Russia's naval doctrine and strategy

launchers and Redut launchers (note even the 9M96 50km and 150km range missiles would be a huge improvement over the 90km range Rif, let alone a 200km range S-300 variant or 400km range S-400 variant),

Half of PtG S-300 are Rif the other half are rif-M which is naval PMU2 standard and uses 48N6E2 missiles with 250km range. You can see that the front radar is the one from ground s-300 (rif-M) and the one in the back is a big round radar for rif that you can also see on slavas.

Gorshkov could have had the rif-M too just like chinese frigate that have it. The VLS just like Redut launcher is not universal so that change nothing apart missile types being carried.

The only "waste" could be in vertical space (as the shorter range.missile are also shorter), unless they decide to have some of the VLS launcher shorter (as it is the case for the french VLS, that exists in different lenghts but with the same horizontal area), maybe be able to install them in other part if the ships with less vertical space available

Just keep the redut then . Because a universal VLS that is too short for most of missiles is no longer universal.

Since 2012, more than 80 ships and boats have entered service. We publish the list:

On April 23, 2019, at a ceremonial event in St. Petersburg on the occasion of the laying of new warships, it was reported that from 2012 to the present, more than 80 ships and boats, including three strategic missile submarines, were handed over to the armament. This statement caused interesting discussions and discussions in public circles, as many believe that this figure is too high. In this regard, it will be interesting to consider the completion of our Navy since 2012 and to see whether our fleet has really accepted more than 80 combat units.

For starters, it should be noted separately that quite often many analysts and experts in the military field, analyzing the update of our fleet, take into account only large warships and submarines, well, suppose everything that has a displacement of 1000 tons and above, justifying it by that only these units are able to solve problems in the far sea zone and pose a serious threat to the enemy. In addition, often forget about the ships and boats for special purposes. This is fundamentally wrong, since each combat unit, starting from a boat, has its own range of tasks and mission. Moreover, a ship / boat enrolled in the Navy by order of the Navy GC is considered a military unit of the Navy, it is given a combat flag - the flag of the Navy (Andreevsky) and this unit is credited to a particular base / unit. Therefore, ignoring, say, patrol / anti-sabotage or amphibious boats is a deep mistake. The following is a list of ships and boats of all projects submitted to the Russian Navy from 01/01/2012 to the present (we confine ourselves to the date 04/23/2019 - at the time of the announcement of the figures):

1). Project 955 CPSW-535 "Yury Dolgoruky" - adopted in the Northern Fleet in 2012.

2). K-550 SSBN “Alexander Nevsky” of Project 955 - adopted in the Pacific Fleet in 2013.

3). The K-551 SSBN "Vladimir Monomakh" of Project 955 was accepted into the Pacific Fleet in 2014.

4). APKR K-560 "Severodvinsk" project 885 - adopted in the Northern Fleet in 2013.

5). Diesel-electric submarines B-260 "Novorossiysk" project 06363 - was accepted into the BSF in 2014.

6). The diesel-electric submarines B-237 "Rostov-on-Don" project 06363 - was accepted into the BSF in 2014.

7). Diesel Substation B-262 "Old Oskol" project 06363 - was accepted into the BSF in 2015.

. Diesel-electric submarines B-265 "Krasnodar" project 06363 - adopted in the BSF in 2015.

9). The diesel-electric submarines B-268 "Veliky Novgorod" project 06363 - was accepted into the Black Sea Fleet in 2016.

10). The diesel-electric submarines B-271 "Kolpino" project 06363 - was accepted into the Black Sea Fleet in 2016.

11). The frigate "Admiral of the Fleet of the Soviet Union Gorshkov" project 22350 - adopted in the Northern Fleet in 2018.

12). The frigate "Admiral Grigorovich" project 11356 - was accepted into the Black Sea Fleet in 2016.

13). The frigate "Admiral Essen" project 11356 - adopted in the Black Sea Fleet in 2016.

14). The frigate "Admiral Makarov" project 11356 - adopted in the Black Sea Fleet in 2017.

15). Corvette "Boiky" project 20380 - adopted in the BF in 2013.

16). Corvette "Resistant" project 20380 - adopted in the BF in 2014.

17). Corvette "Perfect" project 20380 - adopted in the Pacific Fleet in 2017.

18). Corvette "Loud" project 20380 - adopted in the Pacific Fleet in 2018.

19). Rocket ship "Dagestan" project 11661K - adopted in the CFL in 2012.

20). Patrol ship "Vasily Bykov" project 22160 - adopted in the Black Sea Fleet in 2018.

21). Small rocket ship "Grad Sviyazhsk" project 21631 - adopted in the CFL in 2013.

22). Small rocket ship "Uglich" project 21631 - adopted in the CFL in 2013.

23). Small rocket ship "Veliky Ustyug" project 21631 - adopted in the CFL in 2014.

24). Small rocket ship "Serpukhov" project 21631 - adopted in the Black Sea Fleet in 2015. Since 2016, the service carries in the BF.

25). Small Rocket Ship "Green Dol" project 21631 - adopted in the BSF in 2015. Since 2016, the service carries in the BF.

26). Small rocket ship "Vyshny Volochek" project 21631 - adopted in the Black Sea Fleet in 2018.

27). Small rocket ship "Orekhovo-Zuyevo" project 21631 - adopted in the Black Sea Fleet in 2018.

28). Small rocket ship "Mytishchi" project 22800 - adopted in the BF in 2018.

29). Small artillery ship "Makhachkala" project 21630 - adopted in the CFL in 2012.

30). Sea trawler "Alexander Obukhov" project 12700 - adopted in the BF in 2016.

31). Sea trawler "Ivan Antonov" project 12700 - adopted in the Black Sea Fleet in 2018.

32). The average reconnaissance ship “Yuri Ivanov” of project 18280 was accepted into the Northern Fleet in 2014.

33). The average reconnaissance ship Ivan Khurs of project 18280 was accepted into the Black Sea Fleet in 2018.

34). Large landing ship "Ivan Gren" project 11711 - adopted in the Northern Fleet in 2018.

35). The landing craft on the “Ivan Kartsov” air-cavity of the Project 21820 was accepted into the Pacific Fleet in 2014.

36). The landing craft on the air-cavity “Michman Lermontov” of the project 21820 was accepted into the Baltic Fleet in 2014.

37). The landing craft on the air-cavity “Denis Davydov” of the project 21820 - was accepted into the Baltic Fleet in 2014.

38). The landing craft on the air-cavity “Lieutenant Rimsky-Korsakov” of Project 21820 - was accepted into the BF in 2014.

39). The landing craft on the air-cavity “D-199” of project 11770 was accepted into the Black Sea Fleet in 2014.

40). The landing craft on the air cavity "№-746" (w / o) of project 11770 - was accepted into the CFL in 2013.

41). The air-cavity landing craft (tentatively No. 722) of project 11770 was accepted into the CFL in 2013.

42). Anti-sabotage boat "P-680" of project 12150A - adopted in the BF in 2013.

43). Anti-sabotage boat "P-679" of project 12150A - adopted in the BF in 2013.

44). The anti-sabotage boat P-191 "Cadet" of project 21980 was accepted into the Black Sea Fleet in 2012.

45). Anti-sabotage boat P-349 "Suvorovets" project 21980 - adopted in the BSF in 2012.

46). Anti-diversion boat P-350 "Kursant Kirovets" project 21980 - adopted in the Black Sea Fleet in 2013.

47). Anti-sabotage boat P-355 "Yunarmeets Crimea" project 21980 - adopted in the Black Sea Fleet in 2014.

48). Anti-sabotage boat P-424 "Kinel" project 21980 - adopted in the Black Sea Fleet in 2014.

49). Anti-diversion boat "P-433" project 21980 - adopted in the Black Sea Fleet in 2017.

50). Anti-diversion boat P-351 "Caspian Yunarmeets" project 21980 - adopted in the CFL in 2013.

51). Anti-sabotage boat "Yunarmeets Tatarstan" project 21980 - adopted in the CFL in 2018.

52). The anti-sabotage boat P-340 "Ynarmeets Polaria" project 21980 - was accepted into the Northern Fleet in 2016.

53). Anti-sabotage boat P-421 "Yunarmeets Belomorye" project 21980 - adopted in the Northern Fleet in 2016.

54). Anti-sabotage boat P-430 "Valery Fedyanin" project 21980 - adopted in the Northern Fleet in 2017.

55). Anti-sabotage boat P-429 "Sergey Preminin" project 21980 - adopted in the Northern Fleet in 2017.

56). Anti-diversion boat P-377 project 21980 - adopted in the Pacific Fleet in 2013.

57). Anti-sabotage boat P-420 "Yunarmeets of Primorye" project 21980 - adopted in the Pacific Fleet in 2014.

58). Anti-sabotage boat P-417 "Yunarmeets Kamchatka" project 21980 - adopted in the Pacific Fleet in 2014.

59). The anti-sabotage boat P-431 “Yunarmeets of Chukotka” of the project 21980 was accepted into the Pacific Fleet in 2017.

60). The anti-sabotage boat of the project 21980 (serial number 8006) was accepted into the Pacific Fleet in 2018.

61). Anti-sabotage (amphibious assault) boat "P-274" project 03160 - adopted in the Black Sea Fleet in 2015.

62). The anti-sabotage (amphibious assault) cutter P-275 of Project 03160 was accepted into the Black Sea Fleet in 2015.

63). Anti-sabotage (amphibious assault) boat "P-276" project 03160 - adopted in the Black Sea Fleet in 2015.

64). Anti-sabotage (amphibious assault) boat P-280 "Yunarmeets Baltika" project 03160 - adopted in the BF in 2015.

65). Anti-sabotage (amphibious assault) boat P-281 project 03160 - adopted in the BF in 2015.

66). Anti-sabotage (amphibious assault) boat P-344 project 03160 - adopted in the BF in 2015.

67). Anti-sabotage (amphibious assault) boat P-845 project 03160 - adopted in the Black Sea Fleet in 2015.

68). Anti-sabotage (amphibious assault) boat P-838 of project 03160 - was accepted into the Black Sea Fleet in 2015.

69). Anti-sabotage (amphibious assault) boat P-413 of the project 03160 - accepted into the Black Sea Fleet in 2017.

70). Anti-sabotage (amphibious assault) boat P-425 of the project 03160 - accepted into the Black Sea Fleet in 2017.

71). Anti-sabotage (amphibious assault) boat "P-345" project 03160 - adopted in the BF in 2015.

72). The anti-sabotage (amphibious assault) boat P-415 “Georgy Potekhin” of Project 03160 was accepted into the Baltic Fleet in 2017.

73). Anti-sabotage (amphibious assault) boat number 659 of project 03160 - adopted in the BF in 2018.

74). The D-308 amphibious assault boat of project 02510 was accepted into the Northern Fleet in 2018.

75). The D-2110 amphibious assault boat of project 02510 was accepted into the Northern Fleet in 2018.

76). The D-655 amphibious assault boat of project 02510 was accepted into the Black Sea Fleet in 2018.

77). The amphibious assault boat D-296 of project 02510 was accepted into the Black Sea Fleet in 2015.

78). High-speed patrol boat "RK-2173" project A-149-1 - adopted in the CFL in 2015.

79). High-speed patrol boat of the project A-149-1 - adopted in the Black Sea Fleet in 2013.

80). The high-speed patrol boat P-834 of the project IC16MII - in 2013 became part of the Black Sea Fleet.

81). The high-speed patrol boat "P-835" of the project IC16MII - in 2013 became part of the Black Sea Fleet.

As we see, in fact, since 2012, the Russian Navy has really received at least 80 new combat units into its units. It is also worth noting that, according to preliminary data, no less than 6 airborne assault boats of the Project 02800 of the “Tavr” type have already been transferred to the Russian Navy, which in turn act both independently and as a regular unit of the new patrol ships of the Project 22160. For the near future until the end of 2019, according to the Russian Defense Ministry, it is planned to transfer at least 15 combat units to the Navy. Among them, the frigate of the project 22350, the PC of the project 22160, the MRK of the project 21631 and 22800, the submarine of the project 06363, the submarine of the projects 955A and 885, the MSCP of the project 12700, the PKA of the project 03160 and 024510 and the RAN of the project 21980 of the Rook type.

GarryB wrote:

Since 2012, more than 80 ships and boats have entered service.

Nice list... wasn't there talk of 160 new ships by 2023-2025 or something?

Probably includes non combat vessels also. During that same period of the 80 fighting vessels, there have been about 100 support vessels arrive also. Another factor that confuses the situation is the difference between a ship and a boat. Half those vessels on the list mentioned would be classified as a ship, while the rest are boats suitable for harbour and inshore operations only.

Vladimir79 wrote:

PapaDragon wrote:
...How did the French justify the infrastructure for building carriers?

Easy, they have you

Disrespect will not be tolerated.  Enjoy your time out.

When is said "you" I meant Russia as a country not you as an individual.

Why would I even refer to you personally in this context? It makes no sense.


I guess what kept eehenie in the game as long as it did was simple tidy sentence structure...



As for more elaborate answer:

Vladimir79 wrote:...How did the French justify the infrastructure for building carriers?

They justified it on account of simple fact that they (and rest of Europe) never lost track of their main objective which is to permanently take out Russia. 90s alone wouldn't do.

Russians on the other hand were happily listening to empty drivel about peace and cooperation while Europeans never stopped trying to wrap garotte around their necks and squeeze.

Keeping their eyes on the ball, that's how all those "needless" military expenses were justified. Not peacekeeping, not terrorism, not imperialism.

Just goood old primary target: Russia

They need Navy they are actually capable of building and supporting and without having to wait several decades to even get halfway there.

This means missile ships, corvettes and frigates.

Karakurts for missile ships. You always need padding.

Gorshkovs for corvettes. Reasons are obvious.

Derzkii/Mercury for frigates.

Steregushi has the equipment but short range. Gremashi has equipment and range but is overstuffed.

Then you have Mercury. Has equipment (AA system, anti-ship missiles, full anti-sub package, helicopter/missile container depending on need, speedboats), has range, has better propulsion (and local one) and plenty of room for whatever comes up down the road including drones.

The moment they put Mercury in the water and confirm it it floats they should discontinue other two and fully switch to Mercury class.


And most importantly: these ships can be built in more than one shipyard.


Look at Karakurts and Bykovs: they are fastest growing ship classes precisely because you have more than one shipyard on the job. And you can get benefits of having competition between shipyards this way and reward good ones with more contracts.

No wonder UEC is fuming over Pella. They are making them look bad by bringing attention to their incompetence. It would be even better if they gave Pella contract for corvette like Mercury. Direct competition.

Nuclear destroyers or (God forbid) carriers will be built exclusively by one shipyard, it will be crazy slow, costs wil skyrocket as always, there will be no oversight because it will be too big to fail in case of carrier (which it will) and in they end they will only have handful of them at best after insane amount of time. Just look at Kirovs for reference.