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    Su-57 Stealth Fighter: News #8

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    Post  Gomig-21 Mon Jul 11, 2022 4:32 am

    Some more really nice pics of this sleek beauty.

    Love the blue burn.

    Su-57 Stealth Fighter: News #8 - Page 14 Eg5zLYUXcAA7K8M?format=jpg&name=large

    Very rare seeing the flaps engaged on this aircraft. It seems to have such great lift with the wide body and the air directing of the LEVCONs that it seems like it almost never uses any flaps, even on take-offs.

    Su-57 Stealth Fighter: News #8 - Page 14 FM2x5ppXsAUMI5Y?format=jpg&name=small

    Su-57 Stealth Fighter: News #8 - Page 14 FXAtzxjWIAAiJ_E?format=jpg&name=900x900

    Su-57 Stealth Fighter: News #8 - Page 14 FXAt4oeWIAsbyc5?format=jpg&name=small

    One of the better pics with most of the movable surfaces engaged.

    Su-57 Stealth Fighter: News #8 - Page 14 FXAuPrjXEAgobJh?format=jpg&name=small

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    Post  LMFS Mon Jul 11, 2022 11:02 am

    Gomig-21 wrote:Anyone know what's going on here?  Or what the story is behind this photo?

    They test that the pilot can still fly and control the plane, should he glazing be lost or accidentally ejected

    Very rare seeing the flaps engaged on this aircraft. It seems to have such great lift with the wide body and the air directing of the LEVCONs that it seems like it almost never uses any flaps, even on take-offs.

    I don't think that I have seen the flaps deployed during take off, but they indeed do it during landing.

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    Post  Gomig-21 Tue Jul 12, 2022 5:07 am

    LMFS wrote:They test that the pilot can still fly and control the plane, should he glazing be lost or accidentally ejected

    Interesting.  Wouldn't that be more of a test of the pilot's physical ability and endurance rather than the aircraft itself?

    Unless the canopy jettison somehow triggers a shutdown of some or all control systems for the aircraft and the test pilot has to try turning them back on?

    That reminds me that they have tested such extreme and dangerous situations before on one of the T-50 prototype as well as the Su-35S while performing the tests on the flat spin recovery, they removed the landing drag parachute and installed a spin-recovery parachute (which is much larger than the drag chute) in case the pilot wasn't able to regain control by a certain altitude, once deployed, the spin recovery chute would at least slow down the spin and decrease the AoA so that the pilot could then jettison the chute and be able to regain control and land the aircraft.  Really remarkably dangerous but certainly necessary and these are such a great example of the lengths they go to test the performances of these aircraft on top of exemplifying the hazards of being a test pilot.  

    The missing canopy could also be a test of the automated control system (not sure what the actual name is) that gets automatically activated when it senses the pilot has either passed out or doesn't have control of the aircraft for whatever reason and subsequently it takes control of the aircraft, leading it back to the landing strip.  I seem to remember the Su-57 has something like that.  Similar to a collision avoidance system but much more complex.  A great aircraft saving technology.

    LMFS wrote:I don't think that I have seen the flaps deployed during take off, but they indeed do it during landing.

    True, it's really something, though, that they almost never use the flaps for taking off.  Not sure I've ever seen any other aircraft do that.

    But what do you suppose is happening in this pic I posted in the first of the last two batches of pics.  All 4 aircraft flying at identical air speeds, identical AoA identical everything it seems yet the 2 trailing aircraft have their flaps deployed while the front two don't!?!? FBW reacting differently on those two, perhaps from the turbulence caused by the 2 leading AC?  Maybe something else?  Fascinating to me anyway.

    Su-57 Stealth Fighter: News #8 - Page 14 FXAtfL5XgAIXQ1R?format=jpg&name=small

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    Post  Gomig-21 Wed Jul 13, 2022 7:49 am

    Preflight inspection?  Hard to tell. Neat pic nonetheless.

    Su-57 Stealth Fighter: News #8 - Page 14 FXam8lcXEAcbUud?format=jpg&name=small

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    Post  PeregrineFalcon Sun Jul 17, 2022 3:42 pm

    Gomig-21 wrote:

    True, it's really something, though, that they almost never use the flaps for taking off.  Not sure I've ever seen any other aircraft do that.

    But what do you suppose is happening in this pic I posted in the first of the last two batches of pics.  All 4 aircraft flying at identical air speeds, identical AoA identical everything it seems yet the 2 trailing aircraft have their flaps deployed while the front two don't!?!? FBW reacting differently on those two, perhaps from the turbulence caused by the 2 leading AC?  Maybe something else?  Fascinating to me anyway.

    Su-57 Stealth Fighter: News #8 - Page 14 FXAtfL5XgAIXQ1R?format=jpg&name=small

    The two trailing planes are using "air-brakes" because you can see that they want to stay in formation but are edging forward a little bit!
    Su-57 has no dedicated air-brake, instead the FCS is turning the vertical tails inwards (wich can be seen in the photo) creating a lot of drag, but at the same time that makes the plane to pitch down, and in order to counteract that unwanted motion, it uses the flaps to create additional lift, and at the same time creating more drag adding to very efficient braking without addition of the complexity/weight of dedicated air brake!

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    Post  Gomig-21 Sun Jul 17, 2022 8:32 pm

    PeregrineFalcon wrote:
    The two trailing planes are using "air-brakes" because you can see that they want to stay in formation but are edging forward a little bit!
    Su-57 has no dedicated air-brake, instead the FCS is turning the vertical tails inwards (wich can be seen in the photo) creating a lot of drag, but at the same time that makes the plane to pitch down, and in order to counteract that unwanted motion, it uses the flaps to create additional lift, and at the same time creating more drag adding to very efficient braking without addition of the complexity/weight of dedicated air brake!

    Makes a lot of sense. Thank you. thumbsup

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    Post  PeregrineFalcon Wed Jul 20, 2022 11:22 am

    Gomig-21 wrote:Makes a lot of sense.  Thank you. thumbsup

    You are welcome thumbsup

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    Post  LMFS Thu Jul 21, 2022 1:43 pm

    The dates for the start of tests of a new communication complex for Su-57 fighters have been announced

    The Russian fifth-generation fighter Su-57 will receive a modernized communications complex, the work is being carried out by Polyot Research and Production Enterprise, which is part of the Roselectronics holding. The complex is entering the testing phase.

    A modernized communication system for the Su-57 has been created, and prototypes are currently being manufactured that will be tested as part of the aircraft. According to the press service of the holding, testing is scheduled to begin this autumn. There is no more detailed information.

    Prototypes of the modernized communication complex are under production, they are planned to be tested in mid-autumn, including as part of the Su-57 aircraft

    - leads TASS Roselectronics message.

    The fact that the Russian Su-57 fighter will receive a modernized communications system was announced exactly a year ago at the MAKS-2021 air show taking place in Zhukovsky. Then the Ruselectronics holding announced the start of work on an improved version of the S-111 communications system for fifth-generation Su-57 fighters.

    As a result of the work carried out, the S-111 complex should become lighter and more compact, in addition, its communication channels will be able to receive and transmit information over a greater distance, and their reliability will also increase. Data transfer will be much faster.

    https://en.topwar.ru/199332-nazvany-sroki-nachala-ispytanij-novogo-kompleksa-svjazi-dlja-istrebitelej-su-57.html

    Is this part of the Megapolis modernization package?

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    Post  owais.usmani Fri Aug 12, 2022 9:20 am

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    Post  Stealthflanker Sun Aug 14, 2022 7:23 am

    Looking forward to Izd-810.

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    Post  TMA1 Sun Aug 14, 2022 8:07 am

    Indeed. Also izd 30. I know 2024/2025 is when they are supposed to come out but isnt it usual to see preproduction pieces a year or so earlier on some fighters?
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    Post  LMFS Sun Aug 14, 2022 12:02 pm

    TMA1 wrote:Indeed. Also izd 30. I know 2024/2025 is when they are supposed to come out but isnt it usual to see preproduction pieces a year or so earlier on some fighters?

    The first tests of the modernized and re-engined Su-57 with 2x izd. 30 and the rest of the results of project Megapolis should be flying already this year, according to the original schedule. They may or may not disclose anything about those tests. Transfer to the serial production was indeed planed for 2025.

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    Post  Gomig-21 Sun Aug 14, 2022 9:11 pm

    Let's goooooo!

    Su-57 Stealth Fighter: News #8 - Page 14 FaHN2agXwAE_MEc?format=jpg&name=medium

    Su-57 Stealth Fighter: News #8 - Page 14 FaHOC7PXEAArkRc?format=jpg&name=large

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    Su-57 Stealth Fighter: News #8 - Page 14 FaHNALTXgAAGrla?format=jpg&name=small

    Su-57 Stealth Fighter: News #8 - Page 14 FaHQjpCXkAMSjj_?format=jpg&name=medium

    Su-57 Stealth Fighter: News #8 - Page 14 FaHNHEKXoAE2aT-?format=jpg&name=small

    WOW! Too bad pic didn't capture the whole aircraft!

    Su-57 Stealth Fighter: News #8 - Page 14 FaHQX_oXoAEgO-5?format=jpg&name=large

    Su-57 Stealth Fighter: News #8 - Page 14 FaHSHFQXkAE_wqg?format=jpg&name=medium

    Nice finale!

    Su-57 Stealth Fighter: News #8 - Page 14 FaHWFBGXwAAQuyY?format=jpg&name=medium

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    Post  Gomig-21 Mon Aug 15, 2022 6:01 pm

    An excellent video on the Su-57 production line.  The only bad thing about it is that it's only 1:52 minutes long!  Despite that, it's packed with a lot of great shots and clips, especially the guy checking the aileron angle with an old-school angle meter!  You can't help but admire something like that.  Not everything should be strictly computerized and done only with digital calibration and stuff like that and that was a perfect example of having that human touch go into the process.  A lot of that seems to be lost in this day and age.

    Enjoy if you haven't seen it already.

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    Post  LMFS Mon Aug 15, 2022 9:28 pm

    The news about the participation of the Su-57 in the SMO should be here too:

    The head of the UAC appreciated the work of the Su-57 during the special operation

    Head of the UAC Slyusar: the Su-57 fighter shows its best side in a special operation

    Su-57 Stealth Fighter: News #8 - Page 14 1809690761_44:0:3685:2048_640x0_80_0_0_d8a876ae732718973e7c29d0a67ba30d

    Russian fifth-generation Su-57 multi-role fighter at Army 2022 at the Patriot Convention and Exhibition Center

    KUBINKA (Moscow region), 15 Aug-RIA Novosti. The Su-57 fighter jet is used during a special military operation in Ukraine and shows its best side, Yuri Slyusar, head of the United Aircraft Corporation (UAC), told reporters on the sidelines of the Army-2022 forum.
    "The plane (Su-57 - ed.) takes part in a special military operation, shows itself at its best. I have heard feedback from the Aerospace Forces and the Ministry of Defense, we are receiving feedback and are proud that the aircraft is already at the stage of mass production, " Slyusar said.

    https://ria.ru/20220815/su-57-1809748940.html

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    Post  LMFS Tue Aug 16, 2022 2:57 am

    UAC and the Defense Ministry discuss the possibility of creating a two-seat Su-57

    The advantage of the new version of the fighter may be new tactical capabilities when operating with UAVs for various purposes, said UAC General Director Yuri Slyusar.

    PATRIOT PARK / Moscow region/, August 16. /tass/. The United Aircraft Corporation (UAC, part of the Rostec State Corporation) is discussing with the Russian Defense Ministry the creation of a two-seat multi-purpose fighter of the fifth generation Su-57. This was announced by UAC Director General Yuri Slyusar in an interview with TASS during the Army-2022 forum.

    "We are in the active phase of interaction with the customer. A significant advantage of the two-seat version of the Su-57 can be new tactical capabilities when operating with UAVs for various purposes, which allows you to get a synergistic effect when performing special tasks," said the head of the corporation.

    The Su-57 is a fifth-generation multi-role fighter designed to destroy all types of air, ground and surface targets. It has supersonic cruising speed, in-fuselage armament, radio-absorbing coating, as well as the latest complex of avionics. By the end of 2024, the Russian Aerospace Forces will receive 22 Su-57s, and by 2028 their number will be increased to 76 units. The first fighter entered the army in 2020.

    The International military-Technical Forum "Army-2022" is being held from August 15 to 21 in the Patriot exhibition center near Moscow. The event is organized by the Russian Defense Ministry.

    The full text of the interview will be published on the TASS website at 09: 00 Moscow time.

    https://tass.ru/armiya-i-opk/15478429

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    Post  GarryB Tue Aug 16, 2022 9:33 am

    If they are going to make a two seater then perhaps make it with folding wings and tails and make it carrier capable too... a large carrier capable sized aircraft is expensive but capable and worth the extra money.

    It could replace the Su-33s which are getting long in the tooth...

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    Post  LMFS Tue Aug 16, 2022 11:00 am

    @GarryB, look they hear you Smile

    From Slyusar's interview at TASS

    — If we talk about the fifth-generation Su-57 multi-role fighter that is already being delivered to the troops, how are its deliveries progressing? How many Su-57s will be delivered to the military this year?

    — As part of the signed state contract with the Ministry of Defense of the Russian Federation for mass production of the Su-57, four aircraft have been built to date. This year it is planned to deliver the next batch of aircraft. UAC works with related companies in accordance with the concluded state contract.

    — At what stage is the development of the Su-57 two-seat command fighter designed to control the S-70 Okhotnik spacecraft? What is the advantage of controlling a UAV using such an aircraft in comparison with a ground command post?

    — We are in the active phase of interaction with the customer. A significant advantage of the two-seat version of the Su-57 can be new tactical capabilities when operating with UAVs for various purposes, which allows you to get a synergistic effect when performing special tasks.

    — Is work underway to create a deck-based version of the Su-57 for naval aviation of the Russian Navy?

    — The naval doctrine of the Russian Federation is supposed to ensure the possibility of building modern aircraft-carrying warships. From our point of view, the most promising is the construction of an aviation group of such ships based on the fifth-generation aircraft, as well as the use of drones. The groundwork created under the Su-57 program allows us to solve the tasks of naval aviation of the Russian Navy in the shortest possible time.

    https://tass.ru/interviews/15472119

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    Post  George1 Tue Aug 16, 2022 11:15 pm

    LMFS wrote:@GarryB, look they hear you Smile

    From Slyusar's interview at TASS

    — As part of the signed state contract with the Ministry of Defense of the Russian Federation for mass production of the Su-57, four aircraft have been built to date. This year it is planned to deliver the next batch of aircraft. UAC works with related companies in accordance with the concluded state contract.

    https://tass.ru/interviews/15472119

    4 aicrafts including the destroyed one?
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    Post  LMFS Tue Aug 16, 2022 11:17 pm

    GarryB wrote:If they are going to make a two seater then perhaps make it with folding wings and tails and make it carrier capable too... a large carrier capable sized aircraft is expensive but capable and worth the extra money.

    It could replace the Su-33s which are getting long in the tooth...

    Nobody says that the Su-57K needs to be a remake of the F-14 with their WSO... actually a naval fighter, due to reinforcements, is already normally burdened to put a second crew member on top of that.
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    Post  LMFS Tue Aug 16, 2022 11:18 pm

    George1 wrote:4 aicrafts including the destroyed one?

    I think it is apart from it
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    Post  TMA1 Wed Aug 17, 2022 4:52 am

    I assume first naval su-57 aircraft will be land based. I really cannot wait to see what a naval su-57 will look like and what color scheme it will have. Can you imagine an su-57 with that dark blue and light blue bottom color? Would be gorgeous.

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    Post  GarryB Wed Aug 17, 2022 7:25 am

    Having an Su-57K that has a two seat canopy design that allows single or two seat operation like the MiG-29K would make things easier in terms of training.

    It would add flexibility... and some missions would benefit an extra set of eyes.
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    Post  ALAMO Wed Aug 17, 2022 8:47 am

    LMFS wrote:

    Nobody says that the Su-57K needs to be a remake of the F-14 with their WSO... actually a naval fighter, due to reinforcements, is already normally burdened to put a second crew member on top of that.

    You are missing one tiny issue bro.
    The engines of V. generation are powerful enough to start from a carrier without any assistance, not only a catapult but a ramp either.
    So the existence of extra crewmember starts to be irrelevant, the plane will have strengthened body, additional arresting hook and wing folding mechanism anyway - that does not come without extra weight.
    But what you get then, is a plane that is perfectly suitable for commanding a drone swarm, or several big strike drones of S-70 class - that is a force multiplier being on pair with leap advance the F-14 presented back then. Having a plane capable to shoot at 6 targets from such a long distance was a serious threat to a whole Soviet naval strategy leading to a jump increase in the missile's speed, resistance, and attack plan. This is how the Mach3.0 titanium armored and swarm tactic were born.

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    Post  LMFS Wed Aug 17, 2022 1:20 pm

    ALAMO wrote:You are missing one tiny issue bro.
    The engines of V. generation are powerful enough to start from a carrier without any assistance, not only a catapult but a ramp either.
    So the existence of extra crewmember starts to be irrelevant, the plane will have strengthened body, additional arresting hook and wing folding mechanism anyway - that does not come without extra weight.
    But what you get then, is a plane that is perfectly suitable for commanding a drone swarm, or several big strike drones of S-70 class - that is a force multiplier being on pair with leap advance the F-14 presented back then. Having a plane capable to shoot at 6 targets from such a long distance was a serious threat to a whole Soviet naval strategy leading to a jump increase in the missile's speed, resistance, and attack plan. This is how the Mach3.0 titanium armored and swarm tactic were born.

    We will see, I suspect it is a thing of the military rather than from Sukhoi (they had no need of it even for training purposes), to have second crew member and it will depend seriously on the type of mission. We still need to see how that drone swarm commanding thing works in reality and how demanding it is in terms of crew attention, or if rather it is IA that will take care of it.

    TO without ramp and catapult, I am not so sure. There are online tools you can use to calculate that, and what I saw is that a Su-57 with second stage engines and a ramp could take with full load. Without ramp I did not check, but I assume there would a substantial decrease in performance, plus there is little time to make the rotation of the plane in a 100 m TO run. Weight and complexity are enemies of a plane, always, and adding 500 kg weight + ca 1 m³ fuel reduction due to a second crew member is never a good idea from a performance point of view. Effects on the aerodynamics for a supercruising plane are also very relevant. You don't want that on a land based plane and in a naval one with already heavier structure, the performance gap will increase further. I see no reason why the second crew member is more relevant in a naval plane than in a land based one, that's it.

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