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    Decline of the western society #2

    franco
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    Post  franco Wed Jun 16, 2021 10:59 pm

    kvs wrote:I spent a couple of years in the USA and found the people there to be reasonable just like in Canada.   Where I lived things were good
    and one can find seedy locations in Canada so there is nothing that can be extrapolated from this.   So an American loving America
    is perfectly fine and rational.   The world's problems are generated at the country level by top level deciders and not by the grass roots.
    Even though people think that they exert democratic control, no such thing is true in reality.   I simply cannot see Americans en masse
    pushing for any of the ridiculous foreign meddling by the USA.  Instead, this meddling is foisted on them as necessary to defend America
    and to spread freedom and human rights.   Voting for the D. or R. Party will not flip US foreign policy around.  

    Trump and the domestic focus (MAGA) faction in the US is the country's best choice but the rotten deep state that has established
    itself over the decades is not letting Americans choose the right path.   It is taking them for a ride to oblivion.

     

    I have always found Americans to be decent people... in fact we forget that they are the biggest victims of Corporate America.

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    lancelot
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    Post  lancelot Thu Jun 17, 2021 1:27 am

    The citizens of the US are much like people in the UK who had miserable lives when they had the Empire.
    The Empire ruins the little guy everywhere.

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    ALAMO

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    Post  ALAMO Thu Jun 17, 2021 8:41 am

    Atmosphere wrote:
    And then it would be those same idiots banging their heads over free expression

    Because they allow the full freedom of expressing the things they want to hear only lol!

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    GarryB
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    Post  GarryB Thu Jun 17, 2021 1:44 pm

    I have always found Americans to be decent people... in fact we forget that they are the biggest victims of Corporate America.

    When I first read that I thought that was correct, but thinking about it I think the people of North Korea and Iran and Cuba and Vietnam and Cambodia and Serbia and quite a few other places that never did anything to hurt Americans in America are actually suffering a bit more... to be fair.

    But I do appreciate your point that the average American voter has little say in what its government and military does in its name.

    To be fair when put in a position where they could do something about it... the Mannings, the Assanges, the Snowdens... and actually a very large number if CIA people who just went to jail and got no attention for the war crimes and other criminal activity the US government and western governments around teh world get up to even now... these people have stepped up and despite knowing the likely response did it anyway... and ironically if you listen to the American patriot bullshit censored like the Clinton family and the Bush family spout... these people should be heroes, but they are treated as traitors and criminals... because they know if anyone actually listened to these people it would be the Clintons and Bushes and Kennedies in prison and shown to be the real criminals...

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    kvs
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    Post  kvs Tue Jun 22, 2021 2:05 am

    https://summit.news/2021/06/21/teacher-investigated-after-using-n-word-to-help-students-properly-pronounce-name-of-african-country/

    Teacher Investigated After Using N-Word to Help Students Properly Pronounce Name of African Country

    A teacher in the UK is under investigation and faces possible termination after he used the n-word in class to remind students to be careful when pronouncing the name of the African country Niger.

    And these neo-theocracies have the gall to lecture Russia over democracy.

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    Maximmmm
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    Post  Maximmmm Wed Jun 23, 2021 1:27 pm

    kvs wrote:https://summit.news/2021/06/21/teacher-investigated-after-using-n-word-to-help-students-properly-pronounce-name-of-african-country/

    Teacher Investigated After Using N-Word to Help Students Properly Pronounce Name of African Country

    A teacher in the UK is under investigation and faces possible termination after he used the n-word in class to remind students to be careful when pronouncing the name of the African country Niger.

    And these neo-theocracies have the gall to lecture Russia over democracy.  


    10/10 clown world.
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    Post  Maximmmm Wed Jun 23, 2021 2:25 pm

    kvs wrote:I spent a couple of years in the USA and found the people there to be reasonable just like in Canada.   Where I lived things were good
    and one can find seedy locations in Canada so there is nothing that can be extrapolated from this.   So an American loving America
    is perfectly fine and rational.   The world's problems are generated at the country level by top level deciders and not by the grass roots.
    Even though people think that they exert democratic control, no such thing is true in reality.   I simply cannot see Americans en masse
    pushing for any of the ridiculous foreign meddling by the USA.  Instead, this meddling is foisted on them as necessary to defend America
    and to spread freedom and human rights.   Voting for the D. or R. Party will not flip US foreign policy around.  

    Trump and the domestic focus (MAGA) faction in the US is the country's best choice but the rotten deep state that has established
    itself over the decades is not letting Americans choose the right path.   It is taking them for a ride to oblivion.

     

    The US is a young country and it's people have never really had a brush with extinction. So they're still naive and believe in democracy and freedom and all that jazz.
    One of the advantages (and often a big disadvantage) of Russian society is that we're all a bunch of cynical fuckers. We've seen it all, all the promises and the lies. So we don't fall for that shit head over heels like the west does.
    It's also the reason rational arguments so often fail with them, because they've been told that you're the axis of evil, so they're like "well, that's how it is you know".
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    Post  GarryB Thu Jun 24, 2021 8:36 am

    Teacher Investigated After Using N-Word to Help Students...

    The investigation should have stopped there... teacher using word to HELP STUDENTS.

    If that teacher was using the word to describe a group of people or to berate someone in their class, I would agree... fire them... probably... still needs an investigation... but would be worth investigating.

    Who does it help to fire this teacher warning of the dangers of saying the N word... the west is literally eating its own...
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    Post  Vann7 Thu Jun 24, 2021 7:06 pm

    A better title for this thread should be..

    The Rise of the Anglo-zionist one world ,anti society project for dividing and conquering the world


    If anyone thinks the west are "crazy" or have "lost their minds" or what everyone repeats
    that "communism is over taking the world " The you need to go back to school and take
    reason and common sense 101 classes.

    The west world have created    SUPER EMPIRE and idiots and fools can't create such things , of extraordinary wealth and power , unless it is crafter by brilliant people that plans things for generations. This are people that marry with same family members , and controls entire nations
    with just a phone call.

     Presidents and politicians ,that you see in the west are only the ones in charge to implement policies created for them, but the master minds of all this far left (and far right) movements are
    super billionaires families , and what could better represent them as a group , i propose the name
    the synagogue of satan. as in the bible they were called , fake jews of immense power , that all the way to the biblical times , they knew how to have major influence over society but specially those in power.

    Rockefellers family are probably the head of the snake of this Far Left (and far right) policies.
    According to Aaron Russo in this interview , it was rockefeller family member that the feminism movement was being funded by them and many of this "far left" anti parents ,anti family laws ,
    are lobbied by big big money , that comes from this so called "jews" that are not necessarily zionist and not necessarily care about israel. the western super billionaires (like rockefellers ,soros ,rothchilds) can hire the best minds in the world , the best scientist to craft an education system that can create the dumb and easy to manipulate societies  they want.

    the west don't even hide ,who are the architech of their radicals policies is all in every main
    stream media in the west .



    This is one example of part pf the policies ,the west is implementing on the average citizens (not the high class) to follow , the information is all revealed in this book. this is like a manual of how to break society or a government 101 for dummies with examples of how to create chaos..

    Decline of the western society #2 - Page 8 41izygP+wuL._SX298_BO1,204,203,200_

    The west is using that information and others they also have ,to create the system they want.
    the west have a lot more  experts in deception and deceiving and manipulating humans, society and governments .

    this is why mike popeyo former cia director told it..
    how impressive ,was the CIA courses of cheating ,lying and deceiving , entire manipulation courses
    for the government and media to help US system ,to hold and continue dominating as a super empire.


    So the west are not "fools" , they know what they are doing , the only important idiot , the only super fool  , that was attempting to oppose them in the past 21 years ,is the extremely over rated and super outdated president of Russia vladimir putin ,the idiot behind this Russia re-actionary
    foreign policy , that waits for nations to be overthrow , for nations to be nearly completely captured, and things to become really bad , in order to do something .   No

    The west is not seeking a nuclear war with Russia , they are not fools , they know putin is weak and will do anything ,including sacrificing thousands of soldiers lives , to avoid a nuclear war with the west . So the west have no reason to use nukes in Russia ,because they have a free pass , to do as they wish ,thanks to putin and recruit anyone they want in russia. and break russia from the inside as they did it with soviet union and also did with the romanov family and now trying to finalize the destruction of russia for ever , in this next one..

    and if the west will not destroy russia with nukes , then how they plan to do it...

    1) with economic sanctions war
    2) with political war
    3) with media war
    4) with cultural war .
    5) Business war
    6) Religious war .
    7) energy wars
    Cool mercenaries proxy wars
    9) biological wars

    all this policies of the west ,  were people like soros and rockefellers finance feminism , black lives matter , gay communities , far right nazis in baltics and ukraine , and even also finance islamic extremist terror group like isis and alqaeda , all this policies are aimed at the total destruction of
    Russia and putin the fool is fighting the west in the most lamest and stupied way possible. just by waving his nukes on the western faces and later showing politeness with them ,requesting good relations.   No

    From 1 to 100 , putin is promoting  ZERO good relations , with the west , the moron don't understand at all the power of leadership , he don't really understand what leadership really is , don't understand what the job of a president of a nation should really be  and how leadership (personal leadership + nation business leadership) can influence the west to change.

    all that he is doing ,is delaying problems ,freezing conflicts ,and encouraging  a real nuclear war
    to happen. because the west see Putin's insecurity and weakness from a mile and this encourage their military and intel agencies to directly attack russian soldiers , russian planes and attack russian bases with drones and attack russia main land with terror attacks ,and now putin encouraging the west with more biological attacks .

    This is why the west is so radical , because they see how stupid is their president , how outdated he is and his nation culture , and they seek to take advantage of this , and neither Russia have a modern culture ,modern religion ,that can properly defend and counter the western one . and the anglo jewish west correctly figure out , they can break Russia from the inside , by creating chaos at all levels of Russian life.   No

    Just like i said ,many times , the major problems the world face , is that the west dominating powers are too well organized and too smart and putin's Russia incredibly stupid and incredibly dumb.

    All that Russia needs is ...

    LEATHERSHIP  , their entire government of Russia , need to go back to school and takes course of
    leadership , but more importantly putin..  but i don't think you can change an idiot , that was born that way and is too stuck with his ways of thinking , a brand new figure need to rise in russia , and ironically it have to be someone highly critical of putin ,but also at the same time , critical of all western paid CIA ,liberals in Russia politics , leading civil unrest in Russia..

    When a nation leadership fails , your country face a major exodus of people of the young generations ,to somewhere else , this is exactly what is happening in Russia.  millions of ethnic russians are leaving the country  , and those primitives fanatics muslims , are the ones growing .  forget the elections of Russia , the best poll in the world about any support for any government is the one of population movements , is russia population growing? or decreasing ?  they are leaving in masses ,because they no longer have faith in their government leaders , neither faith in their nation future ,
    where population no longer trust in the ability of their government to improve the future ,that government have a very serious problem of leadership and problem of development. All those 50 billion dollars that putin's invested in sochi , was to promote a growing population  and promote more patriotism (using artificial epenis contest like sports is.)  but obviously ,for those that eyes and can see, putin's major olympic blunder and pipelines economy ,was a big mistake , and those leaving the nation in the millions is the proof of it.


    Russia is losing the fight to the west , and this mass exodus of the population in the millions, is the biggest true sign of a major disaster happening in Russia , and putin is the only one to blame for this for refusing to leave and holding power for so long and not helping to improve the perception of the modernization of the country.  Russia surviving for 21 years of putin in power ,should not be seen
    as a sign of success. The only thing Putin achieved was delaying the collapse of Russia , by modernization of military , and keeping economy ,at the bare minimum , to keep it in one piece.
    but he have absolutely no strategy , to get Russia out of  the dangers , it is . and this is why under putin russia have no future.

    and people can't say , ohh it was the pandemic.. wrong.

    Russia population decline started ,when the sanctions began in 2014 against Russia ,
    Way Before THE PANDENIC BEGAN.

    Russia’s Natural Population Decline to Hit 11-Year Record in 2019
    https://www.themoscowtimes.com/2019/12/13/russias-natural-population-decline-hit-11-year-record-2019-a68612


    So the decadence of the west (low income and middle class) is working as intended .
    Bush and obama knew what they were doing ,when they were moving millions of business
    manufacturing from US to China. The billionaires became more billionaires and the poor more poor.
    exactly what they wanted.

    The western policy is called  Divide and Conquer  --> C h a o s  M a n a g e m e n t ,
    and Saul Alinsky ,  which democrats praise ,was one of the Architect of this policies ,
    that super billionaires families in the anglo west finance and lobby in politics.

    before controlling the world , in a big super dictatorship ,ultimate absolute world empire ,you need first to break the family structure across the world  , break society unity and their ability to solve differences unite and fight corrupt governments , and all this intolerance and dictatorship of the mind , trying to rule over what people think , and censor discussion of controversial topics , is precisely done ,so society different ethnic groups  can solve their problems with each other and so the government keep them busy fighting.  the west don't give a shit about gays , blacks or womens right , or neither about human rights.. they mascarade their support for minorities ,by promoting total intolerance between them , by removing anyone from their jobs ,for the slightiest comment that is less than great against a gay and trans community or  black.

    Putin big mistake is to remain idle and don't counter the western culture with a superior and more modern one , that do not exclude common sense and christians family values ,  When putin repress people as he does , violate their rights to be whoever they want to be , he banns religions not approved by the state , that don't promote violence , to operate ,for fear of losing control over them.  this is why putin is not far way of a blood totalitarian dictator, all brutal dictators ,start like putin ,with  good intentions , but later they increase their repression , until  the nation becomes a north korea prison state or a saudi arabia totalitarian religious dictatorship.

    The western mistake , is that this extremely ambitious and very unconstructive policies , can blow back in their face , and could end destroying them. the west do this divide and conquer policies in their own countries ,thinking ,they will have always things ,even during chaos , under control , and that society will be too busy fighting each other , to fight the system instead.  but what if a major leader rise in the west and explain everyone , how society is being played , by the government ,to keep them busy fighting each other?  leaders can rise , in chaotic places , and the major thing they under estimate is how a new generation of leaders , can divide also people behind the system too ,
    can divide the military , divide the elites ,and trump as bad he is as president , was an example ,that US elites can be divided too and not just the population , but the military and the billionaires elite too , can be divided in america , so the trump experiment ,proved the anglojewist west can be divided too , even israel can be divided , you saw how netanyahoo was kicked.  pirat    doesn't means any change of policy at all with their neighbors , but shows , you can divide anything , that alliances can break ,  and any empire or system can be divided too.  Even the queen family in britain is divided today. So all this super billionaires in the west ,that have all the money they want ,controlling US and Europe policies are not immune to divisions.
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    andalusia

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    Post  andalusia Fri Jun 25, 2021 7:07 am

    In my home state of Louisiana, the governor just vetoed a transgender sports ban bill. I strongly disagree with this.  I think it is sick that confused males would want to compete against females in sports.  I would have never imagined this being an issue twenty years ago.  What is next?


    https://www.npr.org/2021/06/23/1009415758/louisiana-trans-transgender-sports-ban-veto-governor-edwards






    This article makes a good case for single sex sports for girls and women: https://www.nationalreview.com/2019/05/girls-women-deserve-single-sex-sports/?utm_source=Sailthru&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=WIR+-+Sunday+2019-05-05&utm_term=WIR-Smart&fbclid=IwAR3RSz6YHMiGRvOj5M6qO68Y6f4zOs7Q8I9ZoE1pg2jl5cewc4mJbVpzvkk
    GarryB
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    Post  GarryB Fri Jun 25, 2021 9:00 am

    LEATHERSHIP , their entire government of Russia , need to go back to school and takes course of
    leadership , but more importantly putin..

    That really says it all Vann, do you think everyone will be wearing leather in the future?

    If you actually meant Leadership then why does Russia need its entire population to be expert leaders?

    When you have a ship with millions of people on board how many leaders do you actually need?

    Have you heard the term too many cooks spoil the broth... too many leaders and you have nothing but arguments and bullshit.

    Putin has done a great job so far and western media venom proves that... the fact that the west wants Putin gone means he remains effective and useful for Russia... and the best thing Putin can do is step back and keep doing what is best for Russia while the west burns itself to the ground... maybe then out of the ashes something might pop up that Russia and China can trade and deal with, but if it is just more of the same then they can ignore that too and wait for something else to take over that understands respect and the interests of others and can talk to other countries instead of down at them.

    In my home state of Louisiana, the governor just vetoed a transgender sports ban bill. I strongly disagree with this. I think it is sick that confused males would want to compete against females in sports. I would have never imagined this being an issue twenty years ago. What is next?

    The problem is created by femenists who refuse to accept men and women are different.

    If men and women are the same then why is there mens sports and womens sports to start with... lets let women weight lifters compete with male weight lifters... but of course that is not "fair" but transgender women are actually physically and biologically men, but saying a man who wants to be a woman is still a man violates their rights to choose gender.

    You can't choose gender any more than you can choose how tall you are.

    You can get leg and arm and neck extensions via surgery but what results is not really taller, just like what results from gender alteration surgery does not really change gender.

    Reading some of their material most of its seems to be mood rather than gender and what they really want to fight is social stereotypes where boys play with trucks and cars while girls play with dolls and learn to cook.

    Well boys would benefit from learning to cook too and learning about clothes and repairing their own clothes by sewing should not require a gender change... perhaps instead of forcing the issue with chemicals and surgery and lawyers perhaps just accepting that people are different and not judging them might be the best way forward, but these people wanting acceptance and tolerance of their choices also want people who use the wrong pronoun be fired from their jobs for doing so... so ironically these people demanding acceptance and understanding are the least accepting and understanding of all.

    I say fucking man up and accept being weird and accept that some people wont accept your choices.

    Get some thicker skin and harden the **** up.

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    kvs
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    Post  kvs Sat Jun 26, 2021 7:04 am



    The coming feudalist utopia in the west. While trying to scare the sheeple with BS about security, car manufacturers are
    moving to wireless for car functions. We already had examples of how modern cars can be hacked and sabotaged while
    on the road thanks to brain dead computerization of everything from steering to the breaks. Now these corporate overlord-wannabes
    are trying to make this hijacking that much easier. All to avoid independent car mechanics from taking away the filthy lucre from
    their racket with the dealerships.

    A simple electrical circuit cannot be hacked without some EMP burst. Electronic circuits with chips and wireless receivers make
    cars into PCs on wheels. So they are hackable when cars from even the 1990s were not. I do not see any value in all of this
    computerization. It is a scam designed to give dealerships more repair revenue money. The days of being able to fix your car
    in every aspect are gone.

    Maybe some people like this and have the money to burn, but that is not everyone.
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    Post  kvs Mon Jun 28, 2021 6:21 pm



    What a scam! And this is considered acceptable business practice in the west. An ATM button that takes over 10% of the money
    you withdraw for no purpose other than lining the pockets of the ATM owners. These c**nts don't even make it part of the ATM fee,
    they just rob you via a trick.

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    Post  ALAMO Mon Jun 28, 2021 8:10 pm

    Ekhm ...
    First time heard of banksterism? scratch
    Laughing
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    Post  kvs Mon Jun 28, 2021 11:32 pm

    ALAMO wrote:Ekhm ...
    First time heard of banksterism? scratch
    Laughing

    I doubt this ATM feature was there even 15 years ago.

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    Post  ALAMO Tue Jun 29, 2021 9:39 am

    Of course, it was, it is called the spread.
    The most delicious cake the banks can have.
    As long as I love Janek and his channel, he is obviously biased against financial issues.
    These ATMs target tourists, as none of the Czech citizens would use them.
    The choice to get an exchange with the banks' currency rates or fixed is at least 10 years old.
    As Janek said, the main difference is, that EU regulations forced the ATM operator to include the info, how much is the provision cost in the "fixed" exchange rate. How much you will lose to a currency spread, literally.
    Usually, it is approx. 4-6%, but in Prague, there are lots of tourist traps, and the insane conversion rates are just some of them.
    Janek is dealing with them all, he is "The honest guide" and I recommend his advices to anyone wishing to visit the Czech Republic.
    The general rule is, use popular bank's ATMs or official operators like Euronet or Cash4U. Do not step into strange exchange places, always read the currency rates carefully. EU regulations for a while already grat you the law to withdraw from the transaction that was already made, within 2 hours. You just give back the recipe, the local currency you have received, and they are obliged by the law to give you the full amount of the currency you have exchanged. No provisions, fees, nothing. If they don't want to, just take a first police patrol spotted around, and get back to them.
    And pay with your card as often as you can, this is the less expensive solution.
    If you want to see a pure water robbery, take a look at the exchange rates that Paypal provides. Selling something on Ebay literally means about 15% of combined provisions. 12,86%? Amateurs! Laughing
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    Post  kvs Tue Jun 29, 2021 3:18 pm

    I disagree. I have taken money out of European ATMs in 2007 and earlier and do not recall such a button.
    This is the particular racket of this American company. There is a trend even if you do not see it.



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    Post  ALAMO Wed Jun 30, 2021 1:16 am

    What is the point to discuss that further scratch ?
    Been to Prague 5 times in the last 5 years.
    Plus all around the Czech Republic.
    If you know better how it works there ... cheers.
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    Post  Cowboy's daughter Thu Jul 01, 2021 7:28 pm

    Macron said the political left's insistence on defining their countrymen by their ethnicity and depicting them as victims is causing rifts, and blamed social science ideas that have come from the United States.

    'I see that our society is becoming progressively racialised,' Macron told Elle magazine in an interview published this week, going on to say that he believed ethnic minorities have been placed 'under house arrest' by left-wing ideology.

    He also pointed blame at feminists and black rights activists for seeking to define people according to their gender and their skin colour, arguing that such views cause rifts in French society and limit social mobility among ethnic minorities.
    A new generation of younger French activists are increasingly vocal in denouncing the problem of racism in France and the legacy of the country's colonial past in Africa and the Middle East.

    But their opponents see the focus on race and the past as opening up unnecessary divisions and encouraging a culture in which minorities and women see themselves as constantly oppressed and discriminated against.

    Movements against racism over the last year such as Black Lives Matter, which resonated in France after arriving from the US, have led to fears among some critics that the country is importing American racial and identity politics sometimes labelled as 'woke culture.'

    Macron took aim in particular at the idea of 'intersectionality' - popular among left-leaning U.S. academics - that seeks to explain discrimination and poverty by examining the role played by race and gender in affecting an individual's life chances.

    'The logic of intersectionality fractures everything,' he said. 'I stand for universalism. I don't agree with a fight that reduces everyone to their identity or their particularity.

    'Social difficulties are not only explained by gender and the colour of your skin, but also by social inequalities,' he insisted.

    'We had freed ourselves from this approach and now we are once more categorising people according to their race and by doing that we are totally placing them under house arrest,' the head of state added.

    The 43-year-old added that he could think of young white men in his hometown of Amiens or nearby Saint-Quentin in northern France 'who also have immense difficulties, for different reasons, in finding a job'.

    'Social difficulties are not only structured by gender and by skin colour, but also by social inequality,' he said.


    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-9745875/Macron-Woke-leftist-culture-racialising-France-causing-splits-society.html


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    Post  kvs Thu Jul 01, 2021 10:00 pm



    SJW degeneracy is indoctrinated by the western media.

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    Post  kvs Mon Jul 05, 2021 8:32 pm



    It is clear that Antifa are the brown-shirts of the new woke totalitarian order.

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    Post  higurashihougi Fri Jul 09, 2021 4:07 pm

    Singapore is not Western, certainly, but I think I will put it here as a topic about society and social issue.

    https://www.channelnewsasia.com/news/singapore/census-more-married-couples-women-childless-no-kids-15139522

    ‘I don't think I will regret it’: Why more married couples are remaining childless

    There are a multitude of reasons for remaining childless, ranging from financial concerns to a preference for existing lifestyles, or even fertility issues as couples delay marriage.

    At the core of many of these reasons is the priority given to work and making a living, said Associate Professor Tan Ern Ser from the sociology department at the National University of Singapore (NUS).

    “For those in mid- to higher-level jobs, the driving force that makes people spend more time on work are key performance indicators (KPIs).  You may have a day off or even leave to clear, but the expected deliverables remain.”

    In addition, raising a child entails not just having someone to look after them, but also “being deeply involved in the child’s development, which could conflict with the priority of having to deliver on the KPIs”, said Assoc Prof Tan.

    Having to make a trade-off with one’s career is a big concern for women like Ms Tanya Pillay, 28, who works in corporate communications.

    “If I was a mum, I wouldn’t have that peace of mind to go that far in my career, to be able to work until (late) - you can’t do that if you have a child.

    “Women should be able to have both (children and a career). I believe it can be done - but perhaps not in Singapore,” said Ms Pillay, citing a general lack of workplace support for parents.

    Her husband, who she married in 2019, also does not want kids.

    Another reason for the decision is that the world can be an ugly place, she said.

    “There is sexism, racism all around, workplace discrimination, inequality, so many evil things and social injustices that we are (seeing) every day.

    “For us who are already on this earth, we do what we can … But it’d be so unfair to bring (a) child into this,” said Ms Pillay, who works in the non-profit sector.

    Ms Loh caveated that while she does not want to have children now, she might feel differently in future. One thing that might change her mind is having more workplace support for parents.

    “We have friends who are young parents, who don’t have work-life balance, even though they have childcare leave and so on.

    “There’s also still expectations from work - like even though you’re just back from maternity leave, you must be performing at 90 to 100 per cent of where you were before. For fathers, you’re expected not to take leave for family issues and instead settle that on weekends or at night.”

    She added that it would help if “in general, society was a bit more forgiving”.

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    Post  Rodion_Romanovic Fri Jul 09, 2021 4:30 pm

    higurashihougi wrote:Singapore is not Western, certainly, but I think I will put it here as a topic about society and social issue.

    https://www.channelnewsasia.com/news/singapore/census-more-married-couples-women-childless-no-kids-15139522

    ‘I don't think I will regret it’: Why more married couples are remaining childless

    There are a multitude of reasons for remaining childless, ranging from financial concerns to a preference for existing lifestyles, or even fertility issues as couples delay marriage.

    At the core of many of these reasons is the priority given to work and making a living, said Associate Professor Tan Ern Ser from the sociology department at the National University of Singapore (NUS).

    “For those in mid- to higher-level jobs, the driving force that makes people spend more time on work are key performance indicators (KPIs).  You may have a day off or even leave to clear, but the expected deliverables remain.”

    In addition, raising a child entails not just having someone to look after them, but also “being deeply involved in the child’s development, which could conflict with the priority of having to deliver on the KPIs”, said Assoc Prof Tan.

    Having to make a trade-off with one’s career is a big concern for women like Ms Tanya Pillay, 28, who works in corporate communications.

    “If I was a mum, I wouldn’t have that peace of mind to go that far in my career, to be able to work until (late) - you can’t do that if you have a child.

    “Women should be able to have both (children and a career). I believe it can be done - but perhaps not in Singapore,” said Ms Pillay, citing a general lack of workplace support for parents.

    Her husband, who she married in 2019, also does not want kids.

    Another reason for the decision is that the world can be an ugly place, she said.

    “There is sexism, racism all around, workplace discrimination, inequality, so many evil things and social injustices that we are (seeing) every day.

    “For us who are already on this earth, we do what we can … But it’d be so unfair to bring (a) child into this,” said Ms Pillay, who works in the non-profit sector.

    Ms Loh caveated that while she does not want to have children now, she might feel differently in future. One thing that might change her mind is having more workplace support for parents.

    “We have friends who are young parents, who don’t have work-life balance, even though they have childcare leave and so on.

    “There’s also still expectations from work - like even though you’re just back from maternity leave, you must be performing at 90 to 100 per cent of where you were before. For fathers, you’re expected not to take leave for family issues and instead settle that on weekends or at night.”

    She added that it would help if “in general, society was a bit more forgiving”.
    In the future she will have to see if she will still be capable of a successful pregnancy... If she waits too long that is not a given...

    Furthermore many men when they turn 50 and the kids are grown regret having spent too little time with their family because of work. For a woman that remain childless after menopause the consequences are even sadder.

    The career is a trap. Work should not become a voluntary slavery. Of the people that actually have "success", and have sacrificed their time and their family in order to climb the corporate ladder and get that famous 3 letter acronim job (CEO, COO, CFO, etc) or at least an high level executive role, there are another 1000 that have done the same sacrifices (spending regularly more than 60 hours a week at work), but that obtain similar recognition in comparison colleagues that found a balance between work, family and rest.

    Basically now women are being happy to repeat the worst mistakes that many men did in the past, but in their case is it even worse, since some of these mistakes are not recoverable...

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    Post  GarryB Sat Jul 10, 2021 6:23 am


    Basically now women are being happy to repeat the worst mistakes that many men did in the past, but in their case is it even worse, since some of these mistakes are not recoverable...

    Very true, but they wanted equality which means the good stuff and the bad.

    I can remember days growing up when I am sure my mother would have loved to have gone to work and left dad at home with the kids for a day... just to get a break.

    The fact of the matter is that it is not critical for the survival of the human race for everyone to have a dozen children, and in fact it is probably better for the planet if we don't.

    Mortality rates in the west are low enough to not need to have spares for when you lose a few before their 5th birthday, and education and contraceptives means having some by accident should not be something that happens to people over the age of 18 or so.

    The more you learn about how fucked up the west really is and that the so called bad guys are actually just guys who don't do as the real bad guys tell them and you wonder what you can tell your kids to prepare them?

    Teach them all their growing years to be honest and honourable, only for them to find out their government is anything but honest and honourable and if you are not also careful and suspicious then you are going to get conned.
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    Post  higurashihougi Sat Jul 10, 2021 1:45 pm

    What I am afraid that in such systems, if employees do not try to climb up and meet all the KPI stuffs, the system will push them down, and they may even losing their job and losing their stable income which is essential for maintaining children and meet all the daily life cost.

    I think for these people, probably having a "low" job with unstable and "low" income can destroy the family quicker than having little time for family.

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