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Dr.Snufflebug
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    Russian Civil Helicopters: News

    flamming_python
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    Post  flamming_python Fri Oct 18, 2024 9:42 am

    Better late than never! Cool

    The Mi-34 is not exactly a new model anymore, but it's great to have a fully domestic helicopter of this class available. I think all the competing prototypes from other manufacturers all used foreign engines as well.

    Now the next step would be to re-engine the Ka-226 as that helicopter is actually widely in service. The Ansats and Ka-62s and whatever can wait.

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    GarryB
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    Post  GarryB Fri Oct 18, 2024 10:51 am

    I wonder if the extra power might lead to a change in the main rotor... perhaps an extra blade or modification of the blades length and width?

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    franco
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    Russian Civil Helicopters: News - Page 3 Empty It is reported that on October 15, 2024, at the airfield of JSC Mil

    Post  franco Fri Oct 18, 2024 12:17 pm

    It is reported that on October 15, 2024, at the airfield of JSC Mil and Kamov National Helicopter Manufacturing Center of Russian Helicopters in Tomilino, Moscow Region, the first prototype of the light Mi-34M1 helicopter, equipped with a VK-650V turboshaft engine manufactured by JSC UEC-Klimov, made its first hovering flight. The Mi-34M1 helicopter is a modernized version of the light Mi-34S family helicopter, equipped with piston engines. There was no official announcement about the Mi-34M1 helicopter program or the start of flight tests of its first prototype. The first prototype of the modernized light helicopter Mi-34M1 (S-1, OP-2, tail number "1002"), equipped with a VK-650V turboshaft engine, during its first flight in hover mode.

    https://bmpd-livejournal-com.translate.goog/4866337.html?_x_tr_sl=ru&_x_tr_tl=en&_x_tr_hl=en#cutid1

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    George1
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    Post  George1 Fri Oct 18, 2024 3:55 pm

    GarryB wrote:I had forgotten about the Mi-34... it needed a Russian engine... sounds like it now has one...

    Excellent.

    it was actually a "forgotten" project for years. First version flew in 1986

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    lancelot
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    Post  lancelot Sat Oct 19, 2024 2:55 am

    Helicopter with VK-650V engine takes to the air for the first time
    18.10.2024

    On October 15, 2024, the upgraded Mi-34M1 helicopter made its first hovering flight at the Mil and Kamov National Helicopter Manufacturing Center in Tomilino, Moscow Region. The machine is equipped with a VK-650V turboshaft engine manufactured by UEC-Klimov. Video story from Tomilino published in VK Mashnews.

    Previously, helicopters with the VK-650V engine had not taken to the air. Initially, it was designed to replace imported power plants on the Ansat and Ka-226 helicopters. The Mi-34M1 became the first flying helicopter with the VK-650V engine, ahead of the Ansat, which is only being prepared to begin certification flight tests with this turboshaft engine.

    The Mikhail Mil Design Bureau developed the Mi-34 in the 1980s as a light training and sports helicopter to replace the Mi-1 and Mi-2 used for these purposes. The power plant was a piston engine M-14V-26 with a capacity of 325 hp designed by I.M. Vedeneyev.

    In 2009, Russian Helicopters announced plans to resume production of the Mi-34 in two variants: the modernized piston Mi-34S1 and the gas turbine Mi-34S2 with an Arrius 2F engine with a capacity of 504 hp from Turbomeca. As Andrey Shibitov, CEO of Russian Helicopters, stated on the eve of MAKS-2009, one of the tasks that the holding company faced at that time was diversification of the model range with the aim of moving into the niche of the best-selling machines in the civilian sector.

    However, this program was later abandoned in favor of developing a new light helicopter in partnership with the Italian company Agusta Westland. Joint work with the Italians ceased in 2014.

    In 2023, Russian Helicopters returned to the idea of ​​reviving the Mi-34 with the Russian VK-650V turboshaft engine. Now this promising turboshaft engine is being considered for installation on helicopters and in the turboprop version on the Yak-152 training aircraft, as well as for use in a hybrid power plant , a demonstrator of which was created in Klimov.

    In the context of the severance of all relations with the Russian aviation industry by former Western partners, Russian Helicopters needs to add a single-engine gas turbine helicopter to its model range that could compete with the Airbus H125 and H130, Agusta AW119 and Bell 407 and 505. The implementation of this program is facing delays primarily due to the lack of domestic theater aircraft. The success of the programs to create light helicopters and training aircraft largely depends on the timing of the VK-650V certification and the launch of its serial production by UEC-Klimov.

    https://aviation21.ru/vertolyot-s-dvigatelem-vk-650v-vpervye-podnyalsya-v-vozdux/

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    lancelot
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    Post  lancelot Sat Oct 19, 2024 3:04 am

    I think they would be better off redesigning the helicopter. The Mi-34 was originally designed to keep the radial piston engine behind the cockpit. So that huge space is right now unused. The higher output engine, it has twice the power, also allows the creation of a larger helicopter capable of carrying more stuff.



    If you look at the Mashnews video at 2:50 the Mi-34M1 looks kinda overpowered and a bit hard to control with the VK-650V. But they definitively need a good cheap single engine helicopter. And this engine will likely be produced in large numbers for Ka-226 and Ansat twin engine helicopter designs, so it should be a good candidate for the propulsion unit.

    IMHO they probably did not announce the flight because it was likely just a test flight to check engine integration with an helicopter airframe that they had readily available. But given the interest people showed in the test flight this might change and lead to the creation of a single engine helicopter.

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    kvs
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    Post  kvs Sat Oct 19, 2024 1:36 pm

    The engine has to fit the scope of the frame so throwing in an overpowered one is kind of stupid. I like Garry's idea of extra blades but that will probably make
    things worse since the frame is too light. I think the engine is a more substantial engineering challenge than the frame. They have no excuse not to redesign.
    If they pull the cost argument, then they should be shot on the spot.

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    PapaDragon
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    Post  PapaDragon Sat Oct 19, 2024 8:56 pm

    George1 wrote:
    GarryB wrote:I had forgotten about the Mi-34... it needed a Russian engine... sounds like it now has one...
    Excellent.
    it was actually a "forgotten" project for years. First version flew in 1986

    Damn, you are right

    1986, that's a long time ago but better late than never, as long as they get them rolling off the assembly lines in numbers it's all good

    Plus it still looks nice enough, just imagine how good it looked 30 years ago

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    PapaDragon
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    Post  PapaDragon Sat Oct 19, 2024 9:01 pm

    lancelot wrote:I think they would be better off redesigning the helicopter. The Mi-34 was originally designed to keep the radial piston engine behind the cockpit. So that huge space is right now unused....

    Just put extra seats and a cargo compartment there, no biggie


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    GarryB
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    Post  GarryB Sun Oct 20, 2024 7:19 am

    Damn, you are right

    1986, that's a long time ago but better late than never, as long as they get them rolling off the assembly lines in numbers it's all good

    I remember in the 1990s an article in Air International mentioning a revitalising of the Mi-34 with new engines that are going to make it viable and popular...

    (Edit... looking at a post above it might have been in 2009...)

    The engines of course were western, and one included as the article above mentioned a French engine at 504hp, so this engine isn't a lot more powerful, and they can use the extra power for better hot and high performance and also as PD mentions... give it greater capacity.

    This engine is going to be used in the Yak-152 and probably the Altius twin engined drone, so using it in the Mii-34 and also the Ansat (as a twin) and the KA-226 as a twin would make sense.... though for the latter the VK-800 engine in twin arrangement would be good for a specialist hot and high helicopter or just using it as a sky crane with no module fitted would be interesting too.


    Just put extra seats and a cargo compartment there, no biggie

    Of course we do lack important information... the original engine was 350hp, but the French engine they were going to use was a 500hp engine, so maybe the original engine could have been underpowered?

    Now that the engines they have been working on all this time are becoming available they will be spoiled for choice, but a 650hp for takeoff and 750hp for emergency rating is not a huge amount more powerful than the French engine at 500hp.

    They will be getting the VK-650, the VK-800, and the VK-1600 engines, plus the new engines for the Il-112/Il-114 that will also be used in the Mi-38 as well.

    Really should take the time to map out all the new engines and the aircraft and drones they could be used on...
    Rodion_Romanovic
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    Post  Rodion_Romanovic Sun Oct 20, 2024 11:10 am

    The original mi-34 was rated only for 2 or 3 passengers and had a Vedeneyev M-14V-26V 9-cylinder air-cooled radial piston engine, 239 kW (321 hp).

    While this new version of the mil Mi-34M1 has a vk-650 which has more than twice the power of the original engine of the Mi-34.

    I know that in the past there was a proposed variant of the Mi-34 with a french turboshaft engine rated at 500 hp, but possibly there were also additional changes.

    The old mi-2 had 2 engines rated at 400 hp at take-off and could carry 8 passengers or 700 kg payload.

    This new Mil-34 could be more or less halfway between the old mi-2 and the larger Kazan Ansat or Ka-226 (which are powered by 2 Vk-650 turboshaft engines each)

    There was also a coaxial helicopter project in the same size which could also use a single VK-650 engine, the VRT-500 (originally planned with a foreign powerplant in mind), but with much better speed, range and payload (6 passengers or 700 kg) than the original mi-34.

    I am expecting this new mil mi-34 to have performances similar to the VRT-500.
    I know that they have a different set up (the VRT-500 has coaxial rotors), but there is not a large difference between the planned performances of the Ka-226 Vs the Kazan Ansat.
    GarryB
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    Post  GarryB Mon Oct 21, 2024 5:30 am

    Even just changing from a piston engine to a gas turbine will dramatically improve high altitude and also hot environment performance, so operators in Afghanistan or India would appreciate the improved performance.

    I had a look at some old photos of the Mi-34 and it is a two seat helo with the piston engine behind the seats, whereas this new modification has the engine in the roof below the main rotors and space for four seats.

    It essentially seems to have moved from a Robinson R-22 to a Robinson R-44 like helicopter with this new engine.

    The use of the VK-650 in the Mi-34 (1 engine), and the Ansat (two engines) and the standard Ka-226(two engines), should lead to the wide use of the engine... especially if used in larger drones too.

    Would like to see the Ka-226 have a sky crane version with the more powerful VK-800 engines too... or perhaps a scaled up naval modular type that can carry extra fuel for long endurance flights.

    Maybe even a VK-800 equipped Ansat armed helicopter with light modern composite armour and armament like twin 23mm cannon and rocket pods and missiles.

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