Syrian War: News #16

Isos wrote:

If they give their S-200 launchers to Syria maybe, missiles are not produced anymore to my knowledge outside North Korea.

Buks... well China, Belarus and Ukraine.

Iran has domestic Buk and S-200 if I'm not wrong. Missiles are already copied for those sytems so they could use them.

@ kimppis Buying still requires money...not to mention Isreale stops everything on ships going to Syria.

@isos - S-200/S-300 (?) copy is called Bavar or I am wrong ? but still their effective value is to be proven

nd yes Raad looks a bit like buk ))

With the loses to SAA air defences I wonder if Russia will resupply them with more Buk Sa-5 or Sa-3. The upgraded 2m penchora is still a great system as now proven and when mounted even better, mounted on T-55 chassis or wheeled chassis it normally gets an additional missile 4 instead of 3.

And good news that the upgraded Sa-5 is still deadly  Sa-2 is also still good better if they are also Self propelled. If I am correct it was SA-3 and SA-5 that did the job???? Although I've seen articles stating SA-2 and SA-3 anyone clarify

Turkish outposts/observation post in Idlib/Aleppo.

We saw pictures and videos about Israeli loses burning, at least of some of them, we saw nothing about loses on air defenses.

Where are the habitual satellite pictures?

I read that no SA-5 sites destroyed but SA-3 site was, 2 launchers. Other missiles intercepted.

eehnie wrote:We saw pictures and videos about Israeli loses burning, at least of some of them, we saw nothing about loses on air defenses.

Where are the habitual satellite pictures?

Soon they will be processed. I am also waiting for them to see if they hit anything.

"ISIS HUNTERS REVEAL NEW DETAILS ABOUT U.S. ATTACK ON SYRIAN ARMY IN DEIR EZZOR,"

On February 11, the ISIS Hunters of the 5th Assault Corps of the Syrian Arab Army (SAA) releveled in an official statement that the US-led collation attacked the Syrian Arab Army (SAA) and its units on February 7 because they had repelled a joint attack of the US-backed Syrian Democratic Forces (SDF) and ISIS on their positions.

In its official statement, the unit said that a joint convoy of the SDF and ISIS was first spotted near the SDF-held town of al-Suwar in the eastern Deir Ezzor countryside. Later, the joint force launched an attack on SAA positions in the village of Khasham east of Deir Ezzor.

“Almost immediately Hunters managed to suppress ISIS and make them retreat. (Later an intercepted radio traffic confirmed that the group was partly ISIS, partly Kurds and they retreated towards CONOCO factory),” the statement said.

The ISIS Hunters acknowledged that it lost 20 fighters in the US-led coalition airstrikes on February 7 and said that the SAA lost a higher number of soldiers.

Syrian pro-government sources reported on February 10 that a funeral for dozens of Syrian fighters of the ISIS Hunters was held in the Christian town of al-Suqaylabiyah in northern Hama.

The ISIS Hunters held the SDF responsibility for the US-led coalition airstrikes on its units in Deir Ezzor and vowed to “hunt” ISIS and the SDF’s Kurdish fighters from now on.

“Since now there is no difference for us between ISIS and Kurds. Same terrorists, same attitude towards them. Kurds, be sure, ISIS Hunters are going to hunt you on Syrian soil like your ISIS mercenaries are hunted. Our brothers will be revenged!” the unit said.

Meanwhile, several Syrian opposition sources reported that clashes between the SAA and the SDF are ongoing around Khasham for the fourth day in a row. However, these reports have not not confirmed by the SAA or the SDF.

According to pro-government Syrian experts, the SAA and the ISIS Hunters will not likely launch attacks against the US-backed forces. However, a serious response to the SDF and the US-led coalition is highly possible in case they launch another attack against the SAA in Deir Ezzor. A response that might be similar to the one Israel faced on February 10.


https://southfront.org/isis-hunters-reveal-new-details-about-u-s-attack-on-syrian-army-in-deir-ezzor/

Kurd sold their soul to the devil (aka Uncle Scumbag) and will be shafted like they were after WWI. They don't understand
that Uncle Scumbag makes no commitments to anyone. Their only value to Scumbag is as tools to further his agenda.

People need to take with a big grain of salt Israel claims..
they are 98% propaganda and 2% facts.. This is not the first F-16 that Syria shutdown..
they always cover their damages with technical problems. malfunctions or simply deny it..
What happens is that israel fly their planes either outside Syria territory from standoff
position or only for a few minutes , hit and run.. not allowing Syria army enough time
for their airdefenses to calculate the interception data...

Israel is claiming only lost 1 plane now.. but reality is 3 combat jets lost..

Israel says it hit many airdefenses in Syria.. but Syrian army deny it..
and claims most of israel attacks where INTERCEPTED by their airdefenses..
and the only damages they got ,was a depot of mortar artillery.. and a wounded soldier..

So stop propagating Israeli propaganda as if it was true.
According to Syria general command ,There was never also an Iranian drone at all..
israel simply used that excuse to justify their agression on Syria.
Israel simply tried to attack Syria Military base to slow down their progress..
and go their ass kicked by Syria..

here explain , the reality of the Israel attack.. it was a total failure.. the first one and the second one.

https://syrianperspective.com/2018/02/zionism-terrorism-the-proof-is-in-the-pudding-american-troops-in-a-cia-death-wish-pandemonium-in-terrorist-ranks.html

Vann7 wrote:
People need to take with a big grain of salt Israel claims..
they are 98% propaganda and 2% facts.. This is not the first F-16 that Syria shutdown..
they always cover their damages with technical problems. malfunctions or simply deny it..
What happens is that israel fly their planes either outside Syria territory from standoff
position or only for a few minutes , hit and run.. not allowing Syria army enough time
for their airdefenses to calculate the interception data...

Israel is claiming only lost 1 plane now.. but reality is 3 combat jets lost..

Israel says it hit many airdefenses in Syria.. but Syrian army deny it..
and claims most of israel attacks where INTERCEPTED by their airdefenses..
and the only damages they got ,was a depot of mortar artillery.. and a wounded soldier..

So stop propagating Israeli propaganda as if it was true.
According to Syria general command ,There was never also an Iranian drone at all..
israel simply used that excuse to justify  their agression on Syria.
Israel simply tried to attack Syria Military base to slow down their progress..
and go their ass kicked by Syria..

here explain , the reality of the Israel attack.. it was a total failure.. the first one and the second one.

https://syrianperspective.com/2018/02/zionism-terrorism-the-proof-is-in-the-pudding-american-troops-in-a-cia-death-wish-pandemonium-in-terrorist-ranks.html

"What happens is that israel fly their planes either outside Syria territory from standoff
position or only for a few minutes , hit and run.. not allowing Syria army enough time
for their airdefenses to calculate the interception data..." - Dem Israelis are so stupid, they should fly in diamond formations over Damascus.

Also, did I understand this correctly: if Syria says something, it must be true. Kk, convincing. They never do propaganda or exaggerate enemy casualties, nope. That settles it, thanks.

Kimppis wrote:Also, did I understand this correctly: if Syria says something, it must be true. Kk, convincing. They never do propaganda or exaggerate enemy casualties, nope. That settles it, thanks.

Syria Government have far better record , that ISIS supporters..  
There is no question about this... Almanar News.. if you don't want to take Syria government
claims , Also shows a totally different picture of what Israel propaganda claims..

To defeat an airdefense in Syria , like PAntsir or BUK you need a line of sight and a visual
sight of the target. because they are mobile air defenses..  This means that Israeli aiforce will have to
fly withing very dangerous close visual distance in order to hit their targets and this also a HUGE
Risk of losing a pilot and that he is later captured for humiliating even More Israel.

Not even Russia airforce fly withing visual distance of their targets , in ISIS positions. They use special
forces/drones to guide their missiles.. or free fall bombs ,while flying in a straight line above their targets. Israel have no special forces in damascus with lazer designators to guide any missile.. ok?

So the only realistic way for israel to achieve any precision in Damascus over mobile targets is with lazer guided missiles ,because they can't stay too long over Syria airspace.. TV Guided missiles are easily jammed its signals.. so don't work. Radio guided missiles will not work either for electronic jamming. And GPS guided missiles will only work against STATIC targets.. but they are not very precise. All said.. the real precision capability of Israel in Syria.
should be similar of the one of the Americans with Cruise missiles and GPS..
which was only 30% of effectiveness with 70% of their missiles lost.   But the Syrian Army general command is saying that they intercepted most of Israeli missiles in their severals waves.. and hit multiple planes.. including drones and combat jets. So if we are to believe in Syrian army and other sources.. which have been more consistent in their losses... then only about 10% of Israel attacks hit their intended targets.. but without enough precision and without major damages.. only in static targets..   With dynamic Airdefenses ,like Pechora, Pantsir and buks , that constanly move their positions , Israel have ZERO Change  to defeat. Because their planes will not know where the air defenses are.. satelite images will always show an outdated position.  dynamic air defenses can use passive radars.. that are not detected by Israel airforce..or any radar..  and also Russia air defenses ,and Radar.. can become the EYES.. of Syrian army air defenses.
So how is Israel going to know where are Syria air defenses newest position ,if they constantly move them?

Not even Russia can defeat easily Mobile airdefenses.. this is why their combats planes fly very high altitude over ISIS positions ,they lost planes in Georgia war.  Mobile airdefenses are a pain in the ass to defeat..you need very low flying attack hellicopers fkying over damascus for that if they constanly move or israeli special forces with line of sight and lazer target designators ,aiming in real time every movement of the missiles.. so Israel claims are fantasy at best.

To hit stationary targets is the only chance Israel have..in stadoff long distance attacks.. with weak precision. using GPS missiles.. but Syria government said ,they intercepted most israel missile attacks over damascus too..

lie about their damages and exxagerate the effectiveness of their attacks. They did this in Hezbola -Israel war..
that Israel claimed that their losses were significantly smaller , than reality .

GPS armed missiles ,like Cruise missiles is not accurate enough. As the attack of Americans proved on Syria military base. That was running withing 2 hours after the attack after cleaning the dust ,contrary to the American version
that the base was "completely destroyed".


Is  also worth to mention that Syria don't need radars at all..in general terms ,which Israel claim they also "destroyed".
in vast majority of cases..  This is because Russia military base can be the Eyes.. of Syrian air defenses..
So unless Israel attack Russian base ..and defeat those radars and S-400 , then Israel have ZERO chance
to blind Syria air defenses.. ZERO chance. Unless they bomb Russia airbase.  So i bet none of the zombies
though about that?   So Syria only need missiles to be in constant motion in Syria ,and launch them ,and then
continue moving.. because all the missiles can be safely guided from Russia military base. safely.. So what did Israel really bombed is the question?  If they disable airports ,or run ways.. then perhaps ,that will delay things abit..
for syria.. just 24 hours of repairs and the show will continue. All things said.. israel have no way to effectively
Neutralize Syrian airdefenses.. until they have boots on the ground ,with laze designators.. Something that they dont
have in damascus at least or central Syria ,where the attacks happened. in  Syria borders is a different story.
But even if they had this .. which they don't.. Russia can resupply more mobile cheap defenses to Syria ,like modernized pechora and the fighting will continue.

So in summary Israel can't defeat with its airforce Syria Mobile Air defenses.. Wishful thinking.
and neither they can blind Syrian Radars..because they can use Russian radars
that are safe in Russia military base..

So this means that israel airforce in reality do not have real goals with their attacks.. that could change things
in their favor.. Since Russia military can resupply endlessly Syria military with new missiles ,when they used ,
and can be the eyes of Syria air defenses.  you need boots in the Ground to take territory in Syria ,take their military bases in order to really limit Syria possibilities to defend their nation or their airspace.  Probably Israel real goals is to
pressure Russia to capitulate in their support for Assad. Because their airforce attacks alone will not win any war.
and will only achieve they losing planes.. and teaching Syria and IRAN and hezbolah how to master the shutdown their planes.

Vann7 wrote:

Kimppis wrote:Also, did I understand this correctly: if Syria says something, it must be true. Kk, convincing. They never do propaganda or exaggerate enemy casualties, nope. That settles it, thanks.

Syria Government have far better record , that ISIS supporters..  
There is no question about this... Almanar News.. if you don't want to take Syria government
claims , Also shows a totally different picture of what Israel propaganda claims..

To defeat an airdefense in Syria , like PAntsir or BUK you need a line of sight and a visual
sight of the target. because they are mobile air defenses..  This means that Israeli aiforce will have to
fly withing very dangerous close visual distance in order to hit their targets and this also a HUGE
Risk of losing a pilot and that he is later captured for humiliating even More Israel.

Not even Russia airforce fly withing visual distance of the planes , in ISIS positions. They use special
forces to guide their missiles.. Israel have no special forces in damascus with lazer designators
to guide any missile.. ok?

So the only realistic way for israel to achieve any precision in Damascus is with lazer guided missiles ,because
they can't stay too long over Syria airspace.. TV Guided missiles are easily jammed its signals.. so don't work.
And GPS guided missiles will only work against STATIC targets.. but they are not very precise. All said.. the real
precision capability of Israel. should be similar of the one of the Americans with Cruise missiles and GPS..
whic was only 30% of effectiveness.   But the Syrian Army general command is saying that they intercepted
most of Israeli missiles in their severals waves.. and hit multiple planes.. including drones and combat jets.
So if we are to believe in Syrian army.. which have been more consistent in their losses... then only about 10%
of Israel attacks hit their intended targets.. but without enough precision and without major damages.. on static
positions that is..   With dynamic Airdefenses ,like Pechora, Pantsir and buks , that constanly move their positions , Israel have ZERO Change  to defeat. Because their planes will not know where the air defenses are.. satelite images will always show an outdated position.  dynamic air defenses can use passive radars.. that are not detected by Israel airforce..or any radar..  and also Russia air defenses ,and Radar.. can become the EYES.. of Syrian army air defenses.
So how is Israel going to know where are Syria air defenses newest position ,if they constantly move them?

Not even Russia can defeat easily Mobile airdefenses.. this is why their combats planes fly very high altitude over ISIS positions ,they lost planes in Georgia war.  Mobile airdefenses are a pain in the ass to defeat..you need very low flying attack hellicopers fkying over damascus for that if they constanly move or israeli special forces with line of sight and lazer target designators ,aiming in real time every movement of the missiles.. so Israel claims are fantasy at best.

To hit stationary targets is the only chance Israel have..in stadoff long distance attacks.. with weak precision. using GPS missiles.. but Syria government said ,they intercepted most israel missile attacks over damascus too..

lie about their damages and exxagerate the effectiveness of their attacks. They did this in Hezbola -Israel war..
that Israel claimed that their losses were significantly smaller , than reality .

.
.  GPS armed
missiles ,like Cruise missiles is not accurate enough. As the attack of Americans proved on Syria military base.
That was running withing 2 hours after the attack after cleaning the dust ,contrary to the American version
that the base was "completely destroyed".

"To defeat an airdefense in Syria , like PAntsir or BUK you need a line of sight and a visual
sight of the target. because they are mobile air defenses.. This means that Israeli aiforce will have to
fly withing very dangerous close visual distance in order to hit their targets" - Why exactly? Why would someone need to be in visual range to strike Pantsir or Buk exactly? Ever heard of anti-radiation missiles or...about any PGM out there?

"using GPS missiles" - Delilah is using CCD with GPS + INS. Its precise as far as Precision goes. Popeye INS plus IIR. Also... "weak precision"... seriously..

" TV Guided missiles are easily jammed its signals." - TV guided missiles are basically out of use in Israel. And they are not easy to jam, not sure where and who told you that.

The article linked by Bann says some interesting things, bolded in green, about which I commented also here:

According to my sources, the Zionists thought they had a free corridor in Lebanon and could fire their missiles at airbases in Syria with impunity.  Some Zionist bombers even flew over Southern Syria where their pilots, if need be, could eject into friendly terrorist territory.

The Syrian High Command had already been given the okay by President Michel Aoun of Lebanon to fire at Zionist aircraft flying in Lebanese airspace.  When one F-16-S flew over South Lebanon and was detected by SAA radar, an S-300 was fired right at it and struck the jet dead on almost killing the two-rodent crew.  The aircraft, due to its attitude and altitude, crashed into Occupied Palestine in the Galilee near the Arab town of Umm Al-Fahm.  In addition to this,  Zionist aircraft flying over the Hawraan in Syria, fired missiles at SAA bases but almost all the projectiles were intercepted and destroyed before they could reach their intended targets.  Another bomber flew over Lebanon in an attack on Jamraayaa northwest of Damascus, but, the aircraft were only successful in delivering their bombs to areas surrounding the town.  My source, Monzer, writes that another Zionist jet was struck by air defense missiles fired from Brigade 22 which is 3 kms north of Lake ‘Utayba.  The news of that strike is still being investigated.

1.- Lebanon becomes no-fly zone for hostile aircrafts.

https://www.russiadefence.net/t7040p350-russian-military-involvement-and-aid-to-syria-12#211746
https://www.russiadefence.net/t7040p350-russian-military-involvement-and-aid-to-syria-12#211756

PapaDragon wrote:

eehnie wrote:..............

Also, is likely to see, a new joint Russia-Lebanon Joint Air Defense command.

Why would Russia fiddle with Lebanon? Especially now when they got everything they wanted in east Med?

There is nothing in Lebanon.

2.- Presence of the S-300 in Syria. The article says a S-300 shut down the Israeli aircraft. Right? Then the question is: Russian or Syrian? And the next question is: Has Syria S-300?

https://www.russiadefence.net/t5518p775-syrian-civil-war-news-11#187991
https://www.russiadefence.net/t5518p775-syrian-civil-war-news-11#188065
https://www.russiadefence.net/t5518p775-syrian-civil-war-news-11#188070
https://www.russiadefence.net/t5518p775-syrian-civil-war-news-11#188081

KoTeMoRe wrote:

Militarov wrote:

eehnie wrote:

d_taddei2 wrote:i know it was a couple of weeks ago when Israel bombed Syria again, but the question i have to ask is Syrian air defence really unable to deter Israeli aircraft? surely the systems below that Syria has (although in what numbers i dont know now since the war) can deter or shoot down Israeli aircraft. The most modern/effective systems in place are Sa-24, Pantsir and BUK

systems currently in use.

Sa-7
Sa-14
Sa-16
Sa-18
Sa-24

Sa-6
Sa-8
Sa-9
Sa-13
BUK
ZSU-23-4
Tunguska
Pantsir

Sa-2
Sa-3
Sa-5
(and possibly rumours of S-300)

They are reports with declarations of high range Russian officials that say that some unit of S-300 has been delivered to Syria.

https://www.rt.com/news/361586-russia-s300-supplied-syria/

Also there are new of some israeli F-16 shut down in Syria by S-300.

https://sputniknews.com/middleeast/201609131045249097-syria-israel-warplane-downed/

Never happened.

1. Was simply S-300 transferred to Russian contingent.
2. Indeed never happened. Once again, to Bomb Mezzeh, they don't need to cross the border. They do it only for high stakes. Basically not since 2013.

He keeps spreading BS.

And this onea is an epic quote of the same time. To note that Israel is attacking the Russian-Syrian Joint Air Defense Command.

https://www.russiadefence.net/t5518p775-syrian-civil-war-news-11#188096

Papadragon wrote:

KomissarBojanchev wrote:Can we all agree that Russia shouldn't negotiate with Israel and should fund hezbollah since it's fighting against al qaeda, while the pissrael is aiding it and killing civilians additionally on its own?

Israel is non belligerent country towards Russia. A reliable partner all things considered and given the average rating.

Hezbollah is pro Iranian group. They should receive funding from Iran. Same Iran that keeps trying to screw Russia over, from airliner sales to Hamadan base and Tartus lease, even though they were supposed to be allies.

I say Russia should keep doing same thing they have been doing so far: staying out of stupid, irrelevant crap that they have no use of.

Militarov wrote: Why would someone need to be in visual range to strike Pantsir or Buk exactly? Ever heard of anti-radiation missiles or...about any PGM out there?

"using GPS missiles" - Delilah is using CCD with GPS + INS. Its precise as far as Precision goes. Popeye INS plus IIR. Also... "weak precision"... seriously..

" TV Guided missiles are easily jammed its signals." - TV guided missiles are basically out of use in Israel. And they are not easy to jam, not sure where and who told you that.

Anti Radiation missiles will not know the difference between a refrigerator with a decoy ,and a real airdefense..
This is why.. you need real Physical EYES to differentiate fake targets from the real ones.. So you need
Boots on the ground.. israeli special forces with lazer target designators ,correcting every missile trayectory..
This is how Russia targets anything with precision in Syria.. with Russian special forces correcting the trayectory
of any missile. but also with drones aid.

Decoys can be made to have 100% identical radiation signature of any air defense system. and even look
from satellites like the real thing.



decoys no only fake electronic signature.. (which is what active radar guided missiles chase) ,they also
can fake heat signature too. and look identical to the real thing.

So the question is.. How can Israel know ,they hit ,something in Syria?
How can they confirm if their attacks were successful or not? without visual confirmation to verify they
hit the target and that the target was real and not fake ?

The answer is obvious..they have no way to know.
Unless they have boots on the ground ,very close to Syria military bases in damascus to verify things..
but they don't.

In fact.. all of damascus.. have to be a minefield of thousands of electronic/heat decoys .. to confuse electronic /heatseeking missiles from israel.. This is why you need boots on the ground (special forces )to properly guide missiles.
This is what Russia is doing to target terrorist positions.. with boots on the ground. Israel don't have special forces
in any part of damascus. Drones could replace Boots on the ground ,but they need to be very close to the air defenses
to really know if it is real or a dummi fake.. and drones are easy to intercept for Syria. So don't fall for Israel propaganda..  The best chance they will have is with static buildings , storage depots.. and runways to disable them.
But their success with Syria airdefenses will be next to zero.. if they are in constant motion.. and without boots on the ground correcting the trajectory of the missiles.

Russia is very aggressive in the use of decoys ,this is part of their air defenses package .. and it will be
silly if Russia did not used this cheap tactics to help Syria fool its enemies.

reality check..Vast majority of syria airdefenses that they lost in the past ,were destroyed not by israeli airforce. but by Terrorist (boots on the ground ) using suicide bombers trucks..

d_taddei2 wrote:With the loses to SAA air defences I wonder if Russia will resupply them with more Buk Sa-5 or Sa-3. T

nope, you think why Netaniahu called Russia?