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    2020 Nagorno-Karabakh war #2

    miketheterrible
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    Post  miketheterrible Sun Nov 01, 2020 7:26 pm

    Armenia isn't doing anything. They can send weapons and men, officially. They haven't. They won't get hit by turkey or Azerbaijan because of Russia and CSTO.

    So no, there is plenty Armenia can do but won't do it.

    kvs and lyle6 like this post

    chinggis
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    Post  chinggis Sun Nov 01, 2020 8:46 pm

    [quote="franco"]Battle Lost: What "Post-War Armenia" Will Look Like

    Franco, this is rely good post, who is write it or say it?
    franco
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    Post  franco Sun Nov 01, 2020 9:22 pm

    chinggis wrote:
    franco wrote:Battle Lost: What "Post-War Armenia" Will Look Like

    Franco, this is rely good post, who is write it or say it?

    Sorry, it was a link off a link and in Russian hence the translated version fully posted. I probably looked at 12 or more of them at that time and unfortunately cannot locate the original at this time.
    lyle6
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    Post  lyle6 Sun Nov 01, 2020 9:42 pm

    chinggis wrote:

    Franco, this is rely good post, who is write it or say it?


    Try this:
    https://topcor.ru/17105-proigrannaja-bitva-kak-budet-vygljadet-poslevoennaja-armenija.html?utm_source=politobzor.net

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    LMFS
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    Post  LMFS Sun Nov 01, 2020 10:06 pm

    miketheterrible wrote:Armenia isn't doing anything.  They can send weapons and men, officially. They haven't.  They won't get hit by turkey or Azerbaijan because of Russia and CSTO.

    So no, there is plenty Armenia can do but won't do it.

    Some analysts are even claiming that Russia is not being honest, since Armenian territory has been "attacked" by Azerbaijan already in some occasions in this war, but if that is the case, then why is Armenian military not engaging Azeri troops proper? Why are they not moving things at the UNSC to get NK recognized? Why no referendum under conditions of threat for the Armenian population there? They are not moving a finger either politically or militarily but expect Russia to be their bitches, honestly they can go to hell...

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    Tsavo Lion
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    Post  Tsavo Lion Sun Nov 01, 2020 10:19 pm

    I'm sure Armenians r sending people & arms/ammo,etc. to NK- they r under the martial law & general/total mobilization, with Ks of volunteers signing up to join the army.

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    kvs
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    Post  kvs Sun Nov 01, 2020 10:59 pm

    Tsavo Lion wrote:I'm sure Armenians r sending people & arms/ammo,etc. to NK- they r under the martial law & general/total mobilization, with Ks of volunteers signing up to join the army.

    And I am sure that Russia is giving covert support.

    So let's cut the crap about Russia failing to help Armenia in this thread.

    If people want Russia to get involved overtly, then Armenia has to first.

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    Tai Hai Chen
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    Post  Tai Hai Chen Sun Nov 01, 2020 11:23 pm

    Armenians fighting like lions in Karabakh. Azerbaijanis suffering heavy losses. Nearly 1200 documented KIA in only 1 month. That's some mighty high casualties for a country of only 9 million people. Azerbaijani offensive running out of steam after getting lured into mountain.

    https://m.facebook.com/herbimedia/
    LMFS
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    Post  LMFS Mon Nov 02, 2020 12:04 am

    Tsavo Lion wrote:I'm sure Armenians r sending people & arms/ammo,etc. to NK- they r under the martial law & general/total mobilization, with Ks of volunteers signing up to join the army.

    They don't need to do anything undercover and much less let their youth and responsible citizens get killed while their military is idle in the face of claimed attacks against their territory and their diplomats indulge in making empty statements. There are conditions in the UN charter they can invoke to recognise NK, it is their brethren in the end that are getting slaughtered and losing their land. These are the deeds of a treacherous government and Russia can plainly see through their rethoric
    Tai Hai Chen
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    Post  Tai Hai Chen Mon Nov 02, 2020 12:12 am

    Turkic genocidal aggression against Christians laid bare for all the world to see. Time for Russia to act. Azerbaijan is Russia's enemy. Turkey is Russia's enemy. Unlike Armenia which votes in Russia's favor at UNGA, Azerbaijan and Turkey vote against Russia at UNGA.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_Nations_General_Assembly_Resolution_68/262

    Captured Syrian terrorist says they were promised additional $100 for each head of "infidels" (video)

    Tai Hai Chen
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    Post  Tai Hai Chen Mon Nov 02, 2020 12:17 am

    Azerbaijanis bomb Armenia proper and Russians are chilling. Russians be like. Ah heck, I didn't see that. Heck, even if Azerbaijani army marches on Yerevan Russians be like no way man I'm sure our Azerbaijani partners are merely trying to take back the Azerbaijani enclaves in Armenia. Pffft, whatever man. Whatever. Suspect

    https://twitter.com/301_AD/status/1322270515071995906

    https://twitter.com/301_AD/status/1322568789020545024
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    Post  nero Mon Nov 02, 2020 12:57 am

    It is beyond me how the Russian Foreign ministry keeps talking in regards to Turkey as a 'partner' when it is going directly against Russian interests by formulating alliances with Georgia, Ukraine and fighting Russia in Libya, Syria and the Caucasus.

    Here is a good post to read:

    Полковник Александр Жилин специально для канала «Военкор Котенок»:

    «Эрдоган готов воевать с Россией до последнего азербайджанца»

    По-моему, уже всем разумным от народа стало понятно, что вести всякие переговоры с Ильхамом Алиевым нет никакого смысла. Его полномочия подверглись обрезанию хозяином. Раджеп Эрдоган выстроил идеальную для себя схему. Заставив Алиева развязать карабахский военный конфликт, он зажёг бикфордов шнур войны против России на Кавказе и, при этом всю вину за происходящее возложил на Алиева, чья судьба предрешена. Судя по некоторым разведпризнакам, Эрдоган не прочь распространить войнушку затем и в Поволжье. Замечу, что в Афганистане подготовлены к наступлению вдоль Каспия значительные силы ИГИЛ, которые в своё время были выведены из-под нашего удара американцами и вывезены военно-транспортной авиацией США.

    Опытный и эффективный политик Эрдоган, чтобы о нём не говорили наши пропагандисты, действует решительно. Агрессия против Арцаха уже использована ним для превращения Азербайджана в свой военный ресурс, и он готов воевать до последнего азербайджанца не только в Арцахе, но и в других местах.
    Может ли Эрдоган решиться на военный конфликт с Россией? Безусловно. Не случайно ведь он накачивает Закавказье террористами. Это их руками турецкий президент может устроить кровавую баню на нашем Кавказе. Вот почему мы не имеем права бросить Армению-Арцах на растерзание, нравится кому-то в Кремле Пашинян или нет. Идёт проверка на слабо не Армении, а России!

    Замечу, что у нас никто не замечает стремительно крепнущего альянса Анкары и Киева. А на Украине, напомню, американские «партнёры» активно содействовали подготовке бойцов диверсионно-террористических подразделений. Сколько их было подготовлено за постмайданное время, один Бог знает. Таким образом, можно вести речь о консолидации антироссийских сил у наших границ.
    Что и кто стимулирует антироссийские силы к активным, даже безумным действиям? Ну, кроме наших извечных врагов? На мой взгляд, ​наша пассивная позиция. Сосредоточившись на глухой обороне в углу ринга, мы пытаемся уговаривать соперника повременить с нокаутом. Эрдоган, похоже, поверил в своё превосходство, в т.ч. при поддержке НАТО. Или кто-то думает, что в случае 14-й войны с Турцией НАТО поддержит нас?

    Глухая оборона, если за ней не последует встречный бой, приводит только к поражению.
    Поясню: я не призываю атаковать танками всех и вся. Речь идет об эффективных гибридных действиях. А это возможно, только если власть сформулирует образ будущего – за что воевать, образ победы – в чем его суть. А пока мы смахиваем на корабль без руля и ветрил.

    P.S. Сергей Шойгу против которого ополчилось либеральное крыло правительства, а главарь Минфина бьёт ВС РФ в спину, в одиночку решить все задачи национальной безопасности страны решить не в состоянии, будь он семи пядей во лбу…».

    I now seriously doubt that Russia will involve themselves in Armenia. It has been over a day since the Armenians invoked the 'Treaty of Friendship' (which is a similar treaty that Russia had/has with Syria) and there has been no real action to date.

    All the while Turkey bolsters it's forces in Idlib... They have even claimed that they consider these territories as 'theirs'. I wonder when will they consider Crimea as 'theirs' and will start to cause all kinds of misery? They are already plan to build a drone factory in Ukraine...

    And yet Putin ignores this, hoping for 'positive' dialogue with his Turkish partners. Continuing the same mistakes they've made with the United States and Europe. It is time to count your losses and move on.
    PapaDragon
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    Post  PapaDragon Mon Nov 02, 2020 12:57 am

    Tsavo Lion wrote:I'm sure Armenians r sending people & arms/ammo,etc. to NK- they r under the martial law & general/total mobilization, with Ks of volunteers signing up to join the army.

    That's all very nice, very nice indeed

    What is Armenian Military doing exactly?

    Last time I checked those Azeri oil facilities are still chugging along and those Armenian Iskanders are still in their garages

    And NK is still unrecognized by Armenian government



    Tsavo Lion wrote:Armenia can't do much more than she already does...

    Bullshit



    Tsavo Lion wrote:...w/o getting pounded by Azeris & Turks into submission- that's why her cries for help. Erevan has no strategic depth, surrounded by enemies, & in case of Georgia & Iran, collaborators on all sides. ...

    Getting pounded by Azerbaijan and Turks is precisely what would trigger Russian involvement, all Armenians need to do is to show some balls and get serious about this supposedly important issue

    But they don't want to do that do they because it could possibly upset Brussels and cause inconvenience for voters in Armenia



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    SeigSoloyvov
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    Post  SeigSoloyvov Mon Nov 02, 2020 12:59 am

    That doesn't look like a bombing at all....a couple of bullets holes is all.

    There would be much more damage if it was a proper strike, Twitter isn't evidence of anything.
    SeigSoloyvov
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    Post  SeigSoloyvov Mon Nov 02, 2020 1:01 am

    kvs wrote:
    Tsavo Lion wrote:I'm sure Armenians r sending people & arms/ammo,etc. to NK- they r under the martial law & general/total mobilization, with Ks of volunteers signing up to join the army.

    And I am sure that Russia is giving covert support.

    So let's cut the crap about Russia failing to help Armenia in this thread.  

    If people want Russia to get involved overtly, then Armenia has to first.


    Well do you have any evidence Russia is supplying NK? so maybe provide proof before you call something "BS"
    SeigSoloyvov
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    Post  SeigSoloyvov Mon Nov 02, 2020 1:03 am

    miketheterrible wrote:Armenia isn't doing anything.  They can send weapons and men, officially. They haven't.  They won't get hit by turkey or Azerbaijan because of Russia and CSTO.

    So no, there is plenty Armenia can do but won't do it.

    CSTO is a defensive org, if Armenia takes offensive action in NK, Russia is still under no obligation to support them.

    The Azeri's and Turk would be free to target their forces at that stage.
    PapaDragon
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    Post  PapaDragon Mon Nov 02, 2020 1:08 am

    nero wrote:It is beyond me how the Russian Foreign ministry keeps talking in regards to Turkey as a 'partner'...

    They call everyone partner, it doesn't mean anything

    Partner = bro, dude, buddy, guy, etc...



    nero wrote:Here is a good post to read:...

    It's in Russian



    nero wrote:I now seriously doubt that Russia will involve themselves in Armenia...

    Why would they involve themselves in Armenia?

    Nothing is happening in Armenia, Armenians are first who will tell you that



    nero wrote:And yet Putin ignores this, hoping for 'positive' dialogue with his Turkish partners...

    Turkish partners are being less insolent and two faced than Armenian 'brothers'



    nero wrote:It has been over a day since the Armenians invoked the 'Treaty of Friendship' (which is a similar treaty that Russia had/has with Syria) and there has been no real action to date...

    Treaty of friendship is not defensive pact and Armenia is not under military threat

    Military assistance would require them to invoke CSTO treaty but they have no conditions required to invoke it and even if they had it would upset Brussels so they won't be invoking it anyway



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    LMFS
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    Post  LMFS Mon Nov 02, 2020 1:29 am

    Tai Hai Chen wrote:Turkic genocidal aggression against Christians laid bare for all the world to see. Time for Russia to act. Azerbaijan is Russia's enemy. Turkey is Russia's enemy.

    I can feel your genuine Chinese outrage about all this  lol1

    Keep trying dude

    SeigSoloyvov wrote:Well do you have any evidence Russia is supplying NK? so maybe provide proof before you call something "BS"

    They supplied 50 tons of humanitarian help some days ago.

    https://news.am/eng/news/610421.html

    Hell, that goes even beyond that friendship treaty that essentially means nothing...

    PapaDragon wrote:
    Last time I checked those Azeri oil facilities are still chugging along and those Armenian Iskanders are still in their garages

    True, and their Su-30SM are parked while Azeri drones are used to humiliate them and even amidst constant claims of Turkish F-16 involvement in the fight... clown

    PapaDragon wrote:
    Nothing is happening in Armenia, Armenians are first who will tell you that

    Exactly!

    Man, some people and even entire countries have some serious reckoning in front of them when they realize Russia does not owe them shit and will act only when it is beneficial to them, not to please the whims of any arrogant foreign elites or even in reaction to some Russians' deep seated complex of guilt. Enough is enough.

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    Tai Hai Chen
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    Post  Tai Hai Chen Mon Nov 02, 2020 1:37 am

    nero wrote:It is beyond me how the Russian Foreign ministry keeps talking in regards to Turkey as a 'partner' when it is going directly against Russian interests by formulating alliances with Georgia, Ukraine and fighting Russia in Libya, Syria and the Caucasus.

    Here is a good post to read:

    Полковник Александр Жилин специально для канала «Военкор Котенок»:

    «Эрдоган готов воевать с Россией до последнего азербайджанца»

    По-моему, уже всем разумным от народа стало понятно, что вести всякие переговоры с Ильхамом Алиевым нет никакого смысла. Его полномочия подверглись обрезанию хозяином. Раджеп Эрдоган выстроил идеальную для себя схему. Заставив Алиева развязать карабахский военный конфликт, он зажёг бикфордов шнур войны против России на Кавказе и, при этом всю вину за происходящее возложил на Алиева, чья судьба предрешена. Судя по некоторым разведпризнакам, Эрдоган не прочь распространить войнушку затем и в Поволжье. Замечу, что в Афганистане подготовлены к наступлению вдоль Каспия значительные силы ИГИЛ, которые в своё время были выведены из-под нашего удара американцами и вывезены военно-транспортной авиацией США.

    Опытный и эффективный политик Эрдоган, чтобы о нём не говорили наши пропагандисты, действует решительно. Агрессия против Арцаха уже использована ним для превращения Азербайджана в свой военный ресурс, и он готов воевать до последнего азербайджанца не только в Арцахе, но и в других местах.
    Может ли Эрдоган решиться на военный конфликт с Россией? Безусловно. Не случайно ведь он накачивает Закавказье террористами. Это их руками турецкий президент может устроить кровавую баню на нашем Кавказе. Вот почему мы не имеем права бросить Армению-Арцах на растерзание, нравится кому-то в Кремле Пашинян или нет. Идёт проверка на слабо не Армении, а России!

    Замечу, что у нас никто не замечает стремительно крепнущего альянса Анкары и Киева. А на Украине, напомню, американские «партнёры» активно содействовали подготовке бойцов диверсионно-террористических подразделений. Сколько их было подготовлено за постмайданное время, один Бог знает. Таким образом, можно вести речь о консолидации антироссийских сил у наших границ.
    Что и кто стимулирует антироссийские силы к активным, даже безумным действиям? Ну, кроме наших извечных врагов? На мой взгляд, ​наша пассивная позиция. Сосредоточившись на глухой обороне в углу ринга, мы пытаемся уговаривать соперника повременить с нокаутом. Эрдоган, похоже, поверил в своё превосходство, в т.ч. при поддержке НАТО. Или кто-то думает, что в случае 14-й войны с Турцией НАТО поддержит нас?

    Глухая оборона, если за ней не последует встречный бой, приводит только к поражению.
    Поясню: я не призываю атаковать танками всех и вся. Речь идет об эффективных гибридных действиях. А это возможно, только если власть сформулирует образ будущего – за что воевать, образ победы – в чем его суть. А пока мы смахиваем на корабль без руля и ветрил.

    P.S. Сергей Шойгу против которого ополчилось либеральное крыло правительства, а главарь Минфина бьёт ВС РФ в спину, в одиночку решить все задачи национальной безопасности страны решить не в состоянии, будь он семи пядей во лбу…».

    I now seriously doubt that Russia will involve themselves in Armenia. It has been over a day since the Armenians invoked the 'Treaty of Friendship' (which is a similar treaty that Russia had/has with Syria) and there has been no real action to date.

    All the while Turkey bolsters it's forces in Idlib... They have even claimed that they consider these territories as 'theirs'. I wonder when will they consider Crimea as 'theirs' and will start to cause all kinds of misery? They are already plan to build a drone factory in Ukraine...

    And yet Putin ignores this, hoping for 'positive' dialogue with his Turkish partners. Continuing the same mistakes they've made with the United States and Europe. It is time to count your losses and move on.

    Turkey is far more dangerous to Russia and US and Europe. While the western world is democratic, Turkey is a dictatorship where drones are built by the thousands to take over the world.
    Tai Hai Chen
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    Post  Tai Hai Chen Mon Nov 02, 2020 1:38 am

    PapaDragon wrote:
    Tsavo Lion wrote:I'm sure Armenians r sending people & arms/ammo,etc. to NK- they r under the martial law & general/total mobilization, with Ks of volunteers signing up to join the army.

    That's all very nice, very nice indeed

    What is Armenian Military doing exactly?

    Last time I checked those Azeri oil facilities are still chugging along and those Armenian Iskanders are still in their garages

    And NK is still unrecognized by Armenian government



    Tsavo Lion wrote:Armenia can't do much more than she already does...

    Bullshit



    Tsavo Lion wrote:...w/o getting pounded by Azeris & Turks into submission- that's why her cries for help. Erevan has no strategic depth, surrounded by enemies, & in case of Georgia & Iran, collaborators on all sides. ...

    Getting pounded by Azerbaijan and Turks is precisely what would trigger Russian involvement, all Armenians need to do is to show some balls and get serious about this supposedly important issue

    But they don't want to do that do they because it could possibly upset Brussels and cause inconvenience for voters in Armenia




    NK is recognized by Armenia unofficially, the same way northern Syria is recognized by Turkey as part of Turkey unofficially. Pushinyan visted NK multiple times. His son served in NK. Can't say the same about Putin with regards to Donbas.
    Tai Hai Chen
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    Post  Tai Hai Chen Mon Nov 02, 2020 1:45 am

    Azerbaijan claims Turkish F-16 stationed in Azerbaijan shot down 2 Armenian air force Su-25. Meanwhile, Azerbaijani Su-25 pounding the crap out of Armenians using Turkey supplied laser guided bombs after Turkish TB2 took out Armenian AD.

    https://apa.az/en/frontline-news/Azerbaijani-MoD-Armenias-two-Su-25-attack-aircrafts-334219

    https://twitter.com/RALee85/status/1322975854985662464

    https://twitter.com/RALee85/status/1322982474536882177

    Turkish TB2 blasted 2 of Armenian army's 6 Smerch. That's gotta hurt.



    It's pretty clear by this point Armenians are no match for the Turkey + Azerbaijan Turkic duo. An invasion and annexation of Armenia the way Turkey did in northern Syria is in the cards if Russia is silent.
    SeigSoloyvov
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    Post  SeigSoloyvov Mon Nov 02, 2020 1:51 am

    50 tons is very little and I clearly mean weapons, not food or meds.
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    Post  PapaDragon Mon Nov 02, 2020 1:54 am


    Ultron AKA Tai Hai Chen is spamming again

    Mods requested


    miketheterrible likes this post

    Isos
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    Post  Isos Mon Nov 02, 2020 1:58 am

    SeigSoloyvov wrote:50 tons is very little and I clearly mean weapons, not food or meds.

    Depend what weapon. If only atgm or suicide drone that started to be used by SAA in Idlib then 50 tons represent a good amount of them.

    If it's ammo for artillery then it's nothing.
    Tai Hai Chen
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    Post  Tai Hai Chen Mon Nov 02, 2020 2:51 am

    Armenia should buy Orion drones from Russia to counter Azerbaijan's Turkish and Israeli drones.

    https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1320682528269881346




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