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    Can Russian medicine surpass Western one?

    Walther von Oldenburg
    Walther von Oldenburg

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    Post  Walther von Oldenburg Fri Feb 26, 2021 5:11 pm

    Can western medical research improve upon and exceed the efficiacy of Western medical research?>

    This is already a case to a degree with Sputnik 5.
    kvs
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    Post  kvs Fri Feb 26, 2021 6:35 pm

    Walther von Oldenburg wrote:Can western medical research improve upon and exceed the efficiacy of Western medical research?>

    This is already a case to a degree with Sputnik 5.

    It's not a 100 m track race. It's like asking if western science (e.g. physics) can "exceed" Russian science. There is a common baseline
    on top of which there are distinct branches (not fields) of research. So we have Johnson and Johnson, AstraZeneca, Pfizer, and then
    we have Russian and Chinese vaccines which follow varied approaches. In terms of the ability to develop vaccines there is no technological
    gap between the major players on the planet. That is something the western fake stream media does not want to admit. So it spews
    hate propaganda insinuating that Russian vaccine "technology" is inferior. What is inferior is the understanding on the part of both the
    fake stream media urnalists and the consumers that lap up their excrement.

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    GarryB
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    Post  GarryB Sat Feb 27, 2021 4:34 am

    There is much that the arrogant western medical profession are closed minded to and cannot embrace in terms of alternatives.

    But then there are plenty of western quackery too... like Homeopathy...
    lyle6
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    Post  lyle6 Sat Feb 27, 2021 9:47 am

    Western medicine prescribes cutting off your balls and t*ts to satisfy a deep seated mental depravity so I'd say even Chinese is better.

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    Nomad5891

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    Post  Nomad5891 Mon Mar 01, 2021 12:37 pm

    Russian medicine is fueled by the state mainly while Western is developed by private companies with such little to midium coordiantion with the state.
    Russian medicine in terms of budget can not comapre to western one. It lags far behind. I think up to 2008-2010 Russia was importing basic drug as insulin as it was not able to produce it. Of course things have changed for the better today but I dont see Russia as medicine exporter any time soon. Yes they may reach a point where they cover their internal needs and market, but from there to actually develop new drugs and being able to produce them in the ammounts needed to export them...well, it quite the leap.

    On the other hand, having the state control your medicine research can be interesting, in the sense that private capital invests only when there is expectation for profit. Take for example the antibiotic field- it is very expensive to develop new antibiotic while humandkind is closing to the day when current antibiotics will not be effective due to resistent bugs. So Russians can actually get an edge here, as they will not care (that much) about profit and could invest money in the development of new antibiotics, that one day can be exported to the world.
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    mnztr

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    Post  mnztr Fri Mar 05, 2021 5:52 am

    There is a lot of soviet medical tech that exceeds western tech. For example phage therapy for infections. Its unique and really effective with antibiotic resistant bacteria.
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    Nomad5891

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    Post  Nomad5891 Fri Mar 05, 2021 7:46 am

    mnztr wrote:There is a lot of soviet medical tech that exceeds western tech. For example phage therapy for infections. Its unique and really effective with antibiotic resistant bacteria.

    Well, I would be very interested to hear which "a lot" soviet medical tech exceeds current western one.
    Phage therapy in its current form for sure does not exceed antibiotic treatment to which it is an alternative. It is complicated and not that practical to produce, store and use.
    Same bacterial infection in two different persons may require two different strains of phages being developed. Even during treatiment of a single person bacteria could evovlve and become resistent to the pahge used which will requiere a new phage to be developed. Now imagine having to treat 1000 people. Antibiotics currently would win anytime over this.
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    calripson

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    Post  calripson Fri Mar 05, 2021 5:30 pm

    Nomad5891 wrote:
    mnztr wrote:There is a lot of soviet medical tech that exceeds western tech. For example phage therapy for infections. Its unique and really effective with antibiotic resistant bacteria.

    Well, I would be very interested to hear which "a lot" soviet medical tech exceeds current western one.
    Phage therapy in its current form for sure does not exceed antibiotic treatment to which it is an alternative. It is complicated and not that practical to produce, store and use.
    Same bacterial infection in two different persons may require two different strains of phages being developed. Even during treatiment of a single person bacteria could evovlve and become resistent to the pahge used which will requiere a new phage to be developed. Now imagine having to treat 1000 people. Antibiotics currently would win anytime over this.

    All current orthopedic surgery techniques in the West for limb lengthening/shortening/reconstruction after severe trauma involving distraction derive from the Illizarov technique developed in Kurgan, USSR by Dr. Illizarov. The top surgeons in the world in this area like Dr. Dror Paley from John Hopkins and Dr. Rozbruch from the Institute for Special Surgery all acknowledge their gratitude for the work and innovation of Professor Illizarov.

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    GarryB
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    Post  GarryB Sat Mar 06, 2021 9:10 am

    Private companies are interested in profit, the patient isn't someone they care about, the patient is the person they fleece for their income.

    A CEO at Goldman Sachs posted an open memo to the pharmaceutical company they were investing in and it was rather an interesting read.

    Essentially what he said was that the focus should be on treatments rather than cures because in the case of infectious diseases a cure not only is a one off charge to a patient with no ongoing revenue like you would get from treatments, but it also means that person can no longer pass that disease on to others limiting the future revenue potential of the cure.

    Big Pharma claim their big profits are necessary because developing new drugs is expensive... but over 70% of their money goes in to marketing and shmoosing doctors and health professionals to prescribe their medicines above generic or rival brands especially when their brand has unpleasant side effects and cheap generic drugs don't.

    The vast majority of money invested in developing new drugs comes from the governments of countries who fund development of cures and treatments.

    Look at the American healthcare system... the best in the world and also the most expensive... all those flash machines... if you have health insurance the hospitals screw the insurance companies by using those expensive machines for things that don't warrant it... I suspect they pocket the actual difference between what they charge and what it actually costs...

    I wouldn't say that western medicine is the best path to follow no matter what... there are alternative options.

    I am sure Boris Johnson plans to defund the NHS to the point where there are so many complaints he bows to public demands and privatises it all... it saves the government billions because they don't have to fund it at all, but it is the majority of the people who suddenly find they can't afford any sort of health care that will suffer... and it will be the insurance companies that make really big money out of this... charging people to pay them in case they might get sick, and making the coverage agreement full of holes they can exploit so it is the insurance company that decides if you get that expensive scan and not the doctor... what would doctors know anyway.

    It is like direct to public advertising of drugs... do you have that... we are decades behind the rest of the west so I guess you do have it and have had it for ages.

    Drug companies telling you what your doctor should be prescribing for your various problems.... go on... ask for x drug by name... because you know better than your doctor.... you have seen an advert on TV so you know at least as much as someone who has made a career out of this...

    State run healthcare is healthcare to keep the people healthy and working, private healthcare wants profit... treatment, not cures... they want hepatitis to spread, not be cured... treating thousands is good profit... disease wiped out means no profit at all and they spent all that money on treatments.

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    kvs
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    Post  kvs Sat Mar 06, 2021 6:30 pm

    America is a fine example of what a racket private medicine is. It turns out that there is no national market for HMOs in the USA.
    That's right, there are state-level markets only. The mind boggles at this detail. There are no national level competitive pressures
    and economies of scale. It is a pseudo-market where you have local oligopolies. This is inefficiency squared.

    For a country that tries to jam its monetarist dick up everyone's ass, the USA is land of pure hypocrisy. If you want to see
    what effectively amounts to state capitalism, it is the USA. Except it is not the nominal state but the oligarchy which milks
    the consumers both directly and through their taxes.

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