Russia Defence Forum

Would you like to react to this message? Create an account in a few clicks or log in to continue.

Military Forum for Russian and Global Defence Issues


    F-35 Development and News Thread:

    GarryB
    GarryB

    Posts : 28753
    Points : 29283
    Join date : 2010-03-30
    Location : New Zealand

    F-35 Development and News Thread: - Page 26 Empty Re: F-35 Development and News Thread:

    Post  GarryB Thu Mar 25, 2021 4:31 am


    I would like to know how they even managed this.

    Many gunpods are angled upwards to loft the rounds high into the air so they drop back down into the line of sight when they reach the target which might be 1-2km away for ground targets.

    Cannon shells can leave the barrel at very high velocities but most cannon rounds are filled with HE which is not very dense like lead or steel, so they tend to be large high drag projectiles that are not particularly heavy so they slow down fast.

    A 5.56mm HATO round leaves a rifles muzzle at about 920m/s or about mach 3 but within about 500m of travel the bullet will be travelling at 510m/s and it is a slim aerodynamic shape with a heavy lead core.

    A 30mm cannon round or a 20mm cannon round is going to slow down fast too... and being in a gun pod it wont be a subcalibre high velocity round...

    So high trajectory for shooting at distant targets on the ground in a steady dive means sometimes an aircraft can easily catch up with the rounds it is firing.

    Can be made rather worse with low velocity rounds like the 30mm calibre round of the Apache or a 40mm grenade launcher round which is launched at a low velocity anyway.
    Godric
    Godric

    Posts : 591
    Points : 611
    Join date : 2015-04-30
    Location : Alba (Scotland)

    F-35 Development and News Thread: - Page 26 Empty Re: F-35 Development and News Thread:

    Post  Godric Thu Mar 25, 2021 6:03 pm

    kvs wrote:
    magnumcromagnon wrote:Are vassals given the option to use Vaseline? Wink
    New SG MOD paper:"Most importantly,any foreign operator of the F-35 JSF will undoubtedly be at the mercy of the US Government should they decide to switch off local access to the ALIS whenever they ever disagree with how the made-in-USA jets are deployed."

    https://www.mindef.gov.sg/oms/safti/pointer/documents/pdf/monthlyissue/jan2021.pdf

    https://twitter.com/TheDEWLine/status/1370920756440395778

    Where is all the pride of America's "allies" who submit to having a leash put around their necks?

    Maybe instead of foaming at the mouth with hate for Russia, they should grow a spine.

    those made in America jets come with a kill switch installed curtesy of Uncle Sam

    and they told/warned the Pakistanis they couldn't use their F-16s against India in their recent dust off

    what's the point of buying something when you have no control over which you bought it's a bit like UK and it's nukes as the soon to be rUK cannot use their nukes without the say so of Uncle Sam because the delivery package is made in the USA and the UK only leases them from America ... NATO is a America's con job on Europe

    GarryB and Backman like this post

    lyle6
    lyle6

    Posts : 472
    Points : 474
    Join date : 2020-09-14
    Location : Philippines

    F-35 Development and News Thread: - Page 26 Empty Re: F-35 Development and News Thread:

    Post  lyle6 Fri Mar 26, 2021 5:36 am

    The jokes write themselves. The UK can't even vaporize Moscow without prior authorization from the US Razz
    I expect bowel movements have to have a license in that country soon enough.

    But yeah, trying for US jets is just asking for trouble. Not only are you effectively leasing your aircraft, you also have to pay to send your best pilots to the US for training. Months even years spent in a foreign country where you can't monitor or police the people around your pilots. If that isn't a recipe for subversion I don't know what is. Turkey might be on to something obtaining a Russian SAM as a sort of praetorian guard against unreliable US trained pilot cadre.

    GarryB, LMFS and Hole like this post

    AlfaT8
    AlfaT8

    Posts : 2066
    Points : 2059
    Join date : 2013-02-02

    F-35 Development and News Thread: - Page 26 Empty Re: F-35 Development and News Thread:

    Post  AlfaT8 Wed Mar 31, 2021 10:25 pm

    GarryB
    GarryB

    Posts : 28753
    Points : 29283
    Join date : 2010-03-30
    Location : New Zealand

    F-35 Development and News Thread: - Page 26 Empty Re: F-35 Development and News Thread:

    Post  GarryB Thu Apr 01, 2021 6:26 am

    Explosive rounds that explode near the muzzle is also a problem, but more a problem with ammo rather than the aircraft.

    I remember seeing damage on a Kamov Ka-50 or 52 where a fired HE round had exploded as it was fired...

    Possibly an EM situation with radar or radio interference with the fuse in the projectile, but most such rounds have a safety delay so the round does not go live till it has travelled a few tens of metres from the muzzle.
    George1
    George1

    Posts : 15992
    Points : 16489
    Join date : 2011-12-22
    Location : Greece

    F-35 Development and News Thread: - Page 26 Empty Re: F-35 Development and News Thread:

    Post  George1 Fri Apr 09, 2021 10:02 pm

    Another European country has received an American fifth-generation fighter, the F-35A. The first fighter was handed over to the Danish Air Force.

    Denmark received its first F-35 from 27 fighters ordered. The rollout and handover of the aircraft took place on April 7 at the Lockheed Martin facility in Fort Worth, Texas. Despite the official handover, the aircraft will remain in the United States and will operate at Luke Air Force Base in Arizona, where Danish pilots will be trained. Five more F-35As of the Danish Air Force will also go there.

    https://en.topwar.ru/181779-pervyj-iz-dvadcati-semi-danija-poluchila-na-vooruzhenie-amerikanskij-istrebitel-f-35a.html
    magnumcromagnon
    magnumcromagnon

    Posts : 7294
    Points : 7443
    Join date : 2013-12-05
    Location : Pindos ave., Pindosville, Pindosylvania, Pindostan

    F-35 Development and News Thread: - Page 26 Empty Re: F-35 Development and News Thread:

    Post  magnumcromagnon Tue Apr 13, 2021 2:45 am

    All those years draining the ballsack of Lockedroom Farting Lockheed Martin, The Drivel is feeling remorseful! lol1 clown Razz

    Today's F-35As Not Worth Including In High-End War Games According To Air Force General

    LMFS and Hole like this post

    lancelot
    lancelot

    Posts : 179
    Points : 181
    Join date : 2020-10-18

    F-35 Development and News Thread: - Page 26 Empty Re: F-35 Development and News Thread:

    Post  lancelot Tue Apr 13, 2021 4:00 am

    You would be wrong. Joseph Trevithick is a long standing F-35 hater.
    magnumcromagnon
    magnumcromagnon

    Posts : 7294
    Points : 7443
    Join date : 2013-12-05
    Location : Pindos ave., Pindosville, Pindosylvania, Pindostan

    F-35 Development and News Thread: - Page 26 Empty Re: F-35 Development and News Thread:

    Post  magnumcromagnon Tue Apr 13, 2021 3:18 pm

    lancelot wrote:You would be wrong. Joseph Trevithick is a long standing F-35 hater.

    Whether it's true or not, I wouldn't know because I don't really follow Western urinalists, and most of the time The Drivel's editorial board has been routinely caught deepthroating Lockheed Martin sausage. Suffice to say I don't care either way. Whether they're 'for' or 'against' the F-35 quagmire, I just love to take shots at Lockheed fanboy's every chance I get! Wink thumbsup

    kvs, Godric, Hole and Backman like this post

    magnumcromagnon
    magnumcromagnon

    Posts : 7294
    Points : 7443
    Join date : 2013-12-05
    Location : Pindos ave., Pindosville, Pindosylvania, Pindostan

    F-35 Development and News Thread: - Page 26 Empty Re: F-35 Development and News Thread:

    Post  magnumcromagnon Fri Apr 16, 2021 11:20 pm

    “The operating costs of the F-35 are high because they are designed to be” interview with Dan Grazier from the Project On Government Oversight

    LMFS and Backman like this post

    LMFS
    LMFS

    Posts : 3368
    Points : 3370
    Join date : 2018-03-03

    F-35 Development and News Thread: - Page 26 Empty Re: F-35 Development and News Thread:

    Post  LMFS Sat Apr 17, 2021 12:04 am

    Hahaha, that interview is gold:

    “The real costs of all the F-35 variants can be found in the service’s budget documents, all of which are available online. The F-35A cost $110.3 million per aircraft in 2020, the F-35B $135.8 million, and the F-35C $117.3 million. These costs differ significantly from the advertised prices. The difference is that all the costs necessary to build each aircraft are spread across multiple budget years. The services budget for advance procurement to purchase components in earlier years, but then claim that the money spent in the actual production year is the total cost which is definitely not the case. This is a deliberate public relations ploy to make the F-35 look better on paper and make it appear as though the program is meeting its cost goals.”

    I was not aware of that one... good trick, as you would expect it from the expert scammers at the US MIC thumbsup

    magnumcromagnon, JohninMK, Hole, lyle6 and lancelot like this post

    Backman
    Backman

    Posts : 629
    Points : 637
    Join date : 2020-11-11

    F-35 Development and News Thread: - Page 26 Empty Re: F-35 Development and News Thread:

    Post  Backman Sat Apr 17, 2021 1:51 am

    LMFS wrote:Hahaha, that interview is gold:

    “The real costs of all the F-35 variants can be found in the service’s budget documents, all of which are available online. The F-35A cost $110.3 million per aircraft in 2020, the F-35B $135.8 million, and the F-35C $117.3 million. These costs differ significantly from the advertised prices. The difference is that all the costs necessary to build each aircraft are spread across multiple budget years. The services budget for advance procurement to purchase components in earlier years, but then claim that the money spent in the actual production year is the total cost which is definitely not the case. This is a deliberate public relations ploy to make the F-35 look better on paper and make it appear as though the program is meeting its cost goals.”



    We know this but when you go on other non Russia specific forum, there will be Yanqui fanboys saying that the F-35 is cheaper than the su 57. No No They say it with a straight face. A poster by the name of SpudmanWP on Key Pub always posted these fictitious F-35 prices. He was never that bad of a poster. But even he drank the Kool Aid. They could at least keep the lier price above a 100 million so we could pretend to believe it but nope. They really believe that the high rate of production gets the cost down that much.

    "Hey man Turkey should get F-35 because its cheaper than su 57" censored

    magnumcromagnon likes this post

    LMFS
    LMFS

    Posts : 3368
    Points : 3370
    Join date : 2018-03-03

    F-35 Development and News Thread: - Page 26 Empty Re: F-35 Development and News Thread:

    Post  LMFS Sat Apr 17, 2021 4:09 am

    Backman wrote:We know this but when you go on other non Russia specific forum, there will be Yanqui fanboys saying that the F-35 is cheaper than the su 57. No No They say it with a straight face. A poster by the name of SpudmanWP on Key Pub always posted these fictitious F-35 prices. He was never that bad of a poster. But even he drank the Kool Aid. They could at least keep the lier price above a 100 million so we could pretend to believe it but nope. They really believe that the high rate of production gets the cost down that much.

    "Hey man Turkey should get F-35 because its cheaper than su 57" censored

    The moment they started in compulsively hyping the price reduction of the plane per successive lot it was clear that the program was under big pressure... hardly surprising that those prices were not true either, accordingly with a program which is a true manual of worst practises and malfeasance.

    As for those arrogant idiots that still have not understood that Russia buy their planes in Rubles and hysterically deny a Su-35 can cost roughly the same than the engine on the F-35B, they should first get beyond their functional illiteracy to even be worth listening, they don't have a clue what they talk about. There was one of them that until now is 200% sure the VKS will buy the J-31 in despair because of the abject failure of the Su-57, I kid you not... Suspect

    magnumcromagnon, Hole and lancelot like this post

    LMFS
    LMFS

    Posts : 3368
    Points : 3370
    Join date : 2018-03-03

    F-35 Development and News Thread: - Page 26 Empty Re: F-35 Development and News Thread:

    Post  LMFS Sat Apr 17, 2021 5:17 am

    I have become an instant fan of this Dan Grazier, he simply demolishes the F-35 in the interview above and runs this organization POGO with great information on the program:

    https://www.pogo.org/analysis/2021/04/f-35-changes-needed-while-still-in-infancy/

    Well done Sir thumbsup
    GarryB
    GarryB

    Posts : 28753
    Points : 29283
    Join date : 2010-03-30
    Location : New Zealand

    F-35 Development and News Thread: - Page 26 Empty Re: F-35 Development and News Thread:

    Post  GarryB Sat Apr 17, 2021 11:25 am

    They really believe that the high rate of production gets the cost down that much.

    Yeah, mass production only makes things cheaper when you have finalised and essentially fixed the design... when you have made 500 and they still don't work properly then production actually makes things work because every one you make might need to go back to the factory to get something fixed which is never cheap.

    ahmedfire and LMFS like this post

    JohninMK
    JohninMK

    Posts : 8693
    Points : 8786
    Join date : 2015-06-16
    Location : England

    F-35 Development and News Thread: - Page 26 Empty Re: F-35 Development and News Thread:

    Post  JohninMK Sat Apr 17, 2021 11:52 am

    GarryB wrote:
    They really believe that the high rate of production gets the cost down that much.

    Yeah, mass production only makes things cheaper when you have finalised and essentially fixed the design... when you have made 500 and they still don't work properly then production actually makes things work because every one you make might need to go back to the factory to get something fixed which is never cheap.

    And the foreign customers are probably stuck with the mod level they got delivered. Which could give interoperability issues. Wonder how different the Danish ones are from the Norwegians next door?

    GarryB likes this post

    magnumcromagnon
    magnumcromagnon

    Posts : 7294
    Points : 7443
    Join date : 2013-12-05
    Location : Pindos ave., Pindosville, Pindosylvania, Pindostan

    F-35 Development and News Thread: - Page 26 Empty Re: F-35 Development and News Thread:

    Post  magnumcromagnon Sat Apr 17, 2021 9:49 pm

    JohninMK wrote:
    GarryB wrote:
    They really believe that the high rate of production gets the cost down that much.

    Yeah, mass production only makes things cheaper when you have finalised and essentially fixed the design... when you have made 500 and they still don't work properly then production actually makes things work because every one you make might need to go back to the factory to get something fixed which is never cheap.

    And the foreign customers are probably stuck with the mod level they got delivered. Which could give interoperability issues. Wonder how different the Danish ones are from the Norwegians next door?

    It doesn't matter, they have full-blown Quisling regimes....their leaders don't care, and Uncle Sham will tell them to jump and they'll say "How high?" These Scandinavians are going to get bent, and get pumped full of Uncle Sham's 'lutefisk!'

    Backman likes this post

    JohninMK
    JohninMK

    Posts : 8693
    Points : 8786
    Join date : 2015-06-16
    Location : England

    F-35 Development and News Thread: - Page 26 Empty Re: F-35 Development and News Thread:

    Post  JohninMK Sat Apr 17, 2021 11:31 pm

    magnumcromagnon wrote: These Scandinavians are going to get bent, and get pumped full of Uncle Sham's 'lutefisk!'

    That was cruel reminding me. Have you ever tasted lutefisk?

    Sponsored content

    F-35 Development and News Thread: - Page 26 Empty Re: F-35 Development and News Thread:

    Post  Sponsored content


      Current date/time is Fri Apr 23, 2021 1:30 pm