will want also independence and Americans support them. The big winners in this war seems to be will be Kurdish people and the creation of Kurdistan..  and Russia have also a big card there against Turkey..  Because Russia can say if Turkey invades Syria that he will provide lethal weapons to Kurds to defend against "ISIS"..but that can also use against Turkey army..lol1

    a quick look at Kurds territory in the middle east.. will be easy to see why Turkey policy of
    arming jihadist to attack Syria will back fire big time..

    Russian military intervention and aid to Syria #2 - Page 18 Kurdish-inhabited_areas_of_the_Middle_East_and_the_Soviet_Union_in_1986

    because Russia and IRAN can arms Kurds to overthrow Erdogan and truly disband the second most powerful Nato country that pose a major threat to Russia free acess to the mediterranean sea. The kurds zones in TUrkey are the most impossible to conquer since its full of high mountains that tanks cannot climb ,that regular artillery cannot reach and that that can easily allow regular manpads to target planes at any altitude taking advantage of the elevation of their zones.. welcome to afganistan2.  Very Happy

    Russian military intervention and aid to Syria #2 - Page 18 Image


    If i were Russia i will arm kurds inside turkey  to Fight Turkey with help of special forces  if he notice Turkey will not end supporting terrorist.. to pressure them to end their war against Syria.Also open another front in Yemen ,to push toward Saudi Arabia and give scuds to yemenis to Bomb saudi oil fields to get Oil prices at $120 again..  Smile

    So i predict Turkey will have to pay a real heavy price ,and major blow if continues annoying
    Russia ..they will pay back arming Kurds with enough weapons to wipe the Turkey army.

    If i were Russia i will use Nukes. or burn whole cities like IDLIB and RAqqa.. where heavy concentrations of terrorist and s upporters are.


    Last edited by Vann7 on Wed Oct 07, 2015 1:45 am; edited 4 times in total
    Walther von Oldenburg
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    Post  Walther von Oldenburg Wed Oct 07, 2015 1:18 am

    During ww2 Soviet people fought for survival - literally. Defeat meant death or slavery for everyone. Nobody gave a damn how much would the war cost in lives and in money. This is not the same thing as fighting a war far away.

    And what Russia's position is? When it comes to demographic and economic potential Russia is basically Mexico with nuclear weapons and a larger army (and arms industry). It has very limited ability to project power beyond ex-Soviet republics.
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    Post  Guest Wed Oct 07, 2015 1:45 am

    "Tour in Talbisah town after Russian airstrikes"

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    Post  Guest Wed Oct 07, 2015 1:50 am



    Rebels in northern Homs countryside are preparing for SAA offensive which is to be supported by Russian air strikes.
    d_taddei2
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    Russian military intervention and aid to Syria #2 - Page 18 Empty reply

    Post  d_taddei2 Wed Oct 07, 2015 1:53 am

    i think as this thread is getting bigger and the lets face it the Russians involvement in syria is going to be here for a while, i think it would be good to start a thread where its based on map updates on strikes and SAA advancement, so we can see the gains being made and the current postion of SAA and the terrorists, its just a thought.
    ExBeobachter1987
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    Post  ExBeobachter1987 Wed Oct 07, 2015 2:01 am

    Walther von Oldenburg wrote:And what Russia's position is?

    Intervening in order not to fight on Russian territory again.
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    Post  Guest Wed Oct 07, 2015 2:15 am

    http://ruslanleviev.livejournal.com/41730.html

    Okay.. guy posted this on twitter saying "We found moderate rebels that Russian gov cant".... Is this guy serious? I really do admire Russians since i know many of them and not only that, but this guy is... Russia does not need external enemies, they have these "independent researchers" and "Human rights activists", they will do job far better than anyone in Pentagon or Brisel.

    My sourceS:

    https://twitter.com/ReggaeMortis1/status/651420489211117570

    And author: https://twitter.com/ruslanleviev

    His pinned post is naturally: Крым — это Украина. #хуйРоскомнадзору -.-
    sepheronx
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    Post  sepheronx Wed Oct 07, 2015 2:36 am

    The replies were funny. Guy uses a photo of something in the background as moderate rebels? hahahaha.

    No such thing in Syria. Keep up the good work Russia!

    BTW, Twitter isn't really a source of good info. You got lots of idiots posting stupid shit on twitter. Sometimes good for some info especially with pictures, but not every single tweet about Syria and Russia....
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    Post  Guest Wed Oct 07, 2015 2:39 am

    sepheronx wrote:The replies were funny.  Guy uses a photo of something in the background as moderate rebels? hahahaha.

    No such thing in Syria.  Keep up the good work Russia!

    BTW, Twitter isn't really a source of good info.  You got lots of idiots posting stupid shit on twitter.  Sometimes good for some info especially with pictures, but not every single tweet about Syria and Russia....

    97% of info posted on Twitter is useless, fake, biased, propaganda i try to filter it, keeping legit sources available to me, but even those reliable sometimes tend to be fooled by others. But thats like that with every media out there to be honest.
    sepheronx
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    Post  sepheronx Wed Oct 07, 2015 2:45 am

    Militarov wrote:
    sepheronx wrote:The replies were funny.  Guy uses a photo of something in the background as moderate rebels? hahahaha.

    No such thing in Syria.  Keep up the good work Russia!

    BTW, Twitter isn't really a source of good info.  You got lots of idiots posting stupid shit on twitter.  Sometimes good for some info especially with pictures, but not every single tweet about Syria and Russia....

    97% of info posted on Twitter is useless, fake, biased, propaganda i try to filter it, keeping legit sources available to me, but even those reliable sometimes tend to be fooled by others. But thats like that with every media out there to be honest.

    It was always full of crap and a way for any twat to post their so called evidences and crappy opinions. But, whatever, free world. Add to it that you got 5th column idiots from both sides (US, Russia, whatever) being a bunch of losers and it is their only destination beside tumblr or whatever that is full of it.

    Anyway, I trust you can find the only decent quality posts from that site. But there is a good reason why I steer clear from it besides 1: https://twitter.com/EgoRZemtsoV
    KoTeMoRe
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    Post  KoTeMoRe Wed Oct 07, 2015 2:46 am

    Militarov wrote:http://ruslanleviev.livejournal.com/41730.html

    Okay.. guy posted this on twitter saying "We found moderate rebels that Russian gov cant".... Is this guy serious? I really do admire Russians since i know many of them and not only that, but this guy is... Russia does not need external enemies, they have these "independent researchers" and "Human rights activists", they will do job far better than anyone in Pentagon or Brisel.

    My sourceS:

    https://twitter.com/ReggaeMortis1/status/651420489211117570

    And author: https://twitter.com/ruslanleviev

    His pinned post is naturally: Крым — это Украина. #хуйРоскомнадзору -.-

    No probo, he tells it as it is. Qatar financed people. Nothing more to add.
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    Post  Guest Wed Oct 07, 2015 2:54 am

    sepheronx wrote:
    Militarov wrote:
    sepheronx wrote:The replies were funny.  Guy uses a photo of something in the background as moderate rebels? hahahaha.

    No such thing in Syria.  Keep up the good work Russia!

    BTW, Twitter isn't really a source of good info.  You got lots of idiots posting stupid shit on twitter.  Sometimes good for some info especially with pictures, but not every single tweet about Syria and Russia....

    97% of info posted on Twitter is useless, fake, biased, propaganda i try to filter it, keeping legit sources available to me, but even those reliable sometimes tend to be fooled by others. But thats like that with every media out there to be honest.

    It was always full of crap and a way for any twat to post their so called evidences and crappy opinions.  But, whatever, free world.  Add to it that you got 5th column idiots from both sides (US, Russia, whatever) being a bunch of losers and it is their only destination beside tumblr or whatever that is full of it.

    Anyway, I trust you can find the only decent quality posts from that site.  But there is a good reason why I steer clear from it besides 1: https://twitter.com/EgoRZemtsoV

    Issue with twitter is that it works like wave. One imbecile posts how Chinese flying aircraft carrier built by technology stolen from Aliens loaded with Russian built jets and Saddams lost nuclear weapons is going towards Syria everyone starts retweeting and reposting it. Main reason for this is that common people lack knowledge of geopolitics and military technology, even some people that served in the army know just how to reaload and clean rifle, so anything beyond that is hard to separate truth from stupid crap.

    Higgins posts "Till now i confirmed 12 types of cluster ammunition used in Syria by Russians and regime". Good for you, i could have told you that 2 months ago before strikes even started, what are they going to use aganist infantry in field? Potatoes? And people retweet that like Jesus himself came down to ground and enlightened them.


    Last edited by Militarov on Wed Oct 07, 2015 3:01 am; edited 1 time in total
    KoTeMoRe
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    Post  KoTeMoRe Wed Oct 07, 2015 2:58 am

    Militarov wrote:
    sepheronx wrote:
    Militarov wrote:
    sepheronx wrote:The replies were funny.  Guy uses a photo of something in the background as moderate rebels? hahahaha.

    No such thing in Syria.  Keep up the good work Russia!

    BTW, Twitter isn't really a source of good info.  You got lots of idiots posting stupid shit on twitter.  Sometimes good for some info especially with pictures, but not every single tweet about Syria and Russia....

    97% of info posted on Twitter is useless, fake, biased, propaganda i try to filter it, keeping legit sources available to me, but even those reliable sometimes tend to be fooled by others. But thats like that with every media out there to be honest.

    It was always full of crap and a way for any twat to post their so called evidences and crappy opinions.  But, whatever, free world.  Add to it that you got 5th column idiots from both sides (US, Russia, whatever) being a bunch of losers and it is their only destination beside tumblr or whatever that is full of it.

    Anyway, I trust you can find the only decent quality posts from that site.  But there is a good reason why I steer clear from it besides 1: https://twitter.com/EgoRZemtsoV

    Issue with twitter is that it works like wave. One imbecile posts how Chinese flying aircraft carrier built by technology stolen from Aliens loaded with Russian built jets and Saddams lost nuclear weapons is going towards Syria everyone starts retweeting and reposting it. Main reason for this is that common people lack knowledge of geopolitics and military technology, even some people that served in the army know just how to reaload and clean rifle, so anything beyond that is had to separate truth from stupid crap.

    Higgins posts "Till now i confirmed 12 types of cluster ammunition used in Syria by Russians and regime". Good for you, i could have told you that 2 months ago before strikes even started, what are they going to use aganist infantry in field? Potatoes? And people retweet that like Jesus himself came to ground and enlighted them.

    Yeah, why even start there.
    magnumcromagnon
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    Post  magnumcromagnon Wed Oct 07, 2015 4:10 am

    Don't know how verifiable this is, but fake or not it's still funny as hell lol!

    Russian military intervention and aid to Syria #2 - Page 18 CQqZbrfUYAE4QZ-


    Very reminiscent of this:

    Russian military intervention and aid to Syria #2 - Page 18 USAID
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    Post  Guest Wed Oct 07, 2015 4:15 am

    magnumcromagnon wrote:Don't know how verifiable this is, but fake or not it's still funny as hell lol!

    Russian military intervention and aid to Syria #2 - Page 18 CQqZbrfUYAE4QZ-


    Very reminiscent of this:

    Russian military intervention and aid to Syria #2 - Page 18 USAID

    Yep, its legit. Photo is quite old, late 2014. even i belive.

    EDIT: Photo appeared around 24.09.2013.


    Last edited by Militarov on Wed Oct 07, 2015 5:22 am; edited 1 time in total
    zorobabel
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    Post  zorobabel Wed Oct 07, 2015 4:30 am

    magnumcromagnon wrote:Don't know how verifiable this is, but fake or not it's still funny as hell lol!

    Russian military intervention and aid to Syria #2 - Page 18 CQqZbrfUYAE4QZ-


    Very reminiscent of this:

    Russian military intervention and aid to Syria #2 - Page 18 USAID
    Funny.

    The bottom pic looks like Abu Muhammad Al-Amriki -- sent to hell by Kurds in Kobane.
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    Post  OminousSpudd Wed Oct 07, 2015 5:07 am

    2nd tent on the left, above the left guy's head, there's another "US" on the canvas. Interesting...
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    Post  Guest Wed Oct 07, 2015 5:19 am

    zorobabel wrote:
    magnumcromagnon wrote:Don't know how verifiable this is, but fake or not it's still funny as hell lol!

    Russian military intervention and aid to Syria #2 - Page 18 CQqZbrfUYAE4QZ-


    Very reminiscent of this:

    Russian military intervention and aid to Syria #2 - Page 18 USAID
    Funny.

    The bottom pic looks like Abu Muhammad Al-Amriki -- sent to hell by Kurds in Kobane.

    Guy in a pic is certain Commander Muhajireen Kavkaz wa Sham of Jaish al-Muhajireen wal-Ansar brigade.
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    Post  GarryB Wed Oct 07, 2015 7:16 am

    Without someone doing the "dirty work" on the ground these bombings will be ineffective or in vain. Syrian army is not capable of it, Russia will not send ground troops, Hezbollah doesn't have enough men so it's all up to Iran, IRGC, Basij.

    The Iranians have had troops on the ground in Syria and Iraq... what they really needed was air support that was accurate and that they could trust.
    Iranian air power would not be up to the  job without a lot of work, and of course no western air force could be trusted... only the Russian air force has the capability and can be trusted to hit all the right targets for this job.

    BTW comments about Turkey wanting to be part of a consulting group on the attacks is exactly what I suspected... but I doubt they now support Russia and Syria... I suspect they just want early inside information about targets to be hit and the chance to influence what targets are chased.

    I am sure they would be happy to direct the Russians to hit Kurdish targets and ignore anti assad forces.

    And what Russia's position is? When it comes to demographic and economic potential Russia is basically Mexico with nuclear weapons and a larger army (and arms industry). It has very limited ability to project power beyond ex-Soviet republics.

    And I believed that hogwash too... NATO propaganda... no one can save the world but us.

    But this deployment to Syria, which seems to have caught the west pretty much by surprise, and hitting real targets accurately and with a fairly high tempo despite not having that many planes in situ... I would suggest the Russian Military is clearly comparable to the vast majority of NATO countries and superior to many.

    Once they build their Mistral class replacement carriers they will be rather less reliant on friendly safe areas, the way the US can use carriers to attack from anywhere, but in terms of bang on target they seem to be able to put on a good party.

    Something Mexico could not... nor for that matter could germany or poland... in fact the only NATO countries with that sort of capability would be the US, UK and France... and I doubt they could do it as quickly and quietly...  tongue

    Okay.. guy posted this on twitter saying "We found moderate rebels that Russian gov cant".... Is this guy serious? I

    Hahahah... so this guy claims to have found moderate terrorists.... then the Russian Air Force will use moderate guided bombs (ie sat guided bombs with moderate colours painted on them) when fighting them...
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    Post  sepheronx Wed Oct 07, 2015 7:39 am

    Walther von Oldenburg wrote:During ww2 Soviet people fought for survival - literally. Defeat meant death or slavery for everyone. Nobody gave a damn how much would the war cost in lives and in money. This is not the same thing as fighting a war far away.

    And what Russia's position is? When it comes to demographic and economic potential Russia is basically Mexico with nuclear weapons and a larger army (and arms industry). It has very limited ability to project power beyond ex-Soviet republics.

    Not quite:

    http://www.tradingeconomics.com/mexico/gdp-per-capita-ppp

    vs

    http://www.tradingeconomics.com/russia/gdp-per-capita-ppp

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mexico

    vs

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Russia

    There is a massive difference between Mexico and Russia economically. Russia has industries that Mexico does not. Mexico relies entirely of their sales on exports of electronics and other manufactured goods to the United States and Canada (NAFTA man, half of the specialized equipment is made in Mexico, with the fabrications done elsewhere). Russia relies entirely on its domestic consumers, at least roughly 80% of its GDP. Taxation is also higher in Mexico compared to Russia. Mexico has maximum taxation of 35%, while Russia has a flat tax rate of 13% for income taxes. Huge difference. It was said that if Russia increased income tax by just 1%, they would gain another 220B Rubles in 1 year.

    Mexico has a decent prospering tech industry thanks to its much cheaper labor and huge demand in the US for it. I appraise Mexico for that. But they are entirely reliant on others for security equipment. Russia has the upper hand compared to Mexico on that. They also have an upper hand in specialized technologies to become self reliant, like nuclear technology (civil and military) as well as space technologies and the manufacturing behind it. That is not to say Mexico cannot do it. But the problem is lack of willpower in Mexico, as well as a huge problem ongoing in Mexico regarding corruption and the drug issues.

    Mexico also has a significant more vibrant tourism industry than Russia. That brings in tons of money.
    sepheronx
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    Post  sepheronx Wed Oct 07, 2015 8:16 am

    http://tass.ru/en/politics/826798

    So, what was all that stupid shit then that Putin was saying about how US is illegally there in Syria?  What is wrong with the Russian mod?  Cause lets face it, Russia reamed out the US and others for being in Syria without either UNSC or Syrian government approval.  They also mention how US has openly funded these groups.  So why work with them?  I hope this is some stupid sick joke on Russia's end.  There should be absolutely no agreement, cause US will use this agreement as some sort of UNSC agreement and will go in to remove Assad.  Assad should step up and demand to Russia if they work with US, then Russia loses its privileged to work in Syria.

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