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    Su-57 Stealth Fighter: News #7

    Atmosphere
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    Post  Atmosphere Fri May 07, 2021 12:41 am

    >2021
    >People believing that the plane can only carry two MRAAMS in those gigantic weapon bays that previously carried missiles that are twice as big in similar amounts.

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    Post  Gomig-21 Fri May 07, 2021 2:14 am

    I knew the Okhotnik was pretty large but when you see it in the foreground with the Su-57 (which BTW, I will NEVER call it the Felon as that is the worst insult ever by NATO and you know they did this on purpose) you can really distinguish the size of the unmanned drone that the Su-57 operates.

    Su-57 Stealth Fighter: News #7 - Page 21 E0t5tvPXoAcLAtH?format=jpg&name=900x900

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    Post  Isos Fri May 07, 2021 3:39 am

    If there is space they will always be able to engineer new pylon to hold more missiles.

    Those things are being considered after the plane get ready be it su-57 or s-70 drone.

    Looot of work to do first before integrating weapons. You can't just create a fighter that easy. First you create a plane that flies then you make it a fighter or a bomber or a drone or what else.

    Some underestimate the work needed to create just tge plane and not the fighter.

    Rafale comes in 4 standard and the 4th is from 2019 while the Rafale was being flown in 2000 and designed in the 80s. F-16 has almost ten different variant and the first could carry only short range missile in the 80s while the last version is made in 2020 for quatar and can carry lot of stuff.

    Same thing for any aircraft including su-57 whose potential will increase with new standards.
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    Post  Backman Fri May 07, 2021 5:39 am

    Gomig-21 wrote:I knew the Okhotnik was pretty large but when you see it in the foreground with the Su-57 (which BTW, I will NEVER call it the Felon as that is the worst insult ever by NATO and you know they did this on purpose) you can really distinguish the size of the unmanned drone that the Su-57 operates.



    Are you Russian Gomig ? I've seen a few Russians have a very negative reaction to the Felon name.

    The Felon name is meant to be edgy and its not actually meant to be an insult IMO. It's like a hockey team name. The Bandits , the Villains , the Felons. That angle. Maybe Russians don't quite roll like that 

    I would have went with the Frostbite. But that could be seen as negative too I guess

    The Flanker name is just perfect. Gotta give them that.

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    Post  Gomig-21 Fri May 07, 2021 6:25 am

    Backman wrote:
    Gomig-21 wrote:I knew the Okhotnik was pretty large but when you see it in the foreground with the Su-57 (which BTW, I will NEVER call it the Felon as that is the worst insult ever by NATO and you know they did this on purpose) you can really distinguish the size of the unmanned drone that the Su-57 operates.



    Are you Russian Gomig ? I've seen a few Russians have a very negative reaction to the Felon name.

    The Felon name is meant to be edgy and its not actually meant to be an insult IMO. It's like a hockey team name. The Bandits , the Villains , the Felons. That angle. Maybe Russians don't quite roll like that 

    I would have went with the Frostbite. But that could be seen as negative too I guess

    The Flanker name is just perfect. Gotta give them that.

    Me Russian?  No, I'm Egyptian living in the US and just following the developments out of a selfish interest that Egypt might acquire this killer beast when it's available.

    I understand your analogy between the hockey team names and the NATO code-naming of such a great aircraft.  In sports it's more of a fun thing.  This is serious business.  I think this was done on purpose because the US came out with the Raptor and then the Russian followed with this aircraft and so they called if the felon.  Even though the J-20 popped out of nowhere, I think there is more tension and technological competition between the US and Russia and so keeping up with the developments of this moliotta? is very interesting to me.

    Frostbite would've been a great name for it!  I wouldn't much preferred that then that other.  It gives the enemy a frostbite instead of being labeled the synonym of a criminal.

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    Post  GarryB Fri May 07, 2021 6:03 pm

    I don't like Felon either... essentially a criminal that needs to be punished....

    Regarding fitting missiles the Russians have been making new generation missiles every few generations of aircraft... originally the early produced missiles were complex and expensive and not actually that good... the AA-1 and AA-3 and AA-5 were good examples of this, but when they captured some sidewinders and had a look at them they were amazed... so simple and basic and modular... it would take time to incorporate such a design into their missiles so the first thing they did was copy the Sidewinder in the form of the AA-2 or R-13 and R-3 missiles... this allowed them to get such a simple and cheap and easy to produce and maintain missile into service.

    The AA-7 was an example of a new missile with this modular layout, as a medium range standard missile and the short range missile being the excellent little R-60 (AA-Cool which was used across a range of aircraft, while the MiG-25 was the only aircraft big enough and with a radar powerful enough to use the AA-6 heavy missiles.

    Then they created new standard light, medium, and heavy missiles in the form of the R-73, R-27, and R-33... the former very much superior to the western equivalent Sidewinder (the R-60 is tiny and while good was not as good as sidewinder), the R-27 was better than Sparrow, and the R-33 was shorter ranged and only SARH compared with the superior later model Phoenix ARH long range missiles.

    Well the current generation is R-74, R-77, and R-37, but there are new missiles being developed for next generation aircraft and they will likely be optimised for much better performance in terms of range and ability to hit a wide range of targets... they will likely use thrust vector engine control as well as perhaps scramjet propulsion so lots of wings and fins wont be needed... making internal carriage easier and also reducing drag to improve long range flight performance.
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    Post  Finty Fri May 07, 2021 8:26 pm

    Gomig-21 wrote:
    Me Russian?  No, I'm Egyptian living in the US and just following the developments out of a selfish interest that Egypt might acquire this killer beast when it's available.

    I understand your analogy between the hockey team names and the NATO code-naming of such a great aircraft.  In sports it's more of a fun thing.  This is serious business.  I think this was done on purpose because the US came out with the Raptor and then the Russian followed with this aircraft and so they called if the felon.  Even though the J-20 popped out of nowhere, I think there is more tension and technological competition between the US and Russia and so keeping up with the developments of this moliotta? is very interesting to me.

    Frostbite would've been a great name for it!  I wouldn't much preferred that then that other.  It gives the enemy a frostbite instead of being labeled the synonym of a criminal.

    I appreciate I'm off topic here but I'd say the worst name NATO bestowed on a Soviet Aircraft is Fagot, with Crusty in second place.

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    Post  Backman Fri May 07, 2021 8:47 pm

    Su 57 high pitch howl again at parade rehearsal.  Man it must be cool being downtown and taking that in

    https://twitter.com/DylanMalyasov/status/1390535336539852802?s=19

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    Post  PapaDragon Fri May 07, 2021 8:55 pm


    Frostbite sounds awesome but I firmly believe that Felon will catch on big time

    I remember when Flanker was considered weird and today it's popular, this stuff takes time

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    Post  LMFS Sat May 08, 2021 12:51 am

    Su-57 Stealth Fighter: News #7 - Page 21 284797

    4.5G my arse...

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    Post  Finty Sat May 08, 2021 2:56 am

    Backman wrote:Su 57 high pitch howl again at parade rehearsal.  Man it must be cool being downtown and taking that in

    https://twitter.com/DylanMalyasov/status/1390535336539852802?s=19

    That was rather nice, shame the likelihood of seeing one at RIAT or just on exercise in the UK is rather slim, for now!
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    Post  Gomig-21 Sat May 08, 2021 4:03 am

    LMFS wrote:Su-57 Stealth Fighter: News #7 - Page 21 284797

    4.5G my arse...

    Looking at those two camo schemes, and hoping the EAF ends up being the first export customer of these, they would look good in this camo color, don't you think? Laughing

    Su-57 Stealth Fighter: News #7 - Page 21 ECZPn1JUYAIfpCU


    Last edited by Gomig-21 on Sat May 08, 2021 5:43 am; edited 1 time in total

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    Post  LMFS Sat May 08, 2021 4:48 am

    I don't see those pictures, just me?

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    Post  Gomig-21 Sat May 08, 2021 5:44 am

    LMFS wrote:I don't see those pictures, just me?

    Now?

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    Post  GarryB Sat May 08, 2021 1:13 pm

    Used to deal with a lot of experts telling me that Russian aircraft camo is useless and totally ineffective and that the HATO gray was vastly superior... but a while back there was a video of a Flanker and an F-15 flying in close proximity.... I seem to recall the F-15 had come to look at a Russian plane the Su-27 was escorting and so the Su-27 moved him along.

    As they both departed flying further and further away the Su-27 melted into the background and disappeared, while the F-15 remained visible.

    Question answered.

    Better question is why do westerners think everything the west does is right and perfect and effective without seeing any examples to show that.

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    Post  Isos Sat May 08, 2021 1:59 pm

    Better question is why do westerners think everything the west does is right and perfect and effective without seeing any examples to show that.

    They have to justify the overprice somehow.

    There is no science behind cammo. Either it works or doesn't. You just test it.

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    Post  GreyHog Sat May 08, 2021 6:14 pm

    GarryB wrote:Used to deal with a lot of experts telling me that Russian aircraft camo is useless and totally ineffective and that the HATO gray was vastly superior... but a while back there was a video of a Flanker and an F-15 flying in close proximity.... I seem to recall the F-15 had come to look at a Russian plane the Su-27 was escorting and so the Su-27 moved him along.

    As they both departed flying further and further away the Su-27 melted into the background and disappeared, while the F-15 remained visible.

    Question answered.

    Better question is why do westerners think everything the west does is right and perfect and effective without seeing any examples to show that.

    I believe it is this one?

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    Post  Backman Sat May 08, 2021 9:13 pm

    ^ That's amazing. Camo 101.
    I wonder why China does the dark grey. Some of them are a lighter grey actually

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    Post  Finty Sun May 09, 2021 1:30 am

    GarryB wrote:Used to deal with a lot of experts telling me that Russian aircraft camo is useless and totally ineffective and that the HATO gray was vastly superior... but a while back there was a video of a Flanker and an F-15 flying in close proximity.... I seem to recall the F-15 had come to look at a Russian plane the Su-27 was escorting and so the Su-27 moved him along.

    Better question is why do westerners think everything the west does is right and perfect and effective without seeing any examples to show that.

    I wouldn't use the word 'perfect' as there's been concerns raised before about the F22's low observable coating and the cost of maintaining it, but nevertheless it's food for thought. I was almost surprised to see the F15EX had been outshopped in the mod eagle scheme which has been around since 1991/92 rather than the darker but radar-absorbing scheme, Have glass V.


    Speaking of 1992, a comparison of camo schemes and a throwback to somewhat less frosty times in Russian-American relations.

    Su-57 Stealth Fighter: News #7 - Page 21 F15-and-su27

    https://defencyclopedia.com/2015/01/23/origins-evolution-of-the-su-27-into-an-f-15-killer-part-2/

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    Post  GarryB Sun May 09, 2021 8:11 am

    I wouldn't use the word 'perfect' as there's been concerns raised before about the F22's low observable coating and the cost of maintaining it, but nevertheless it's food for thought.

    I meant perfect... in the sense that when Russia or the Soviets do something differently it must be inferior or just wrong.

    Soviet tanks have anti tank missiles... must be because Soviet tank guns are inaccurate and can't hit targets at long range, so they need to use missiles to hit targets at long range, while western tanks can just use standard ammo...

    Except a moving target is very hard to hit... especially when you are moving too... any unexpected movements between when you fire and when your round impacts means a miss... but not with a guided missile.

    The guided missiles were for long range shots against moving targets... including helicopters... but western amateur experts don't think about such things.


    There have been plenty of concerns raised about US 5th gen aircraft but no question they are superior to Russian 5th gen aircraft...

    Many westerners see the Su-57 is Russia trying to catch up, but Russia has different needs and requirements... it is not just a copy of an F-22... it clearly has a different focus and goals.

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    Post  Gomig-21 Sun May 09, 2021 11:21 pm

    Fun pic, giving it some scale?

    Su-57 Stealth Fighter: News #7 - Page 21 E09sbNaX0AMeSw6?format=jpg&name=medium

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    Post  thegopnik Mon May 10, 2021 2:13 am



    1:10:20 Su-57s

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    Post  Finty Mon May 10, 2021 3:36 am

    thegopnik wrote:

    1:10:20 Su-57s


    Good show, first victory parade I've watched. Very impressive air display and all those T34s!

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    Post  Backman Mon May 10, 2021 5:06 am

    There was some footage onboard one of the  su 57's. It looks like there is a slatted louver in the intake.

    Su-57 Stealth Fighter: News #7 - Page 21 File


    Su-57 Stealth Fighter: News #7 - Page 21 Su57victoy_by_backspin321_dejc1l4-fullview.jpg?token=eyJ0eXAiOiJKV1QiLCJhbGciOiJIUzI1NiJ9.eyJzdWIiOiJ1cm46YXBwOjdlMGQxODg5ODIyNjQzNzNhNWYwZDQxNWVhMGQyNmUwIiwiaXNzIjoidXJuOmFwcDo3ZTBkMTg4OTgyMjY0MzczYTVmMGQ0MTVlYTBkMjZlMCIsIm9iaiI6W1t7ImhlaWdodCI6Ijw9NTA3IiwicGF0aCI6IlwvZlwvNjczMmY2M2YtZDU0Zi00Nzg5LWI0ZWEtZGU0ZTIxMzMyZDk2XC9kZWpjMWw0LThiOTc1MDRlLWU0MDMtNGVhOC1hYjMwLWY4ZmFkMzMwY2IzNi5wbmciLCJ3aWR0aCI6Ijw9MTE5MCJ9XV0sImF1ZCI6WyJ1cm46c2VydmljZTppbWFnZS5vcGVyYXRpb25zIl19

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    Post  LMFS Mon May 10, 2021 5:46 am

    It is all CGI

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