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78 posters

    Russian special military operation in Ukraine #16

    d_taddei2
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    Post  d_taddei2 Sun May 15, 2022 1:28 am

    diabetus wrote:
    d_taddei2 wrote:@diabetius u stated "That's nonsense. An AK is better at every conceivable role save for sniping. An AK firing semi auto with iron sights is far more effective at defending buildings at realistic ranges than a mosin with irons is."

    Clearly you have zero military experience and majority of your comments are BS hence I have u on ignore enough said.

    @regular you stated "
    It's evident they won't be doing armed school cop duty and will be part of an offensive on an ever-changing battlefield. SVD is superior to any bolt action there is in ANY ROLE, even in sniping"

    Yet again its clear u have no military experience or weapons intelligence. SVD is a marksman/battlefield rifle it isn't superior at anything other than that role. It's certainly not superior to sniping as you claim it cannot match the accuracy of a bolt action sniper rifle and it cannot match the range and accuracy of a 12.7mm sniper rifle. I actually fired a Dragunov in Ukraine back in 2014 (happy to show you the pic) on the same day also a mosin nagant carbine. Ask yourself if the SVD is superior to any other weapon in any role as u state then every Russian would be armed with one and nobody would be armed with assault rifles and sniper rifles, LMG, etc. Your comment was pretty dumb to be honest. Every weapon has it's purpose and it's advantages and disadvantages.

    Sigh. You need to learn how to read. A mosin (or SVD) is not better at any role than an AK is with iron sights. You can't see far enough to make a use of the ballistics of the full sized 7.62 round. I've served and continue to serve in an army for almost a decade, if you really think a mosin is a superior infantry rifle (not a sniper rifle with optics, and it probably is inferior as a DM rifle with optics) then you have no idea what you're talking about. I don't care if you've shot something at a range. This is settled as assault rifles have replaced bolt action rifles for just about every role. If you disagree, do some basic research after you lay off the drugs you take.

    You're arguing that soldiers with iron sighted mosins are better off than they would be with AKs. Think about the foolishness of such a statement.

    As I said u have no military experience clearly the only thing you have been serving is more than a decade in mental health secure unit, taking vast amounts of meds and copium. Your comments on this forum are troll like and full of nonsense. I confirmed everything I have claimed in my past in this forum with evidence. Currently u have zero. Have done any FIBUA training????? Clearly not. Maybe u should enlist and doing some actual training and I don't mean on call of duty like where u got your current experience. Also learn how to use an iron sight while your at it.

    Ur Back on the ignore list again

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    Erk
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    Post  Erk Sun May 15, 2022 1:30 am

    mnztr wrote:
    Erk wrote:
    mnztr wrote:Former Chinese ambassador to Ukraine - Russia will lose war:

    https://asiatimes.com/2022/05/rethinking-ukraine-in-china/

    Kinda alarming as it is not likely that these guys would speak out unless it was approved by Beijing. Seems like some message that China may be losing confidence in Russias ability to win.
    Since when does a former ambassador have enough military experience to come up with value judgements like "lousy performance"? He probably doesn't even know what a war of attrition means. More than likely he has made enough Ukrainian contacts to get paid handsomely to make such unfounded media statements.


    Its very possible he has access to Chinese intel as this guy was up there in the party. If ANYONE knows what a war of attrition looks like its the Chinese. Remember Korea? I doubt someone like this would make open statement without Chinese govt approval. Even the Russians admit they are losing the propaganda war.

    The article is nothing but propaganda.
    CGTN have English speaking Chinese war correspondents on the ground near the frontline of Donbass.
    Watch their reports instead of reading that garbage.

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    GunshipDemocracy
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    Post  GunshipDemocracy Sun May 15, 2022 1:32 am

    Erk wrote:
    Since when does a former ambassador have enough military experience to come up with value judgements like "lousy performance"? He probably doesn't even know what a war of attrition means. More than likely he has made enough Ukrainian contacts to get paid handsomely to make such unfounded media statements.


    Couldn't agree more. IMHO "former" here is the key. For something he was fired... perhaps lost his compass or was openly pro western. BTW Asia Time is NOT any Chinese official news outlet just a joint investment of thai and hk banker.

    Then next we can worry about Russia's horoscope? Same info value more fun tho.

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    GunshipDemocracy
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    Post  GunshipDemocracy Sun May 15, 2022 1:45 am

    ATLASCUB wrote:You ask for a cease-fire to give your proxy room to breathe and get its shit in order to continue the defense and the objective at hand.

    Aka you fish for idiots... cause once in a while you'll catch one. Now, if you don't throw the bait at all, you'll never give yourself the chance of catching an idiot or two. Given Russia's historical record this century, fishing for idiots inside the Russian leadership is a no brainer.

    A practice in competence.


    and what are you on about?

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    flamming_python
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    Post  flamming_python Sun May 15, 2022 1:47 am

    Arkanghelsk wrote:

    I mean we have streams and streams of all kind of equipment

    And where has it gone?...


    Hopefully not all neatly lined up for another artillery barrage to get it dunno

    I must say whatever the story is with all these river crossings and the Moskva and everything else, whatever the actual casualties, there are clearly enough incompetents around in the officer corps to fill some penal battalions with. And the penal battalion is very much a practice we need to bring back. Give the LDNR and Chechens a break from being sent into to storm urban fortresses.

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    d_taddei2
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    Post  d_taddei2 Sun May 15, 2022 1:55 am

    Regular wrote:
    d_taddei2 wrote:
    @regular you stated "
    It's evident they won't be doing armed school cop duty and will be part of an offensive on an ever-changing battlefield. SVD is superior to any bolt action there is in ANY ROLE, even in sniping"

    Wasn't SF, haven't seen real action, never deployed, and haven't killed a person (or so I hope). I served many years in Mechanised forces, infantry, and then in "stay-behind" irregular forces and had many nasty service rifles. For me first of all, service was just work and not a firing range fun.

    We had M16A2, AK-4 and Polish AKM (Not beryl on tantal, but we had Beryls in armory) Not sure if I have weapons intelligence, just weapon common sense I guess? Most of the colleagues in my army thought that AK-4 was Kalashnikov as well, but it didn't stop them from scoring at targets better than me clown My favorite service rifle was AKM, even if it was older than me, but like 99,9% of everyone else who used other rifles they preferred it. Especially when it came to storming buildings and rappeling. Imagine we had to do it with AK-4 too. Who was training for KFOR had M16A2 and I better not say anything about this rifle.

    I never shot Mosin or SVD, but I have shot M14/21, and vehicle-mounted M2, not an expert on these.

    SVD is a marksman/battlefield rifle it isn't superior at anything other than that role.

    I will disagree, people who have dropped terrorists for a living have praised SVD for being a superior rifle to anything they used

    Video title is "SVD is a weapon of real battle" and it touches on this subject about bolt-actions


    Not sure if it has English Subtitles, but youtube should be able to generate them. They talk about eliminating targets while using backup iron sights on SVD as well and they praise its rapid-fire rate, and quick target acquisition, good optics. Sniper said that in real-life conditions they have made/witnessed shots that would be in the category of controlled competition shooting with bolt-actions, not that in real life they need such accuracy all the time.

    It's certainly not superior to sniping as you claim it cannot match the accuracy of a bolt action sniper rifle and it cannot match the range and accuracy of a 12.7mm sniper rifle.

    12.7 sniper rifle is very niche weapon, no denying in it's benefits, but in real-life SVD will excel in almost all cases apart from anti-material function. Range is something that you can't comfortably choose when fighting in a unit. You support them at any distance when shit hits the fan. There is a reason why SVD had bayonet lug.

    Also, my comment wasn't saying that SVD should replace all AK rifles, but rather they should replace Mosin ones, like when the Soviets did this in what, 1967-1968.

    Specific snipers working in tandem can have Lobaev "Bentley" rifles for what I care. 12.7mm, even 30mm autocannons or whatever they can lift, but not the infantry squads that can be told to take attack, defend and do anything HQ wants basically.

    As previously stated no evidence u have served although I have proven on this forum of service and any claims I have made. Secondly I see your backtracking slightly. It was a very foolish claim to make that the SVD is superior in ANY role, because clearly it's not as I pointed out. And u then agreed with such as 12.7mm. thirdly not all mosin have iron sights some actually were issued with scopes. Also if your well trained in using an iron sight then you can still hit targets 600-800 if Ur not then 400-600. Bolt actions are more accurate than self loading rifles due not having to deal with the bolt moving back an forth hence why sniper rifles 7.62mm upto 12.7mm are 99% of the time bolt action. In fact the Finnish used their old stocks of mosin are upgraded then into more modern hunting /sniper rifles (can't remember the name they called them) when the British army got rid of the SLR many complained that the sa-80 lacked power, and accuracy. The SAS refused to use it and continued to use the SLR. The mosin isn't useless ideal for Defense in urban warfare, not so great for attacking in urban areas or assaulting enemy positions in the field. These troops were most likely being put into Defensive positions in buildings, Russia and donbass militia aren't short of SKS, AK's.

    As for SVD it's doesn't Excel as an assault rifle, nor a highly accurate sniper rifle. As previously stated its role is as a marksman/ battlefield rifle. This was what it was designed for to units an extended range weapon but that could still deliver a reasonable rate of fire if needed. Russia have used them for decades while the western didn't use such rifle but opted for a true sniper rifle a bolt action 7.62mm rifle. The marksman/battlefield rifles never really took off in the western until Afghanistan where western units were working alongside eastern European armies who were still using SVD and soon found how useful they were in that environment. The west then started investing more into these types of rifles. SVD is a good weapon for what it was designed to do but it's certainly not superior in ANY ROLE as u stated. The SVD and especially it's sight needs more training than a mosin nagant rifle does. The mosin round packs a serious punch much more than the AK-47 7.62x39, the mosin uses 7.62x54R and Dragunov uses it as well. I have fired M-4, AKM, AK-74, Sa-80, mosin carbine, and Dragunov and I can tell you the mosin and Dragunov had some serious kick. Ukrainian solders have been getting issued various types of body armour so using more Powerful calibres is a good idea.

    I would also say liking and backing up diabetus only serves to discredit u.

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    flamming_python
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    Post  flamming_python Sun May 15, 2022 2:08 am

    This argument about the Mosin-Nagant is academic

    They were literally dished out to hastily mobilized school teachers and such

    These aren't trained marksmen. They're civilians who at the most might have a little experience from the first war 8 years prior but would be pretty out of practice by now. More likely though, they're just ordinary civilians.
    I mean I'm sure these rifles are used in defense of buildings, with attempts at all sorts of interesting tactics. But for people with that level of expertise, they'll be better off with AKs, and defend or advance the good old fashioned way - by attaining firepower superiority. Rain enough fire onto the advancing enemy and he won't be able to get closer. Rain enough fire onto an enemy in defense and you'll pin him and then you can get closer. That's why assault rifles are versatile and noob-friendly.

    To hit even a target 300m away consistently with any sort of weapon, you need a lot of time spent at the range already. And BTW any AK apart from the most abysmal Bulgarian copy is perfectly accurate enough up to at least that range.
    If we're talking about ranges beyond 300m, then any weapon that maintains accuracy to 400-800m is fabulous, but useless for most people. You'll need a scope on the rifle, that you'll need the training, nerves and so on to be able to use effectively, you'll need to know how to keep the scope zero'd, and so on and so on. Not that I even saw scopes on those rifles.

    What a bolt-action rifle is good for as well though, is to teach the fundamentals of shooting. So I guess, it might be an interesting way to get the mobilized reserves through a baptism of fire. So long as you don't stick them anywhere too hairy. And then better issue them with AKs afterwards, unless they prove to be fantastic shots.


    Last edited by flamming_python on Sun May 15, 2022 7:30 am; edited 1 time in total

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    Post  diabetus Sun May 15, 2022 3:05 am

    flamming_python wrote:This argument about the Mosin-Nagant is academic

    They were literally dished out to hastily mobilized school teachers and such

    These aren't trained marksmen. They're civilians who at the most might have a little experience from the first way 8 years prior but would be pretty out of practice by now. More likely though, they're just ordinary civilians.
    I mean I'm sure these rifles are used in defense of buildings, with attempts at all sorts of interesting tactics. But for people with that level of expertise, they'll be better off with AKs, and defend or advance the good old fashioned way - by attaining firepower superiority. Rain enough fire onto the advancing enemy and he won't be able to get closer. Rain enough fire onto an enemy in defense and you'll pin him and then you can get closer. That's why assault rifles are versatile and noob-friendly.

    To hit even a target 300m away consistently with any sort of weapon, you need a lot of time spent at the range already. And BTW any AK apart from the most abysmal Bulgarian copy is perfectly accurate enough up to at least that range.
    If we're talking about ranges beyond 300m, then any weapon that maintains accuracy to 400-800m is fabulous, but useless for most people. You'll need a scope on the rifle, that you'll need the training, nerves and so on to be able to use effectively, you'll need to know how to keep the scope zero'd, and so on and so on. Not that I even saw scopes on those rifles.

    What a bolt-action rifle is good for as well though, is to teach the fundamentals of shooting. So I guess, it might be an interesting way to get the mobilized reserves through a baptism of fire. So long as you don't stick them anywhere too hairy. And then better issue them with AKs afterwards, unless they prove to be fantastic shots.

    Well said.
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    Post  diabetus Sun May 15, 2022 3:07 am

    d_taddei2 wrote:
    diabetus wrote:
    d_taddei2 wrote:@diabetius u stated "That's nonsense. An AK is better at every conceivable role save for sniping. An AK firing semi auto with iron sights is far more effective at defending buildings at realistic ranges than a mosin with irons is."

    Clearly you have zero military experience and majority of your comments are BS hence I have u on ignore enough said.

    @regular you stated "
    It's evident they won't be doing armed school cop duty and will be part of an offensive on an ever-changing battlefield. SVD is superior to any bolt action there is in ANY ROLE, even in sniping"

    Yet again its clear u have no military experience or weapons intelligence. SVD is a marksman/battlefield rifle it isn't superior at anything other than that role. It's certainly not superior to sniping as you claim it cannot match the accuracy of a bolt action sniper rifle and it cannot match the range and accuracy of a 12.7mm sniper rifle. I actually fired a Dragunov in Ukraine back in 2014 (happy to show you the pic) on the same day also a mosin nagant carbine. Ask yourself if the SVD is superior to any other weapon in any role as u state then every Russian would be armed with one and nobody would be armed with assault rifles and sniper rifles, LMG, etc. Your comment was pretty dumb to be honest. Every weapon has it's purpose and it's advantages and disadvantages.

    Sigh. You need to learn how to read. A mosin (or SVD) is not better at any role than an AK is with iron sights. You can't see far enough to make a use of the ballistics of the full sized 7.62 round. I've served and continue to serve in an army for almost a decade, if you really think a mosin is a superior infantry rifle (not a sniper rifle with optics, and it probably is inferior as a DM rifle with optics) then you have no idea what you're talking about. I don't care if you've shot something at a range. This is settled as assault rifles have replaced bolt action rifles for just about every role. If you disagree, do some basic research after you lay off the drugs you take.

    You're arguing that soldiers with iron sighted mosins are better off than they would be with AKs. Think about the foolishness of such a statement.

    As I said u have no military experience clearly the only thing you have been serving is more than a decade in mental health secure unit, taking vast amounts of meds and copium. Your comments on this forum are troll like and full of nonsense. I confirmed everything I have claimed in my past in this forum with evidence. Currently u have zero. Have done any FIBUA training????? Clearly not. Maybe u should enlist and doing some actual training and I don't mean on call of duty like where u got your current experience. Also learn how to use an iron sight while your at it.

    Ur Back on the ignore list again

    It must hurt to be this clueless.
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    Post  diabetus Sun May 15, 2022 3:12 am

    Regular wrote:
    Arkanghelsk wrote:https://t.me/uvznews/2068

    Uralvagonzavod has put this bad boy into service,  what say all of you ?

    30 mm module unmanned, day/night channel, and 30mm GL for escorting logistics

    На видео – управляемый боевой модуль БМ30-В  «Спица».  АО ЦНИИ «Буревестник» #КонцернУВЗ производит его  уже серийно!

    Предназначен для установки на бронированные машины сопровождения и охраны специальных грузов.  

    Необитаемый модуль башенного типа с круговым вращением оснащен 30-мм автоматической пушкой и 30-мм гранатометом, имеет прицел с дневным и ночным каналами. Обзор поля боя и управление модулем экипаж осуществляет дистанционно, с автоматизированных рабочих мест.




    This modular turret is amazing and it needs to go on BMP-1/BMP-2/BTR-80/82A.

    Fully digital, multi-axis stabilized, would be great to fit actual thermal optics as well, much better than the BPPU-1 turret with the 2A72 30mm, not as bulky as BTR-BM one too.

    Would love to see ATGM mounted on it.

    Russian special military operation in Ukraine #16  - Page 4 Image27

    So it does not currently have a thermal gunners sight at least?
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    Post  Arkanghelsk Sun May 15, 2022 3:14 am

    Why would Secretary of Defense of USA call Shoigu?

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    Post  PapaDragon Sun May 15, 2022 3:19 am

    Arkanghelsk wrote:Why would Secretary of Defense of USA call Shoigu?

    Trailer for Avatar 2 dropped that day, maybe he wanted his opinion?

    It looks great IMO


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    Post  Big_Gazza Sun May 15, 2022 5:12 am

    mnztr wrote:Even the Russians admit they are losing the propaganda war.

    Source pls? Suspect

    Russia isn't fighting a propaganda war, they are too busy mulching the Ukronazi military. The triggering of progressive liberal millennials on Twatter doesn't win wars. Razz

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    Post  mnztr Sun May 15, 2022 5:39 am

    Big_Gazza wrote:
    mnztr wrote:Even the Russians admit they are losing the propaganda war.

    Source pls? Suspect

    Russia isn't fighting a propaganda war, they are too busy mulching the Ukronazi military.  The triggering of progressive liberal millennials on Twatter doesn't win wars. Razz

    The point of the Chinese ambassadors comments is that modern war is multi dimensional. Propaganda is part of EVERY modern war. If you are losing the propaganda war it does not mean you will lose the war, but it sure as hell will be harder to win. If the Russians were more adept at propaganda there would be less support for Ukraine and less hatred against Russia. You think Finland and Sweden joining NATO is a win?
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    Post  sepheronx Sun May 15, 2022 5:46 am

    mnztr wrote:
    Big_Gazza wrote:
    mnztr wrote:Even the Russians admit they are losing the propaganda war.

    Source pls? Suspect

    Russia isn't fighting a propaganda war, they are too busy mulching the Ukronazi military.  The triggering of progressive liberal millennials on Twatter doesn't win wars. Razz

    The point of the Chinese ambassadors comments is that modern war is multi dimensional. Propaganda is part of EVERY modern war. If you are losing the propaganda war it does not mean you will lose the war, but it sure as hell will be harder to win. If the Russians were more adept at propaganda there would be less support for Ukraine and less hatred against Russia. You think Finland and Sweden joining NATO is a win?

    That isn't propaganda though. That is controlled governments.

    You think EU doesn't controll their subjects? Finland is part of that. Sweden too and always had a Hate for Russia. If you truly believe what you say, then I'm sorry but there is no hope for you as you are as blind as those who believe the propaganda.

    Reality is, no one outside of the West's grasp believes the propaganda that is being spewed. Only the EU and their people and even then, most don't believe it. You will be surprised how many people in North America knows its bullshit cause they have zero trust in their open media and it shows by their ratings and viewership.

    Propaganda or not, it does nothing. Even if every single person rose up to demand a stop to this in let's say England and to build better relations with Russia, the government will not do it. Why? Because the people have no power in those countries. Mine included. We have seen the results of protests throughout Europe and how it was crushed hard by authorities with absolute abuse (randomly water cannon some passerby in Denmark).

    There will always be people who hate Russia. There will always people who hate black people or brown people pr Asian people or whatever.

    Doesn't matter. What matters is that Russia does its job and completes the conflict.

    Majority of US didn't want the Afghanistan war especially for as long as it lasted. Constant protests about it. Didn't stop it. They left because it was no longer sustainable.

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    Post  sepheronx Sun May 15, 2022 5:56 am

    diabetus wrote:
    d_taddei2 wrote:
    diabetus wrote:
    d_taddei2 wrote:@diabetius u stated "That's nonsense. An AK is better at every conceivable role save for sniping. An AK firing semi auto with iron sights is far more effective at defending buildings at realistic ranges than a mosin with irons is."

    Clearly you have zero military experience and majority of your comments are BS hence I have u on ignore enough said.

    @regular you stated "
    It's evident they won't be doing armed school cop duty and will be part of an offensive on an ever-changing battlefield. SVD is superior to any bolt action there is in ANY ROLE, even in sniping"

    Yet again its clear u have no military experience or weapons intelligence. SVD is a marksman/battlefield rifle it isn't superior at anything other than that role. It's certainly not superior to sniping as you claim it cannot match the accuracy of a bolt action sniper rifle and it cannot match the range and accuracy of a 12.7mm sniper rifle. I actually fired a Dragunov in Ukraine back in 2014 (happy to show you the pic) on the same day also a mosin nagant carbine. Ask yourself if the SVD is superior to any other weapon in any role as u state then every Russian would be armed with one and nobody would be armed with assault rifles and sniper rifles, LMG, etc. Your comment was pretty dumb to be honest. Every weapon has it's purpose and it's advantages and disadvantages.

    Sigh. You need to learn how to read. A mosin (or SVD) is not better at any role than an AK is with iron sights. You can't see far enough to make a use of the ballistics of the full sized 7.62 round. I've served and continue to serve in an army for almost a decade, if you really think a mosin is a superior infantry rifle (not a sniper rifle with optics, and it probably is inferior as a DM rifle with optics) then you have no idea what you're talking about. I don't care if you've shot something at a range. This is settled as assault rifles have replaced bolt action rifles for just about every role. If you disagree, do some basic research after you lay off the drugs you take.

    You're arguing that soldiers with iron sighted mosins are better off than they would be with AKs. Think about the foolishness of such a statement.

    As I said u have no military experience clearly the only thing you have been serving is more than a decade in mental health secure unit, taking vast amounts of meds and copium. Your comments on this forum are troll like and full of nonsense. I confirmed everything I have claimed in my past in this forum with evidence. Currently u have zero. Have done any FIBUA training????? Clearly not. Maybe u should enlist and doing some actual training and I don't mean on call of duty like where u got your current experience. Also learn how to use an iron sight while your at it.

    Ur Back on the ignore list again

    It must hurt to be this clueless.

    Judging by your post right after this one, you are in no position to call anyone clueless.

    The man served in an actual army. You didn't. You are a couch warrior with no skills but plenty of time to waste trolling this forums which I might add is also against the rules.

    I'll ask GarryB or George to clean up this thread with all the nonsense. I know if I still had my mod privileges like I did years ago, I would be handing out suspensions for a week for the trolling going on here.

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    Post  ALAMO Sun May 15, 2022 6:24 am

    Arkanghelsk wrote:I am not giving my opinion on t90 vs t72, I post what Uralvagonzavod released on their own channel
    They said white house is working to stop UVZ, but they will continue to work, and posted t90M
    The old world is done, it's gone, the very orientation of Russian defense companies has shifted due to world changes
    Russia will no longer depend on exports, and domestic orders will increase
    I will not be surprised to see all orders fulfilled and additional orders placed and filled in secret
    The time of disclosing Russian orders is gone.
    The west will have no idea how many t90m or su30 or su57 are in the works right now
    And none of that info is available to guys on the internet
    If the West thinks they can declare war in Russia and depend on Russia happily announcing orders and figures for equipment they are so wrong its not even funny

    Always wonder why one cares to explain to the trolls scratch
    UVZ is the biggest tank producer in the world, and working nonstop since the breakup of the SU.
    They have open lines, skilled staff, newly established production lines, know-how, and technology. They can fulfill hundreds of tanks order in a relatively short time, and the number of T-90 that is close to 2000 pcs at the moment speaks for itself.  Not to mention the simultaneous program of T-72 and T-80 modernization, which gives several dozens of tanks each year.
    Each ministry report about the fulfillment of GosZakaz is pure insanity, as they call literally 150-200 tanks each year, both new build and refurbished, and that is all being supplied with budget spending on pair with France.
    Not a single new M1 was delivered to US troops in the last 30 years or so, and the Lima factory is just a shadow of itself, keep breathing due to the Trump's direct order 3 years ago. The whole "production power" used to be one refurbished tank a month, and the donors are taken from the scrapyard.
    Europe can be considered a tank production superpower, as the last Leclerc was out of the factory "only" 15 years ago. And KMW still "produces" or refurbishes some Leopards ...
    Someone who is questioning the Russian capability of scaled military production is either troll, or stupid.
    Russkies can produce tenfold the numbers NATO can supply at the moment, at 1/10 of the price. When KMW tells the Ukrs that they can supply the Pzh2000 in 2026, they are bloody serious - there is no production at the moment, and it needs to be re-established if needed.
    I suppose that the whole army of engineers from Africa is waiting out there in refugee camps to build modern weaponry at any moment.
    They have a waste of experience in producing the world's scariest weaponry which is a stick with a dog's poo at the end.

    Hole wrote:I´m always laughing when reading statements like: "NATO is stronger then ever now!", "Finland and Sweden joining NATO means defeat for Putin!", "More troops on Russias border then before Putin´s demands!"
    The offer last December was made to keep peace. Pull back your military where it were in 1997. Neutrality for Ukraine. Lets talk about arms contron treaties and so on.
    This is off the table now. Russia doesn´t care anymore if there are more western troops at her borders or if Finland with his pathetic 26.000 soldiers joins NATO.
    Her hands are untied now. The dogs are unleashed, baby.
    In the next years Russia will field Tsirkon missiles on board every ship and sub that is capable of launching this sort of missiles + all Bastion complexes will get them, too.
    The follow-on to Iskander will receive Kaliber-M and Tsirkon missiles and a new quasi-ballistic missile with multiple stages.
    New hypersonic missiles for tactical and strategic aircraft will be fielded.
    S-500 and other air/missile/space defence systems will appear.
    These statements from the west remind me of a little kid whizzling in a dark cellar.

    They will start with two-stage Iskander, to get a MRBM targeting European assets - at the moment, the stupidity of Gorbi erased a very serious strategic advantage they had with Pioniers etc.
    And yeah, I find it funny, too. Triumphing about how the NATO will become stronger due to the fact, that two small nations in the north will change a de facto NATO membership for de iure membership Laughing Laughing
    Dude, Russkies will be soon 500+ km closer to London, but it does not matter anyway, as they can strike the whole continental Europe with a tactical weapons, not leaving their own borders. A buffer zone in Ukraine will be demolished, Russia-China alliance is a fact, and Iran is acting as a guard of the Russian belly.

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    Post  OminousSpudd Sun May 15, 2022 6:39 am

    https://t.me/intelslava/28857


    Russian special military operation in Ukraine #16  - Page 4 Screen12

    Makin' bacon in Azovstal


    Last edited by OminousSpudd on Sun May 15, 2022 6:42 am; edited 1 time in total (Reason for editing : low effort posting)

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    Post  Regular Sun May 15, 2022 7:02 am

    Russian special military operation in Ukraine #16  - Page 4 Image64

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    Post  ALAMO Sun May 15, 2022 7:29 am

    Regular wrote:Russian special military operation in Ukraine #16  - Page 4 Image64

    Oh, a new Eurovision jury came to the scene! Laughing

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    Post  Vann7 Sun May 15, 2022 7:47 am

    Big_Gazza wrote:
    Look forward and keep your eyes on the prize.  The only way Russia can loose this is if they lose focus and allow the West to dictate the terms of engagement.  Ignore those cnts and treat them with the contempt that they so richly deserve Twisted Evil


    The way for Russia losing this..

    1) that all their generals , do not tell the truth to putin ,how their tactics against ukraine are terrible
    and needs to be significantly modified .  Russia needs to achieve real air superiority , other wise those endless waves of kamikazi ,attack and artillery guide drones , will cause hundreds of thousands of dead russian soldiers , because russia will never catchup with nato alliance production capabilities of modern artillery ,drones and intelligent missiles , like those fire and forget , ai Brimstone missiles..
    that will only increase the destruction rate of russian military armor , add increase the pain of putin's army.

    2) that everyone in the internet continues praising bad tactics and incompetence of russian military.. is only with pressure , and feedback and telling the truth , how can the russian military correct their mistakes..  having yes man generals around a already poor leadership of russia will only make things worse.  If they not told what they doing bad,, how are they suppose to ever learn ?  

    3)russia failing to achieve air domination and air superiority , is russia major weakness. this is what zelensky was crying in first week ,he wanted to stop russia and he got it.. no longer russia flight hellicopters in the many dozens any place in ukraine.  the russian military don't have at all any air superiority and likely never will have , if they don't get their shit together and change their tactics.

    russia needs many thousands of super cheap drones ,that their sole function is to simulate the flight of orion attack drones or even orlan-10 and intentionally lure ukros army ,to hit them , with manpads and s-300s airdefenses.

    The more manpads ukraine fire , the more air defenses missiles they waste in fake targets , the less russian drones and real combat jets will be shotdown and the more ukraine will be out of missiles..
    this is not rocket science.  Russia have decoys and drones, but the problem is that they don't use them properly and don't mass produce them and use them in the right numbers to make a difference  

    if future wars , artillery will become obsolete , when nations manage to build super intelligent cheap drones in big numbers , with AI to do swarm saturation attacks ,that operate without human intervention are aware of enemy armor .  brimstom missiles already can do that ,, missiles that choose their own targets.. this is going to increase the pain of russia in a noticeable way ,russia military in the battle field, when all those columns of tanks caught in the middle of a group of brimstone missiles attack searching for armor .  Russia needs missiles like that . all this tactics of just capturing territory by just scorching earth ,that most of the missiles fails to hit any real target is not very efficient. neither from capturing point of view ,neither from winning wars.. in 21 century , it didn't worked well for armenia. drones will rule the battle field ,. period and russia needs to completely stop ukraine from using the airspace and keep ukraine soldiers heads hidding under ground , they can achieve that with far superior efficiency using modern drones in big enough numbers.   loitering munition for example , produce a big sound to scare everyone making them to believe the drone will hit them..  so just one drone can keep a hundred of soldiers heads down , for fear of being them the target..  this doesn't happen with artillery.  artillery don't keep flying around a zone , scaring enemy forces , forcing them in the run or to hide, .. intelligent drones can choose targets and keep searching ,while forcing enemy armies to seek cover.   ukraine do have the superior weapons to win the war in an efficient way..  russia only way could do that is scorching earth tactics , destroying entire cities with civilians inside , not leaving a single building standing.. Russia cruise missiles will not win a war , and russian artillery alone either is too slow ,specially if they don't receive permanent real time intel of enemy moving positions , something that only can be achieved by having a strong drone air support 24 hours a day above their soldiers positions.



    Last edited by Vann7 on Sun May 15, 2022 7:54 am; edited 1 time in total

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    Post  Serberus Sun May 15, 2022 7:53 am

    Terminators spotted, reportedly near Severodonetsk.
    https://t.me/swodki/95820

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    Post  Hinex1988 Sun May 15, 2022 8:15 am

    🇷🇺🇺🇦Briefing by Russian Defence Ministry

    ▫The Armed Forces of the Russian Federation continue the special military operation in Ukraine.

    💥High-precision air-based missiles of the Russian Aerospace Forces have hit 2 command posts, 11 company strongpoints and 4 ammunition depots of AFU near Zaporozhye, Paraskovievka, Kostantinovka and Novomikhailovka of the Donetsk People's Republic.

    ✈💥Operational-tactical and army aviation have hit 32 areas of AFU manpower and military equipment concentration.

    ▫2 S-300 anti-aircraft missile launchers and 1 radar post near Shpilevka, Sumy Region, have been destroyed.

    💥Missile troops and artillery have hit 6 command posts, 123 areas of manpower and military equipment concentration, and 13 AFU artillery batteries at firing positions.

    ▫The attacks have resulted in the elimination of more than 150 nationalists and up to 26 armoured and motor vehicles.

    💥Russian air defence mean overnight shot down 15 Ukrainian unmanned aerial vehicles near Novotroitskoe, Vladimirovka, Petrovskoe, Luganskoe of the Donetsk People's Republic, Yepifanovka, Kudryashovka, Verkhnyaya Duvanka of the Lugansk People's Republic, Chkalovskoe, Velykie Prokhody, Vyshee Solenoe in Kharkov Region and over Snake Island.

    ▫In addition, 1 Tochka-U tactical missile was intercepted near Stepnoe, Kherson Region, and 11 Smerch multiple-launch rockets were intercepted near Kamenka, Malaya Kamyshevakha, Brazhkovka, Kharkov Region, and Chernobayevka, Kherson Region.

    📊In total, 165 Ukrainian aircraft and 125 helicopters, 879 unmanned aerial vehicles, 306 anti-aircraft missile systems, 3,098 tanks and other armored combat vehicles, 381 multiple launch rocket systems, 1,525 field artillery and mortars, as well as 2,934 units of special military vehicles were destroyed during the operation.

    #MoD #Russia #Ukraine #Briefing
    @mod_russia_en

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    Post  Vann7 Sun May 15, 2022 8:20 am

    OminousSpudd wrote:https://t.me/intelslava/28857


    Russian special military operation in Ukraine #16  - Page 4 Screen12

    Makin' bacon in Azovstal

    this is interesting..

    they provoking special fire in the the plant , to poison the air ,that feeds the ventilation tubes the nazis underground will receive , in just one week doing this , they might end surrendering many of them not ready to die for zelensky , to avoid asphyxia.

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    Post  pavi Sun May 15, 2022 8:25 am

    Mig-31BM2 Super Irbis-E wrote:
    Scorpius wrote:
    Mig-31BM2 Super Irbis-E wrote:We gave the north to the east to make it better in the east. But it moves very slowly and it even goes back in some places. Nothing happens towards Odessa.

    To give up the north thinks a serious mistake. Now nothing happens on the Odessa Front and it doesn't go better in the east.

    When is there any significant progress?
    What will be a significant progress for you?

    The formation of Keselln and their destruction. That is what weakens big armies and keeps your own losses low.

    6 weeks ago, cutting from north to the south would have been my plan and thus prevent everything from the west.

    What is the plan now? I don't see any, about you? And please, don't come with careful procedure and Bla Bla.

    Deep blows ? air strikes? Do you only see a fully packed MIG-31BM?

    Anyone who plays with the handbrake attracted loses this operation!

    Cutting Ukraine from western border is quite a task. The border with NATO is more than 1000 km long and you ould only supply it from Belarus. You would need to secure both fronts border with NATO and one with western Ukraine. That would endanger your troops for massive cauldron.

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