The Situation in the Ukraine. #22

Akula971 wrote:
SOOOO MINSK 3 NOW ?? OR T90s in Kiev ??

OR

Ukrops attack, get killed by the hundreds, civilians get shelled and that is the end of it ??

Our hope is that they suffer such losses that the Novorussians can lauch their offensive and retake lost territory. Their leaders have already said there would be no Minsk 3. Even in the Kremlin they will realize someday is useless to negotiate with the Kiev gang and they have to strive for regime change in Ukraine.

Ispan wrote:

Akula971 wrote:
SOOOO MINSK 3 NOW ?? OR T90s in Kiev ??

OR

Ukrops attack, get killed by the hundreds, civilians get shelled and that is the end of it ??

Our hope is that they suffer such losses that the Novorussians can lauch their offensive and retake lost territory. Their leaders have already said there would be no Minsk 3. Even in the Kremlin they will realize someday is useless to negotiate with the Kiev gang and they have to strive for regime change in Ukraine.

Which means they would be replaced by others who sign Minsk III.

Unfortunately, it is too late for regime change in Kiev.
The US-clients are too entrenched.

I am not that pessimistic. Unlike Poro, Zakharchenko and Plotnisky are not puppets. Pawns, perhaps. But a pawn can be promoted...

And I consider the junta regime very weak. It can only maintain its hold on power with reppressive measures, but even if the Novorussians don't reach Kiev, the regime would crumble if the army is defeated, economic collapse aside.

Back to the front. Seems this time is for real and not saber rattling. That they took half a dozen villages in the neutral zone could be securing jump off positions. They are also moving troops to Lugansk, of course it is a feint, but would still fix Lugansk troops in place.

http://fortruss.blogspot.co.uk/2015/12/the-situation-in-donbass-is-heating-up.html

The situation in Donbass is heating up: Kiev moves equipment and troops to Lugansk

The situation along the line of contact in Luhansk People's Republic became more complex over the past three days. Ukrainian security forces intensified the shelling of territories of the Republic and positions of the NAF. Currently, gunfire occurs daily on objects of the LPR, with the Kiev military using small arms and anti-tank rocket-propelled grenades along with mortars.

As was reported by "Russian Spring", with reference to the representatives of the self-proclaimed LPR, December 6th, in the Slavyanoserbsk district, saw the attack of a Plant, named after Lenin, from small arms and antitank grenade launchers. Fire was opened on the NAF side of the city Happiness (Shchastya). Anti-aircraft guns and mortars of 82-mm caliber were fired at the village of Bold from positions of the Kiev.

On December 7th, fighters of the Ukrainian armed forces fired automatic grenade launchers at a NAF checkpoint near the village of Mikhailovka, near the city of Pervomaisk.

In addition, it became known that the Ukrainian security forces continue to move military equipment and personnel to the frontline. According to the LPR forces, up to 200 personnel of the armed forces arrived in Svatovo, with two columns of military equipment with staff of about 60 people arriving in Severodonetsk.

ExBeobachter1987 wrote:

flamming_python wrote:

ExBeobachter1987 wrote:

higurashihougi wrote:

ExBeobachter1987 wrote:The Donbass War is used as a reason to accept deteriorating conditions in Ukraine.

Hopefully another frozen winter may let them know whether to accept it or not.

And then what? These people are neither organized nor armed, and Kiev has the guns and the will to use them.

Russians did not overthrow Yeltsin either when they froze.

Not our problem whether they freeze or not and what, or what not, they do about it.

No money no honey. No gas either.

I hope so, but you never know with the Kremlin.
Unlike nations like Turkey, the West and the "Ukrainian brothers" seem to get preferential treatment way too often.

I can only hope, I can only hope.

Hope that not another rouble more from my taxes or Russia's state treasury, will go towards propping up the Ukraine; giving it gas discounts, gas transit through its territory, discussing loan deferments, etc...

Maybe this lawsuit will serve as the final straw to declare full-scale economic non-tolerance of this country and all the expenses it brings us. Not a rouble more.

higurashihougi wrote:

ExBeobachter1987 wrote:I hope so, but you never know with the Kremlin.
Unlike nations like Turkey, the West and the "Ukrainian brothers" seem to get preferential treatment way too often.

Seems like not anymore

https://www.rt.com/politics/325217-medvedev-blasts-ukraines-crookedness-over/

‘They won’t pay us back because they are crooks’ - Medvedev on Ukraine debt

It's rare for goverment leaders to publicly use such harsh words against foreign counterparts, and things seems like Moskva is giving Kyiv the last warning.

The problem is that Kiev will ignore the warning and get away with it, especially if the Kremlin continues to play by Western rules.
These people do not care what Moscow calls them or the rules that are supposed to limit their options.

The PM also said the approach of the International Monetary Fund (IMF) and other players in the field of international finance was far from correct: “It is very surprising that international financial organizations have started saying this was not sovereign borrowing. This is rubbish. This is obviously a blatant and cynical lie,” Medvedev stated.

He noted that according to commonly accepted rules, failure to repay a sovereign debt in time - also called a default on sovereign debt - should always lead to “unpleasant consequences” for the borrower.

On Tuesday the executive board of the IMF agreed to change its policy on lending to countries that are in arrears to other governments. Previous IMF guidelines on lending to such states were relatively strict, stating that "the IMF doesn't lend to countries that are not making a good-faith effort to eliminate their arrears with creditors."

With its $3 billion debt to Russia, Ukraine is among such countries covered in the IMF statement, with Kiev being on course to miss the end-of-the-year repayment deadline for the loan.

Russia has previously offered to restructure the debt on condition of a third party guarantee, but the Ukrainian side has rejected the offer.

If in doubt, the West will bend the rules to suit its interests.
Will the court in Britain respect the truth? I don't see it.

You can make the explanation as convoluted as you want, but the bottom line is the Ukes are goin to stiff Russia for the the three bill, with the full encouragement of the West. You can also anticipate with something like certainty the Ukes will follow up on that with threats, racial slurs and demands for more and more subsides from Russia, again with the full encouragement of the West.

Personally, I am with Paul Craig Roberts on this: Turn off the tap on the Ukes and all the rest of them. Refuse to sell to any state that us a member of NATO.

ExBeobachter1987 wrote:

If in doubt, the West will bend the rules to suit its interests.
.

Another very actual piece from Counterpunch:

http://www.counterpunch.org/2015/12/09/the-imf-joins-the-new-cold-war/

The IMF Joins the New Cold War

"on Tuesday, the IMF joined the New Cold War. It has been lending money to Ukraine despite the Fund’s rules blocking it from lending to countries with no visible chance of paying ."

"the country is run by the U.S.-backed junta put in place after the right-wing coup of winter 2014. Ukraine has refused to pay not only private-sector bondholders, but the Russian Government as well.
This should have blocked Ukraine from receiving further IMF aid. Refusal to pay for Ukrainian military belligerence in its New Cold War against  Russia would have been a major step forcing peace, and also forcing a clean-up of the country’s endemic corruption.
Instead, the IMF is backing Ukrainian policy, its kleptocracy and its Right Sector leading the attacks that recently cut off Crimea’s electricity. The only condition on which the IMF insists is continued austerity. Ukraine’s currency, the hryvnia, has fallen by a third this years, pensions have been slashed (largely as a result of being inflated away), while corruption continues unabated.

"In the end, the IMF simply lent Ukraine the money.
By doing so, it announced its new policy: “We only enforce debts owed in US dollars to US allies.” This means that what was simmering as a Cold War against Russia has now turned into a full-blown division of the world into the Dollar Bloc (with its satellite Euro and other pro-U.S. currencies) and the BRICS or other countries not in the U.S. financial and military orbit."


Bottom line : IMF is just another weapon pointed at Russia.

Wonder if this will happen? From Interfax


Ukraine's Ministry of Energy and Coal Industry expects the resumption of coal shipments from the occupied areas of Donbas after switching on the 220 kV Kakhovska-Titan power grid. "As far as I understand, all the orders [for the resumption of coal shipments] have been made, but the delivery to the controlled territories has not begun," Minister of Energy and Coal Industry of Ukraine Volodymyr Demchyshyn said in Kyiv.
As reported, the minister linked the resumption of coal supply from the ATO area with the switching on of one of the Crimean power lines.

Probably yes after this


Russian President Vladimir Putin has ordered that the government resume coal supplies to Ukraine in response to Kyiv resuming electricity flow to Crimea. "They [Ukraine] might only have gotten only one line up and running, but it's still one line [of power transmission]. It is necessary to resume coal supplies," Putin said at a meeting with government members.

Then its 'dream on' time

Ukraine's Ministry of Energy and Coal Industry is working on a new contract for the supply of electricity to the territory of Crimea, Minister Volodymyr Demchyshyn has said. "We are working on the agreement," he told reporters in Kyiv.
Demchyshyn added that the leaders of the Crimean Tatars demand that the text of the agreement noted the affiliation of Crimea to Ukraine. "The Crimean Tatars demand that the document indicate Crimea as Ukraine in parentheses. I agree with that," he added.

JohninMK wrote:Wonder if this will happen? From Interfax


Ukraine's Ministry of Energy and Coal Industry expects the resumption of coal shipments from the occupied areas of Donbas after switching on the 220 kV Kakhovska-Titan power grid. "As far as I understand, all the orders [for the resumption of coal shipments] have been made, but the delivery to the controlled territories has not begun," Minister of Energy and Coal Industry of Ukraine Volodymyr Demchyshyn said in Kyiv.
As reported, the minister linked the resumption of coal supply from the ATO area with the switching on of one of the Crimean power lines.

Probably yes after this


Russian President Vladimir Putin has ordered that the government resume coal supplies to Ukraine in response to Kyiv resuming electricity flow to Crimea. "They [Ukraine] might only have gotten only one line up and running, but it's still one line [of power transmission]. It is necessary to resume coal supplies," Putin said at a meeting with government members.

Disappointing, but not unexpected.

JohninMK wrote:Then its 'dream on' time

Ukraine's Ministry of Energy and Coal Industry is working on a new contract for the supply of electricity to the territory of Crimea, Minister Volodymyr Demchyshyn has said. "We are working on the agreement," he told reporters in Kyiv.
Demchyshyn added that the leaders of the Crimean Tatars demand that the text of the agreement noted the affiliation of Crimea to Ukraine. "The Crimean Tatars demand that the document indicate Crimea as Ukraine in parentheses. I agree with that," he added.

If the Russian side has some dignity left, it should refuse to accept this insult.
Ukrainian electricity is not as essential as it used to be.

ExBeobachter1987 wrote:

JohninMK wrote:Wonder if this will happen? From Interfax


Ukraine's Ministry of Energy and Coal Industry expects the resumption of coal shipments from the occupied areas of Donbas after switching on the 220 kV Kakhovska-Titan power grid. "As far as I understand, all the orders [for the resumption of coal shipments] have been made, but the delivery to the controlled territories has not begun," Minister of Energy and Coal Industry of Ukraine Volodymyr Demchyshyn said in Kyiv.
As reported, the minister linked the resumption of coal supply from the ATO area with the switching on of one of the Crimean power lines.

Probably yes after this


Russian President Vladimir Putin has ordered that the government resume coal supplies to Ukraine in response to Kyiv resuming electricity flow to Crimea. "They [Ukraine] might only have gotten only one line up and running, but it's still one line [of power transmission]. It is necessary to resume coal supplies," Putin said at a meeting with government members.

Disappointing, but not unexpected.

JohninMK wrote:Then its 'dream on' time

Ukraine's Ministry of Energy and Coal Industry is working on a new contract for the supply of electricity to the territory of Crimea, Minister Volodymyr Demchyshyn has said. "We are working on the agreement," he told reporters in Kyiv.
Demchyshyn added that the leaders of the Crimean Tatars demand that the text of the agreement noted the affiliation of Crimea to Ukraine. "The Crimean Tatars demand that the document indicate Crimea as Ukraine in parentheses. I agree with that," he added.

If the Russian side has some dignity left, it should refuse to accept this insult.
Ukrainian electricity is not as essential as it used to be.

It depends to whom. They can have a yearly contract while the power bridge is still being set up. Then sever the links.

KoTeMoRe wrote:

ExBeobachter1987 wrote:

JohninMK wrote:Wonder if this will happen? From Interfax


Ukraine's Ministry of Energy and Coal Industry expects the resumption of coal shipments from the occupied areas of Donbas after switching on the 220 kV Kakhovska-Titan power grid. "As far as I understand, all the orders [for the resumption of coal shipments] have been made, but the delivery to the controlled territories has not begun," Minister of Energy and Coal Industry of Ukraine Volodymyr Demchyshyn said in Kyiv.
As reported, the minister linked the resumption of coal supply from the ATO area with the switching on of one of the Crimean power lines.

Probably yes after this


Russian President Vladimir Putin has ordered that the government resume coal supplies to Ukraine in response to Kyiv resuming electricity flow to Crimea. "They [Ukraine] might only have gotten only one line up and running, but it's still one line [of power transmission]. It is necessary to resume coal supplies," Putin said at a meeting with government members.

Disappointing, but not unexpected.

JohninMK wrote:Then its 'dream on' time

Ukraine's Ministry of Energy and Coal Industry is working on a new contract for the supply of electricity to the territory of Crimea, Minister Volodymyr Demchyshyn has said. "We are working on the agreement," he told reporters in Kyiv.
Demchyshyn added that the leaders of the Crimean Tatars demand that the text of the agreement noted the affiliation of Crimea to Ukraine. "The Crimean Tatars demand that the document indicate Crimea as Ukraine in parentheses. I agree with that," he added.

If the Russian side has some dignity left, it should refuse to accept this insult.
Ukrainian electricity is not as essential as it used to be.

It depends to whom. They can have a yearly contract while the power bridge is still being set up. Then sever the links.

There is no need for an annual contract. The electricity bridge is supposed to be finished till May 2016.

ExBeobachter1987 wrote:

KoTeMoRe wrote:

ExBeobachter1987 wrote:

JohninMK wrote:Wonder if this will happen? From Interfax


Ukraine's Ministry of Energy and Coal Industry expects the resumption of coal shipments from the occupied areas of Donbas after switching on the 220 kV Kakhovska-Titan power grid. "As far as I understand, all the orders [for the resumption of coal shipments] have been made, but the delivery to the controlled territories has not begun," Minister of Energy and Coal Industry of Ukraine Volodymyr Demchyshyn said in Kyiv.
As reported, the minister linked the resumption of coal supply from the ATO area with the switching on of one of the Crimean power lines.

Probably yes after this


Russian President Vladimir Putin has ordered that the government resume coal supplies to Ukraine in response to Kyiv resuming electricity flow to Crimea. "They [Ukraine] might only have gotten only one line up and running, but it's still one line [of power transmission]. It is necessary to resume coal supplies," Putin said at a meeting with government members.

Disappointing, but not unexpected.

JohninMK wrote:Then its 'dream on' time

Ukraine's Ministry of Energy and Coal Industry is working on a new contract for the supply of electricity to the territory of Crimea, Minister Volodymyr Demchyshyn has said. "We are working on the agreement," he told reporters in Kyiv.
Demchyshyn added that the leaders of the Crimean Tatars demand that the text of the agreement noted the affiliation of Crimea to Ukraine. "The Crimean Tatars demand that the document indicate Crimea as Ukraine in parentheses. I agree with that," he added.

If the Russian side has some dignity left, it should refuse to accept this insult.
Ukrainian electricity is not as essential as it used to be.

It depends to whom. They can have a yearly contract while the power bridge is still being set up. Then sever the links.

There is no need for an annual contract. The electricity bridge is supposed to be finished till May 2016.

Given that this is the low power line that has been restored and it apparently serves only a small part of Crimea as well as bits of Ukraine, maybe there is a possibility that that part of Crimea is not served by the rest of the Crimea 'grid' which was supplied by the two higher voltage lines. Also as this line seems to loop into Crimea on its way to supplying those bits of Ukraine perhaps there is no way for Ukraine to stop Crimea using power on the line without turning it off totally.

Fortrus examining the promises of money to Kiev made by the EU/World Bank/IMF/US versus what has actually been delivered. Basically F All. Ukraine is slowly having all its financial resources stripped, ready for the raping of their assets at knockdown prices in 2016/7.

A new burst of war in the east and the inevitable defeat, which will not be stopped by NATO as it will ensure that Western occupation forces will be able to move in unopposed. Ukraine is starting to discover the real differences between being a 'colony' and part of a 'union'.

http://fortruss.blogspot.co.uk/2015/12/a-sugar-pill-from-biden-how-ukraine-was.html

http://fortruss.blogspot.co.uk/2015/12/donetsk-resumes-coal-trade-with-ukraine.html

Guys get serious, words on paper don't mean sh*t as we all know by now. This is even less than words on paper, it's wishfull thinking about words on paper. Why are you even making fuss over this?

Crimea goes energy independent in several month at most, bridge will be up and running in couple of years, hell technical one is done already and everything else comes from Russia across Kerch.

As for everything else read JohninMKs post.

Easy on the drama everyone!

https://eadaily.com/news/2015/12/10/evrosoyuz-predlagaet-rossii-po-druzheski-prostit-ukraine-20-eyo-dolga

EU representative ask Russia to write off 20% of Kyiv's debt like the West has done similarly. He said that between good friends it is possible to write off some of the debt..

Wait, wait, wait, who are good friends ?

Pay back all debts first, friend later

https://www.rt.com/business/325232-russia-putin-sues-ukraine-debt/

Russian President Vladimir Putin has ordered Finance Minister Anton Siluanov to file a lawsuit against Ukraine if Kiev fails to repay Russia's $3 billion Eurobond loan by the December 20 deadline.

Putin’s order followed the Finance Minister’s Wednesday report on the debt repayment situation. Siluanov told the President about the refusal of the US to give guarantees on future payments of Ukrainian sovereign debt.

“It is strange. If they are so confident in the country’s solvency for the next year, then they could somehow participate during the last four years to share the risks," said Putin.

"Fine. File the lawsuit," he added.

Countdown untill the dead line. Tik tak tik tak tik tak.

Ivan Katchanovski
Facebook
3 mins ·

Ukraine is now a client state par excellence similarly to DNR and LNR. Ukrainska pravda cites sources close to Poroshenko confirming Biden's request during his meetings with Poroshenko and Yatseniuk to fire Shokin and Baiden's involvement in appointments of other top officials. Biden has reportedly agreed to change prime minister, the most senior position in Ukraine according to the constitution. Poroshenko offered him to appoint Saakashvili, Hroisman, or a foreigner as new prime minister. But Biden did not endorse these candidates proposed by Poroshenko. Ukrainska pravda also reports that searches for candidates to replace the GPU head and Yatseniuk are underway but no final decisions yet have been made in both cases. Poroshenko also reportedly suggested Jaresko as new prime minister.

http://www.pravda.com.ua/articles/2015/12/9/7091891/


Ivan Katchanovski
Facebook
December 7 at 10:01am ·

The US vice-president during his visit to Ukraine calls for a reshuffling of the Ukrainian government and firing Prosecutor General of Ukraine. This is another evidence that Ukraine is treated by the US government as its client state and that the US policy towards Ukraine is driven primarily by geopolitical interests and not by support of democracy, sovereignty, and Western values

Text of Biden's speech in English

What a joke. There is no such thing as an honest politician in America.

https://www.whitehouse.gov/the-press-office/2015/12/09/remarks-vice-president-joe-biden-ukrainian-rada

Cowboy's daughter wrote:Text of Biden's speech in English

What a joke. There is no such thing as an honest politician in America.

https://www.whitehouse.gov/the-press-office/2015/12/09/remarks-vice-president-joe-biden-ukrainian-rada

He didn't mention his son in all that rubbish?
Strange that...

He nprobably thought 'they were desperate, they would have taken any crap we sent' but he phrased it more diplomatically.

WASHINGTON (Sputnik) – Reports emerged late in November that the Ukrainian military decried "secondhand" equipment supplied by the United States as part of its $250 million non-lethal military aid to the country. These included up to 30-year-old Humvees and decade-old bulletproof vests.

"Maybe the quickest stuff that could have been provided might have been some older equipment, I don’t know," Hodges told a Defense Department briefing late Wednesday, clarifying that the range of other equipment was "brand new." Hodges, who said more than $250 million of equipment has been delivered to Ukraine, asserted that Kiev "knew what [it was] getting," which he argued "counts for something." "You try to do the best you can as fast as you can to get what you can upon request," he stressed.

Read more: http://sputniknews.com/europe/20151210/1031510799/us-ukraine-military-aid.html#ixzz3tv7Y9s2u

Seems like old junks or improvised steel coffins will form the backbone of Kyiv's military equipments in the future

Ukraina used to manufacture T-64, T-80, Antonov An-xx... and now they are using decaded-old Humvee.

F*** you Maidan, you ruin your own country, you backstab your own people.