Then making sure that there were significant elements in it with significant US IPR so that they retained a degree of control, as they do over ours.
This wont be an Australian class of sub... it will be forward deployed cannon fodder that the US can use to poke the bear or poke the dragon... a role filled in the past by Georgia and Ukraine...
Meanwhile the French are pissed off
Not normally a vindictive person, but I find that amusing... how dare an ally backstab like that... hahaha...
The region has been a flashpoint for years and tensions there remain high.
Bollocks... it was a quiet backwater till China started developing and growing and the EU and US started poking their nose in and being aggressive and stirring trouble.
Chinese state media carried similar editorials denouncing the pact, and one in the Global Times newspaper said Australia had now "turned itself into an adversary of China".
That is exactly what they have done... perhaps China might want to buy some Tu-142 Bears with Sea Dragon installed and some modern anti sub technologies...
It means Australia will now be able to build nuclear-powered submarines that are faster and harder to detect than conventionally powered fleets.
Easier to detect but fast enough and long range enough to leave the area and lose contact and then sneak back later. Nuke subs are by design noisier than SSKs.
They can stay submerged for months and shoot missiles longer distances - although Australia says it has no intention of putting nuclear weapons on them.
That is not true... Russian SSKs can carry the new model of Kalibr with a range of 5,000km which outranges all non ballistic weapons carried by western nuclear subs.
"This really shows that all three nations are drawing a line in the sand to start and counter [China's] aggressive moves," said Guy Boekenstein from the Asia Society Australia.
It is US and UK and Australian ships going to the South China sea, not Chinese ships going to US or UK or Australian waters, but the lie is that it is China being aggressive... perhaps in Americanspeak Aggressive has a new meaning... perhaps it means not doing as Washington demands.
UK Defence Secretary Ben Wallace told the BBC that China was "embarking on one of the biggest military spends in history... Our partners in those regions want to be able to stand their own ground."
I am glad to see the UK and Australia have come out of the pandemic with so much cash they want to piss it all away on crap like this but things are now a bit clearer.
It is pretty clear the actual deal from Biden was that if the UK spends billions on Trident then they can steal the sub contract from France for Australia and get jobs making subs for the Aussies, but what does Australia get?
To be Cannon fodder and destroy its commercial relationship with China completely.... their mining industry will be devastated...
The European Union's foreign policy chief, Josep Borrell said he understood why France was disappointed by the deal, adding that the EU was not consulted about the new alliance.
"This forces us once again... to reflect on the need to make the issue of European strategic autonomy a priority. This shows that we must survive on our own," he said on Thursday.
...what... the EU not part of the decision making process? Almost like the US is acting in its own interests and ignoring the interests of even its closest allies...
Nuclear subs for Australia does make a lot of sense considering that they are a key US ally in the fight against China BUT this program is going to be hugely expensive if the subs are going to be new builds. Might in the end prove too expensive and then they may have to crawl back to France for a cheaper alternative. Australia is practically a jail atm due to the Covid restrictions but there used to be a very strong anti-nuclear lobby in Australia which can also put an abrupt end to these plans when it comes to election time.
The mining industry is also quite powerful and exports a lot to China too.
Would be hilarious to find where the money is coming from... especially if it is borrowed from China....
I disagree with your first sentence. Australia isn't a key ally.
Australia is like the Ukraine... it occupies a very useful location that would give them strategic depth in the region if they needed it.
Many Australians are not happy with the way the current Government is handling the Covid crisis and it may eventually result in a new government that will most likely kill the deal.
It is no set in stone and China is becoming a much more lucrative market for Australia than the US ever was, but these sorts of stupid moves will cut them out of the Chinese market for good and while I am sure the UK will be eager to fill the gap to replace its lost EU market, Australia isn't big enough for the UK and the UK isn't big enough to replace all of China for Australia.
With the possible exception of New Zealand these countries have now openly declared economic and political warfare against China.
And we get a lot of stick for not preaching to China about what they should or should not be doing... Horse Face rightly says it is none of our business... if we have a right to tell them what to do does that not mean they have the same right to tell us how to behave in our own country?
Western countries would not tolerate that so why should China... the Wests biggest problem with Russia is that they don't listen either... and why should they?
The west does not realise there is an entire world out there of countries wanting more and fairer trade than they get from the west who use them to make money.
There are also other major countries at play here including Japan and Korea and together with Australia they form the key Pacific alliance against China.
Did you not notice they talk about the Indo Pacific region... they will want 1.2 billion Indians to place their lives on the line too and to tighten their belts so they can afford all the western military shit they are going to try to pump into them... it seems the EU has dried up and wont buy any more US crap so plan B is Asia and the Pacific...
China is militarily basically surrounded but their leadership had the foresight to rebuild and modernize the PLA into a formidable force for what was inevitable.
So Russia should help them to make those mass produced ships more capable with newer and better weapons and technology...
BTW China and Russia has huge economical reserves that can last for many years - The US and it's allies does not have this luxury.
The UK and US are in the process of trying to pump money out of Australia and India to try to pay for it... the UK will likely spend hundreds of billions on their Trident submarines that the US controls and their payoff will come from exploiting Australia and eventually India most likely.
Australia can't declare eco war to China. It's totally dependant on chinese growth. All their natural ressources are bought by chinese companies. If they try to replace China by US they will go bankrupt.
The template is clear in the Ukraine...
Even US isn't declaring such war. Trump tried but failed. Take out chinese stuff from US stores and they become empty. Try to produce them in US and they will cost 10 times more.
Trump wanted to do that anyway, but even if he had succeeded production would not have moved to the US... it would have gone to India or Bangledesh... which is probably what India is hoping... suck up to the yanks and get them to invest in production in India and then do what China did and lots of other countries the west used to use as slave labour like Japan and Malaysia and Singapore etc etc... if the governments are clever it can be a real boost in living standard and economy...
You're right - but with the exception of New Zealand - they don't think so. We all know they will fail with dire consequences. That is why I referred to the vast Chinese and Russian reserves.
Russia is independent, but China has the enormous benefit of having such a large internal market that even cutting them off from everyone and they would still have growth and stability.
How about France help build the Belt and Road to China instead ? As well as offering the Submarine contract to China ? Stab them in the back , as they did to France !
There is profit to be made on the Belt and Road project.... and why not sell subs to China... business is business... if the US objects they can buy them themselves... down graded models of course so the US doesn't get all their conventional sub design secrets and become competitors.
Adding Virginia payload module on Astute is just asking for pain in the ass and burning money
If they want to use cruise missiles there are easier ways to do it, launching cruise missile from torpedo tubes would be best approach
They would likely be allowed Harpoon at best... I doubt Tomahawk would be on the table.
Also, French are absolutely furious, like big time
Delicious isn't it?
Maybe Egypt might buy those subs?
Australia can't build diesel subs, let alone building nuclear ones. So if they go for it, it will be built by the US because they will tell UK to **** themselves when they will ask to build them in the UK because what matters at the end is the US mainland.
I am sure the Aussies will want to make them but I suspect they wont be allowed to because of secret technology.
I rather suspect the UK will get this production deal for agreeing to spend billions of pounds on Trident like they did recently.
They aren't planing to protect Australia from Chinese but US mainland.
I suspect Australia will be a base of operations that is far enough back that it is safer than say Japan or South Korea who are in range of most Chinese weapons and aircraft. Australia will be a fall back location where they speak english and have nice weather most of the time and can probably be convinced they need lots of ships too... LCS perhaps....
Why even comment then.
That channel does not have a great track record... just letting you know.
Australia to acquire Tomahawk cruise missiles
WOW... so the rules on exporting missiles is just going to be ignored... good to know... wonder how many 5,000km range cruise missiles Cuba and North Korea and Iran want at the moment...
French are stupid people. Instead of getting involved in such theatrics they should sell nuclear submarines to Indonesia. Australia will get the message.
That might be step 4 or 5 of the grieving process for them...
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