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    EU, ΙMF and Greece and Spending cut

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    Hannibal Barca
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    Re: EU, ΙMF and Greece and Spending cut

    Post  Hannibal Barca on Mon Jan 26, 2015 3:59 am

    Lothar von Trotha wrote:Hannibal Barca, what does Greece have to do to regain it's economic robustness?


    This is a really really lengthy discussion my friend.
    In a nutshell there are some very specific problems you can figure out looking the microeconomics:

    -titanic trade deficit
    -huge and chronic fiscal deficit
    -great unemployment
    -demographics


    -For the first one you need to re-start the industrial complex, the private sector, agriculture, tourism and remaking business. All comes down to volatility and soft currency.
    EURO is simply a no no for this. END OF STORY!!

    -Fiscal deficit. Pensioners and civil servants account for the total income from taxation and public owned property...for all the rest you simply have to borrow! This can only get worse due to demographics. You have to fight corruption, bureaucracy, be business friendly, fight tax evasion but at the end of the day you have to cut pensions even further...

    -Unemployment. All come down to high production and employment cost due to hard currency and balanced fiscal policy compined with low inflation due to ECB rules. EURO is a deadend unemployment madness. END OF STORY!! Huge illegal immigration is a huge pain as well. Uninsured employment is a pain. EU policy is a menace, leftist ideology is the finishing shot.


    -Demographics. All of the above, plus inferiority complex, plus american soft power, plus leftist ideology, plus social norms and children overprotection make demographics a real time bomb. We face similar situation like all stagnated American vassals. Like Germany or Japan and elsewhere. People have low self esteem, become atheistic like the USA and with zero national pride. They don't reproduce, as simple as that. They try to counter by sending us loads of immigrants but only exaggerate the problem.


    This is pretty much all you need to know in a first glance.

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    Re: EU, ΙMF and Greece and Spending cut

    Post  George1 on Mon Jan 26, 2015 9:48 am

    'Independent Greeks' Party Confirms Readiness to Form Coalition With Syriza

    Independent Greeks party leader says that the party has already told Syriza's leader Alexis Tsipras about its willingness to cooperate.

    ATHENS, January 26 (Sputnik) — Independent Greeks (ANEL) party has already told Syriza's leader Alexis Tsipras about its willingness to cooperate, ANEL's leader Panos Kammenos said Monday.

    According to Kammenos, ANEL will help Syriza, which is running ahead of the incumbent New Democracy party in country's parliamentary elections, stabilize the situation for the benefit of the country and the Greek people.

    "I contacted Tsipras, congratulated him on his victory and said that Independent Greeks, as we have been saying from the very beginning, support the changes on the political scene in our country on the principles, which we announced publicly," Kammenos said in elections press center.

    Britain's Prime Minister David Cameron delivers a speech at Dynamic Earth in Edinburgh, Scotland, on January 22, 2015.

    According to the data from 75 percent of polling stations across the country, Greece's leftist Syriza party is leading the country's snap elections with 36.12 percent of the votes and receives 149 seats of the parliament's 300 seats.

    The ANEL party gets 4.7 percent of the votes and 13 seats in parliament, which is enough to create a coalition government with Syriza.


    A total of seven parties have managed to pass the 3-percent threshold needed to enter the parliament.

    The radical left Siryza party has promised in its pre-election campaign to put an end to the widely unpopular austerity measures imposed by EU bankers, including severe budget cuts and tax hikes.

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    Re: EU, ΙMF and Greece and Spending cut

    Post  higurashihougi on Mon Jan 26, 2015 10:36 am

    Hannibal Barca wrote:People have low self esteem, become atheistic like the USA and with zero national pride.

    USA is NOT atheistic. Protestant fundamentalists and Zionist is swarming the political sphere of the United States.

    A lot of people in the U.S. do not believe in evolution and Big Bang, thanks to the Church.

    For me I see nothing wrong of being an atheist. I do not believe in the existence of God, but that does not reduce my national pride.

    BTW, back to Greece.


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    Re: EU, ΙMF and Greece and Spending cut

    Post  George1 on Mon Jan 26, 2015 11:14 am

    higurashihougi wrote:
    Hannibal Barca wrote:People have low self esteem, become atheistic like the USA and with zero national pride.

    USA is NOT atheistic. Protestant fundamentalists and Zionist is swarming the political sphere of the United States.

    A lot of people in the U.S. do not believe in evolution and Big Bang, thanks to the Church.

    For me I see nothing wrong of being an atheist. I do not believe in the existence of God, but that does not reduce my national pride.

    BTW, back to Greece.


    Ιndepedent Greeks: Populist, christian-democratic party

    Hannibal Barca
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    Re: EU, ΙMF and Greece and Spending cut

    Post  Hannibal Barca on Mon Jan 26, 2015 11:44 am

    higurashihougi wrote:
    Hannibal Barca wrote:People have low self esteem, become atheistic like the USA and with zero national pride.

    USA is NOT atheistic. Protestant fundamentalists and Zionist is swarming the political sphere of the United States.

    A lot of people in the U.S. do not believe in evolution and Big Bang, thanks to the Church.

    For me I see nothing wrong of being an atheist. I do not believe in the existence of God, but that does not reduce my national pride.

    BTW, back to Greece.




    Well being leftist you can hardly have any national pride whatsoever and every country fall to this disease went down in demographics eventually for a good reason don't you think? A non family oriented mentality always hurt children making in the long run. Anyway this is out of my purpose I just want to paint a picture about Greece without the stupid vogue information your mass media transfer to you.

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    Re: EU, ΙMF and Greece and Spending cut

    Post  higurashihougi on Mon Jan 26, 2015 1:15 pm

    Hannibal Barca wrote:Well being leftist you can hardly have any national pride whatsoever and every country fall to this disease went down in demographics eventually for a good reason don't you think? A non family oriented mentality always hurt children making in the long run.

    But I do have my own national pride.

    Although I do not believe in God or whatsoever supernatural existence, I still burn the incense and still kowtow in front of my deceased ancestors graves and pictures. And I still attend traditional ritues at temples and pagodas during holidays.

    I don't believe that my dead relative will come back and haunt me, but I still do the ritues simply to pay respect to my ancestors and to my nation's traditions.

    In national holidays, our President, Prime Minister and goverment still go to the temples, graveyards,... and burn incense and bow in front of the dead heroes. Most of them do not believe in ghost, but they still do the rituals to pay respect to the traditions and the deads.

    I am a leftist, but I believe in familiy values and traditional moral ethics, in my case is the traditional East Asian value which is still relevant today.

    So I see nothing wrong about being a leftist and atheist... at least for me.

    And actually, our East Asian "religions" (Confucism, Taoism, Buddhism) are actually non-theistic religions. Because these religions do not believe in a superme God like Christianity or Islam. Confucism, Taoism do not say anything about God, while Buddhism says that gods and deities can be wrong, can be defeated, can be killed, and it is alright for human to criticize God if human think God is wrong.

    Hannibal Barca wrote:Anyway this is out of my purpose I just want to paint a picture about Greece without the stupid vogue information your mass media transfer to you.

    I do not surprise if what the media said is drastically different from the truth. We already know how information is twisted by the media and by the propaganda machine.

    The first theorem of public propagamedia said that: they cheat you dollar by dollar, they stole from you cent by cent. Their speech, their words, their acts, their deeds, their very existence is only to stole to your very last penny. If you are wise enough to understand the truth, then they will target your parents, your spouse, and your children, the very dearest relatives which are left vulnerable when you are busy with tons of workload.

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    Re: EU, ΙMF and Greece and Spending cut

    Post  Hannibal Barca on Mon Jan 26, 2015 2:00 pm

    Are you East Asian? OK then obviously what I said doesn't apply to you! You have a completely different culture and a much more resilient society.
    I had in mind Europe and North America. Your approach is much better for nation building and start to show lately.

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    Re: EU, ΙMF and Greece and Spending cut

    Post  Werewolf on Mon Jan 26, 2015 4:21 pm

    higurashihougi wrote:
    Hannibal Barca wrote:Well being leftist you can hardly have any national pride whatsoever and every country fall to this disease went down in demographics eventually for a good reason don't you think? A non family oriented mentality always hurt children making in the long run.

    But I do have my own national pride.

    Although I do not believe in God or whatsoever supernatural existence, I still burn the incense and still kowtow in front of my deceased ancestors graves and pictures. And I still attend traditional ritues at temples and pagodas during holidays.

    I don't believe that my dead relative will come back and haunt me, but I still do the ritues simply to pay respect to my ancestors and to my nation's traditions.

    Such funeral traditions embedded in cultures are not for the dead but for the living to process the loss and make them feel better that they may still exist somewhere in haven, Valhalla or Sovngarde for that matter. Such traditions have actually no roots in current religions or religions themselfs this is just salvation for people to feel better and not to fear of the uncertain thing that happens after death. I am atheist and i am very proud of my nation and do not need to be right wing to have that, even tho in germany you artificially get indoctrinated that germany and germans are bad people by nature because we have an zionistic policy going on here. Even as an atheist in dangerous situations especially in hopeless situations people will always turn to a point where they realize they can't do much on their own, like stuck in a hole, and they will pray to devines, that is not because gods exist but because hope is a psychological mechanism within all humans to keep us alive to live a little bit longer.

    higurashihougi wrote:
    In national holidays, our President, Prime Minister and goverment still go to the temples, graveyards,... and burn incense and bow in front of the dead heroes. Most of them do not believe in ghost, but they still do the rituals to pay respect to the traditions and the deads.

    I am a leftist, but I believe in familiy values and traditional moral ethics, in my case is the traditional East Asian value which is still relevant today.

    So I see nothing wrong about being a leftist and atheist... at least for me.

    Actually more leftists value more family lifes and traditions than any right wing liberal or demorats, which is visible through out every country, all western countries that are more right wing than anything else dumb all family and traditional values and whore around like the ald romans on the peak of decadence, while eastern countries value their relatives and families, marry at much younger age around 20 average and have more than one child with constantly solid or raising birth rates, while it is the complete opposite in western countries, kids get thrown out of houses much earlier, they also don't lift a finger at home, the average in lot of western countries marry around 30's some even with 40's and a cosntantly rising demographic of people who got indoctrinated against mother nature not to want any children or to marry (yes this is indoctrinated to act against your own nature).

    Actually most of my points are addressed to Hanibal but anyway, you get the point.

    higurashihougi wrote:
    And actually, our East Asian "religions" (Confucism, Taoism, Buddhism) are actually non-theistic religions. Because these religions do not believe in a superme God like Christianity or Islam. Confucism, Taoism do not say anything about God, while Buddhism says that gods and deities can be wrong, can be defeated, can be killed, and it is alright for human to criticize God if human think God is wrong.

    And from all religions so far this are the only religions that very moderate and do not have emphasized or were used for "christianisations" or like the celtic/norse culture had Gods of war that the entire traditions and alives were built upon Vikinger style lifes where plunder,rape and genocide was "honored". The east asian religions are mainly pacifistic and rational without shitty gods that are hungry for virgins and blood.

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    Re: EU, ΙMF and Greece and Spending cut

    Post  George1 on Tue Jan 27, 2015 8:30 am

    Germany's Left Party Says Reduction of Greece's Debt Needed to Help Country

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    Re: EU, ΙMF and Greece and Spending cut

    Post  George1 on Thu Jan 29, 2015 8:23 am

    Greece to Suggest New Deal to European Creditors

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    Re: EU, ΙMF and Greece and Spending cut

    Post  Kyo on Fri Jan 30, 2015 8:11 pm

    zerohedge.com wrote:Putin's Unexpected Victory: Europe Furious That Greece Is Now A Russian Sanctions Veto

    Two days ago, Zero Hedge first, and shortly thereafter everyone else, pointed out something stunning: the biggest surprise to emerge so far out of the new anti-Troika/austerity Greek government was not so much its intention to proceed with the first test of "Odious Debt" - this was largely known in advance - but its dramatic pivot away from Germany and Europe, and toward Russia.

    As we noted before, not only has Greece already blocked all ongoing privatization processes, a clear snub of Merkel and the Troika which demands the piecemeal blue light special sale of Greece to western buyers as part of the "bailout", but is also looking at plans to reinstate public sector employees and announce increased pensions for those on low incomes: further clear breaches of the Troika's austerity terms.

    But the most important message that Tsipras is sending to Europe is that (after meeting the Russian ambassador first upon his election) Greece is now effectively a veto power when it comes to future Russian sanctions

    This was first hinted when the Foreign Minister Nikos Kotzias, who arrives in Brussels today to discuss possible additional sanctions on Russia over the conflict in Ukraine, said a few days ago that the Greek government disagreed with an EU statement in which President Donald Tusk raised the prospect of “further restrictive measures” on Russia. As Bloomberg observed before, in recent months, Kotzias wrote on Twitter that sanctions against Russia weren’t in Greece’s interests. He said in a blog that a new foreign policy for Greece should be focused on stopping the ongoing transformation of the EU “into an idiosyncratic empire, under the rule of Germany.”

    And Europe, shocked that one of its own has dared to question its "unanimous" policy toward Russia, a policy driven by the US foreign state department whose opinion of Europe is best captured by the hacked and intercepted "Fuck the EU" outburst by Victoria Nuland in February 2014, has been forced to backtrack. From DPA:

    The European Union denied Wednesday that it ignored Greek objections when it issued a statement raising the prospects of new sanctions against Russia.

    The row is the first of several clashes expected between Brussels and Greece's new prime minister, Alexis Tsipras, who was elected Sunday on promises to renegotiate the bailout granted to Greece by its European neighbours and the International Monetary Fund.

    Tsipras has in the past also spoken out against sanctions on Russia, rejecting the use of "Cold War language."

    The EU has imposed several rounds of sanctions on Russia for its role in the Ukraine crisis, notably economic measures restricting Russian access to European credit markets and European exports. On Tuesday morning, EU leaders in a joint statement tasked their foreign ministers with considering "further restrictive measures" when they meet on Thursday.

    But Tsipras complained to Greek media that his country had not been consulted on the statement. "Greece do not consent," a statement by Tsipras' office said on Tuesday evening, adding that the announcement from Brussels violated "proper procedure."

    A spokesman for EU President Donald Tusk, who issued the statement on behalf of the leaders, denied that Athens had been sidelined during the preparation of the text.

    "We consulted everybody, as we always do, and we didn't ignore or sidestep Greece in any way - quite to the contrary," Preben Aamann told dpa. "We tried to find a special solution that would accommodate them."

    Actually what the EU "always does" is to ignore the voices and interest of everyone but the most powerful. And as for "not ignoring" Greece, apparently the EU failed. Only this time Greece, its government no longer a Eurozone lackey, will no longer let it slide: "Greek broadcaster Skai said newly appointed Foreign Minister Nikos Kotzias would bring up the issue at Thursday's meeting in Brussels. Tsipras is also expected in the Belgian capital on February 12 for an EU summit that will touch upon the situation in Ukraine."

    And here is how Russia just won another completely unexpected victory in Europe: "EU sanctions require unanimity to be implemented, so a Greek veto could block any further measures." And all thanks to the epic blunder by Brussels to allow a European nation to voice its opinion in a democratic fashion.

    It wasn't just Zero Hedge who first suggested the Greek Russian pivot: here is RBS' Greg Gibbs who says that there are now "concerns Greek government may threaten to veto further Russian sanctions in exchange for debt relief fuels fear of conflict."

    To be sure, Germany, whose theatrical opposition to money printing folded like Boehner's lawn chair last week, as it is now all too clear the preservation of German export dominance (and hence aversion to the DEM) and the sanctity of Deutsche Bank is what it is all about no matter the hyperinflationary concerns of the people, is quite furious that the grand ambitions of Europe's economic powerhouse - which as we reported moments ago has now officially entered deflation - have been crushed by tiny, depression-ridden Greece.

    Here is Germany's economy minister Gabriel, who was on the tape earlier, casting fire and brimstone at Greece. From Reuters:

    Greece should not burden the rest of Europe with its internal political debates, German Economy Minister Sigmar Gabriel said on Thursday, adding that Greece's own inequalities were to blame for problems that it tried to blame on its multilateral lenders.

    Gabriel told parliament Greece should stay in the euro but the new leftist leader Alexis Tsipras must respect the terms of its bailout. Greece could not blame the "troika" of multilateral lenders for its own unfair distribution of wealth, he said.

    "All democratic people must respect the democratic decision of voters and a newly-elected government's right to decide its course - but the rest of Europe's citizens should not have to expect changes in Greek politics to burden them," he said.

    Of course, as long as the changes in Greek politics allowed the rest of Europe's citizens to continue to benefit at Greek expense, nobody batted an eyelid. But change the equation and all hell breaks loose.

    And the final confirmation that suddenly tiny Greece may have all the leverage in Europe is that moments ago Germany's Foreign Minister Frank-Walter Steinmeier said that European sanctions on Russia are complicated by the "new Greek government."

    The good news for Greece, of course, is that it now has all the optionality: it can use its veto power as a bargaining chip to unblock US foreign policy in Ukraine (because at the end of the day, Europe is merely losing as a result of the Russian sanctions) and demand a debt haircut in exchange for siding with John Kerry on further Russian "punishment." Or he may simply hold the line and hold off for a competing, better offer from Russia and the BRICs, whose leverage may be nominal now that crude is plummeting, but if and when the last shale junk bond investor blows up and the US shale renaissance is over sending crude soaring right back to $100, then watch as the oil exporters are back with a bang, and dictating geopolitical terms.

    And whatever happens, please don't remind Brussels that point 40 of Syriza's 40 Point Manifesto, aka the "nuclear option", is "Closure of all foreign bases in Greece and withdrawal from NATO."

    It is so bad that Business New Europe went so far as to ask if the New Greek Government is "Russia's Trojan horse inside the EU?"

    In any event, the European balance of power has just shifted and in a way that nobody anticipated:

    The biggest winners: if only for now: Greece and Russia (and, while it will never be admitted, all those Europeans who desperately need the Russian import market).

    The biggest losers: all the unelected Eurocrats in Brussels who at this moment are scratching their heads how to bring the bad news that there is no longer unanimity on Russian sanctions to John Kerry, and all thanks to a country nobody thought would dare to speak up.

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    Re: EU, ΙMF and Greece and Spending cut

    Post  GarryB on Sat Jan 31, 2015 10:07 am

    If Greece stands up and vetos any further sanctions against Russia, then Russia should drop its food ban on Greece and restore full trade ties as a reward...

    I can just see French farmers who would normally be exporting food to Russia blocking streets and having protests in Paris to get Mistrals delivered... Twisted Evil

    Getting very close to that deadline too...


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    Re: EU, ΙMF and Greece and Spending cut

    Post  higurashihougi on Sat Jan 31, 2015 11:32 am

    Choose your sides Very Happy

    http://mrzine.monthlyreview.org/2012/images/greece_ballot_paper.gif

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    Re: EU, ΙMF and Greece and Spending cut

    Post  Kyo on Sat Feb 07, 2015 2:11 pm

    Troika Trojan horse: Will Syriza capitulate in Greece?

    Pepe Escobar for RT.

    The 2015 Greek tragedy is a sorry (financial) remix of the Trojan War. But now the troika (ECB, EC, IMF) has replaced Greece, and Greece is the new Troy.

    It is now crystal clear the ECB will pull no punches to turn Greece into a European failed state. The rationale: others – from Spain to even, in the near future, France – must not entertain funny ideas. Toe the austerity line, or we’ll get medieval on you.

    It was so predictable that the destiny of Athens – and in fact the euro – would ultimately rest in the hands of ECB Governor Mario ‘Master of the Universe’ Draghi, purveyor of the latest QE which in thesis will grant an austerity-ravaged Europe a little extra time to pursue ‘reforms’.

    Some background is essential. The troika sold Greece an economic racket, but it’s the Greek people that are paying the price. Essentially, Greece’s public debt went from private to public hands when the ECB and the IMF ‘rescued’ private (German, French, Spanish) banks. The debt, of course, ballooned. The troika intervened, not to save Greece, but to save private banking.

    The ECB bought public debt from private banks for a fortune, because the ECB could not buy public debt directly from the Greek state. The icing on this layer cake is that private banks had found the cash to buy Greece’s public debt exactly from…the ECB, profiting from ultra-friendly interest rates. This is outright theft. And it's the thieves that have been setting the rules of the game all along.

    Where’s our money?
    The result is that Athens is now broke. Greek Finance Minister Yanis Varoufakis at least embarked on his European tour with a sound proposal; the ECB could move €1.9 billion of profit on the back of Greek bonds; and then release other €10 billion in short-term state obligations, as well as open an emergency line to banks. From the beginning, the key point for Varoufakis was to open the way to renegotiate the €240 billion of the troika ‘rescue’ plan.

    ECB hawks – as in Errki Liikanen from Finland – barred these options from the outset, insisting that without a comprehensive agreement, as in total Greek surrender, not a single euro will go to Athens.

    What a drag for Prime Minister Tsipras and for Varoufakis – to embark on an European tour as supplicant beggars facing a sterling collection of silky mobsters, including EC president Jean-Claude Juncker and president of the European Council, warmonger Donald Tusk.

    Next week there may be an extraordinary meeting of the Eurogroup, ahead of a sparks-will-fly European summit in Brussels on February 12.

    The bottom line: it does not look good.
    Varoufakis tried to put a brave face, continuing to rule out a Grexit as “hugely detrimental to Greece.” More detrimental would be in fact the Syriza party totally capitulating to the neoliberal Masters of the Universe. This will ensure Greek depression will go on forever. And yes, eventually, the fascist Golden Dawn may accede to power.

    Varoufakis, in his press conference with German finance minister Wolfgang Schauble in Berlin, even as he agreed with 67 percent of the current ‘plan’, stressed – soundly - it does not tackle the excesses of corruption and rent-seeking in Greece; and everything is all about debt repayments, not putting the Greek economy back into shape.

    For his part, Schauble, predictably, issued a thinly veiled threat of an “uncertain future” without a bailout program. Schauble’s now famous “we agree to disagree” was in fact hardball enveloped in velvet.

    There is no evidence as it stands that a complex negotiation of at least a few months will ensue, as Athens tries to restructure how to deal with the troika. The ECB is now tacitly playing the game that Greece is essentially doomed. Ergo, the ECB is voting down Syriza, and actually supporting fascist Golden Dawn. That’s central bank ‘democracy’ for you.

    Bomb Frankfurt, anyone?
    So in the end it breaks down to this; without ECB cash – at least some cash by the end of the month - Greece risks going back to the drachma without even firing a shot. And yet that’s exactly what legions across Europe are absolutely rooting for. In parallel, no wonder – from Lisbon to Rome - rumblings multiply that if the ECB would have done that to a relatively well weaponized nation, the tanks would be out in the streets (but to do what? Bomb Frankfurt?)

    Varoufakis insists, “One thing we will not do is capitulate.” That would translate, essentially, into a Greek default. We’re not there – yet. In the very short term, Draghi also knows that were Athens to get some of the cash it needs short term, there would be war against the Bundesbank. It won’t happen; the ECB and the Bundesbank are partners in crime.

    Once again; both the ECB and the Bundesbank came to the conclusion there is no risk of contagion even with a Grexit. So the ‘strategy’ won’t wobble; crush Greece and all’s well that ends well – as in the troika’s terminator economics trampling whole countries underfoot.

    Beware of Masters of the Universe dispensing smiles. Draghi and the Zegna-clad ECB goons may dispense all the smiles in the world, but what they are graphically demonstrating once again is how toxic central banking is now enshrined as a mortal enemy of democracy.

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    Re: EU, ΙMF and Greece and Spending cut

    Post  George1 on Fri Apr 17, 2015 2:42 pm

    IMF Refuses to Grant Greece Delay in Debt Payment

    Christine Lagarde said that International Monetary Fund is refusing to grant Greece a delay in payment of its debt in May.

    MOSCOW (Sputnik) — International Monetary Fund (IMF) is refusing to grant Greece a delay in payment of its debt in May, IMF head Christine Lagarde said.

    According to the Financial Times newspaper's Thursday report, Lagarde had explained the policy of not granting delay requests to Greek Finance Minister Yanis Varoufakis after Greece informally asked for more time earlier this month.

    "Payment delays have not been granted by the board of the IMF in 30 years. We have been able to express and explain the policy of the IMF in terms of payment delays and give the precedents and history of that to Mr Varoufakis," Lagarde said at a press conference, as quoted by the Financial Times.

    Lagarde called on Athens to implement "tedious" work of designing reforms for the country's economy, saying that stability "is not done by a political last-minute accord, it's done by looking at measures, committing to reforms, measuring what the outcome will be."

    Greece's debt to the troika of international creditors, that includes the IMF, the European Union and the European Central Bank (ECB), is estimated to be some $270 billion.

    The country is expected to repay $220 million to the IMF on May 1 and $840 million on May 12.

    Athens and Eurozone finance ministers agreed on the extension of Greece's bailout for four months in February. As part of the deal, Greece promised to implement a range of economic reforms.

    Greece now needs to come up with a reform plan before the next meeting with the EU Finance Ministers scheduled for April 24, in order to receive the next aid package.

    Read more: http://sputniknews.com/politics/20150417/1021002767.html#ixzz3XZNfCsK8

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    Re: EU, ΙMF and Greece and Spending cut

    Post  George1 on Tue May 12, 2015 4:06 pm

    Greece Used Emergency Money to Repay Multimillion IMF Loan - Reports

    MOSCOW (Sputnik) — Greece avoided a default by raiding its emergency funds at the International Monetary Fund (IMF) in order to transfer a 750 million euro ($840 million) repayment installment to the bank, the Telegraph reported Tuesday.

    The newspaper said, citing a Greek parliamentarian, that Athens withdrew about 650 million euro from its IMF account in order to make the repayment.

    The news comes after European media reported that the IMF was not keen to approve another relief package for the country.

    Earlier in the day, Greece transferred an $840-million installment of its multibillion debt. Western media reported that the payment has left Athens without funds to repay other loans or to pay social benefits.

    Greece was particularly hard-hit by the global financial crisis of 2008-2009, leaving the country reliant on loans from the IMF, the European Commission and the European Central Bank.

    Read more: http://sputniknews.com/business/20150512/1022036402.html#ixzz3ZvuAfMeZ

    medo
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    Re: EU, ΙMF and Greece and Spending cut

    Post  medo on Sat Jun 27, 2015 11:04 pm

    Greece will have a referendum on July 5th, which will actually decide for Greece to leave EU. With the fail of "negotiations" in Bruxelles, Greece will go bankrupt on June 30th. I hope Greece will leave NATO too and then join BRICS club to receive investments from Russia and China to rebuild their economy.

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    Re: EU, ΙMF and Greece and Spending cut

    Post  magnumcromagnon on Sat Jun 27, 2015 11:49 pm

    medo wrote:Greece will have a referendum on July 5th, which will actually decide for Greece to leave EU. With the fail of "negotiations" in Bruxelles, Greece will go bankrupt on June 30th. I hope Greece will leave NATO too and then join BRICS club to receive investments from Russia and China to rebuild their economy.

    Actually I'd want to see both Greece and Cypress go further than that and hold referendums to join the Russian Federation, as it would strategically change the chessboard of European and Middle East geopolitics if successfully done, and don't worry about Russia being held hostage with their debt as they would hold a debt payment moratorium and Russia wouldn't be obligated to pay a single cent of their debt because it's not their own.

    So what is the strategic implications of Greece and Cypress joins the Russian Federation:

    1.) Crippling NATO's logistic and supply chain for the Middle East, by ending the refueling and logistic assets in Crete.

    2.) Greatly undermining the threat of the Bosporus and Dardanelles being used as a strategic chokepoint against Russia's Black Sea Fleet.

    3.) S-500's in Cyprus would cover the entirety of Israel and could greatly undermine the threat of Israeli's illegal and unaccounted for thermonuclear stockpile.

    4.) Russian military presence in Cyprus could 'scare strait' all the countries that are bordering Syria, and force them to shut their boarders and prevent the transit of ISIS and Al Nursa Front, due to the fear of Russia utilizing the 'Hot Pursuit' method of neutralization of terrorism.

    5.) All the warm water ports the Russian Navy could want.

    6.) Greece could be the key to undermine NATO's ABM ambitions in the Balkans, especially if Serbia and possibly Macedonia follows them same path as Greece and Cyprus.

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    Re: EU, ΙMF and Greece and Spending cut

    Post  George1 on Sun Jun 28, 2015 7:10 am

    medo wrote:Greece will have a referendum on July 5th, which will actually decide for Greece to leave EU. With the fail of "negotiations" in Bruxelles, Greece will go bankrupt on June 30th. I hope Greece will leave NATO too and then join BRICS club to receive investments from Russia and China to rebuild their economy.

    Greece cant join BRICS, referendum is a tactical move, it will fail


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    Re: EU, ΙMF and Greece and Spending cut

    Post  Cyberspec on Sun Jun 28, 2015 8:26 am

    magnumcromagnon wrote:Actually I'd want to see both Greece and Cypress go further than that and hold referendums to join the Russian Federation

    Not exactly a realistic scenario

    George1 wrote:Greece cant join BRICS, referendum is a tactical move, it will fail

    It can join the BRICS Bank assuming China agrees....but I sort of agree with you, it seems most Greeks want to stay part of the EU, including this new government. I don't think it's serious about some sort of fundamental shift, it's just playing chicken with the EU comission

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    Re: EU, ΙMF and Greece and Spending cut

    Post  medo on Sun Jun 28, 2015 10:02 am

    It's not what Greeks government and citizens wish or want, but that the only option to survive is to exit EU and to get BRICS investments in economy. Staying in EU will be continue with painful agony till death. There is no future for Greece in EU.

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    Re: EU, ΙMF and Greece and Spending cut

    Post  Cyberspec on Sun Jun 28, 2015 11:47 am

    medo wrote:It's not what Greeks government and citizens wish or want, but that the only option to survive is to exit EU and to get BRICS investments in economy. Staying in EU will be continue with painful agony till death. There is no future for Greece in EU.

    I agree. But there's influential people who probably benefit from the agony

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    Re: EU, ΙMF and Greece and Spending cut

    Post  medo on Sun Jun 28, 2015 2:05 pm

    Cyberspec wrote:
    medo wrote:It's not what Greeks government and citizens wish or want, but that the only option to survive is to exit EU and to get BRICS investments in economy. Staying in EU will be continue with painful agony till death. There is no future for Greece in EU.

    I agree. But there's influential people who probably benefit from the agony

    True, but the bankrupt, which will happened in Tuesday will make hard landing for Greeks back to reality and Greece will looks like Argentina in 2001. The shock of default will force Greeks to think what to do next to survive. Argentina get back on their feet, when Hugo Chavez help them to pay off IMF. Greece will need help and investments from BRICS.

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    Re: EU, ΙMF and Greece and Spending cut

    Post  magnumcromagnon on Mon Jun 29, 2015 4:38 am

    Cyberspec wrote:
    magnumcromagnon wrote:Actually I'd want to see both Greece and Cypress go further than that and hold referendums to join the Russian Federation

    Not exactly a realistic scenario


    If I recall right there were political parties in Russia that were calling for de-Dollarization a year before the Ukraine crisis, and they were ignored with claims saying they were aspiring to 'unrealistic goals'...fast forward two years now Russia is scrambling to de-Dollarize. Desperate times calls for desperate measures, and the scenario I mentioned is the best option for both countries. Mind you Crimea re-joining Russia was not foreseen three years ago, even though the referendum to join Russia existed 20 years prior. Greece stays in Euro, Turkish steam ends up never getting built, if Greece joins Russia then it gets built for sure, with extra benefit that neither side will have to deal with EU bureaucracy, plus the other perks that I previously mentioned.

    Greece has no better option, and Russia stands to gain a major strategic advantage in the Middle East.

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    Re: EU, ΙMF and Greece and Spending cut

    Post  Hannibal Barca on Tue Jun 30, 2015 9:59 pm

    Why don't you make a referendum to join Greece? I welcome the idea!

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