Russian special military operation in Ukraine #3

miketheterrible wrote:So much fake news constantly being spread here its getting tiresome and I may have to start blocking 90% of the people here who keep constantly replying to bitcoin since the mods can't seem to get it that everyone wants him gone for trolling.  

Hmm... I'm guilty as charged I'm afraid. I'll resist the urge from here on to peek at his latest brain-dead ravings, and won't be responding anymore. That rucking fetard simply isn't worth the time it takes to reply

'How can I make this about me?'

It effects the whole world... I would expect the US very much encouraged those Indian students to go to universities in the Ukraine and might have even paid them to get them to go there instead of Russia as part of its plans to turn India against Russia and China...

Now that this is happening I hope the Indian students notice the sort of help they get from the US when things go bad and what sort of allies they really are.

Mr Soros angry.
Mr Schwab angry.
Mr Rothschild angry.

Big V. made a lot of serious enemies.

And the current western leaders and western media hate him... he must be doing a good job then.

Note some posts on sanctions regarding Boeings and their effects etc shifted to thread in General discussion/Russia civil aviation  thread.

They were already enemies. Since Yeltsin was deposed Russia has been in the black book.

Actually a good indicator that he is doing the right thing by Russians.

Ukraine got some new drones.

Where was VVS to prevent this? I was told by the armchair generals on this forum that VVS would be zapping everything and not letting the big resupply happen.

Pretty unlikely they flew them in.

They needed more because the ones they had got shot down... how is more going to help?

I am getting extremely pissed off at the Russian government. They are allowing the Kiev regime to stall for time with their
phony "negotiations". Odessa is now open to a liberation attack but we have the clown show which involves moves for a ceasefire.
Give me a F*CKING break.

Stall what? Russian forces continue to move forward except in places they are negotiating surrenders of large population centres.

Negotiations with Kiev are meaningless in that regard.

I don't understand why you are not getting a permanent ban in this forum. You have already posted tons of garbage on this thread itself. Every second post of yours is how your fellow Indians are getting assaulted, killed in Ukraine.

Good evidence for those not from western countries how these so called democratic western allies treat the rest of the world... Indians being abused in Orcland is relevant to this thread and makes more sense than your complaints that such aspects not be discussed.

Why do you people travel to every single country to corner resources from locals and then complain about a retaliation? Stop coming to Russia, Ukraine, Belarus. Stay in your own country and you won't get killed. Get it?

That is what the west will be saying to Russian nationals very soon if not already... stay in your box and don't come out or we will kill you... fortunately the remaining 85%+  of the world is now open and much more appealing to Russia and Russians... and also Indians too...

It is the west revealing its nature to everyone and so the isolation might not go the way they are hoping it will.

Indians are clearly being beaten up or possibly being used as Human shields.
They have been now asked to go Russian controlled area for onward evacuation.

What the Nazis are doing in Ukraine will not be reported in the western media.

This shows that calling the Orcs nazis is fully justified and fully supported by pro western Russians... a faction Putin needs to communicate with and sort out if Russia is going to progress as well as it possibly can.

UNLESS, the slow progress is all about the Ukrainians waiting until Azov and other right wing elements are eliminated by the Russians, at which point its all systems go.

Imagine the situation of the Orc negotiators slipping notes to the Russian diplomats with coordinates for the locations of certain entities tying their hands, whose removal from those of us with breathing priviledges might facilitate more genuine and productive talks to be held...

This looks like a thermobaric blast. Was the target struck with an Iskander? Any idea?

Does look like a thermobaric blast... perhaps it was a biolab and they didn't want the Orcs to get dangerous bio samples they could use as a weapon....

As an aside... when you see a blast that size... never remain standing behind glass...

As mentioned it might also have been fuel or an ammo depot exploding... the initial boom was rather big though.

He was yelling at them that "I am a higher commander in chief!!", and they simply laughed. A sad view, to be honest.

Which is why this invasion was inevitable... sadly.

Russian needs to close the cauldron and end this Chechnya style circus. Ukraine is not going to negotiate in good faith. Won’t happen. Waste of time.

I rather suspect Kiev has little to no control of the forces of Ukraine anyway so any agreement they could possibly come to would in effect be a token agreement.... like Minsk.

After all, Russia doesn’t want Europe, it’s not the USSR. They only want NATO to roll
back to its pre-97 borders. They’re not demanding that Poland or the Baltics leave NATO.
They want no German, American or British soldiers there

When Soviet troops left eastern europe they expected british and french and us troops to leave too... instead they advanced... what message does that send?

The students should have left anyway. Worrying about getting their enrollment cancelled is a rather sad excuse. And the Indians shouldn't have trusted Ukrainians to attempt to allow them to leave in Ukrainian held areas or Poland. Both are well known for a long time being racist shitholes.

I rather suspect the US assisted in promoting they go there instead of Russian universities in an attempt to turn them against Russia...

The US is known for "helping" and leaving you hanging...

This is a big loss?

Not something to be happy about, but ten times less than some were claiming, and rather good considering all the factors and the situation.

1. A "Ghost of Kyiv" hoax circulated for days, even involving the notorious 4Chan phenomenon Sam Hyde (written in a vaguely Slavicized variant, with Ukrainian Cyrillic). A MiG-29 claimed 6 (or more) Russian jets over Kyiv.

It's been a week, and there is no corroborating data for even a single one.

A myth created with a flight simulator called DCS which was used to generate "video evidence" where none existed. A storyline was added and suddenly Marvel has a new character...

No confirmation to date, some 4 days later.

No confirmation because no confirmation is possible.

3. Intense dogfights over Ukrainian cities, with multiple shootdowns by Ukrainian fighters. Not a single wreck documented, not a single piece of guncam footage or anything. Some video game visuals have circulated (from Armed Assault/ArmA, and DCS World), some even published by official Ukrainian authorities, but that's it.

Suspect most Ukrainian aircraft destroyed on the ground and considering the huge fires seen at most of their airfields most of their fuel and ordinance is likely also gone too.

The thing is that it seems to me that the Russian Air Force actually didn't conduct any fixed-wing sorties over Ukrainian territory at all until 4-5 days into the conflict, after some SEAD operations. I could be wrong, but that's what it looks like to me. So literally everything claimed before yesterday appears false.

However, there are loads of photos and videos of aircraft being hit, aircraft crashing, aircraft being found as wrecks in fields. All of these videos have to date been confirmed to show Ukrainian ditto, and barring the occasional mechanical failure or whatever, my guess is that most losses probably involved friendly fire.

The orcs didn't have state of the art stuff, but they did have a Soviet air defence network and all the components, even though they are now dated and not really up to date in terms of really new systems like S-350 and S-400 and the new models of TOR and BUK and Pantsir.

Even without the latest stuff and all the new radars and combat management bits and pieces that makes it super dangerous the systems on their own are still very mobile and still rather dangerous on their own... how long did it take HATO to neutralise the air defences of Serbia during the Kosovo operation?

Well they didn't. The Serb air defence was dangerous from day one till the last day of the operation and they had old obsolete SAMs that lacked a decent level of mobility... the Orcs have much more mobile systems in much larger numbers.

Even without an IADS to connect to an SA-13 is dangerous to aircraft and drones and it will remain dangerous as long as it remains operational.

That is the difference between dealing with a third world country and a peer enemy power...

I would suggest HATO couldn't really operate safely over the Ukraine if they were the enemy either.

As sad as they are, if not pleased I am relieved they are so low.

Dito, but of course forming cauldrons is not the main source of enemy casualties... it is closing the cauldrons and "cooking" the contents that creates the casualties... depending on how the enemy get out and the friendly forces treat them... ie disarm and surrender... or grad, smerch and tos till they are crispy.

Impossible. Ghost of queef alone killed 6 million Russian pilots. Make that 7.

And that is the core problem with propaganda... you can't go backwards... so if he kills 6 planes in the first hours of the first day then after a week he needs to have killed 50 planes...

What was reported earlier was Ukraine had been given more drones and Ukrainian Bayraktar drone destroyed Russian self-propelled artillery piece in Trostyanets.

I wouldn't think they took a lot of artillery vehicles with them...

Or they thought the Ukrainian army would collapse quickly. Attacking a country with the size of Ukraine with 70,000 troops is a very strange idea?

70K troops against a 120K peer enemy with HATO help and training after 4-5 days with about 500 dead good guys... I would say that is a real credit to how those 70K good guys are behaving and performing.

I would not call Americans really educated when it comes to geography.

War hasn't touched them for so long it has become a game that doesn't hurt when you lose except in terms of pride.

Losing 13 soldiers to one bomb in Kabul and they think the withdrawal was a terrible defeat for their country and that staying was the best option despite the fact that they would be losing more than 13 soldiers to stay...

Another part of the problem is that when the cold war ended the west essentially closed their Russian studies departments in their universities and so the morons and muppets took those jobs as "russia" experts and all they knew was we won and they lost so they have to do what we tell them because that is what winning and losing is.

Until western academia starts to up its game and seriously study Putin and Russia with some intelligence and without the rose coloured glasses of victory on, things are not going to change.

The... I have no fucking idea about Russians and Russia so not letting them buy Iphones and blue jeans is going to break them when losing 30 million people during WWII didn't break them... all we need is more sanctions and they will be our puppies like the EU and UK and Australia and Japan and South Korea... they need to realise that just is not going to work and it is now being used to separate Russia from the west so it can openly offer itself as a real alternative to the west for China and the rest of the world... the rest of the world plus Russia has everything they need to grow and develop... including a total lack of colonial bullshit that comes part and parcel with any contact with the west.

You'll have to forgive me, but doesn't sanctioning Russia AND Belarus only serve to further solidify Russian and Belarussian ties?

That ship has sailed...

Putting that soviet flag, on the Verkhovna Rada would be the ultimate final insult to the EU/West, and its nazi's in the world everywhere.

I suspect that is part of the purpose of Nazi symbols being used in the Ukraine and indeed in Croatia and other places in the former Yugoslavia conflict... though obviously some believe in that BS there might be a few just trying to wind up the Russians/Serbs...

Russian combat choppers certainty seem to be tough little beast! It may be down, but its landed in one piece, rightside up, and crew is able to disembark safely. Thats an excellent (and uncommon) outcome for any rotocraft that takes damage while airborne

The rotors are attached so there was no need to eject. The aircraft is up off the ground so the undercarriage was deployed which means it is a landing and not a crash...

The Ribbentrop Pact was simply so he could buy time and invade Western Europe.
Stalin agreed, because the USSR was ill prepared to fight the Nazis at the time.

The Molotov-Rippentrop pact was about splitting Poland into two pieces and designating other areas of German interest and Soviet interest so they don't step on each others toes... Hitler didn't want the part of Poland that was Russia that they stole after WWI ended, so it was really just an agreement on sphere of interests.

It was essentially a non aggression pact... something allies would never need to have.

Though these days it is touted in the west as proof they were friends, while actual agreements made by Britain and other countries with Hitler before its invasion of Poland were no different.

going to purchase lead sheets, what thickness would be good or sufficient, near a big city here?

Honestly I would go find a strategically important thing to sit next to... these days people are so soft they wouldn't know how to make most of the stuff they take for granted and after the first few weeks the broken food distribution systems will mean food will rot where it is and where the people are food will run out real fast... and then you eat your pets and then your neighbours... it wont be pretty or fun.

If you are fit young and healthy you might be OK for a while but any serious injury or sickness and you will likely die a slow painful death.

Russians will look back at this time 20 years from now and thank the collective west for isolating Russia from their collective degeneracy.

And I think the rest of the world will be grateful for an alternative path that does not worship the deviant.

To be clear I have no problem with gays or people who are unsure of their sexuality, and I would defend such people if they were attacked either physically or verbally, but equally I don't think these people should celebrate what they are every year in some parade... there are no straight people parades where people celebrate being conventional... sexuality is a private thing anyway... people who want attention or acceptance are calling attention to themselves... they need to realise the attention they get will not always be positive and to their liking... I am not suggesting they should stay in the closet, but don't throw it in peoples faces either.

It's like the old Kenny Rogers and Gambler song... don't count your "score" until the war is over

My favourite version was the Muppet Version of that song...  

The west isn't all bad.

Could do with new management though....

I want to see Garry b and all the other clowns here try to spin giving a Torm2 away for free to Ukraine and than to the US for proper inspection.

Hahaha... looks like a vehicle being recovered... but by whom?

It is behind the Russian lines because TOR would not operate behind enemy lines on its own, so either these locals are trying to recover it or they are recovering it for the Russians... I suspect the normal follow up units that would normally recover such vehicles will thank them... either in 5.45mm or perhaps rubles depending on what it takes to get it back from them.

Now su34 shot down with photo evidence. Oh boy

Oh please... that might have been a campervan painted those colours and blown up... if it was an Su-34 then where are the engines and the titanium cockpit that would survive hours burning... lack of such photos suggests the claim is BS.

A bunch of freedom fighter volunteers are on their way to kiev right now.

Don't miss your flight.

Allegations of Rape camps and concentration camps are coming. I mean just touch up the script and the mindless March of Yellow Journalism continues.

They know exactly the accusations to make.... they often go to war and can just repeat the stuff they end up doing around the place for their media to broadcast... they certainly can't broadcast it when they do it.

I’m cheering for Russia friend since that’s where I’m from. Watching this incompetent shit storm is painful.

No, your inability to recognise Orc propaganda from fact is what is painful... but then you are likely immersed in it.

The city is not completely blockaded. And when they do blockade it. What’s the plan? Bomb it with artillery? Starve it out? How will they rule over it with those harsh measures?

They are not annexing the country... most likely once they have stability and the locals can take over they will leave most areas.

They might keep the nuclear facilities and manage them for the locals providing free power in return for control of the nuclear materials... there will likely be rather more than two new independent regions though they will likely be free to merge if they want.

I am pretty sure Crimea will expand to secure their new water source too but who can blame them for that?

Cleaning it out is going to be very painful with tons of Russian losses. I don’t see a game plan here.

So why would they bother, there would be no pay off to do such a thing.

Political leadership messed this up with their “fake invasion” narrative to where half of their deployed force is not ready to fight.

The invasion/occupation crap is coming from the west... listen to what Putin actually says, not what western media say he says.

Well you ask the civilian population to leave , then any resistance pocket can be remotely incinerated .

But why? Not Russias problem who occupies Kiev... the Ukraine is getting Yugoslavia treatment and some regions likely will always be openly hostile to Russia no matter what so I wouldn't even send any troops there... just monitor for threats and standoff weapon targets... like weapon shipments crossing borders etc.

If brains were dynamite the pair of them couldn't blow one nostril.

But is often amusing to see his attempts... a bit like watching Wile Coyote trying to get Road Runner... entertaining but ultimately futile and often self defeating.

Those neo-Nazis are financed by Soros. Lenin would say that they are "useful idiots".
All anti-liberal ideology is healthy, I respect historical fascism and its war against the West (Not so his war against communism, whose Stalinist variant was very good). You also have to distinguish between Fascism and Nazism (I didn't). The true problem is the liberalism and the fucking French revolution with its stupid rights that have led to the destruction of cultures and traditions.

The core of the problem is lack of discussion and ironically despite all their venom towards Putin because he does not tolerate gays and all the wests letter people, so they hate him because he is intolerant... and they have no tolerance for intolerant people.... no discussion or alternative points of view are allowed... you are either with us or you are with the terrorists.

Surprising how intolerant the liberal west actually is... shops were boarded up last US election in case Trump won because it was the democrats that burn and destroy things when they lose.

There is no room for anyone who does not step in line with the Whitehouse in the US (ironically there is a whitehouse in Moscow too).

They have succumbed to yes man syndrome...

How did the ukrops even get access to nthis? Does that mean russians are retreating at places?

Im seriously thinking a lot of the drivers of these vehicles are traitors who just abandon.

The fact that they are towing it rather than driving it away suggests what?

Should the Russian advance have stopped because one vehicle broke down?

The leader of the unit likely ordered the vehicle be left behind to be recovered by following support units... these Orcs would not be able to operate this vehicle so it is no threat and will likely be recovered later on... its location would have been marked and its movement will be noted... they might destroy it whereever they move it to or might go get it.

The Russians are going to own the country in 1 - 2 weeks tops. Like the Taliban, they are going to be inundated in so much Western and Soviet crap they won't know what to do with them.

They will likely have more NLAWs and Stingers than they know what to do with...

They did not have the balls to even exclude banks that participate in gas transactions from swift. It is joke. King is naked.

Putin has not responded to a lot of the actions of the west and I suspect he has had it with the west so no return sanctions are off the table... he might go for minimum hurt to Russia or he might go for moderate hurt for Russia max hurt for the west and try to create a real financial situation in the west that breaks the US dollar.... this will be very interesting.

I was wrong about the invasion but I don't think he wants to occupy the entire country... I don't think they will even bother to occupy Kiev... I think the core threat of the cauldrons with the bulk of the orc army near the Donbass and Lugansk regions will result in either a wholescale massacre, or a huge surrender and fight to the death with the hardcore nazis, and then the various regions of the Ukraine might be divided up with Russia keeping control of the nuclear power stations in the south and east... might as well see if they can reach territory near Transnistria and relieve that area too... I mean while they are in the neighbourhood.

Are Stinger AA missiles any danger for Russian aircraft? Or just for helicopters...

They are not something that can be ignored but they would not be much use against high flying drones which could spot where they are being launched from enabling them to find and kill the operators...

So much fake news constantly being spread here its getting tiresome and I may have to start blocking 90% of the people here who keep constantly replying to bitcoin since the mods can't seem to get it that everyone wants him gone for trolling.

Was going to ban him but most of the stuff he posts is obviously fake and propaganda and I think it is rather good the level of desperation the west has regarding this conflict that they have dedicated a lot of resources to create this weak shit

Normally RT is on the air to debunk this shit but while it is down I see it as a service we can provide and it shows we are not censoring any side which is another moral and ethical victory for us.

We need to get this thread back on order because we are barely even talking about the conflict at this point.

The lack of credible pro Orc stuff being posted suggests things are going rather well...

Hmm... I'm guilty as charged I'm afraid. I'll resist the urge from here on to peek at his latest brain-dead ravings, and won't be responding anymore. That rucking fetard simply isn't worth the time it takes to repl

Well I can't help it, perhaps in future I will use an @member reference and explain why their post is so wrong without posting it.... but by the time I have seen their post I am generally 15-20 pages behind so I really need to quote or it is going to be really hard to follow.

GarryB wrote " But why? Not Russias problem who occupies Kiev... the Ukraine is getting Yugoslavia treatment and some regions likely will always be openly hostile to Russia no matter what so I wouldn't even send any troops there... just monitor for threats and standoff weapon targets... like weapon shipments crossing borders etc. " Well it should not be a concern for anyone ,  under normal circumstances , what happens in some country . Unfortunately the situation demands attention from ALL countries , to put things right . The aim of demilitarized and denazified Ukraine , may be achieved quickly or not . Most likely this problem will persist for some time .

Once the bulk of the extremists are defeated and Ukraine is demilitarized , still ethnic conflict together with economic and political problems and negative foreign influence will remain . Should Russia then simply pack up and go home ? Obviously not . Then political and social and economic reconstruction is needed . However if political reconstruction is done correctly , then economic and social problems will be solve by Ukraine itself , without it being a burden on Russia .

Therefore the pre-condition for positive political developments are the most important cost saving measures . And these steps may include : first the provision of voluntary resettlement of refugees in distinct safe areas , Ukraine speakers to be settled in the West and Russian speakers in the East . This single step , will make it possible to police the peace process . Second , time is needed to allow formation of political parties on a free basis  , those that are democratic and non- violent . This step obviously excludes the Nazis . Third and final step , is to ensure fair elections and writing the new constitution , together with allowing the build-up of executive and judicial branch .

Once this is complete , then it is safe for Russian forces to withdraw . In my view , maintaining a force in Ukraine as a policing authority , is the easiest and cheapest and most reliable way of stabilising Ukraine . Packing up and leaving is simply no option . Asking for paper guarantees from a bunch of Nazis , with vested interests in war , to denounce Nuclear weapons and recognise LDPR , and then withdrawing forces , is surely a recipe for disaster . Therefore the present " peace " talks , within the present framework are totally counter- productive .