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    U.S Military encirclement of China

    Backman
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    Post  Backman Wed Aug 03, 2022 5:42 pm

    The US knows that time is on China's side. That's is precisely why they did this stunt and will follow it up with more stunts soon.

    The US has demonstrated that it is willing to risk it all for Taiwan. China really didn't believe that the US would do this. They thought the rhetoric was a sufficient deterrent.


    China might just have to give up Taiwan. Are they really going to fight the US if the US decides to send in a couple carrier groups to Taiwan next year ?

    Maybe China will give up Taiwan and count on the US going the way of the USSR eventually. The US will go broke and the navy will be dismantled. Then they will get it back.

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    Post  flamming_python Wed Aug 03, 2022 5:52 pm

    Well I know that the Twatterverse and Telegram shitstream has already pronounced China DOA dead on arrival but I'd add my voice to the more cautious commentary on this issue. Like that China would indeed be violating Sun Tzu by allowing the US to bait it into a fight at a time and place of its choosing. Or that it's somehow obligated to respond right this instant instead of at its leisure and after preparations are made; the later certainly being the more logical approach from a military standpoint.

    Or that indeed this issue ever had any chance to devolve into a military confrontation. The US didn't prepare a Taiwan task-force and China did not prepare an invasion force. The consequences were always going to be purely economical and political, despite whatever sabre-rattling or rhetoric as of late.
    In which case China did score an own-goal by trying to appear more dominant and bellicose than its actually prepared to be for the time being, while the US scored a propaganda victory by making it appear that it made China back down when in fact it itself was bluffing just as much.


    Last edited by flamming_python on Wed Aug 03, 2022 5:58 pm; edited 4 times in total

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    Post  ATLASCUB Wed Aug 03, 2022 5:52 pm

    sundoesntrise wrote:
    In the light of the recent (December 2021) Chinese real estate crash, the extreme real estate economy, the (localized) bankruns last months and the lack of liquidity of a large number of Chinese banks (involved in the scammy real estate projects - over lending to said real estate projects in violation of the law), this whole 'China numba wan you can't do anything about it' shtick needs re-assessments.

    Because quite frankly, from an outsider perspective the Chinese economy looks like shit, and even worse, it's getting grotesquely mismanaged.

    Chinese banks currently have at least 13 trillion USD outstanding loans to commoners who've managed to 'buy/lease' an apartment that is yet to be build - with many real estate companies bust and the banks low on liquidity.

    That's a proper shitshow. And let's not even go to the Chinese 'epidemic control' which consists of ritually suiciding the economy in favor of keeping Covid1984 (common cold virus) on or near zero. It's estimated that they have spent 4+ trillion USD on testing kits alone (acquaintances in Beijing told me that in 2.5 years they've done 300+ tests), never mind the destroyed supply changes, manufacturing and trading potential

    Before the CCP's massive loss of face yesterday I was under the impression that the Changs would borrow a page out of the USA's book and start a war to distract attention from domestic problems (and royally screw over the millions of investors under some equivalent of a War Powers Act)

    China is not on a trayectory to takeover economically, not anymore.

    All indicators are there that point to that trajectory. In more ways than one they're already there. Industrial base speaking they're beyond the U.S and much of the West. Obviously not everything is rosy, and massive economies like the Chinese will have their bubbles in this sector or that one, it's market capitalism after all. The biggest bubble of all is run by the American fed.

    That trajectory, all things being equal is unchanged. But the Anglo alligiance, along with the Europeans will thus change the rules of the game, tweaking/throwing globalism out the window (aka decoupling)...slowly but surely, as well as engaging in inward protectionism. Above all, the goal is to use "bloc mentality" to deprive China of unfettered access, not only to Western markets but also to plaint regimes associated with or dependent on the West (in one form or another). This is why the Chinese cry so much about bloc mentality, it's their strongest weakness... they have never, in the modern era, built sustainable allied coalitions, economically and/or security wise. They don't possess the experience, despite having the economic clout/money. With that said it's inevitable for them to engage in bloc mentality if your enemies are dead set on boxing you into bloc mentality. That is where BRICS+, and all other Eurasian trade/security constructs that exclude the West come into play - Chinese hypocrisy at its finest. Obviously those constructs are not where they need to be, in terms of mission, trust and effectiveness relative to Western ones but you can see the political overtones already. In the end, if the Chinese are to succeed in having their "century of dominance" they'll need bloc mentality - whatever form it takes. The West will not allow anything else. If the Chinese are not successful in this regard, that trajectory will be severely dented, that is to say, to large degree, contained.
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    Post  kvs Wed Aug 03, 2022 7:53 pm

    If all the claims about China's economy were grounded in reality, then it should have disintegrated years ago. It is funny seeing
    people in the west, that live in economies totally propped up with debt, i.e. fake GDP growth, bitch about China's economy. China's
    economy is growing and is grounded in reality. It has speculative bubbles, but they are not the essence of this economy and merely
    pathologies of capitalism that the precious west is subject to, including the overhyped real estate bubble.

    There is a lot of growth room in China since it has not equilibrated in terms of domestic development. This cannot be said for the
    west.

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    Post  Hole Wed Aug 03, 2022 8:09 pm

    Listen to what Col. MacGregor has to say about it. China can sit there and wait and if the Amercians send ships they can sink them one after the other. How many ships does the USN have in the Pacific? 50? Well, how many Anti-ship missiles does China have? 25.000? 50.000? Good luck trying to "defend" Taiwan.

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    Post  flamming_python Wed Aug 03, 2022 10:38 pm

    https://morningstaronline.co.uk/article/e/poking-dragon-eye-pelosis-taiwan-trip-reckless-and-dangerous

    Poking a dragon in the eye – Pelosi's Taiwan trip is reckless and dangerous

    NANCY PELOSI’S Taiwan touchdown is an irresponsible, provocative stunt which risks starting a war.

    It is a depressing sign of the times that some British MPs’ response to this reckless brinkmanship is to announce their own Taiwan visit for this autumn.

    The Pelosi trip and the British tribute act planned by the ever bellicose Tom Tugendhat and friends will be presented as part of US President Joe Biden’s “democracy alliance.”

    British media will present Taiwan as a plucky little democracy threatened by its authoritarian neighbour, analogous to their presentation of Ukraine and Russia.

    Indeed, Russia’s invasion of Ukraine is cited as a reason Western politicians must shore up their relations with Taiwan. The reasoning is utterly misconceived.

    One delusion is that the build-up of Western military might deters rather than provokes a response. If the definition of madness is to do the same thing over and over again and expect different results, this is a mad policy.

    The US was enlarging its military presence in eastern Europe year on year before Russia attacked Ukraine, masterminding enormous military drills along the Russian border from the Baltic to the Black Sea. These drills were described by one member of the Ukrainian government in 2021 as a dry run for “the war with Russia.”

    It is no justification for the Russian invasion to observe that Moscow viewed these activities as threatening and that preventing further US military encroachment was one factor that led to war.

    Another is the very different status of Taiwan to Ukraine in international law. Chinese sovereignty over Taiwan is recognised by almost every government on Earth, including the US and Britain. It is even recognised by Taiwan, which is officially the Republic of China and maintains a territorial claim to the Chinese mainland.

    History matters. Taiwan is a Chinese province conquered by Japan in 1895, one of the many territorial losses imposed on China in the “century of humiliation” that began with the Opium War of 1842 and ended with the establishment of the People’s Republic in 1949.

    Liberated toward the end of the second world war, Taiwan became the last holdout of the Chiang Kai-shek government after communist revolution swept the rest of China, with the US navy stopping the People’s Liberation Army from reaching the island.

    In Chinese eyes, reunification of the territories sundered by imperialist powers is part of the process of decolonisation. This is why the “one China” policy has always been insisted on as a precondition of opening relations with China.

    US understanding of this underpinned the normalisation of relations with Beijing in the 1970s. Reneging on it undermines the entire basis of US-China ties, taking us into uncharted waters.

    Western liberals, whose sensitivity to colonialism’s long shadow is rarely acute, may dismiss all this as ancient history and say we should still defend Taiwan if it is threatened.

    But when is it “threatened?” Only when Western powers pull stunts like Pelosi’s.

    China has pursued a policy of peaceful reunification for decades, working to deepen trade ties with Taiwan and supporting a “one country, two systems” model similar to that applied in Macao and in Hong Kong, where it was largely successful before a hostile movement opposed to any integration with China, awash with US funding, worked to destabilise it.

    China only threatens military action when Washington implies it is determined to thwart peaceful reunification. Pelosi’s trip makes a Taiwan war more, not less, likely.

    It’s possible this is deliberate: as the Ukraine war has shored up European military subordination to the US through Nato, a China-Taiwan conflict might be viewed as a chance to accelerate Japanese militarisation and bring more Asian countries into its orbit.

    The human cost of such a gamble would be intolerable — and it risks spilling over into war between the world’s most powerful countries.

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    Post  kvs Wed Aug 03, 2022 11:49 pm

    History matters in the "Ukraine" case as well. Appealing to international recognition is BS. The history and the people in the relevant
    regions define the law and have the rights. A collection of governments around the world and their "recognitions" does not create the
    law and the rights.

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    Post  sundoesntrise Thu Aug 04, 2022 2:00 am

    kvs wrote:If all the claims about China's economy were grounded in reality, then it should have disintegrated years ago.   It is funny seeing
    people in the west, that live in economies totally propped up with debt, i.e. fake GDP growth, bitch about China's economy.   China's
    economy is growing and is grounded in reality.   It has speculative bubbles, but they are not the essence of this economy and merely
    pathologies of capitalism that the precious west is subject to, including the overhyped real estate bubble.  

    There is a lot of growth room in China since it has not equilibrated in terms of domestic development.   This cannot be said for the
    west.  


    The absolute economic illiteracy of the usual suspects on this board. I get it, you now China's bitch hence the need to bend over like a good little doggo and put up for based Chinamen. Even so there is no reciprocity at all - how all the 'experts' on here were quietly hoping for an escalation in Taiwan to move the Empire's watchful eye away from Russia's embarrassing campaign in the Ukraine..

    Well, bad luck. Instead you got the screws tightened in the Balkans and Caucasus. Shill away in your reply, it's not gonna make a difference on the ground anyhow.

    Back to the clownery. In short, China has a

    * full on food recession
    * real estate collapse
    * productivity near recession (manufacturing down double digits, pace accelerating)
    * banking crisis
    * population in decline
    * all buyers of exports are not buying because of their own recessions just further making China's problems worse

    If you can't understand what a global market is, you're fucking retarded.

    China's economy is one big sham and the Changs can't Jew their way out of this like they have in the past. China's economy has been fake for years and the CCP spends trillions a year bailing out it's failing economy. This is more than the entire rest of the world combined. Most businesses (not just SOEs) in China aren't profitable at all, and without the CCP bailing them out would have collapsed long ago. This is why so many people have been confused about why China hasn't collapsed yet. Because in secret the CCP were spending trillions a year trying to prevent a collapse. But the problem has gotten so large now even the CCP is struggling to afford it, which is why we've seen shit like Evergrande collapse.

    Your looking at a full on economic shutdown of CCP run banks.

    Just wait until that demographic problem (2021 TFR 1.16, 60-80 million ghost people all below 40) hits China hard. Which by the way is also much worse than official figures are stating according to a recent leak of over 1 billion Chinese peoples data
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    Post  ATLASCUB Thu Aug 04, 2022 2:12 am

    The screws will be tightened everywhere. The anglo's and their European cohorts ain't playing. It almost made me teary eyed, figuratively, to see the German chancellor Schultz deliver a speech at the height of crisis in Ukraine in what read like a declaration of war on Russia, staunchly professing to defend the rules-based order with all of Germany's might... by extension, carrying Europe. Really touching  lol1 lol1 Only Russians can be such suckers to keep bumping against the same old tree. Anyway that is to say the West is in it to win it. The constant is that they'll keep coming, no matter the setback, big or small.

    It's the other side as a whole that needs to figure itself out and deal with all their national and cultural insecurities quick. For the empire it's pretty clear cut what they need to save and protect, and against whom. From that assessment forward, their enemies are crystal clear and all fall in one big pot. Only thing Russia and China can do, more or less how this ends is with enemy collapse (rules-based order), and after it, keeping the foot on the West necks for millennia. It's the way all of this works, and has always worked.

    Maybe Xi and Putin need to organize one of those ice cream meetings to talk things over a bit. They'll get picked apart and it will be death by a thousand long cuts if they don't integrate even faster, and create a sound, in concrete alternative to the rules-based order (not the imaginary one they've been selling that walks slower than a dying old turtle, even to this day). If they split, boy it's over.

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    Post  sundoesntrise Thu Aug 04, 2022 2:47 am

    ATLASCUB wrote:
    sundoesntrise wrote:
    In the light of the recent (December 2021) Chinese real estate crash, the extreme real estate economy, the (localized) bankruns last months and the lack of liquidity of a large number of Chinese banks (involved in the scammy real estate projects - over lending to said real estate projects in violation of the law), this whole 'China numba wan you can't do anything about it' shtick needs re-assessments.

    Because quite frankly, from an outsider perspective the Chinese economy looks like shit, and even worse, it's getting grotesquely mismanaged.

    Chinese banks currently have at least 13 trillion USD outstanding loans to commoners who've managed to 'buy/lease' an apartment that is yet to be build - with many real estate companies bust and the banks low on liquidity.

    That's a proper shitshow. And let's not even go to the Chinese 'epidemic control' which consists of ritually suiciding the economy in favor of keeping Covid1984 (common cold virus) on or near zero. It's estimated that they have spent 4+ trillion USD on testing kits alone (acquaintances in Beijing told me that in 2.5 years they've done 300+ tests), never mind the destroyed supply changes, manufacturing and trading potential

    Before the CCP's massive loss of face yesterday I was under the impression that the Changs would borrow a page out of the USA's book and start a war to distract attention from domestic problems (and royally screw over the millions of investors under some equivalent of a War Powers Act)

    China is not on a trayectory to takeover economically, not anymore.

    All indicators are there that point to that trajectory. In more ways than one they're already there. Industrial base speaking they're beyond the U.S and much of the West. Obviously not everything is rosy, and massive economies like the Chinese will have their bubbles in this sector or that one, it's market capitalism after all. The biggest bubble of all is run by the American fed.

    That trajectory, all things being equal is unchanged. But the Anglo alligiance, along with the Europeans will thus change the rules of the game, tweaking/throwing globalism out the window (aka decoupling)...slowly but surely, as well as engaging in inward protectionism. Above all, the goal is to use "bloc mentality" to deprive China of unfettered access, not only to Western markets but also to plaint regimes associated with or dependent on the West (in one form or another). This is why the Chinese cry so much about bloc mentality, it's their strongest weakness... they have never, in the modern era, built sustainable allied coalitions, economically and/or security wise. They don't possess the experience, despite having the economic clout/money. With that said it's inevitable for them to engage in bloc mentality if your enemies are dead set on boxing you into bloc mentality. That is where BRICS+, and all other Eurasian trade/security constructs that exclude the West come into play - Chinese hypocrisy at its finest. Obviously those constructs are not where they need to be, in terms of mission, trust and effectiveness relative to Western ones but you can see the political overtones already. In the end, if the Chinese are to succeed in having their "century of dominance" they'll need bloc mentality - whatever form it takes. The West will not allow anything else. If the Chinese are not successful in this regard, that trajectory will be severely dented, that is to say, to large degree, contained.

    Talking points about China's 'manufacturing base' are invalid as these things are extremely exposed. China is a giant low cost assembly line where low quality goods and pirated (read stolen) intellectual property are reproduced and put together/ re-engineered by Changs working 12 hour shifts - and even with all the intellectual theft going on they still need to import the vast majority of high tech components from either developed East Asian nations or the West.

    The Jews are angry with China. Like really angry. Foaming at the mouth angry. China didn't 'rise to power', it was made to rise to power. Kissinger (communist in a 5000 USD suit) and associates are and were openly boasting how they'd engineer the fall of the US and recreate the Eurasian landmass superstate along the MacKinder Theory German-Russia-China axis

    Things have changed. Lots of what happens on a surface level is theatrics, but this is not.

    Who changed funding from Chang Kai Shek to Mao in 1947? Who was Sidney Rittenberg, American intelligence officer and good friend of Mao and Kissinger? Who did Deng 'open up' to in 1979 - and with that I don't mean 'the West'. Who shipped the entire manufacturing base of the USA to China? Who engineered and facilitated the constant technology transfer (going on till this day) from the US to China (Israel of course) What is the BIRD? the Silvermaster Spyring? Who is Zohar Zisapel? Who codes Windows? Where are the clouds/data centers of companies like Intel located? And on and on.

    Jews of course. Jews built China and now they are angry at it, and when Jews are angry you better watch out because they still control much of what goes on in the US and by extension Europe. They built China and they can break it down too. The US (Jewish oligarchy) Navy controls the shipping lines which are vital for the Chinese export based economy, the USD is vital for an manufacturing based economy (as opposed to a resource based economy like Russia), the US still holds the patents on the high technology stuff China imports (and without it the Chinese economy would immediately start to hamper), as do many of its allies, and the US still has the most combat ready and experienced armed forces, with the larges amount of resources behind it.
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    Post  flamming_python Thu Aug 04, 2022 2:57 am

    sundoesntrise wrote:
    kvs wrote:If all the claims about China's economy were grounded in reality, then it should have disintegrated years ago.   It is funny seeing
    people in the west, that live in economies totally propped up with debt, i.e. fake GDP growth, bitch about China's economy.   China's
    economy is growing and is grounded in reality.   It has speculative bubbles, but they are not the essence of this economy and merely
    pathologies of capitalism that the precious west is subject to, including the overhyped real estate bubble.  

    There is a lot of growth room in China since it has not equilibrated in terms of domestic development.   This cannot be said for the
    west.  


    The absolute economic illiteracy of the usual suspects on this board. I get it, you now China's bitch hence the need to bend over like a good little doggo and put up for based Chinamen. Even so there is no reciprocity at all - how all the 'experts' on here were quietly hoping for an escalation in Taiwan to move the Empire's watchful eye away from Russia's embarrassing campaign in the Ukraine..

    Well, bad luck. Instead you got the screws tightened in the Balkans and Caucasus. Shill away in your reply, it's not gonna make a difference on the ground anyhow.

    Back to the clownery. In short, China has a

    * full on food recession
    * real estate collapse
    * productivity near recession (manufacturing down double digits, pace accelerating)
    * banking crisis
    * population in decline
    * all buyers of exports are not buying because of their own recessions just further making China's problems worse

    If you can't understand what a global market is, you're fucking retarded.

    China's economy is one big sham and the Changs can't Jew their way out of this like they have in the past. China's economy has been fake for years and the CCP spends trillions a year bailing out it's failing economy. This is more than the entire rest of the world combined. Most businesses (not just SOEs) in China aren't profitable at all, and without the CCP bailing them out would have collapsed long ago. This is why so many people have been confused about why China hasn't collapsed yet. Because in secret the CCP were spending trillions a year trying to prevent a collapse. But the problem has gotten so large now even the CCP is struggling to afford it, which is why we've seen shit like Evergrande collapse.

    Your looking at a full on economic shutdown of CCP run banks.

    Just wait until that demographic problem (2021 TFR 1.16, 60-80 million ghost people all below 40) hits China hard. Which by the way is also much worse than official figures are stating according to a recent leak of over 1 billion Chinese peoples data

    If China's economy is a sham then what do you call the US's? What do you call Europe's?

    Half their economy is virtual based on things like foreign securities, Hollywood, real estate, inflated stock prices and other things that altogether form one of those Jengo towers, where you take turns removing one block at a time until the whole thing keels over.
    The blocks in this case being cheap grains, cheap oil, cheap gas hey presto the rest of the stuff is worth shit. The Asian countries meanwhile keep their virtual economies as they still have the fundamentals courtesy of Russian preferential supplies.

    Not to say that the Western countries are doomed or anything; they will adapt - but their economies are certainly in more trouble than China's

    And no I frankly give a damn about any escalation in Taiwan or taking away the US's eye on Ukraine. It may have been useful months ago but now the Ukraine crisis is entering its twilight phase anyway and the Empire is not going to save it's pet regime there much less defeat Russia.
    Probably why they themselves have chosen to make trouble in Taiwan now, a couple days after stirring the pot in Kosovo, and with Azerbaijan perhaps now being encouraged by them to get up to no good in Karabakh too who knows. It's them that need the distraction to be saved from embarrassment.. so why not kick Serbia a few times in the ribs instead while it's surrounded by NATO already, or publically humiliate that rich Asian kid instead.
    Yeah that will show them.

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    Post  sundoesntrise Thu Aug 04, 2022 3:05 am

    flamming_python wrote:

    If China's economy is a sham then what do you call the US's? What do you call Europe's?

    Half their economy is virtual based on things like foreign securities, Hollywood, real estate, inflated stock prices and other things that altogether form one of those Jengo towers, where you take turns removing one block at a time until the whole thing keels over.
    The blocks in this case being cheap grains, cheap oil, cheap gas hey presto the rest of the stuff is worth shit. The Asian countries meanwhile keep their virtual economies as they still have the fundamentals courtesy of Russian preferential supplies.

    Not to say that the Western countries are doomed or anything; they will adapt - but their economies are certainly in more trouble than China's

    And no I frankly give a damn about any escalation in Taiwan or taking away the US's eye on Ukraine. It may have been useful months ago but now the Ukraine crisis is entering its twilight phase anyway and the Empire is not going to save it's pet regime there much less defeat Russia.
    Probably why they themselves have chosen to make trouble in Taiwan now, a couple days after stirring the pot in Kosovo, and with Azerbaijan perhaps now being encouraged by them to get up to no good in Karabakh too who knows. It's them that need the distraction to be saved from embarrassment.. so why not kick Serbia a few times in the ribs instead while it's surrounded by NATO already, or publically humiliate that rich Asian kid instead.
    Yeah that will show them.

    West's economy is fake too. Maybe even faker. Even so my comments are aimed at the notion (psy-op, facet of demoralization in my opinion) that China is unquestionably ascending to power and that nothing (either domestically or internationally) is standing in the way of that.

    This type of thinking permeates all corners of the internet. Quite frankly I am not so convinced anymore. China has many weaknesses and the Anglo-Zionists have fended off rising contenders (WW2) before.

    We'll have to wait and see
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    Post  flamming_python Thu Aug 04, 2022 3:19 am

    In WW2 they had Russia and China onside
    These days they have the losers of that war on side; Germany and Japan. And the borders of Hitler's ol' empire really together with some of his ideology.
    But they don't have India. Iran is a far harder nut to crack. Latin America is a little more ambitious. Africa is independent, at least nominally, and some parts can even give back spare change such as Algeria. Even countries such as Indonesia and Saudi Arabia have their own opinions. Turkey is hard to put on a leash.

    On the whole the situations cannot be compared. You might as well compare WW2 to Napoleon's time. You are looking at different worlds. The same smoochers trying to stay on top of it, but different worlds where nothing can be predicted. The Anglo-American empire has it's advantages and it's not going to suddenly disappear, but neither will it be able to reassert its dominance in the world and crush challengers. Especially when those challengers are not trying to replace it as hegemon, but advocating a different world order based on multilateralism, that most of the rest of the world agrees with them on.
    Sooner or later, that new system will just end up becoming the dominant one and the best the Anglos can hope for now is to delay that with a return to diplomacy. Their current course is self-destructive and won't stop anything even if they did somehow force a crisis within Russia and/or China.

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    Post  ATLASCUB Thu Aug 04, 2022 3:54 am

    You're covering a lot there.

    When you say exposed you mean a lot of China's economy has codependency not only on Western markets and the influx of tech and know-how from the West but also on the health of these economies. That is true and has been known for a while. While it was once a blessing in peace time as China developed and grew, it's a hindrance in times of confrontation, as it ties their hands, unlike say Russia, who is less exposed. The work to decouple while maintaining this primacy is also even more complex as a result, with several pitfalls that they must avoid, but unfortunately, some of those pitfalls will be unavoidable for China. But this applies in equal or worse measure to the West as well. The thing is, the Chinese have penetrated other markets outside the West, in Asia, Latin America, Africa, the Middle East... becoming the largest trade partner of a great many nations around the world. China has also grown internal economic activity. Those advances however are not an equitable trade-off for the Western markets (and all its benefits) as the Chinese literally built a system wherein they're naturally pegged to be constantly in competitive advantageous position as long as they have access to western markets and devalue the yuan well below the dollar regime. Their investments outside of this paradigm however, the new "silk roads", "BRICS+" etc are a recognition of the inevitability that such stratagem will one day be no more. So, more than a lifeline, this is a strength that China is clearly pushing to build upon - since it's obvious what's on the horizon.

    West dependency on China and Asia has atrophied Western economies to catastrophic effect. To illustrate the point, at the height of the supply chain issues I had to wait for 5-6 months to get a bedroom set shipped from Asia, from late October until March. This is literally just large pieces of cheap carved pine wood. This wasn't some custom piece of furniture, made for custom order hand crafted in a mill, but your standard by design bedroom set that looks nice. Never before had you had to go into a furniture retailer in the U.S and be told that all of their items on sale were on back-order for 5-6 months (and not just a bedroom set). Now if that was my case, can you imagine the millions of Americans who went to the same retailer (biggest here) and had to make the same orders and wait the same amount of time? What about all the other retailers who all source from the same manufacturers more or less? And the kicker, if you wanted to go for some ugly, simplistic cheap crap that's actually in stock, you could go to Amazon to buy the massively overproduced crap that the Chinese have dumped in warehouses across the U.S in the millions.... the in-box mattresses and bed sets.

    Shortages of essentials, even food on major retailers is common place, in the U.S of all places, "a net food exporter"..... pays to know since I got someone close that works in retail to hook me up, beyond just me casually doing the necessary shopping going blind. That is not even mentioning the price gauging going on all across the board on all types of goods and services hiding behind runaway inflation. Real Estate crisis? The prices of homes here have grown to stratospheric highs, while wage increases lag behind several fold. This in turn creates a rental crisis.... where for young adults, living with roommates (strangers) is no longer something to be ashamed of, and temporary, but something common place, and socially acceptable. Thats how bad it's. And say if you're a senior adult who made wrong life choices, well, there is the homeless curb at a big retailer/school or bridge... or if you're one of the lucky ones, a camping trailer made "mobile home" on a trailer park of some rich landowner (or "investor group"), whose price increases are outpacing social security increases on a yearly basis - good luck. I could go on and on. Still beats the world down South in LatAm but not by much... those with roof/safety security in the third world should think more than twice before migrating. Do you read on the news of "manufacturing" making a comeback? Please...only a sucker believes in any number put out by the Fed or the Chamber of Commerce, or the casino known as Wall Street.

    That is to say, I disagree on who holds the dominant hand for the time being. I rather be in China's position, despite the co-dependency, than in the U.S/European position future wise. Much worse in Europe's position, as not only do they share similar co-dependency with China, but energy dependency on Russia, and the Euro, unlike the dollar, is toiler paper. The dollar is still the worlds reserve currency, in which all financial flows are measured against, and there is no sound alternative to that. That is what keeps the U.S afloat and still in the game. If there is something that can bend nations, is feckless elites fearing that their lifeworks (measured in acquired wealth) could potentially be taken away by the U.S at the flip of a finger. Those fleckless elites thus know better to not mess with the house, and thus this is a self-reinforcing system of control, and by extension parasitic privilege (a tax by the house). The combined West, is more powerful than China, and they will knock China out if China doesn't create alternative allegiance blocs to confront them (China is lagging here badly and it's not a sound strategy at all to avoid the inevitable - "comprehensive strategic partnerships" are not effective NATO/G7/IMF alternatives). Anyway.... the decoupling from China to other low cost labor markets like Mexico, India and Vietnam isn't going at the planned or acceptable pace for the global cabal either. When the writing is on the wall, there is only on thing left to do before it becomes completely irreversible.... "great power competition".... to make a bigger Japan out of China through a set of containment policies. You see these containment policies manifest in high tech/engineering where the West still holds competitive advantages in particular, high-value sectors. That is what the wars for leading primacy in semiconductors/phones/electric cars/space is all about.

    As for the Jews and international Jewry.... I really don't dabble in it in so much as there is some truth in it.... and equally, much overblown talk about them. Bottom line is that they're stakeholders, and influential in the countries they reside and have a say in crafting influential policy... just like a Protestant or Catholic elite would have in a position of power. The net result of all of the policies as a collective is what matters, which goes beyond the originating individual(s)... insofar as a counter move is concerned that is made to counter act them. So when you say that international jewry is "mad at China", so are protestant or Catholic elites in those very same countries crafting confrontational long term stratagems against China. It's what it's. If anything I do agree that the collective West in all its flavors is full into the game now - the game is known, the targets are clear (Russia/China/Iran).


    Last edited by ATLASCUB on Thu Aug 04, 2022 5:06 am; edited 4 times in total

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    Post  TMA1 Thu Aug 04, 2022 4:44 am

    The precious rainbow flag waving "rules based" world order is very concerned. Some hegemons are near panic. They are now openly displaying their regime change and proxy war strategies. Thry could give two fucks about "democracy". The west knows if Ukraine is largely taken that it could be the start of a slippery slope down to the end of their neolib phantasy empire.

    Russia needs to dig in and keep fighting. Full on war economy. No more kid gloves on anything stinking of "loyal opposition groups" and NGOs fed thru black and grey channels by western intel agencies. Russia needs to no longer keep the uneasy peace with erdogan and the stupid pan turkish dream the turks have, fed by western assets. It all needs to be sharply put down. Armenia must be defended. Let Erdogan be ostracized by Russian politicians and let him finally get caught in his own slithery webs he weaves. The west will eventually regime change him and this time Putin wont have his back like before.

    Russia needs to speak clearly that thry dont want expansion, but that if Ukraine will not stay neutral, it is a threat to their national security and it will be ultimately stripped of serious power. When they feel they have taken the land they need, they stop moving forward and hold off their pathetic blows till they come to the peace table.

    China made the right move in not directly acting to provocation. But now they must solidify relationships they have with others and prepare to disconnect from the west. Preferably the Chinese should act first to get the initiative.

    Amusing to see neolib and neocon bootlickers here glibly posting nonsense they have gathered from yt and reddit osint types who have completely bought into the western propaganda. They are happy to see demonic hypocrite politicians we have here in the west disturb rising powers in the world, making miserable satellite states at their borders and trying to subvert them till they become their puppets.

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    Post  GarryB Thu Aug 04, 2022 5:48 am

    They really do have a bully's mentality. And they only respect strength, or military force really. Vandals

    Which is not a good reason to fight them... it is a good reason to ignore them and look elsewhere for trade and development and growth.

    The US has demonstrated that it is willing to risk it all for Taiwan. China really didn't believe that the US would do this. They thought the rhetoric was a sufficient deterrent.
    China might just have to give up Taiwan. Are they really going to fight the US if the US decides to send in a couple carrier groups to Taiwan next year ?

    The US has demonstrated nothing at all... they have done nothing to help Taiwan except a visit from a nobody to talk about nothing important.

    Note they also promised support for Ukraine and we can see what that looks like... they are refusing to send troops there in fear of starting WWIII... are you saying sending US carriers and US submarines to defend Taiwan wont start a nuclear war?

    This is all bluff and all bluff from the US wanting to appear relevant... and failing.

    VG article FP.

    West's economy is fake too. Maybe even faker. Even so my comments are aimed at the notion (psy-op, facet of demoralization in my opinion) that China is unquestionably ascending to power and that nothing (either domestically or internationally) is standing in the way of that.

    This type of thinking permeates all corners of the internet. Quite frankly I am not so convinced anymore. China has many weaknesses and the Anglo-Zionists have fended off rising contenders (WW2) before.

    Why do you think powerful countries have no weaknesses?

    All you really need is money and you control most western governments and get them to change their laws to help you make even more money... don't you think that is an enormous weakness that could be exploited.

    The Ascending China stuff is more about them building up a Navy and looking beyond its borders for trade and interaction... it is coming out of its hide and is starting to engage with the rest of the world... and in that sense it really has nothing to do with the health or otherwise of their economy...

    I get it, you now China's bitch hence the need to bend over like a good little doggo and put up for based Chinamen.

    You don't get it... it is the US that demands all countries conform to their will and their culture and if you don't behave then sanctions and propaganda BS about how bad you are.

    China does not want to knock the US off its perch and take the throne itself, it wants a different international structure completely... just as Russia does and all the countries joining BRICS. BRICS isn't about replacing the west with something much the same with China or Russia in charge... it is about countries treating all other countries with respect and about not ganging up on this or that country because you don't approve of their age of consent or the fact that they have the death penalty as a punishment for crimes.

    The west talks about international rules and international norms but never applies them to their own actions, they only talk about war crimes when a country they have decided is their rival or enemy or has something they want is involved and the truth is not actually important... they are happy to stage any bullshit theatrics to launch cruise missile strikes before any evidence can be collected or the situation examined and there are no repercussions to their actions when it was found later to be their fabrication... who wants to live in a world like that... imagine a city where the police could frame you and put you in prison or execute you and then it turns out it was all made up by the police in the first place and that is the end of it... carry on.

    I understand the appeal for the west regarding the current system where they can essentially do as they please and point the finger at everyone else... like a child molesting priest telling his flock they are all sinners and must repent...

    But why would the rest of the world enjoy such a system?

    how all the 'experts' on here were quietly hoping for an escalation in Taiwan to move the Empire's watchful eye away from Russia's embarrassing campaign in the Ukraine..

    The Empires watchful eye is closed. Putin is making the west irrelevant in the Ukraine... they can send all the money and weapons and ammo they like but that wont effect the result which is going to be a very cold winter if they keep escalating... and probably a collapse of German industry too... and not just Germany

    If you can't understand what a global market is, you're fucking retarded.

    The global market is controlled by the west either directly with ships and shipping companies, or indirectly by insurance companies and assessors of various types and all of the wests BS over the conflict in the Ukraine means Russia is already sorting out alternatives moving forward... once alternatives are in place then the wests hold on international commerce will be gone, they will still operate and have significant market share but they wont be the only whore in the whore house.

    Creating a new international currency amongst the BRICS countries will also be very damaging for Americas ability to print money because in the past their printing of money created inflation... in the countries they traded with... when no one wants to trade in US dollars because they print them like they are monopoly money... which is seriously ironic because that is exactly what it is, then the US is going to have to start producing all the stuff they import or have made overseas because their money wont be worth anything.

    Anyway that is to say the West is in it to win it.

    They don't have the hand for this game... their conventional forces are in a sorry state and are totally based on air power... and air defence is a serious Russian strength... they have said they will not intervene in the Ukraine so the best they can hope for is a Syria type situation... but I don't think Putin will put up with that.

    The constant is that they'll keep coming, no matter the setback, big or small.

    The west is built around the US... when the US dollar is not worth shit the whole house of cards collapses... would you take a bribe in leaves or small lumps of concrete?

    Kissinger (communist in a 5000 USD suit) and associates are and were openly boasting how they'd engineer the fall of the US and recreate the Eurasian landmass superstate along the MacKinder Theory German-Russia-China axis

    What are you dribbling about... Henry Kissenger used the Chinese against the Soviets during the Cold war and now wants to use the Russians against the Chinese but US leaders are too thick for that to work and Putin and Xi are too smart for it to work anyway.

    Kissenger is a 1% so he does not want the fall of the US... it is what keeps him and his cronies rich as the working class shift down into poverty... you can't make billions like Musk and Bezos if your workers who earn that money are on a decent wage... and when they wont work for a dollar a day you shift all the production to China or Bangledesh... it will be some place in Africa soon...

    Who changed funding from Chang Kai Shek to Mao in <snip> And on and on.

    Paranoid much?

    Jews of course. Jews built China and now they are angry at it, and when Jews are angry you better watch out because they still control much of what goes on in the US and by extension Europe.

    The all powerful Jews... a bit like the all powerful Putin... when things are complex and not going your way lets blame the Jews or Putin or Covid19 because heaven forbid we should analyse what actually happened and work out the real cause... people have been running amok and killing people at random for thousands of years... the word Amok means to run though your own or another village with a knife killing people for no obvious reason... that is where the western term to run amok comes from... amok is a malaysian word that predates firearms and anti gun nutters don't like it because it shows this problem wont go away when guns are banned or heavily regulated.

    The only jews involved in building up China would be the greedy bastards that shifted western production to China to save a few dollars on production costs... and I would say most were not jews, they were just greedy western 1%ers some of which might even have jewish sounding names but this has nothing to do with jews or their religion.

    They built China and they can break it down too.

    The west built china up to make it their sweatshop factory to make consumer goods disposable and cheap so they could keep selling shoes and clothes over and over because they fall apart well before they should... but when they are only a few dollars who is going to return them.

    There was never any intention by the west to build China up... as far as they were concerned they would be happy if they stayed poor and backward but then they realised they are a market of a billion people... what if they bought western shit too... greedy greedy bastards... and that is why their house of cards sits on a fault line and Russia and China are turning up the German house music...

    the US still holds the patents on the high technology stuff China imports (and without it the Chinese economy would immediately start to hamper), as do many of its allies, and the US still has the most combat ready and experienced armed forces, with the larges amount of resources behind it.

    And when a war starts over Taiwan do you think China or Russia are going to give a shit about IP rights and copywrite held in the west?

    When the US had its little war of independence against the UK one of the first things they did was wipe all European IP and copywrite laws so they could make what they needed because the Europeans owned almost every technology right at that point.

    Russia and China and the rest of the world will do the same.


    West's economy is fake too. Maybe even faker. Even so my comments are aimed at the notion (psy-op, facet of demoralization in my opinion) that China is unquestionably ascending to power and that nothing (either domestically or internationally) is standing in the way of that.

    China is not becoming the US, they have joined BRICS and made it clear they don't want to replace the US at the head of the west and become your overlord, they are breaking with the west and making new relationships with countries that respect international law like the US and the west doesn't.

    China has many weaknesses and the Anglo-Zionists have fended off rising contenders (WW2) before.

    They always used to control the information... with the internet they don't...

    When you say exposed you mean a lot of China's economy has codependency not only on Western markets and the influx of tech and know-how from the West but also on the health of these economies. That is true and has been known for a while.

    China is much more interlinked with the west and a separation will be vastly more painful than the separation Russia had to go through, but this is not going to be easy for the west either because much of their production is in China at the moment so serious sanctions against China might backfire terribly and do rather more damage to western economies... China produces shit which it can sell to the rest of the world and has been for quite some time... in fact they probably make more money selling to the rest of the world than they do selling to the west.

    This is not about China growing up and trying to replace the US as leader of the west, this is about China not taking orders from the US or the west any more and expecting a bit of damn respect... if you want to send a political delegation to China and you start telling them how they should be treating their Muslims (Urghers) then you can just **** off... that is none of your business... especially when it is western countries stirring up trouble there in the first place... it is like western politicians complaining about the treatment of Chechens in Russia when they were the ones funding and supporting the seperatists through Saudi Arabia and UAE in the first place...

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    Post  GarryB Thu Aug 04, 2022 5:50 am

    China made the right move in not directly acting to provocation. But now they must solidify relationships they have with others and prepare to disconnect from the west. Preferably the Chinese should act first to get the initiative.

    There are elections coming up... perhaps they should support Trump in a way they supported Biden in the last election but make it public in a way that leads to Pelosi and the Democraps can't exploit to get idiots who don't care and can't think to vote for them.
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    Post  LMFS Tue Aug 09, 2022 10:08 am

    China decides to make military exercises off the coast of Taiwan permanent

    The People's Liberation Army of China (PLA) on Monday continued military exercises of all branches of the armed forces around the island of Taiwan. These exercises, according to the Chinese edition of Global Times, will not stop until the island is reunited with mainland China. The visit to Taiwan by Speaker of the US House of Representatives Nancy Pelosi played a provocative role. Pelosi's short trip to Taipei launched the process of even greater military and political activation of China in the Asia-Pacific region. In fact, in East Asia, the United States "stepped on the same rake" as in Eastern Europe.


    The exercise being conducted by the PLA is blockading the island from all sides and will demonstrate to the whole world the capabilities of the Chinese military. Even the United States is unable to compete with China in this region, since they cannot concentrate such a number of troops in the Taiwan direction. The command of the Eastern Theater of Operations of the PLA on Monday announced that the main focus of the exercise will be on anti-submarine operations and practicing amphibious landings. In the first case, it is obvious that we are talking about the fight against American submarines, and in the second, it is about honing the skills of landing from the sea to land, which will be useful in conducting a military operation to reunify Taiwan.

    During the exercise, the Changchun type 052C missile destroyer interacted with several Y-8 anti-submarine aircraft, as well as with helicopters. This was previously reported by China Central Television (CCTV). Anti-submarine defense aircraft worked out the technique of detecting submarines at a great distance. With the help of the Ka-28 helicopter, the exact location of the alleged submarine was searched, and the destroyer, after detecting the alleged submarine, conducted an imitation of an attack on an underwater enemy.

    Anti-submarine exercises are called by Chinese analysts the development of the practice of establishing control over maritime space with the help of ships, aircraft and helicopters. The Taiwanese Navy is armed with obsolete submarines, but they will still have to be neutralized if China launches a military operation to reunite with the island. Also, the possibility of intervention by the US and Japanese submarine fleets is not ruled out. Accordingly, it is necessary to work out actions to neutralize possible aggression from American and Japanese submarines.

    Military expert Song Zhongping said that such exercises will now be held continuously until Beijing manages to resolve the Taiwan issue. The Ministry of Foreign Affairs of the PRC calls the exercises transparent and professional, complying with all the requirements of international law.

    The US is already taking action. So, the Pentagon ordered to leave the aircraft carrier USS Ronald Reagan in the waters near the island of Taiwan. Also American aviation will carry out standard transits through the Taiwan Strait.

    https://en.topwar.ru/200054-kitaj-reshil-sdelat-voennye-uchenija-u-beregov-tajvanja-postojannymi.html

    > Taiwan will be made to pay for being Western pawns and allowing themselves to be used against their own country
    > This can be a disaster for the already screwed-up supply chains of electronic components... cannot imagine how many companies in the rest of the world are going to make it if this turns into a de facto blockade of Taiwan. China's mainland own microelectronics industry can become an essential world player in this situation.
    > Main focus of PLAN is unsurprisingly in ASW. But it is clear that China would prevail in and around Taiwan regardless of the US, in the remote case that they would decide to interfere militarily

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    Post  kvs Tue Aug 09, 2022 2:02 pm

    All the "China chickened out" drivel has really shown itself to be premature ejaculation.

    The exercises are basically a blockade.   Expect the precious, precious microchips to get rare and
    expensive.   The retards (or higher functioning autistics) in Washington really stepped in it with
    Pelosi's clown show visit.

    I think China is ready to take on US carrier groups. The Washington retards will now have no
    choice but to try to dislodge China via military means. It will not go well for them.

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    Post  AlfaT8 Tue Aug 09, 2022 2:32 pm

    kvs wrote:All the "China chickened out" drivel has really shown itself to be premature ejaculation.

    The exercises are basically a blockade.   Expect the precious, precious microchips to get rare and
    expensive.   The retards (or higher functioning autistics) in Washington really stepped in it with
    Pelosi's clown show visit.

    I think China is ready to take on US carrier groups.   The Washington retards will now have no
    choice but to try to dislodge China via military means.   It will not go well for them.


    Considering how the U.S's own simulations went.
    Its quite clear that China holds the cards here.
    The U.S cannot afford a major conflict with China, but for now at least neither can China.

    The U.S simply cant handle a war of such scale while its own internal political situation being sp F'ed.
    Less so now, since America's economy has finally begun to falter.

    Nevertheless, the U.S might just force the start of the war anyway as a final Hail Mary to try and unify their broken country and to crush the economic rise of the east, before the east truly suppasses them milatarily.

    That said, i do not believe the fools and cowards that are the current leadership in the West are remotely capable of starting a real no sh#t total war.

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    Post  flamming_python Tue Aug 09, 2022 5:18 pm

    The disadvantage of a blockade is that it would generate ill-will from Taiwan's inhabitants. Many of whom did not need or want Pelosi's visit or provocations against China. Because it's basically the equivalent of a medieval siege, where the lives of people just steadily become more miserable.

    In a way a war/invasion will actually resolve the situation within a limited time frame and then the world can go on, Taiwan can be rebuilt where needed this time as part of China

    A blockade however has no guarantee of any success. It can go on for years, breed resentment or just be cancelled after some time like the Berlin one was; without having accomplished anything.
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    Post  Hole Tue Aug 09, 2022 5:46 pm

    Well, if the people of Taiwan are fed up they can vote in politicians that will negotiate a reunification with the mainland. Otherwise it´s their own fault.

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    Post  flamming_python Tue Aug 09, 2022 6:37 pm

    Hole wrote:Well, if the people of Taiwan are fed up they can vote in politicians that will negotiate a reunification with the mainland. Otherwise it´s their own fault.

    Yeah but people are stubborn. If they perceive someone is trying to punish them they may decide to rally around their US puppet leaders instead

    There are a lot of mainland Chinese working in Taiwan, and Taiwanese nationalism is not actually some major thing. Last thing China actually needs is to transform Taiwan into its own version of Cuba. So far it's not, it's just business, 2 great powers in a tug of war.

    The optimal move might be to enact this blockade for a certain-length of time but then lift it after the message has been sent and received.
    Or else launch a military operation with all the consequences.
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    Post  sundoesntrise Wed Aug 10, 2022 7:29 am

    kvs wrote:All the "China chickened out" drivel has really shown itself to be premature ejaculation.

    The exercises are basically a blockade.   Expect the precious, precious microchips to get rare and
    expensive.   The retards (or higher functioning autistics) in Washington really stepped in it with
    Pelosi's clown show visit.

    I think China is ready to take on US carrier groups.   The Washington retards will now have no
    choice but to try to dislodge China via military means.   It will not go well for them.

    Here is your blockade.

    I know it stings but China ain't ready yet to sit at the big boys table.


    U.S Military encirclement of China - Page 17 Fzkwnp10

    During the exercises (which have finished days ago already).

    U.S Military encirclement of China - Page 17 Fzlfou10


    Last edited by sundoesntrise on Wed Aug 10, 2022 10:24 am; edited 1 time in total
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    Post  GarryB Wed Aug 10, 2022 9:15 am

    The irony is that if chips from Taiwan are blocked the next best place to get them from is China and who in the west could possibly switch from Taiwanese chips to Chinese chips to support the Chinese blockade... the rest of the world will be fine and China will benefit from that, but a sudden stop in available computer chips on that scale will seriously effect western production of goods.

    And of course why not... western sanctions are essentially trade embargoes so the west really can't complain if China decides to move forward with such a plan.

    They could schedule their exercises to slow trade with Taiwan without permanent blockading the island.

    Interesting the variety of reactions... when Kiev claimed Crimea and Donbass and Lugansk regions were theirs the US and her lackies supported them completely, but with Chechnia or Kosovo or Taiwan they support the breakaway groups...

    Western ethics are so flexible...

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