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    Common Lies, Russophobia, Nonsense on Russia

    sepheronx
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    Post  sepheronx on Mon Aug 31, 2009 8:07 am


    Africans 'under siege' in Moscow
    A woman walks past graffiti reading "We love you!" with a swastika mocking migrants
    Many African students in Moscow are afraid to go outside

    Nearly 60% of black and African people living in Russia's capital Moscow have been physically assaulted in racially motivated attacks, says a new study.

    Africans working or studying in the city live in constant fear of attack, according to the report by the Moscow Protestant Chaplaincy.

    A quarter of 200 people surveyed said they had been assaulted more than once. Some 80% had been verbally abused.

    But the number of assaults was down from the MPC's last survey in 2002.

    The report's clear conclusion was that Africans living in Russia exist in a state of virtual siege, says the BBC's Rupert Wingfield Hayes in Moscow.

    Extreme violence

    Many of the African respondents said they:

       * Avoided using the Moscow metro
       * Were also careful to avoid crowded public places
       * Did not go out on Russian national holidays or on days when there were football matches

    Many of the attacks on Africans were pre-meditated and extremely violent, the report found.

    One Nigerian migrant interviewed by the BBC had been repeatedly stabbed in the back and then shot.

    Another man said his attacker had attempted to remove his scalp.

    Officially there are some 10,000 Africans living in Moscow, but far more are believed to live there illegally - many as economic migrants.

    The Moscow Protestant Chaplaincy is an English-speaking interdenominational Christian congregation that has ministered to Moscow's foreign community since 1962.

    I put this into question.  First off, I do not see any other news source to this other then BBC.

    Second, these immigrants in Russia they interviewed, are they now living in England or what?  Cause if they are, then they could also be people extending the truth?  I know skinheads exist everywhere (there are tons in Calgary, Alberta (here), but they are never mentioned.  I have a feeling that this whole statistic is thrown way out of proportion.  But then again, that is what news is good at doing.  Did you know 70% of statistics are made on the spot?  See what I am getting at?  Easy to fabricate the truth.

    Edit: Also, it seems that this article did its job in providing fuel for the fire for all Russophobes I noticed on other forums.  They are now going around saying "Russia needs to do something about immigrants being scalped" and so on.  Funny thing is, who knows if it was a racily motivated attack?  What if it was just a real screwed up guy?  BBC wont say that nor will the russophobes.  They now act as if Scalping is an every day business in Russia.  And this is where our western nations and East will never get along; the stupid will always hate Russia and Russia will always hate us.  To be honest, I don't blame Russia hating us, all our papers and politicians say is how evil they are.  Maybe we should take a look in the mirror sometime.

    Edit 2: Now I re-read this, and saw where the interviews are coming from.  Now, if someone from Russia that can tell me about this group, and what they are like?  An english speaking group in Russia?  Usually these groups are hired goons also known as "the free press" and "Humanitarians"


    Last edited by sepheronx on Mon Aug 31, 2009 8:17 am; edited 1 time in total
    Viktor
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    Post  Viktor on Mon Aug 31, 2009 8:16 am

    I guess in any city in the world you can find to beaten up foreign students thus making mockery of any state in the world. I would not take it to mutch to the heart.
    sepheronx
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    Post  sepheronx on Mon Aug 31, 2009 8:18 am

    Viktor wrote:I guess in any city in the world you can find to beaten up foreign students thus making mockery of any state in the world. I would not take it to mutch to the heart.

    I ain't, but a lot of russophobes are. And I just want info about this "group" that did the interview, and see what their past records are like.
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    Post  Vladimir79 on Mon Aug 31, 2009 12:27 pm

    I wouldn't put too much stock into it. This Amerikan protestant group is trying to make it look worse than it really is. I will admit, illegals of different races will be attacked often. The tactic, ask for valid ID. The people they survey are illegals who frequent their church while they harbour illegals.
    sepheronx
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    Post  sepheronx on Mon Aug 31, 2009 4:55 pm

    Makes sense vlad. All I know is that it seems that whatever happens in Russia (like it would happen here in Canada or worst, the USA) gets more attention. Racial attacks in the USA will happen all the time, like in the poorer areas of USA and if you are white and not Hispanic or black, you would either get beaten or end up dead. Does that ever get media attention? Maybe in the movies.
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    Common Lies, Russophobia, Nonsense on Russia Empty Movie Russians need to Rebut

    Post  nightcrawler on Sat Jun 25, 2011 1:45 pm

    @ http://www.imdb.com/title/tt1486193/
    The movie is very good on action & war machine visuals & depicts russian machinery on a large scale...but what about facts.

    Movie starts & claims to be factual so I want some clarification from Russian sides about the said FACTUAL genocides by the Russian military in Georgia. Plus I also want some answers that was it the oil pipe line that Russian feared to be handed over to west that led to conflict
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    Post  Pervius on Sun Jun 26, 2011 11:47 am

    If Americans knew they were suffering because of all the US dollars and exports being sent to Georgia to buy them off as their friends......the US would be no more.


    Not even Russia has stooped so low. Americans themselves would be over in Georgia killing them. How much are those Georgian boys getting paid to work for DOD in Iraq? Really....gave them US Civil Servant positions?....thought those jobs were reserved for Americans....ahhhh I see....

    Hmmmm...see the Georgians making lots of Youtube video's driving around their new Japanese atvs that usually were sold in America....wow.....


    America's suffering right now because the money's being used to buy friends around the world. Bill Clinton's Quadrennial Defense Review cut US military and used Billions over the years buying off dictators and countries.....awww...Americans lost their jobs? No homes?

    It's ok....maybe they will end up America's friend....maybe they are like Vietnam and playing America as the sucker handing out free things trying to be their friends now.


    ""Genocide""....really? Why were +1 million Iraqi's killed? mmmmm oil.
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    Post  GarryB on Sun Jun 26, 2011 5:06 pm

    Movie starts & claims to be factual so I want some clarification from Russian sides about the said FACTUAL genocides by the Russian military in Georgia. Plus I also want some answers that was it the oil pipe line that Russian feared to be handed over to west that led to conflict

    First of all if the oil pipeline led to the conflict... why was it that it was Georgia that invaded South Ossetia and not Russia invading Georgia?

    I haven't seen the movie but the claim initially from Georgia was that Russian forces were moving into South Ossetia in a big invasion.

    The question then of course is how could the Georgian forces amass a force large enough not only to stop this Russian force but also push them back and hold them long enough to bombard the South Ossetian capital for 2 nights before the Russian forces so decisively pushed them back?

    If the Georgians were fighting front line Russian armour why was most of their equipment and weapons artillery?


    The facts are there was no Russian attack... it was a planned Georgian attack timed specifically to coincide with the opening ceremony of the olympic games in China... typically and traditionally a time of ceasefires and peace rather than a chance to invade and murder.

    The Georgians used artillery because as far as they knew there were only some Russian paratroopers there are peace keepers and rather than fight them one on one they wanted to fight from a distance with artillery knowing their enemy had no heavy weapons.

    Paratroops dropped behind enemy lines are generally dealt with the same way as they are usually well trained troops so firing at them with artillery is usually the best way to deal with them rather than drawing front line well equipped troops from the front to deal with them.

    If the Georgians had ANY evidence of genocide they would have taken it to the various EU courts. They had no evidence at all... which is little surprise... they had been using UAVs to recon South Ossetia and Abkhazia for months before and now we know why... they wanted targets for their artillery and attacks.


    And finally why would Russia "fear" a western pipeline through Georgia?

    Have they bombed Iran?

    Iran has pipelines taking oil from the Caspian Sea too. The west had no access to oil reserves there but Georgia offered a chance for them to take oil from the region... big deal. Hardly a problem for Russia.

    It is a B movie for Rambo fans. Evil Ruskies are coming!
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    Post  Pervius on Tue Jun 28, 2011 11:56 am

    This was my favorite photo of the whole conflict:

    http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/europe/russia-seizes-us-vehicles-902432.html

    What a piece of crap that vehicle is eh? But 5 were free! Were they ever given back to the US? I find no news story since 2008.
    GarryB
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    Post  GarryB on Tue Jun 28, 2011 8:39 pm

    The humvees were a bit of a joke when they first came out.

    Their whole purpose was to replace the Jeep with something that was supposed to be a cross between an MRAP and a range rover.

    In other words a protected vehicle that could go anywhere.

    The result was a huge vehicle that was hard to manouver in narrow streets that was very heavy but not actually an armoured vehicle except in the even heavier armoured models that drank fuel like a sailor drinks booze.

    AFAIK they were not returned... and neither should they be. When was the last time the west returned anything that was captured in war?
    solo.13mmfmj
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    Post  solo.13mmfmj on Tue Aug 16, 2011 9:05 pm

    A classical american style movie .The bad guy shoots the bribe gets killed stuff like that, special georgian forces kill lots of bad guys .
    The soldiers with the white bandana on the hand were chechen paramilitary fighting for Russia?
    Do georgians have any hind helicopters in Afghanistan?
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    Post  Pervius on Wed Aug 31, 2011 9:27 am

    solo.13mmfmj wrote:
    Do georgians have any hind helicopters in Afghanistan?


    It certainly is possible the Georgians were hired via a Contract...to fly US helicopters in Afghanistan.

    Would explain the loss of helicopters! ha ha ha!!
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    Common Lies, Russophobia, Nonsense on Russia Empty The "great" game Company of Heroes 2 and its historical facts

    Post  Werewolf on Sun Aug 11, 2013 9:57 am

    Just watch how poorly anti-russian propaganda in the game Company of Heroes portrayed russians as beasts that kill everything without logical sense.

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    Post  TR1 on Sun Aug 11, 2013 12:18 pm

    It is a dumb game, but pulling it from shelves is retarded.

    I mean, fucking and killing hookers (GTA) is ok, but historical inaccuracy isn't? Bad precedent.
    sepheronx
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    Common Lies, Russophobia, Nonsense on Russia Empty what's with the influx of anti-russia in the news and forums lately?

    Post  sepheronx on Sat Oct 19, 2013 7:23 pm

    Mp.net is being flooded with bullshit news and trolls lately. Reddit isn't better either. It is being targeted pretty rough lately. Guess maybe people are just jelly ;-)
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    Post  GarryB on Sat Oct 19, 2013 7:59 pm

    When they were having problems in the 1990s they were largely ignored... sounds to me like a bit of bitterness...

    Especially as now they clearly seem to be moving forward with their equipment upgrades while the west is cutting defence spending.

    For a lot of people in the west Russia is the enemy... just like for many in the west Germany and Japan is the enemy still... such things only change when generations die out.

    Perhaps when Russia starts expanding its space exploration and perhaps if the US realises it is cheaper to cooperate than compete the image of Russia might change, but I suspect when Russian soldiers are getting good training, are mostly professional forces and have all new equipment they might get the respect they deserve... maybe not.

    Hopefully WTO membership will allow Russian companies to take advantage of lower labour costs and offer high tech products that are more desirable than western equipment made in China.

    I also hope the Russian companies are smart enough to produce their new gear in new factories in Russia rather than what most western companies seem to want to do... make everything in China and make bigger profits.

    Why is making a bigger profit bad?

    Well a big company that pretends to be a western company that produces all its stuff in China is not benefitting that western country with jobs and without creating lots of jobs it is the rich shareholders that make the money from the local consumers buying the product... the money moves from the masses to the workers in China as pay and to local rich as shareholders... the only locals that make money are the transport companies and local retail outlets which usually pay their workers rubbish wages anyway.

    In other words China gets the investment and the skilled if underpaid workers, the country the company comes from get the products slightly cheaper and the rich get richer.
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    Post  GarryB on Sat Oct 19, 2013 8:01 pm

    If particular people on MPnet are getting outrageously anti Russian you could ask them if they are members of Greenpeace... when they btch about greenpeace being a liberal lefty organisation then just comment you thought their anti russian outbursts might be related to either the greenpeace piracy incident or the the anti gay laws Putin is passing... Razz  Clearly it was the latter. Twisted Evil 
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    Post  SOC on Sat Oct 19, 2013 9:34 pm

    sepheronx wrote:Mp.net is being flooded with bullshit news and trolls lately.
    "Lately"?

    I don't know which forum is more ridiculous, that place or ATS.
    sepheronx
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    Post  sepheronx on Sat Oct 19, 2013 10:11 pm

    It's pretty funny though. Even Russian members bashing their own country over small things, or expats bashing the government of the country for trivial things.

    The belief I have regarding many Russians is that they are cynical in nature. I have noticed it within my family as well. So maybe it is that cynicism that shows. I know not everything is perfect and it will never be, but from outside perspective, sounds like things are significantly better than it was 10+ years ago.
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    Post  Deep Throat on Sun Oct 20, 2013 9:03 am

    MP.net ? The number of anti Russians posts are by and large the same as they were a couple of years ago as are anti Iran posts.

    Over the last few years anti Syria , India and China posts have gone up drastically .

    To be sure , there is no consistency in those posts . They condemn Islamic terrorism on one hand & on the other hand they support Syrian militias .
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    Post  Regular on Wed Oct 23, 2013 1:32 pm

    I don't know, Russians criticizing Russia are fair game as they re using their rights to do so. There are some constructive critics like Ash for example. Russians were always critical to themselves as long as I remember. "Only in Russia" is one of lightest saying used by Russians in WTF moments.

    New Russian generation brought back trends of chauvinism - almost on same level as British one in their finest days. Russian nationalism is too extreme to my taste. Eastern European nationalism in general is .. let's say, immature.

    I don't see nothing wrong with other people criticizing/making fun of Russia as Russians themselves make fun of other countries too. Pindosi, fat Americans, fags, Georgians, churki and etc.
    No need to get Your panties in a twist about it. Poland is being mocked no less than Russia
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    sepheronx
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    Post  sepheronx on Wed Oct 23, 2013 1:58 pm

    Very true. I like Ash as he is critical but constructive. Some other members are just too extreme imo.
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    Post  GarryB on Thu Oct 24, 2013 12:03 am

    There is constructive criticism and there is the ignorance of stereotypes.

    It seems if you have any sympathy towards Russia you are a communist and every communist is of course Joseph Stalin in disguise.

    But they are happy with their stereotypes because everything western is good and cannot be scrutinised, everything in Russia is bad and with no redeeming features.. obviously because the west is all about truth and justice and democracy and the commies are all about oppression and gulags and of course corruption.
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    Post  flamming_python on Thu Oct 24, 2013 1:39 am

    GarryB wrote:There is constructive criticism and there is the ignorance of stereotypes.

    It seems if you have any sympathy towards Russia you are a communist and every communist is of course Joseph Stalin in disguise.

    But they are happy with their stereotypes because everything western is good and cannot be scrutinised, everything in Russia is bad and with no redeeming features.. obviously because the west is all about truth and justice and democracy and the commies are all about oppression and gulags and of course corruption.
    To be fair there aren't that many people on mp.net with those sort of views; most people are reasonable and open to debate - many are friendly to Russia because in their view - they are at war with Islamic terrorism and Russia is an ally.
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    Post  macedonian on Thu Oct 24, 2013 10:42 am

    flamming_python wrote:To be fair there aren't that many people on mp.net with those sort of views; most people are reasonable and open to debate - many are friendly to Russia because in their view - they are at war with Islamic terrorism and Russia is an ally.
    Mhm?...nevermind...we're probably thinking of different mp.net... afro

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