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    2S35 Koalitsiya-SV 152mm

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    GarryB
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    Re: 2S35 Koalitsiya-SV 152mm

    Post  GarryB on Tue Jun 09, 2015 10:52 am

    You are contradicting yourself...

    Garry, one of the major issues that the 152mm gun on board Russian Cruisers/Destroyers may face is that they will have a range of less than 30 miles, and the rocket propellant needed to reach this far and the guidance system leaves little room for explosives in the projectile. Ideally when you have a 152mm you would want to go beyond 100 miles.

    So the major issue you say, is that it lacks range, and that when range is extended by increasing propellent and adding base bleed and rocket boosting there is no room for sufficient explosive... and then you say it needs even more range...

    First of all naval gun support is largely for use with landing operations or hitting small targets that don't warrant a missile.

    Where the need for 160km range comes from I don't know, but you yourself suggest that such ranges leads to pathetic payloads... which makes the whole purpose of the system redundant.

    The Russians have a range of guided munition options, some of which are cheap, and others are not so cheap, but range is not what you compare with payload... accuracy and the target are teh important things when considering payload. Even the lightest payload will be effective if the CEP is less than 1 metre and the target is soft. A super heavy bunker will require a large payload no matter what the accuracy is.... and everything in between.

    For a decent naval gun support gun, I personally think the old 203mm guns on a specialised vessel would be the best basis but it would be great for the navy it would not really be so much use for the army... the army unit doesn't control that much area so having 160km range guns just means they are shelling their neighbours target or they never use their guns to their max range.

    Note the Russians are getting extended ranges from new propellent and EM assistance as part of the gun design... by going for conservative ranges they get guidance and good range without having to give up payload... perhaps it is the US that is being stupid?  All that extra range and their rounds can  still be shot down by Klintock.

    ERGMs may be useful against a few high-value targets, but are too expensive for general use, their GPS guidance can be jammed, and their warhead is far too small.

    So your logic is that if the USN can't do it, the Russians shouldn't even bother?

    The US Army decided that tank gun launched guided missiles were a dead end too because their system was a terrible failure... the Russians were much more practical in their approach and that resulted in a new system that could be added to existing vehicles... ie they created a new range of ammo instead of some super missile tank.


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    jhelb
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    Re: 2S35 Koalitsiya-SV 152mm

    Post  jhelb on Tue Jun 09, 2015 11:07 am

    GarryB wrote:You are contradicting yourself...

    So the major issue you say, is that it lacks range, and that when range is extended by increasing propellent and adding base bleed and rocket boosting there is no room for sufficient explosive... and then you say it needs even more range...

    The thing is Navies need a 152mm or 155m gun to hit at ranges of 100 miles or more. However, to do that the projectiles will need a lot of propellant. This extra propellant will reduce the room for sufficient explosives.

    This is why me think the 152 mm/ 155mm naval gun is still work in progress.


    GarryB wrote:The Russians have a range of guided munition options, some of which are cheap, and others are not so cheap, but range is not what you compare with payload... accuracy and the target are teh important things when considering payload. Even the lightest payload will be effective if the CEP is less than 1 metre and the target is soft. A super heavy bunker will require a large payload no matter what the accuracy is.... and everything in between.

    The biggest problem with guided projectiles is that they can be jammed.


    GarryB wrote:Note the Russians are getting extended ranges from new propellent and EM assistance as part of the gun design... by going for conservative ranges they get guidance and good range without having to give up payload...

    Will appreciate if you can elaborate on this development.


    GarryB wrote:For a decent naval gun support gun, I personally think the old 203mm guns on a specialised vessel would be the best basis

    The shock and the weight of the 203mm will strain the ship.

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    Re: 2S35 Koalitsiya-SV 152mm

    Post  Viktor on Fri Jul 03, 2015 8:35 pm

    Serial production in 2016 Laughing Laughing Laughing cheers

    Developer: serial deliveries "Coalition-SV" will begin in 2016

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    Re: 2S35 Koalitsiya-SV 152mm

    Post  GarryB on Sat Jul 04, 2015 11:30 am

    The thing is Navies need a 152mm or 155m gun to hit at ranges of 100 miles or more. However, to do that the projectiles will need a lot of propellant. This extra propellant will reduce the room for sufficient explosives.

    This is why me think the 152 mm/ 155mm naval gun is still work in progress.

    Why do they need a gun to hit targets at 100 miles?

    No matter what the range the smaller the calibre the smaller the shell... going for a 203mm gun actually makes it easier to get better range... not harder.

    The biggest problem with guided projectiles is that they can be jammed.

    So some sort of home on jam capability might be useful?


    Will appreciate if you can elaborate on this development.

    Based on comments about achieving 70km with Coalition in 152mm calibre, with the use of new propellants, a very long barrel, and EM assistance.

    The shock and the weight of the 203mm will strain the ship.

    A 15,000 ton plus cruiser should have no problems at all operating a 203mm gun mount... water is excellent for absorbing recoil...


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    collegeboy16
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    Re: 2S35 Koalitsiya-SV 152mm

    Post  collegeboy16 on Tue Jul 07, 2015 5:09 pm


    Alexandr1233211 wrote:
    >XXI century
    >Hand loading
    >Hand eject
    >Trigger by rope
    >Cleaning barrel after every shot like it is XIX cannon
    Holy shit. This is USSR 50-x technology, maybe, but not modern high-quality weaponary.
    bring back crusader!!!

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    Re: 2S35 Koalitsiya-SV 152mm

    Post  Mike E on Tue Jul 07, 2015 8:31 pm

    Crusader was a complete and utter failure... They need the PzH.

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    Re: 2S35 Koalitsiya-SV 152mm

    Post  George1 on Wed Jul 15, 2015 7:37 pm

    Navy will receive Coastal artillery system based on the "Coalition-SV"


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    franco
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    Re: 2S35 Koalitsiya-SV 152mm

    Post  franco on Thu Jul 16, 2015 10:28 pm

    Viktor wrote:Serial production in 2016  Laughing  Laughing  Laughing  cheers

    Developer: serial deliveries "Coalition-SV" will begin in 2016


    Read the other day that 12 had been delivered this year for the Parade and then testing and training.

    Vann7
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    Re: 2S35 Koalitsiya-SV 152mm

    Post  Vann7 on Wed Jul 22, 2015 9:41 am

    GarryB wrote:
    If an enemy enters your territory and runs out of ammo they could simply pick up a local weapon and ammo...


    Indeed.. but they will not have the training how accurately fire with new weapon..so if they are in the middle of a war ,there will be no time to train.. how the aim works.. how to clean it..  Thats the whole point of training soldiers again and again and gain in one specific weapon.. for maintainance and better use of it.  

    But if the enemy capture ammo storage depot.. without weapons , that is completely different to the one they use.. then it will be useless for them..  Thats the whole point GarryB of Russia using
    different caliber than NATO . Is not because they cannot officially use the one NATO use.. but because is far better to use munition that is not compatible with NATO hardware. If NATO capture tank ammo.. it will be useless with the Caliber the guns of their tanks .. same with their rifles.
    But they cannot "simply pick" an enemy tank and do what you want.. if there is NONE TANK to pick up or no Rifle to pickup and all they got was ammo but from a different caliber of the one they need. .. it will be useless. This is very simple 101 tactics.

    Armata T-14 operation also ,seems will not be easy to pick up either by any foreigner and start using it without training.. According to their own developers takes years to train in armata ,and this have its positive side ,that far outweights the disadvantages.. means the enemy will never be able to use your best weapons against you in short time.. and in case of Armata maybe never..if require password to start the engine or special tricks...that only trainned Russian soldiers in that  tank knows.  Russia latest rifles ammo ,tank ammo and artillery ammo ,use different caliber than NATO ,not by coincidence. but is done by design. To make it less
    easier for potential adversaries to re-supply using your own ammo or military hardware.
    Fortunately also Russia will not get rid of their older tanks like T-90 and T-75.. until they build enough Armatas to replace their soviet hardware.

    George1
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    Re: 2S35 Koalitsiya-SV 152mm

    Post  George1 on Wed Sep 09, 2015 12:54 am

    Serov Mechanical Plant is preparing to release the prototype of shells for ACS "Coalition-SV"


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    George1
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    Re: 2S35 Koalitsiya-SV 152mm

    Post  George1 on Mon Nov 16, 2015 10:58 pm

    The latest gun of self-propelled howitzer "Coalition-SV" if necessary, can be installed on heavy tracked platform "Armata".


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    Re: 2S35 Koalitsiya-SV 152mm

    Post  George1 on Fri Nov 20, 2015 3:22 am

    Developer: Tests of "Coalition-SV" are going according to plan

    New ACS exceeds not only domestic predecessors, but also "a number of indicators," German PzH 2000, said Advisor to General Director of Corporation "Uralvagonzavod" Alexander Romanovsky

    MOSCOW, November 19. / TASS /. Tests self-propelled artillery "Coalition-SV" are on schedule, with no gaps, said Nov. 19 general director of TASS Advisor Corporation "Uralvagonzavod", which developed a fighting machine, Alexander Romanovsky.

    "According to the" Coalition-SV "tests go as planned, worked out a timetable for testing ... We have everything goes according to the approved schedule, no delays," - a spokesman said.

    He did not specify when it is planned to complete the test. "According to the content and the time of their termination need to ask the customer," - said Romanovsky.

    According to him, the new Russian howitzer is superior not only domestic predecessors, but - "a number of indicators" - German PzH 2000 that military experts are often called the best self-propelled guns in the world. By what criteria were compared fighting vehicles, Romanovsky did not elaborate. Meanwhile, earlier in the Defense Ministry stated that "Coalition-SV" superior PzH 2000 2.5-3 times, also explaining about what exactly the parameters in question.

    Romanovsky said that "Uralvagonzavod" continues to overhaul and modernization of existing artillery systems, and to develop promising technology. So, he said, deeply modernized self-propelled howitzer "MSTA-SM" has acquired a completely new quality in terms of both shooting accuracy and comfort of the crew.

    Advisor to the head of the "Uralvagonzavod" is convinced that the emergence of shock drones and other means does not reduce the role of the artillery. "We artillery have the opportunity to work at any time, in any place, in any weather, at any theater of war. Today, the combat capabilities of artillery increased significantly, especially in distance, accuracy and agility. And if you talk straight, not least its advantage - it is cheap, as the artillery - the cheapest way to fire damage today, "- said the agency.

    "Coalition-SV" with a gun caliber 152 mm was presented to the public at the Victory Parade in Moscow on May 9, along with other examples of promising Russian armored vehicles - on platforms "Armata", "Bumergang", "Kurganets." Earlier it was reported that the mass artillery unit will go to the army since 2019.


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    Re: 2S35 Koalitsiya-SV 152mm

    Post  GunshipDemocracy on Sat Nov 21, 2015 7:22 pm

    Deputy Chief of Rocket Troops and Artillery General-the major Alexander Drahomaretskiy: self-propelled howitzer "Coalition-SV" can replace the whole battery

    http://ria.ru/defense_safety/20151121/1325792164.html

    MOSCOW, 21 Nov — RIA Novosti. One of the newest Russian self-propelled howitzer "Coalition-SV" is able to replace an entire artillery battery, said Saturday in an interview with radio station "Russian news service" Deputy of the chief of rocket troops and artillery (Rvia) Land forces of Russia the General-the major Alexander Drahomaretskiy. "The tool of the modern, new. Opportunities are that almost one weapon can replace the artillery battery," said Drahomaretskiy.
    For missile complex "Iskander-M" development of new types of missiles
    He recalled that the new artillery system works in the automated mode, while the crew is outside of the tower, which is uninhabited.
    ACS "Coalition-SV", first presented at parade in honor of the 70th anniversary of the Victory on red square, is designed to engage manpower, military equipment and fortifications. "Coalition-SV" is equipped with Autonomous power supply unit, by means of providing a comfortable habitat crew, satellite navigation systems, latent data and communication systems and effective display of information for the crew. The plant is capable of hitting targets at a distance up to 70 kilometers.





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    Re: 2S35 Koalitsiya-SV 152mm

    Post  George1 on Sun Nov 22, 2015 8:54 pm

    A prototype of self-propelled howitzer "Coalition-SV" based on Kamaz had been created


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    Re: 2S35 Koalitsiya-SV 152mm

    Post  Mike E on Sun Nov 22, 2015 9:41 pm

    There's some new information on 2S35, for me at least;

    T-14 can send targeting directly to the 2S35, which can then, obviously, fire at the requested target. Some sites are also claiming it has sat communication systems.

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    Re: 2S35 Koalitsiya-SV 152mm

    Post  Militarov on Mon Nov 23, 2015 3:50 pm

    "Russia’s Burevestnik Research Institute, part of Uralvagonzavod weapons manufacturer, is developing a wheeled and a tracked version of the Koalitsiya-SV 152mm self-propelled artillery system under the same time schedule, the Uralvagonzavod press office told TASS. "The work on the wheeled version is proceeding under the same time schedule for the tracked version of the self-propelled artillery system," the press office said.

    According to the press office, the preliminary trials of the prototypes are currently under way. "The general customer will make a decision on accepting the Koalitsiya-SV self-propelled artillery system for operation after the state trials of the prototypes are completed and the documentation is assigned the O1 lettertype," the press office said. "A decision on the volumes of its serial production and purchase will be made within the same period," the press office added. Several Koalitsiya-SV self-propelled artillery systems were unveiled at the Victory Day Parade in Moscow on May 9, 2015 together with other advanced Russian-made armored vehicles. Deputy Chairman of the Russian Military and Industrial Commission Board Oleg Bochkaryov said earlier the Russian Armed Forces would start to receive Koalitsiya-SV self-propelled artillery systems in 2019.

    The Koalitsiya-SV self-propelled artillery system is expected to fire new 152mm separate loading projectiles. The system has a remote-controlled combat module with a 12.7mm machine gun mounted on top of its turret and 902B Tucha smoke dischargers on its sides.



    The version of the 2S35 Koalitsiya-SV self-propelled artillery system unveiled in May 2015 was mounted on the T-72/90 tank chassis. However, the system is expected to be installed on the Armata platform. Upgraded projectiles extend the Koalitsiya-SV system’s firing range up to 70 kilometers (43.5 miles) Unlike its foreign analogs, the Koalitsiya-SV system has a bigger ammunition load. All actions of the system’s crew members are shown on displays of the single control unit. The pneumatic loading mechanism enhances the Koalitsiya-SV system’s firing rate. The system can select a projectile type and deliver fire automatically. In 2013, a project of wheeled self-propelled howitzer using the same turret and armament as the Koalitsiya-SV was presented during the Russia Expo Arms defense exhibition. A drawing of the project was unveiled, showing an 8x8 KamAz truck chassis fitted with a turret and armed with one 152mm cannon. According, KamAZ spokesman Oleg Afanasyev, the new howitzer will be based on the four-axle KamAZ-6560 truck. The new howitzer will reportedly be fully automatic, meaning that the crew will remain in the armoured cab for the loading and firing sequence."

    Source: http://www.armyrecognition.com/november_2015_global_defense_security_news_uk/russia_to_develop_a_new_wheeled_version_of_koalitsiya-sv_152mm_self-propelled_howitzer_tass_12211152.html

    max steel
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    Re: 2S35 Koalitsiya-SV 152mm

    Post  max steel on Mon Nov 23, 2015 11:19 pm

    it is similar to the American M-109A6, or is it the A9? Both seems to have the same electronic, but from their own origins. The most newest is the computerized C3I-System in connection with GPS/GLONASS. And also the newest smart ammunition is part of it.

    ult
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    Re: 2S35 Koalitsiya-SV 152mm

    Post  ult on Tue Dec 15, 2015 3:35 pm


    zg18
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    Re: 2S35 Koalitsiya-SV 152mm

    Post  zg18 on Tue Dec 15, 2015 6:43 pm

    ult wrote:

    Nice! thumbsup

    Militarov
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    Re: 2S35 Koalitsiya-SV 152mm

    Post  Militarov on Tue Dec 15, 2015 6:46 pm

    ult wrote:

    Seems like suspension and other components regarding stability and dampening are dealing with recoil alot better than they used to on MSTA-S.


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    Re: 2S35 Koalitsiya-SV 152mm

    Post  ult on Wed Dec 16, 2015 2:49 pm

    And more.




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    Re: 2S35 Koalitsiya-SV 152mm

    Post  Dima on Wed Dec 16, 2015 5:31 pm

    How about Russia sending a dozen of these to Syria for some real field trials....Russian units can man those units. There is nothing better than having it in combat condition.

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    Re: 2S35 Koalitsiya-SV 152mm

    Post  Dima on Wed Dec 16, 2015 5:36 pm

    Militarov wrote:Seems like suspension and other components regarding stability and dampening are dealing with recoil alot better than they used to on MSTA-S.
    The difference probably is the lower (& more centered) CG of system due to the unmanned turret and the 7th road wheel among others.

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    Re: 2S35 Koalitsiya-SV 152mm

    Post  Militarov on Wed Dec 16, 2015 8:15 pm

    Dima wrote:
    Militarov wrote:Seems like suspension and other components regarding stability and dampening are dealing with recoil alot better than they used to on MSTA-S.
    The difference probably is the lower (& more centered) CG of system due to the unmanned turret and the 7th road wheel among others.

    I belive Koalistia is still on modified T90S platform, i see only 6 road wheels. But yeah CG is probably better positioned now compared to MSTA.

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    Re: 2S35 Koalitsiya-SV 152mm

    Post  Cyberspec on Wed Dec 16, 2015 11:09 pm

    Militarov wrote:
    Dima wrote:
    Militarov wrote:Seems like suspension and other components regarding stability and dampening are dealing with recoil alot better than they used to on MSTA-S.
    The difference probably is the lower (& more centered) CG of system due to the unmanned turret and the 7th road wheel among others.

    I belive Koalistia is still on modified T90S platform, i see only 6 road wheels. But yeah CG is probably better positioned now compared to MSTA.

    The current prototypes are on a modified T-90 platform which is confirmed in the videos. Apparently they chose it because they wanted an already tested platform although they plan to mount it on the Armata platform later on.....have to say it looks impressive...real beast thumbsup

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