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    Russian special military operation in Ukraine #15

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    ALAMO


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    Post  ALAMO Fri May 13, 2022 6:56 am

    flamming_python wrote:
    Well if those are the T-72Ms Poland handed over. Even if they are, they wouldn't account for more than 10% of the total of 200 handed over.

    It accounts for perfectly zero %.
    T-72M1R is factory new modernization and the Polish Army own a whole 19 pcs of those tanks, all in the 19. and 20. Armored Brigades.
    All were delivered a year ago, and new ones are on their way. Nobody will give it to the Ukraine, as the 19th Brigade is set for contingent in Latvia next year on.

    sepheronx wrote:
    M777A2 was captured.

    Wow, faster than usual Shocked Laughing Laughing


    Last edited by ALAMO on Fri May 13, 2022 7:21 am; edited 1 time in total

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    Post  sepheronx Fri May 13, 2022 7:09 am

    mnztr wrote:
    sepheronx wrote:

    If it was true, it would have been reported everywhere, even reverse side of the medal.

    Nothing.


    It was reported on Reuters. Attempting a major river crossing with no air power backup? If this happened the commander should definitely be relived and be peeling potatos for the rest of the war.

    And Reuters doesn't lie?  And where was their source from? Same one as this photo?  Also, close ups of the destroyed equipment or just the few drone shots?  Any markings?

    I got a bridge to sell you.

    Reuters also published fakes from Navalny regarding Putins mansion. Want to debate if that was real?

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    Post  ALAMO Fri May 13, 2022 7:15 am

    sepheronx wrote:
    And Reuters doesn't lie?  And where was their source from? Same one as this photo?  Also, close ups of the destroyed equipment or just the few drone shots?  Any markings?

    I got a bridge to sell you.

    Reuters also published fakes from Navalny regarding Putins mansion.  Want to debate if that was real?

    Well, there is some whining by the Russian telegrammers about that, but ...
    I can see a vanilla BTR-70 or 80 there, some BMPs, some T-72s ... so everything that the Ukrainian army has ...
    But not a single piece of hardware the Russkies own. Not even BTR-82.
    Sure, we can consider that those are republican wreckage, but ... they are advancing from the other direction there.

    And we have multiple reports about Ukrainians trying to cross the river several times, all attempts beaten off.

    What a coincidence, mind you? Laughing

    Telling the opposite story to the audience? Checked!

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    Post  TMA1 Fri May 13, 2022 8:17 am

    The propaganda war is the most intense I've ever seen it. Hundreds and hundreds of millions being funnelled thru NGOs and favors being pulled. So many here in the west have swallowed it hook, line and sinker but I'm starting to notice actual pushback. I remember as a young man being fooled by the WMD in Iraq nonsense and it is just more theatre. UK politicos and journalists in particular have been especially toxic with misinformation and even outright lies. Not absolving our fake journalists here though thry are nearly on the same level.

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    Post  sepheronx Fri May 13, 2022 8:23 am

    ALAMO wrote:
    sepheronx wrote:
    And Reuters doesn't lie?  And where was their source from? Same one as this photo?  Also, close ups of the destroyed equipment or just the few drone shots?  Any markings?

    I got a bridge to sell you.

    Reuters also published fakes from Navalny regarding Putins mansion.  Want to debate if that was real?

    Well, there is some whining by the Russian telegrammers about that, but ...
    I can see a vanilla BTR-70 or 80 there, some BMPs, some T-72s ... so everything that the Ukrainian army has ...
    But not a single piece of hardware the Russkies own. Not even BTR-82.
    Sure, we can consider that those are republican wreckage, but ... they are advancing from the other direction there.

    And we have multiple reports about Ukrainians trying to cross the river several times, all attempts beaten off.

    What a coincidence, mind you?  Laughing

    Telling the opposite story to the audience? Checked!

    Thank you.

    I also mentioned more than once the pontoon bridge videos that Russian mod released of them being struck by Russian missiles.

    I'll just leave it to the drones to believe as they wish.

    I just watched the movie Network in it's entirety for the first time. This movie was released in 1975 but it's ever more truthful now than ever before. Or it's just that nothings changed. But it more or less breaks down that people growing up in front of a TV only understands that. No critical thought, no emotions beyond what they tell us how we should feel at the moment and just follow the broadcast. This is entirely the same thing just with internet now. And it's still hook line and sinker.

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    Post  GarryB Fri May 13, 2022 8:28 am

    This 3962 is the KIA figure for all of Russia extrapolated from the Yakutia results and some generous allowances for unconfirmed killed and KIA in other branches. I'd say this estimate tends towards the upper bound. In reality, the KIA can be anything from 3200-4200 or so right now.

    Interesting exercise, but not particularly useful because you are therefore asserting that soldiers killed from one specific region in Russia equates to the number of soldiers killed from other regions at exactly the same rate, which is not obvious and of course not likely... unless the soldiers are deployed based on where they come from and get dangerous or safe jobs to form a normal distribution of deaths across Russia as a country.

    70k for Ukrs?

    Why so ridiculously high?

    The fact that they are killing their own and counter attacking into artillery and air power suggests a rather high attrition rate... and lack of care by Kiev regarding its conscripts and civilians alike.

    Yakuts don't overrepresent the Russian military significantly from my knowledge, that's why they're a good choice. They're a typical Siberian region in terms of representation

    But we are not talking about the entire Russian military... just the troops in Ukraine, which are predominantly naval and VDV and other forces from specific regions... so the demography is unlikely to be homogenious...

    Russia would be wise to develop something similar for artillery.

    Looks like a copy of what Russia developed instead of Excalibur.

    According to some Indian journalists, Ukranian officers have commented in their circles that Javelin proved almost useless in urban fighting because it needs some clear airspace near shooter to climb high and something was always getting in the way

    Overhead lines would be a problem...

    They can just use direct fire mode...

    Which makes them a bigger heavier bulkier Metis-M1 with less penetration.

    Yet it pains me to see Su-34s and Su-24s having to overfly their targets rather than tossing their bombs 10km from the target.

    Toss bombing is an attempt to increase the standoff range where the bombs can be released to keep the bomber out of MANPADS range... but bombing from an altitude of 10km does the same thing with rather better precision.

    Didn´t the glorious plan of the west include some decade long insurgency? With all those weapons that the Russians capture,
    this insurgency will turn out to be a fiasco, like the army of Molotov cocktail throwing civilians

    Important to keep in mind that caches of weapons and ammo like that was not a hijacked truck with this stuff on it... it is more likely an intercepted ambush team either captured or wiped out to then collect up their weapons and equipment for these photos...

    Apparently a Russian telegram channel claims that the bridgehead destroyed vehicles are Russian, and that the Russian command kept trying to send vehicles 3-5 times. All were destroyed.

    Does Navalny have a Telegram channel?

    Better accuse Boris Rozhin and call him a ukrainian troll. Given that certain users called Rybar of all people a ukrainian propagandist, I wouldnt put it past them to do the same with Rozhin.

    Have noticed a Russian trait... PD probably has the Serbian version of it where any story that appears bad about their own government or military they tend to believe even without evidence... FP has the same problem too, as do you Limb and I suspect these two sources probably would follow the same pattern.

    There are reports that the russians still haven't managed to force the severskiy donets near Belogorovka, so this falls in line with their attempts being massaacred.

    Lots of places they haven't moved... so I guess they are being mass slaughtered because as we have already discussed they don't need to move around the place... letting the Orcs come to them gets through the ammo just fine...

    Stupid shit happens. In 1991 Serbian army tried to enter into city of Vukovar with tank column that didn't have any infantry support. Similar happened in Grozny. I could name dozens of stupid mistakes that proffesional officers make, that wouldn't be made by sergeants. Best way to deal with it is too replace commanders that made those calls and make sure they don't happen anymore.
    War is the best way to separate wheat from the chaff.

    Yeah, but demanding Putin be fired and the Russian military all go too because you read about some made up shit on the internet is the real gem of western propaganda at its finest... hope they are paying you good money... because your defeatist BS is really earning it for them.

    This is why I hate appeals to authority that somehow officers and generals on the field know what theyre doing

    Almost as bad as anonymous people on the internet demanding people be fired when they don't know what is happening...

    Keep saying it... if is the biggest word in the English language and sadly the most abused.

    But then butchering the meaning of English words is a tradition that the US and EU has perfected over the centuries and decades...

    I thought corruption in the russian army was stamped out so that repeats of grozny would never happen.

    You think the Russians were paid to do this?

    Also fact that theres so many destroyed BMPs by the pontoon bridge can be explained that the river banks are steep and muddy, and the river current is too fast, so fording the river would very dangerous.

    Yeah... they always plan to cross rivers where it is steep and muddy because if there is one Army on the planet that is fucking stupid when it comes to river crossings it is the Russian Army... obviously Rolling Eyes

    Sit front on to your PC camera... can't see your swastika properly...

    You can't slowly cross a choke point like a river crossing though unless you're able to have lots of air coverage like multiple attack helos orbiting ahead and something like an ac-130 too.

    With snorkles and amphibious vehicles a river is no longer a choke point... anywhere with relatively shallow banks can be crossed.

    I kind of doubt the Ukrainians had resources and time to drive vehicles up and destroy them in order to pass them as Russian vehicles. We have to use Occam's razor here. What's more likely? Russian commanders in this sector were retards and squandered a BTG in 3 ambushes withput proper recon and air support, or Ukrainians parked their own vehicles in a way to pretend like they're doing a river Crossing, and then destroying/abandoning them?

    It is the Orcs presenting the information, which suggests it was made up by the Orcs... they might have taken photos of vehicles that were destroyed in 2014-2015...

    The rivering crossing looks real by all standards, But if the commander lost his BTG trying the same shit three times.....who the **** gave that Buffon a command position

    Like seriously and they are doing bad against Ukraine, against NATO the russians would get their teeth kicked in with this level of performance

    And if you believe that I have a bridge for sale...

    Russian IFVs are amphibious for a reason... their tanks can snorkle for a reason... if one crossing failed why the **** would you try again in the same place let alone try three times.... it is the Orcs trying to pretend that the Russians are incompetent... if they were then why are the orcs doing so badly... they outnumber these dummies three to one and have the bestest western military equipment including Stingers and ATGMs... it should be a cake walk for them... if they are telling the truth... but why would they start telling the truth now?

    It was reported on Reuters.

    Reuters is a well known western intel compromised lie factory.

    I got a bridge to sell you.

    He wants my bridge... back off dude... What a Face

    Not absolving our fake journalists here though thry are nearly on the same level.

    The irony is that the key to a free and fair democracy is an independent and inquisitive media... the CIA has spent the last century infiltrating and corrupting media in the east and the west and everywhere else and made a joke of real democracy... and no one in the west gave a shit... well now we have to live with it.

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    Post  andalusia Fri May 13, 2022 9:03 am

    Just saw this on Yahoo just wanted to ask this forum is this true?

    https://www.yahoo.com/news/putin-precious-war-plan-left-181218351.html
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    Post  nomadski Fri May 13, 2022 9:05 am

    Mnztr wrote " It was reported on Reuters. Attempting a major river crossing with no air power backup? " well the Tanks and APC are most vulnerable to ATGM on the River bank and also remember Ukraine has US satellite info and laser guided arty . The only use armour has now , is protect against small arms fire . They may be viewed as a handicap . Might as well use Rubber dingy and infantry to cross deep Rivers . Put Kevlar armour around exposed sides of Rubber dingy , and give good body armour to infantry , to protect against small arms fire . Dingy may even be able to carry other " heavier "  equipment , such as light  Mortars , ATGM , Motorcycles and quads . A kind of River crossing light . Air power alone does not win wars . You need Boots on the ground . Can use arty instead of planes , to clear Beach - head for landing operation . Saves planes . Repeat same tactic on lowland , deep Rivers , towards Odessa .


    Edit : type of craft for lowland transport : Hovercraft and air-boat and light planes and chopper with flotation devices and specialist mud crossing vehicles , mud - hoppers .......was waiting for opportunity to post link


    https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mudskipper

    Edit : Quads / bikes could tow the dingy or small boat , after crossing River , on dry land . A symbiosis !

    https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=CME7xeA-Kcc

    https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=e-FogNs9DHI

    Cheap !





    Last edited by nomadski on Fri May 13, 2022 11:46 am; edited 3 times in total
    Isos
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    Post  Isos Fri May 13, 2022 9:30 am

    andalusia wrote:Just saw this on Yahoo just wanted to ask this forum is this true?

    https://www.yahoo.com/news/putin-precious-war-plan-left-181218351.html

    Print it. That's some good toilet paper.

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    Post  PhSt Fri May 13, 2022 9:30 am

    andalusia wrote:Just saw this on Yahoo just wanted to ask this forum is this true?

    https://www.yahoo.com/news/putin-precious-war-plan-left-181218351.html

    Clearly this is a redacted copy, Putin actually wanted to extend his conquest to Mars Laughing

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    Post  Hinex1988 Fri May 13, 2022 10:00 am

    ⚡Briefing by Russian Defence Ministry

    ▫The Armed Forces of the Russian Federation continue the special military operation in Ukraine.

    💥High-precision, long-range sea- and air-based weapons on the northern outskirts Kremenchug, Poltava region, have destroyed the production facilities of an oil refinery and tanks with petrol and diesel fuel intended to supply Ukrainian forces' military equipment.

    ✈💥Operational-tactical and army aviation have hit 153 areas of concentration of manpower and military equipment.

    ▫2 Ukrainian Grad multiple-launch rocket launchers and 1 US-made air defence warning and indication radar have also been destroyed near Kharkov.

    💥Missile troops and artillery units have hit 15 command posts, 520 areas of manpower and military equipment concentration, 6 artillery units at firing positions, and 1 missile weapons depot near Shebelinka, Kharkov Region.

    💥Russian air defence means have shot down 1 Su-27 aircraft of the Ukrainian Air Force near Lozovaya, Kharkov Region.

    ▫Additionally, 15 Ukrainian unmanned aerial vehicles have been shot down in the air near Balakleya, Malaya Kamyshevakha, Bolshie Prokhody, Borovskoe, Prudyanka and Volokhov Yar in Kharkov Region, Topolynoe and Pavlovka in Zaporozhye Region, Yevgenovka, Yasinovataya, Yegorovka, Puteprovod, Avdeevka, Panteleimonovka and Krutaya Balka in Donetsk Region.

    ▫2 Ukrainian Smerch multiple-launch rockets have been also shot down over Topolskoe, Kharkov Region.

    📊In total, 165 Ukrainian aircraft and 125 helicopters, 842 unmanned aerial vehicles, 304 anti-aircraft missile systems, 3,032 tanks and other armored combat vehicles, 368 multiple launch rocket systems, 1,491 field artillery and mortars, as well as 2,869 units of special military vehicles were destroyed during the operation.

    #MoD #Russia #Ukraine #Briefing
    @mod_russia_en

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    Post  Erk Fri May 13, 2022 12:07 pm

    mnztr wrote:
    sepheronx wrote:

    If it was true, it would have been reported everywhere, even reverse side of the medal.

    Nothing.


    It was reported on Reuters. Attempting a major river crossing with no air power backup? If this happened the commander should definitely be relived and be peeling potatos for the rest of the war.

    True, it looks like a major stuff up, here is some detail

    https://southfront.org/russian-led-forces-suffer-heavy-losses-attempting-to-cross-river-in-bilohorivka-lpr-photos/

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    Post  JohninMK Fri May 13, 2022 12:24 pm

    An interesting Drive article on a new arrival at Snake Island. Ignore the rest of the article Laughing Laughing Laughing

    "a Russian Navy Project 02690 self-propelled crane barge moored at its small dock.

    The crane barge in the image, which The War Zone obtained from Planet Labs and was taken on May 12, is almost certainly SPK-46150."


    Russian special military operation in Ukraine #15 - Page 34 Crane-at-snake-island

    https://www.thedrive.com/the-war-zone/russian-crane-barge-appears-at-hotly-contested-snake-island

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    Post  Isos Fri May 13, 2022 12:31 pm

    JohninMK wrote:An interesting Drive article on a new arrival at Snake Island. Ignore the rest of the article Laughing Laughing Laughing

    "a Russian Navy Project 02690 self-propelled crane barge moored at its small dock.

    The crane barge in the image, which The War Zone obtained from Planet Labs and was taken on May 12, is almost certainly SPK-46150."


    &auto=webp&optimize=high&quality=70&width=1920[/img]

    https://www.thedrive.com/the-war-zone/russian-crane-barge-appears-at-hotly-contested-snake-island

    That's pretty dumb yo move any stuff there. Ukrainians already succeeded to attack this position and once they get more tb2 thry will come back and sink that valuable barge.

    This island is useless. Just mine it so no one can take it and bomb it if it is taken.

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    Post  Stealthflanker Fri May 13, 2022 12:32 pm

    So there are still people in the island, and they're not Ukrainians. for certain.

    In case Russia -wants- to take the island they will have to increase air covers and maybe, actually land to try occupy possible Ukrainian artillery positions and possible UAV launch sites.


    For the barge tho.. well we'll see if it will actually survive. Ukrainian maybe willing to expend at least 1 Tochka on it.
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    Post  LMFS Fri May 13, 2022 12:58 pm

    andalusia wrote:Just saw this on Yahoo just wanted to ask this forum is this true?

    https://www.yahoo.com/news/putin-precious-war-plan-left-181218351.html

    Why do you keep posting trash from Yahoo? Do you keep going to the restaurant, where the cooker shits on your plate or what?

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    Post  Podlodka77 Fri May 13, 2022 1:20 pm

    The pictures with the destroyed infantry fighting vehicles near Belogorovka are accurate and Juri Podolyaka (he is quite angry) also spoke about it. The complete battalion set with 73 units of military equipment was destroyed.

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    Post  flamming_python Fri May 13, 2022 1:28 pm

    SeigSoloyvov wrote:The rivering crossing looks real by all standards, But if the commander lost his BTG trying the same shit three times.....who the **** gave that Buffon a command position

    Like seriously and they are doing bad against Ukraine, against NATO the russians would get their teeth kicked in with this level of performance

    What's so special about NATO?

    What experience do the Polish, Romanians, Germans, French, etc... have in combined-arms operations?

    You look through military history and you'll find examples of this sort of incompetence all the time, on every side. This doesn't excuse it.

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    Post  Mir Fri May 13, 2022 1:30 pm

    Erk wrote:
    https://southfront.org/russian-led-forces-suffer-heavy-losses-attempting-to-cross-river-in-bilohorivka-lpr-photos/

    One of the pictures show a MTLB ambulance. It does appear to be the Ukrainian version with the raised roof >>
    The Russians don't seem to use this particular version.

    Russian special military operation in Ukraine #15 - Page 34 Mtlb-c10
    Russian special military operation in Ukraine #15 - Page 34 Mtlb-s12

    Early on in the campaign there was an image posted of a river crossing where you could see a Russian vehicle crossing over a submerged/damaged pontoon bridge with a (I think) a stuck T-72B3M dead in the water next to the pontoon. The T-72 in the drone picture looks to be in a very similar position?

    Russian special military operation in Ukraine #15 - Page 34 T-72-c10

    I think the Ukrs just added a few props to the scene?

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    Post  Arkanghelsk Fri May 13, 2022 1:41 pm

    SeigSoloyvov wrote:The rivering crossing looks real by all standards, But if the commander lost his BTG trying the same shit three times.....who the **** gave that Buffon a command position

    Like seriously and they are doing bad against Ukraine, against NATO the russians would get their teeth kicked in with this level of performance

    If NATO had taken 50,000 casualties, Joe Biden would not be only getting 40 billion dollars blocked right now

    It would be the 2nd coming of January 6

    And NATO would have given up long time ago

    Their planes would be shot down,  and they'd be doing the same shit as Ukros


    Actually they are the ones planning the war for Ukros with bright ideas from snake island, to Donbass defense

    So no NATO would get the floor wiped , and actually they wouldn't stick around for this kind of ass kicking

    They would have given the territory up long time ago , because they are little more sensible and materialistic than Ukrainians

    Ain't no westerner taking 50,000 deaths to hold onto Donetsk hahaha

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    Post  Hole Fri May 13, 2022 1:45 pm

    Russian special military operation in Ukraine #15 - Page 34 Fsm5e110
    I remind anyone here that the Nazis claimed they bombed the area. Quote: "Planes come in and started a heavy bombardement". What planes? Rolling Eyes
    Russian special military operation in Ukraine #15 - Page 34 Fsnrho10
    Russian special military operation in Ukraine #15 - Page 34 Fsodsx10

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    Russian special military operation in Ukraine #15 - Page 34 Empty Re: Russian special military operation in Ukraine #15

    Post  caveat emptor Fri May 13, 2022 1:46 pm

    GarryB wrote:
    Stupid shit happens. In 1991 Serbian army tried to enter into city of Vukovar with tank column that didn't have any infantry support. Similar happened in Grozny. I could name dozens of stupid mistakes that proffesional officers make, that wouldn't be made by sergeants. Best way to deal with it is too replace commanders that made those calls and make sure they don't happen anymore.
    War is the best way to separate wheat from the chaff.

    Yeah, but demanding Putin be fired and the Russian military all go too because you read about some made up shit on the internet is the real gem of western propaganda at its finest... hope they are paying you good money... because your defeatist BS is really earning it for them.
    Going ad hominem in response to other peoples messages shows that you don't have anything of substance to say. Better not say anything, in that case.
    You showed a tendency for such reactions. I suggest seeking a medical help Garry. Medicine has come a long way and your condition is treatable. Don't let it get out of hands.


    Last edited by caveat emptor on Fri May 13, 2022 1:49 pm; edited 1 time in total
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    Post  Hole Fri May 13, 2022 1:46 pm

    Russian special military operation in Ukraine #15 - Page 34 Fsnj_110
    Russian special military operation in Ukraine #15 - Page 34 Fsnkap10
    Russian special military operation in Ukraine #15 - Page 34 Fsnkaw10
    Moving by train

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    Post  Hole Fri May 13, 2022 1:47 pm

    Russian special military operation in Ukraine #15 - Page 34 Fsnz0f10
    Russian special military operation in Ukraine #15 - Page 34 Fsnz0o10
    Russian special military operation in Ukraine #15 - Page 34 Fsnze110
    Moving by Quad

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    Post  Hole Fri May 13, 2022 1:48 pm

    Russian special military operation in Ukraine #15 - Page 34 Fsnpt010
    Russian special military operation in Ukraine #15 - Page 34 Fsnpuy10
    Russian special military operation in Ukraine #15 - Page 34 Fsnzud10
    Ze Force

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