Military Forum for Russian and Global Defence Issues


    Best russian attack helicopter?

    Share

    Poll

    If you could only have one type of attack helicopter which would it be?(please read below first)

    [ 9 ]
    28% [28%] 
    [ 6 ]
    19% [19%] 
    [ 17 ]
    53% [53%] 

    Total Votes: 32

    KoTeMoRe
    Colonel
    Colonel

    Posts : 3565
    Points : 3600
    Join date : 2015-04-21
    Location : Krankhaus Central.

    Re: Best russian attack helicopter?

    Post  KoTeMoRe on Wed Feb 24, 2016 7:57 am

    À CSAR mission is going to always be reactive, unless you plan for your planes, people to get shot. The Idea here is simple. Unlike the Russian CSAR mission, the US in similar circumstances,  haven't been à level above. As for not being à trap, well We had à discussion here and the Turkish math doesn't add up regarding the SU 24 shotdown. Same for that TOW readiness. They hauled it on the spot while being "in front" of it, not behind. The actual TOW team and welcome committee, was on both sides of the valley by the time the CSAR went in. We know this, because the fuckers taped it. An then again in Ex Yu same NATO airmen got caught and roughed up. There is no CSAR superiority. There is specialized personnel. But CSAR is à hit&miss business.

    Personally for what was worth, the set up, the actual command to shot down the Su and the area where it was shot down cannot be some kind of mishap.

    The Turks done this with the SyAAF where they shot a Syrian jet then an helicopter while it was well behind the border and got the pilots downed. It's not something new. The placement of the Ambush team that was special. Because they were right on the spot of the shot down. Which per se wouldn't be a problem, there were clashes a bit further. What wasn't normal was that the Turkmen group was within range of the air crew within 3/4 minutes and that the plane was shot above their positions. This was new. The two other aircraft shot were around "Moderats positions", but this time the plane was shot over them.

    The CSAR left within 15 minutes. The helicopters got there as fast as possible. Although there was nothing to save actually. Because the pursuit group had FIRED on the airmen. They had visual contact, unlike the F117 pilot. It's a great luck that one of the crew-members was still alive.

    Same for the Red Wings SEALS, that's why I'm comparing what is comparable.

    Airmen/Distress callers in range from their pursuit party.
    CSAR mission that goes in.
    One mission doesn't get out.
    Guess which one.

    If you maintain the superiority of the US CSAR in comparable situations, I don't know what to add more. But personally I cannot voucher for that.


    higurashihougi
    Colonel
    Colonel

    Posts : 2129
    Points : 2244
    Join date : 2014-08-13
    Location : A small and cutie S-shaped land.

    Re: Best russian attack helicopter?

    Post  higurashihougi on Wed Feb 24, 2016 10:10 am

    GarryB wrote:We need to get something straight here... the Mi-28 has a side door to climb inside the fuselage so you can access the avionics racks... you can climb inside and their would be room for two people in a squeeze, but it is not by any means a troop transport helo... and was never intended as such.

    I heard that there is combat detachment with the size of 3 people and Mi-28 can be used to carry such units. Question Question Idea

    GarryB
    Colonel
    Colonel

    Posts : 15468
    Points : 16175
    Join date : 2010-03-30
    Location : New Zealand

    Re: Best russian attack helicopter?

    Post  GarryB on Thu Feb 25, 2016 9:43 am

    I rather doubt it.

    Look at an Mi-28 from the front... just looking at the width if you put a narrow access walkway down the middle and put electronics racks on each side you will get one person with no equipment or backpack in there to access the equipment on the racks... you could probably squease another person behind them but there would be no room to move let alone weapons or body armour or backpacks or equipment.

    the potential for rescue is potential only... one aircraft lands and one person gets in and then that aircraft takes off and another aircraft lands and another person gets in... a unit of 4-6 helos might be able to take 4-6 people but it would only be in case of a serious emergency where there is no other option.


    _________________
    “The West won the world not by the superiority of its ideas or values or religion […] but rather by its superiority in applying organized violence. Westerners often forget this fact; non-Westerners never do.”

    ― Samuel P. Huntington, The Clash of Civilizations and the Remaking of World Order

    KoTeMoRe
    Colonel
    Colonel

    Posts : 3565
    Points : 3600
    Join date : 2015-04-21
    Location : Krankhaus Central.

    Re: Best russian attack helicopter?

    Post  KoTeMoRe on Thu Feb 25, 2016 11:38 am

    higurashihougi wrote:
    GarryB wrote:We need to get something straight here... the Mi-28 has a side door to climb inside the fuselage so you can access the avionics racks... you can climb inside and their would be room for two people in a squeeze, but it is not by any means a troop transport helo... and was never intended as such.

    I heard that there is combat detachment with the size of 3 people and Mi-28 can be used to carry such units. Question Question Idea

    Nah there's a belly trap door, that is most of the time half empty. That's all. It's used for many things. However if push comes to shove, Mil28's can CSAR like AH64's can by having buckles and strapping the rescued personel.

    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-430251/Pictures-Marines-strap-chopper-daring-rescue.html

    Werewolf
    Colonel
    Colonel

    Posts : 5390
    Points : 5639
    Join date : 2012-10-24

    Re: Best russian attack helicopter?

    Post  Werewolf on Thu Feb 25, 2016 11:47 am

    KoTeMoRe wrote:
    higurashihougi wrote:
    GarryB wrote:We need to get something straight here... the Mi-28 has a side door to climb inside the fuselage so you can access the avionics racks... you can climb inside and their would be room for two people in a squeeze, but it is not by any means a troop transport helo... and was never intended as such.

    I heard that there is combat detachment with the size of 3 people and Mi-28 can be used to carry such units. Question Question Idea

    Nah there's a belly trap door, that is most of the time half empty. That's all. It's used for many things. However if push comes to shove, Mil28's can CSAR like AH64's can by having buckles and strapping the rescued personel.

    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-430251/Pictures-Marines-strap-chopper-daring-rescue.html

    It's not a belly door but an access door under left IR suppressor to access radio/avionic equipment which in modernisation from A to N model recieved modules that are smaller and have freed space for additional equipment if required. It was never filled with more equipment to keep weight low, so they discovered there is enough room to fit 2 man inside.



    No seats just enough space to fit in there, still much better than sitting on a stubbed wing next to a 120-140 db loud engine not to mention that this is completley impossible for someone who is not concious or injured, further the pilot has no chance of avoiding ground fire by maneuvering unless he wants to kill the personal in its undedicated role as a CSAR helo. Apaches factually can not perform CSAR missions Mi-28 can and Mi-24 has a predestination to this kind of job.

    KoTeMoRe
    Colonel
    Colonel

    Posts : 3565
    Points : 3600
    Join date : 2015-04-21
    Location : Krankhaus Central.

    Re: Best russian attack helicopter?

    Post  KoTeMoRe on Thu Feb 25, 2016 11:51 am

    Werewolf wrote:
    KoTeMoRe wrote:
    higurashihougi wrote:
    GarryB wrote:We need to get something straight here... the Mi-28 has a side door to climb inside the fuselage so you can access the avionics racks... you can climb inside and their would be room for two people in a squeeze, but it is not by any means a troop transport helo... and was never intended as such.

    I heard that there is combat detachment with the size of 3 people and Mi-28 can be used to carry such units. Question Question Idea

    Nah there's a belly trap door, that is most of the time half empty. That's all. It's used for many things. However if push comes to shove, Mil28's can CSAR like AH64's can by having buckles and strapping the rescued personel.

    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-430251/Pictures-Marines-strap-chopper-daring-rescue.html

    It's not a belly door but an access door under left IR suppressor to access radio/avionic equipment which in modernisation from A to N model recieved modules that are smaller and have freed space for additional equipment if required. It was never filled with more equipment to keep weight low, so they discovered there is enough room to fit 2 man inside.



    No seats just enough space to fit in there, still much better than sitting on a stubbed wing next to a 120-140 db loud engine not to mention that this is completley impossible for someone who is not concious or injured, further the pilot has no chance of avoiding ground fire by maneuvering unless he wants to kill the personal in its undedicated role as a CSAR helo. Apaches factually can not perform CSAR missions Mi-28 can and Mi-24 has a predestination to this kind of job.

    I was under the impression that there was a belly trap door on the Mil28? Anyway, like usual with Russian equipment, half truths-halflies amount to a lot more than expected. Still I'm with you guys. Far better than jock riding the Hunter.

    Werewolf
    Colonel
    Colonel

    Posts : 5390
    Points : 5639
    Join date : 2012-10-24

    Re: Best russian attack helicopter?

    Post  Werewolf on Thu Feb 25, 2016 12:45 pm

    Don't have picture right now but the Ka-50/52 have an entire section of avionics bay that was from the 80's modernized to 21st century modularity with much smaller components and there is now a the right board side? aviation bay below gun free where you could fit two people in a lying position, but very uncomfortable due to the ribs of the fuselage.

    I try find a picture of it.

    Sponsored content

    Re: Best russian attack helicopter?

    Post  Sponsored content Today at 1:07 pm


      Current date/time is Tue Dec 06, 2016 1:07 pm