Russia and economic war by the west

GunshipDemocracy wrote:KFC Germany helps Ukrainian chicks to find a job      

https://twitter.com/colonelhomsi/status/1531615841023889410?s=20&t=nIfv1tUoCEDjOrZCj3_B1Q

Didn't hear this from official sources yet but Polish PM suggested secondary sanctions for countries outside EU to buy Russia oil. Knowing mental problems of Polish elites it might actually be true.  I wonder how? to sanction China/India?

Its going to be a cap on anyone who buys russian Oil or Gas. Like 30$ per Oil for example. Who ever pays more than that gets sanctions. And lets be honest, who doesn't want to pay lower?

Only option is for Russia to say it wont sell at those prices. As it's going to be a 3 way game, I'm really curious to see how it will played out.

Pacense wrote:Its going to be a cap on anyone who buys russian Oil or Gas. Like 30$ per Oil for example. Who ever pays more than that gets sanctions. And lets be honest, who doesn't want to pay lower?

Only option is for Russia to say it wont sell at those prices. As it's going to be a 3 way game, I'm really curious to see how it will played out.

That is BS and never going to happen. Like you said Russia can simply refuse to sell. And in some cases they have direct routes to final destination countries like China. Good luck knowing how much oil is flowing through the pipeline if neither country wants to tell.

Poland and Ukraine, united, will be able to oust Russia from Europe to Asia. This statement was made by the Deputy Minister of Infrastructure of Poland Marcin Horala.


According to the official, the former Polish lands, which today are part of Ukraine, are claimed by Russia and Poland and this rivalry threatens the Poles directly and confrontation cannot be avoided. At the same time, Ukraine has no choice, Kiev does not want to be friends with Russia and understands that they have only one ally - Poland. It is in alliance with Warsaw that Kiev will be able to confront Moscow. Therefore, the unification of the two states becomes a fact, he stressed.

According to Chorala, Poland, united with Ukraine, in the near future will become a highly developed state, equal in its financial capabilities to Russia. With a population of 90 million, Poland and Ukraine will be able to displace 140 million russia into Asia, finally removing it from the map of Europe.

After that, a free and democratic Europe will be able to live freely and develop without regard to the "Russian threat."

wank, wank, wank .....
they forgot the bit about ....

"... and gender non-specific fairies in non-binary relationships will be able to live peacefully at the bottom of our gardens ! "

Poland .... lol ..... a "powerhouse" ..... lol lol lol
I nearly vomited laughing at this delusional drivel

UK is involved in this of course
another bunch of delusional has-beens ....

The end of fish and chips? Rising prices threaten a British tradition

In just a year, prices for Britain's favourite fish - cod and haddock - are up 75%, sunflower oil is up 60%, and flour is up 40%, Company Debt said.

Cod and haddock are sourced in the Barents Sea, north of Norway and Russia, and the war has heightened uncertainty over those supplies.

In March, the British government listed Russian white fish as among goods to be hit with a 35% tariff as part of sanctions in response to the invasion of Ukraine.

It has paused the move, for now, while the impact is investigated.

.... while "the impact is investigated"
what a bunch of delusional has-beens .....

Boris the Braindead ...... he is even dumber than the Poles
not easy .... no

a great read
an Indian Sikh .... cooking fish and chips in England
and on the menu behind him is "southern fried chicken" (scroll through the photos)

source:

https://uk.news.yahoo.com/end-fish-chips-rising-prices-060710586.html

meanwhile back in Russia the McDonalds chain is relaunching in a few days in Moscow
wonder what the franchise name will be called ?
me ? I'd call it "Z Burgers" ......

Gazputin wrote:With a population of 90 million, Poland and Ukraine will be able to displace 140 million russia into Asia, finally removing it from the map of Europe.

90 million.

That would be according to 2001 Census before the annexation of Crimea and now the Donbass.
So it is just Poland and Ukraine? Not the Intermarium? Not the Visegrad Group? Such drivel.

lancelot wrote:

Pacense wrote:Its going to be a cap on anyone who buys russian Oil or Gas. Like 30$ per Oil for example. Who ever pays more than that gets sanctions. And lets be honest, who doesn't want to pay lower?

Only option is for Russia to say it wont sell at those prices. As it's going to be a 3 way game, I'm really curious to see how it will played out.

That is BS and never going to happen. Like you said Russia can simply refuse to sell. And in some cases they have direct routes to final destination countries like China. Good luck knowing how much oil is flowing through the pipeline if neither country wants to tell.

A lot of things couldn't happen and did happen. I don't think direct routes would do much of a difference, as it will be for a third party interest to comply with the cap. All too soon to tell.

https://www.stalkerzone.org/dare-to-create-the-future-russian-style/

Neon, 50% Azovstal and Donbas with 30% Russia, do the sums.

You can almost see the strategic action cogs clicking into place in Moscow. Add this to the Ukraine fighting be extended as long as possible, to maximise that pain, and you can see the strength of Russia's negotiating position increasing by the day.

As I have said before, the actions of the US over the past 6 months are going to go down in history as one of, if not the greatest strategic blunders ever made.


Russia Hits Hobbled Chip Market, Limiting Export Of Noble Gases
Tyler Durden's Photo
by Tyler Durden
Saturday, Jun 04, 2022 - 01:00 AM

In the latest salvo in an expanding world trade war, sanctions-battered Russia has announced it will limit the export of noble gases, a key ingredient in the manufacture of semiconductor chips.

Through Dec. 31, any export of those gases will require special permission from the Russian government. According to Russia's trade ministry, Russia accounts for nearly a third of the world's supply of three such gases—neon, krypton and xenon.  

"We believe that we will have an opportunity to be heard in this global chain, and this will give us some competitive advantage if it is necessary to build mutually beneficial negotiations with our colleagues," Russian deputy trade minister Vasily Shpak told Reuters on Thursday.

The Ukraine war has already taken a toll on the supply of noble gases. Via two companies—Ingas and Cryoin—Ukraine itself supplies half the world's neon. Both companies shut down in March. Neon is used in lasers during lithography, a part of the chipmaking process where patterns are carved into silicon.

The Russian move promises to prolong a worldwide semiconductor supply crisis that's already wreaking havoc for a wide swath of industries that use the increasingly ubiquitous chips.  

Speaking on Tuesday—before Russia's announcement—U.S. Commerce secretary Gina Raimondo, citing conversations with chipmaker CEOs, warned the shortage was likely to last "deep into 2023, possibly early '24 before we see any real relief."

Russia's import of finished semiconductors has been severely pinched by sanctions in the wake of the country's Feb. 24 invasion of Ukraine. According to the Financial Times:

   Most of the world’s largest chip manufacturers, including Intel, Samsung, TSMC and Qualcomm, have halted business to Russia entirely after the US, UK, and Europe imposed export controls on products using chips made or designed in the US or Europe.

Taiwan—the top producer of chips in general and 92% of the most advanced ones —has also limited exports to Russia.

Russia's Shpak said the limit on Russian noble gas exports would serve as an opportunity to "rearrange those chains that have now been broken and build new ones."

In addition to choking Russia's access to foreign chips, the U.S. government has attacked Russia's own chip industry: On March 31, the Treasury announced sanctions against Mikron, Russia's top producer.

Despite having chip manufacturers of its own, Russia is heavily dependent on imports to meet its needs. Meanwhile, the general worldwide shortage of the product means that even attempts by Russia to circumvent sanctions via "gray market" supply chains can't be very fruitful.

"We plan to increase our production capacity (of noble gases) in the near future," said Shpak. However, he tied that aspiration to "successful" trade negotiations with other countries and, implicitly, an easing of sanctions on Russia.

https://www.zerohedge.com/geopolitical/russia-hits-hobbled-chip-market-limiting-export-noble-gases

lancelot wrote:

Gazputin wrote:With a population of 90 million, Poland and Ukraine will be able to displace 140 million russia into Asia, finally removing it from the map of Europe.

90 million.

That would be according to 2001 Census before the annexation of Crimea and now the Donbass.
So it is just Poland and Ukraine? Not the Intermarium? Not the Visegrad Group? Such drivel.

The population of Ukraine in 2013 was not 42 million as claimed. Ukraine has had no census for over 20 years. Meanwhile it has had
mass economically driven emigration over the last 30 years. There is good reason to think that as of 2015 its population was closer to
25 million and not 35 million which is just the 42 million with Crimea and the rebel parts of Donetsk and Lugansk removed.

Poland is only going to get Halychina at most. It will not be establishing any new empire spanning past Kiev.

Pacense wrote:

lancelot wrote:

Pacense wrote:Its going to be a cap on anyone who buys russian Oil or Gas. Like 30$ per Oil for example. Who ever pays more than that gets sanctions. And lets be honest, who doesn't want to pay lower?

Only option is for Russia to say it wont sell at those prices. As it's going to be a 3 way game, I'm really curious to see how it will played out.

That is BS and never going to happen. Like you said Russia can simply refuse to sell. And in some cases they have direct routes to final destination countries like China. Good luck knowing how much oil is flowing through the pipeline if neither country wants to tell.

A lot of things couldn't happen and did happen. I don't think direct routes would do much of a difference, as it will be for a third party interest to comply with the cap. All too soon to tell.

People who think Russia floats on oil and gas exports are delusional and beyond redemption.

NATzO is never going to coerce China into not buying Russian oil. It is trying to do this with India but is only succeeding in undermining its soft power in that country.
NATzO attempting to terrorize the planet into not trading with Russia is pathetic and humanity will not bend over because retards in Washington and its quisling satellites think
so. It has not been 1900 for a long time.

Pacense wrote:
A lot of things couldn't happen and did happen. I don't think direct routes would do much of a difference, as it will be for a third party interest to comply with the cap. All too soon to tell.

If i understood you right, you say that EU will not allow third countries to pay more than $30 per barrel of oil?
In what way do they plan to enforce that? Sounds idiotic.

caveat emptor wrote:

Pacense wrote:
A lot of things couldn't happen and did happen. I don't think direct routes would do much of a difference, as it will be for a third party interest to comply with the cap. All too soon to tell.

If i understood you right, you say that EU will not allow third countries to pay more than $30 per barrel of oil?
In what way do they plan to enforce that? Sounds idiotic.

By pressure of sanctions. Doesn't sound idiotic to me. In reality is whats happening at a much smaller scale right now. Russia is selling to India for example with discount.

If I was a consumer state how could it not be beneficial to me?

Another thing, is if its possible to apply at all, as Russia can just say no, and that at that price I prefer not to sell at all.

Pacense wrote:By pressure of sanctions. Doesn't sound idiotic to me. In reality is whats happening at a much smaller scale right now. Russia is selling to India for example with discount.

If I was a consumer state how could it not be beneficial to me?

Another thing, is if its possible to apply at all, as Russia can just say no, and that at that price I prefer not to sell at all.

The oil sales would just drop out of official statistics like Iran's oil.
And no, sorry, but Russia will not sell oil below cost or directly fund those countries directly trying to destroy it.
They are lucky they get any oil as is.

Pacense wrote:

By pressure of sanctions. Doesn't sound idiotic to me. In reality is whats happening at a much smaller scale right now. Russia is selling to India for example with discount.

If I was a consumer state how could it not be beneficial to me?

Another thing, is if its possible to apply at all, as Russia can just say no, and that at that price I prefer not to sell at all.

Again, that can only be enforced in EU and even that won't go smooth. They can't do anything to India. It is even ludicrous to think that. This can only backfire on EU and they've been on downward path since 2010's. Second, if sales are done in national currencies there is no way they can even know how much was contracted price.

Pacense wrote:

caveat emptor wrote:

Pacense wrote:
A lot of things couldn't happen and did happen. I don't think direct routes would do much of a difference, as it will be for a third party interest to comply with the cap. All too soon to tell.

If i understood you right, you say that EU will not allow third countries to pay more than $30 per barrel of oil?
In what way do they plan to enforce that? Sounds idiotic.

By pressure of sanctions. Doesn't sound idiotic to me. In reality is whats happening at a much smaller scale right now. Russia is selling to India for example with discount.

If I was a consumer state how could it not be beneficial to me?

Another thing, is if its possible to apply at all, as Russia can just say no, and that at that price I prefer not to sell at all.

Clearly you don't even know what is happening nor the actual trades or how economics work.

I suggest you read more, type less.

Its going to be a cap on anyone who buys russian Oil or Gas. Like 30$ per Oil for example. Who ever pays more than that gets sanctions. And lets be honest, who doesn't want to pay lower?

Only option is for Russia to say it wont sell at those prices. As it's going to be a 3 way game, I'm really curious to see how it will played out.

Well for Russia there are hostile countries and there are non hostile countries and I would say hostile countries can pay market rate for their hostility, but for a non hostile state I would think Russia could agree to some long term contracts where the price of oil or gas would be a more sustainable price for both sides.

Russia is certainly benefitting from Europes criminal attempts to force energy prices down even lower than they were and they were already very low compared with what the rest of the world was paying, but they can still make good money when energy prices are lower and don't benefit themselves from high energy prices at home.

There is no reason for Russia to help the west out at all now that they have shown their true colours sending weapons to the Ukraine with the specific purpose of making Russia bleed.

You don't keep patting a dog pissing on your leg.

Any countries buying Russia oil or gas sanctioning third countries for buying Russian oil or gas should get a price increase on their oil or gas supplies... looking at the US specifically which is trying to force countries around the world to stop buying anything from Russia yet continues to buy oil and gas and Uranium from Russia...

Like someone telling you you take too many prescription pills and you find out they are crack addicts...

Poland and Ukraine, united, will be able to oust Russia from Europe to Asia. This statement was made by the Deputy Minister of Infrastructure of Poland Marcin Horala.

Which will be good for Russia and Asia... and damaging to Europe... so go right ahead.

The irony is that it is the US behind it pushing from behind and the purpose is to damage Russia but also damage the EU so they are more dependent on the US.

According to Chorala, Poland, united with Ukraine, in the near future will become a highly developed state, equal in its financial capabilities to Russia. With a population of 90 million, Poland and Ukraine will be able to displace 140 million russia into Asia, finally removing it from the map of Europe.

Of course because it is economics alone that wins wars and defeats enemies.... hilarious...

Obvious question would be if the US is too afraid of getting directly involved and the UK and France and Germany all afraid to send their soliders to the Ukraine to fight... what kind of stupid does Poland have to be to want to get into a land war with Russia?

If they think the extra numbers will make the difference... the Russian force operating in Ukraine was calculated for the job at hand and they are perfectly capable of adding the Polish forces to their calculations and sending in the extra forces required to do that job too... it might even be quite handy as waste land they can dump any excess nazi families who have commited no actual provable crimes but they don't really want within the borders of the new regions they create.

Makes a mockery of what the west said in 2008 really... they suggested the creation of Kosovo was unique in the sense of creating new countries in Europe... but South Ossetia and Abkhazia and now various regions within the former Ukraine could all be candidates for being new countries too.

I'd call it "Z Burgers" ......

Excellent... but to really screw with them.... pronounce it Zed Burgers... so Americans get corrected when they say it out loud...

If i understood you right, you say that EU will not allow third countries to pay more than $30 per barrel of oil?
In what way do they plan to enforce that? Sounds idiotic.

Yes, that Ursula woman claimed they would not stop buying Russian oil because that would achieve the most damage against Russia because if they stopped buyng Russian oil then Russia could sell that oil in other markets for much higher prices and make rather more money so by not banning oil purchases to the EU they are doing as much damage to Russia as they can achieve... it is only an accident that they get to continue buying cheap Russian oil to keep their own economies going.

Like their generous offer to help ship Ukrainian grain and lift the ban on Russian and Belarus fertilisers... which would of course leave the Ukraine without grain and with no fuel or manpower to get the next crop those grain silos will remain empty... but the EU will have Ukrainian grain and fertiliser for their own crops.

caveat emptor wrote:

Pacense wrote:

By pressure of sanctions. Doesn't sound idiotic to me. In reality is whats happening at a much smaller scale right now. Russia is selling to India for example with discount.

If I was a consumer state how could it not be beneficial to me?

Another thing, is if its possible to apply at all, as Russia can just say no, and that at that price I prefer not to sell at all.

Again, that can only be enforced in EU and even that won't go smooth. They can't do anything to India. It is even ludicrous to think that. This can only backfire on EU and they've been on downward path since 2010's. Second, if sales are done in national currencies there is no way they can even know how much was contracted price.

Are you sure about that? China trades with Russia like 5% of what it trades with US and EU alone. It trades with Japan and SK way more than with Russia. China also gets its oil from a varity of sources. Would they go to a economic war with the EU and US because of an oil cap that it can be beneficial for them as well? I don't think we can say they would.

Pacense wrote:

caveat emptor wrote:

Pacense wrote:

By pressure of sanctions. Doesn't sound idiotic to me. In reality is whats happening at a much smaller scale right now. Russia is selling to India for example with discount.

If I was a consumer state how could it not be beneficial to me?

Another thing, is if its possible to apply at all, as Russia can just say no, and that at that price I prefer not to sell at all.

Again, that can only be enforced in EU and even that won't go smooth. They can't do anything to India. It is even ludicrous to think that. This can only backfire on EU and they've been on downward path since 2010's. Second, if sales are done in national currencies there is no way they can even know how much was contracted price.

Are you sure about that? China trades with Russia like 5% of what it trades with US and EU alone. It trades with Japan and SK way more than with Russia. China also gets its oil from a varity of sources. Would they go to a economic war with the EU and US because of an oil cap that it can be beneficial for them as well? I don't think we can say they would.

Neither they nor any other half-serious country will allow the US and EU to dictate the terms of their sovereignty to them, and who they can buy oil from and at which price - regardless of how much trade they have with whoever.

China's all aboard with the split with the West, don't think otherwise. If their companies prefer to avoid sanctions for now, so they prefer to avoid sanctions - but they've been getting more and more of them anyway for the last 10 years and will only receive more; they're hardly ignorant of that. COVID, South China Sea, Taiwan, Uighurs - the US finds more and more pretexts every year and then pressures its client states such as Australia to join in and stop profiting by trade with China in coal and other goods.

Even if some companies will not take the risk of trading with Russia, the Chinese govt. will set up special channels and guarantees and provide a means to do so. Same with India. Same with many other countries, whether driven by hidden or open political common cause with Russia, or just a thirst for cheap energy.

You here are just repeating Western agitprop about the successful isolation of Russia and Putin from the rest of the world. Well it might have been successful, if much of the rest of the world wasn't convinced that if Russia falls; "they're next". As it is though, whether it's the Saudis or the Iranians, or the Chinese, or the Indonesians or whoever - everyone is just kind of tired of being dictated terms to by Washington. Trade thus in this case subordinates to political will. Whether it's more openly expressed or its more concealed for now, like with Argentina - still ostensibly co-operating with the IMF and whatever, but already talking about joining the BRICS and prior to the war concluding a major contract to purchase Russian rolling stock.

Now the US among others, is concentrating on ripping ASEAN away from co-operation with Russia, with an eye towards turning it against China too. They're already been meeting with the Vietnamese this May, and undercover pro-Western publications are talking about how due to US sanctions, Vietnam will be forced to buy US military equipment and switch away from Russia as an energy partner in the future: https://www.vietnam-briefing.com/news/how-russia-ukraine-conflict-is-affecting-businesses-in-vietnam.html/
Only problem is that they've been talking about that in relation to Vietnam for over 10 years now, and have tried to make it a pro-US anti-Chinese outpost for at least that length of time too. But to no success. The Vietnamese take whatever good deals, trade, technology is offered, but ultimately drive into a dead-end any Western designs of using it as a bulwark against anybody.

He who has cheaper energy, wins. Production states will find they produce way more with cheaper energy. It's gotten to the point EU cannot get rid of cheaper Russian resources unless they want to lose industrial production.

They have to resort to reverse flows (failed term) in order to get their energy which is Russian but not dictated as such. Or they use blends.

China and India gets cheaper energy from Russia than EU does. But it isn't cheaper in whatever nonsense being spread here. It's cheaper than what US and EU pays by large amounts but still more than what it was last year on average.

China and the rest does trade with Russia by using shell Companies. And private enterprises who aren't big in western markets will trade with Russia. It isn't blanket bans on China or others and they wouldn't allow US to tell them how to live.

As with Vietnam, Vietnam told the US and EU to take a hike as is.

Truly an act of desperation if the EU actually threatens to sanction any country that buys Russian oil for a lower price than the EU itself does (!!!)

Dunno if it's just Pacense making things up but honestly it would not surprise me given the prevailing mentality of the Western political class. The Indians even snapped back at them in Bratislava recently.

Does Brussels really think that these gangster tactics will work?
Yes the EU may be collectively the largest economy on the planet, but not for long if it starts trying to impose its will over the rest of the planet's trade relations with each other. I doubt the Africans, Asians, South Americans and others have forgotten about the period of European dominance and are in any mood for inviting it back

You just have to google, Russia Oil Cap, and a lot of articles will show up.

Like this one, from 2 days ago https://www.project-syndicate.org/commentary/europe-russia-oil-embargo-needs-immediate-price-cap-by-sergei-guriev-2022-06

A price cap could be implemented immediately – say, at $70 per barrel – and lowered by about $10 each month the war continues. Yes, Putin could refuse to sell oil at this price. But, given that he is already desperate enough to sell to China and India at steep discounts, and today’s energy prices far exceed production costs, this seems unlikely.

Instead, Russia would probably continue supplying oil and gas to Western buyers at the capped price, while buyers like China and India, under threat of sanctions, would have no reason to pay more. This would provide consumers relief from high energy prices and cause Russia’s revenues to decline sharpl

I've been hearing a lot about 30 Usd per barrel, but also 40 Usd. Never heard about 70 Usd before. But 70 Usd sounds about right. Enough to cripple oil revenues, but also enough to keep production going.