Syrian War: News #22

magnumcromagnon wrote:

Isos wrote:According to russians, syrian buk launched 25 missiles at turkish drones. They destroyed 20 of them, 3 missiles missed and i don't understand about the two other. It's a 80% Pk against drones.

On their official website they say a 70% Pk against cruise missiles which is a similar target than those turkish drones in terms of size.

Under a heavy ECM environment with the Turkish Koral deployed.

Except for the first two days of the Turkey's Operation Spring Shield ,where "tactical surprise" was achieved (in reality more similar to the term "backstab" with the Turkish forces, both within and outside the Syrian border, including majority of the UAV and UCAV involved in the initial phase of the operation, that had been allowed to stay in the area to monitor the situation on the ground second the previous trilateral accord that begun to attack suddenly Syrian Army's forces in theirs area of operation) has been a failure.

If ,in facts, in the first 36-40 hours of the operation, the sudden attack by parts of the Turkish forces, allowed to remain in the area for the previous accord, managed to inflict some noticeable damages on Syrian ground forces, in minor part directly by part of UCAV and theirs few low power ordnance and for the larger part by part of long range Turkish artillery fire corrected with the precise coordinates provided both by UAVs and ground forces at contact range with Syrian Army forces, the situation changed drammatically after those first hours when Syrian Forces declared no fly zone over Idlib and modified deployment and rules of engagement to cope with a conventional armed enemy.

Some launchers of Бук-М2Э was placed in the eastern area ,outside of the engagement footprint of turkish artillery and together with two lauchers of Панцирь-С1 (two had been damaged by combined effort of UCAV and artillery in the initial surprise attack) have generated unsustainable losses on turkish UAVs and UCAVs forcing them to operate mostly at night and at very low altitude mostly in the western Idlib area to reduce the rate of the losses.

Is very important to notice that what happened in those few dozen of hours in a limited area scenario (the forced modification of flight latitude of UAV and UCAV from mid/high to low/very low altitude) fully validate the accepted models developed by domestic military analysis insitutes on which the requirements for composition and modernization of old and creation of new samples of armaments has been based on.

Even a very very low number of export version of realtively modern SAM specimens (well under the minimum prescrived by domestic literature for coverage of ground operation of the magnitude of those in the Idlib governorate) and moreover devoid of organic EW and air support has been capable in a very short time to produce a number of downed UAV/UCAV high enough to modify the flight pact of surveillance UAVs and attack UAVs, as correctly foreseen in domestic models, toward very low altitude operations at night .

This fully validate the technical requirements put at the basis of the last decade improvement plan for Federation Ground Forces encoppassing capabilities by part of elements not pertaining to Air Defense and EW integrated in the armoured and mechanized regiments to be capable to independently destroy, day and night, low altitude flying objects using standard weapons using almost exclusively passive sensors or third party informations.

That capability effectively "close the circle" of defeat, designed to deprive the enemy of effective third party target designation for its long range weapons (air and ground delivered) without weigh-on furtherly on the shoulders of EW and air defense units that in this way can fully deal with long range PGM and delivery platforms.

Some important developments in that precise direction are:

- The introduction of standardized 57 mm caliber autocannons and passive optronic authomatic guidance not only in dedicated Деривация but also in the unmannned turrets of perspective БМП and БМПТ
- Massive introduction of "Верба" manpads in infantry formations
- The introduction of a new generation of gun and shoulder-launched guided missiles with dual anti-tank/anti air capabilities

Russia recaptured the location where Roman Filipov was shot down by Turkish army in 2018 and died heroically in combat against Turkish soldiers. A monument has been built at that location.

https://twitter.com/annanews_info/status/1240261183468339204

Step News Agency
@Step_Agency

An explosive device has exploded targeting an armored Turkish convoy near the village of Mambal west of Idlib and reports of injuries among Turkish soldiers and clashes are taking place between the "Guardians of the Faction" and the Turkish army in the village.


TURKISH CONVOY STRUCK WITH TWO IEDS IN WESTERN IDLIB. CASUALTIES REPORTED

O no! Buhu!

Are those "guardians" one of their proxies ?

Isos wrote:Are those "guardians" one of their proxies ?

Almost all groups there are Turkish proxies , some of them didn't agree on the Turkish Russian deal .

Update :

Russian defense: Two Turkish soldiers killed in clashes with terrorists in Idlib  on the "M4" road in Idlib, northwestern Syria

Pic from Turkish mod for the dead .

ahmedfire wrote:

Isos wrote:Are those "guardians" one of their proxies ?

Almost all groups there are Turkish proxies , some of them didn't agree on the Turkish Russian deal .

Update :

Russian defense: Two Turkish soldiers killed in clashes with terrorists in Idlib  on the "M4" road in Idlib, northwestern Syria

Pic from Turkish mod for the dead .

The chickens coming home to roost! Remember that time when ISIS/ISIL attacked Turkish Leo-2's?

For those groups, Turkey is a western country ... IMO Erdogan doesn't want them in Turkey neither. Now they lost agains SAA+Russia it's just a matter of time they start going in Turkey and ask for a Califat like what they manage to do with ISIS in syria/iraq. And he won't be able to send them all in Lybia.

The chickens coming home to roost! Remember that time when ISIS/ISIL attacked Turkish Leo-2's?

ISIS claims they destroyed at least 10 leo-2 tanks , after that they became friends with turkish intelligence

Green for us says Erdogan. No way Jose says Syria.

https://mobile.twitter.com/RALee85/status/1241088031974662149

Krasnopol in Syria. Deadly accuracy.

Bellow in comment more video and one video of ISIS drone launching hand grenades at russian PMC but total failure.

Isos wrote:https://mobile.twitter.com/RALee85/status/1241088031974662149

Krasnopol in Syria. Deadly accuracy.

Bellow in comment more video and one video of ISIS drone launching hand grenades at russian PMC but total failure.

Laser illuminated by UAV ?

Yes.

Edit: I wonder if all are krasnopol. Russia also mroduce guided rounds for 120mm and 122mm guns.

JohninMK wrote:Green for us says Erdogan. No way Jose says Syria.

Map is well obsolete. Doesn't show any of the recent SAA gains in Turkorat Idlibistan.

Those videos were interesting... if you look at some with the big crosshairs coloured blue or black it marks the exact impact point, while other videos of the same target are centred in other places making the hits look random and not accurate.

I suspect over each target there are drones filming target areas and the drones marking the targets are using their own laser beams to mark the target so when you see video of an attack where the impact is not in the centre of the view of the videoing drone it is because another drone is actually marking the target.

If you go to the above link and look at the second video down at about the 14-16 second mark you see a big circle crosshair marking where the rounds impact on the target so that video is of the target from the drone marking the target... note a section of the roof collapses near the door... then immediately after that view of the impact you see the same building from a different angle... notice the roof collapses again but the impact is not in the centre of view because this camera angle is to view the attack and not to mark the target for the attack.

It is also important to see how close these rounds are to the point of aim... that looks like a CEP of less than 2m to me.... and with a 40kg artillery shell that is plenty...

GarryB wrote:Those videos were interesting... if you look at some with the big crosshairs coloured blue or black it marks the exact impact point, while other videos of the same target are centred in other places making the hits look random and not accurate.

I suspect over each target there are drones filming target areas and the drones marking the targets are using their own laser beams to mark the target so when you see video of an attack where the impact is not in the centre of the view of the videoing drone it is because another drone is actually marking the target.

If you go to the above link and look at the second video down at about the 14-16 second mark you see a big circle crosshair marking where the rounds impact on the target so that video is of the target from the drone marking the target... note a section of the roof collapses near the door... then immediately after that view of the impact you see the same building from a different angle... notice the roof collapses again but the impact is not in the centre of view because this camera angle is to view the attack and not to mark the target for the attack.

It is also important to see how close these rounds are to the point of aim... that looks like a CEP of less than 2m to me.... and with a 40kg artillery shell that is plenty...

The real question is when will we start seeing Inertial Guidance shells introduced? There's laser guided, NAVSAT/GLONASS guided, but Inertial Guidance shells would have all the advantages of the previous methods but with none of the drawbacks.

Well they probably don't have any reason to show us those because you would normally use those against fixed structures and targets like bridges and HQs and comms centres.

In the videos shown it is generally vehicles or buildings people have just driven or run in to... which has the enormous advantage that if someone claims it is evidence they are bombing hospitals then they can show the full footage of the armed group of men running in there just before the munition hit, or point out the HMG on the back of the light truck they are hitting proves it is not an ambulance as orgs of ill repute like bellingcat claims.

I suspect for the vast majority of cases when hunting terrorists within a community you have to pretend are innocent and not just the terrorist support team and families of the head choppers then hitting them with laser guided shells is a good way to go because you have the video often from multiple angles showing what was aimed and and what was hit.

Western audiences would be satisfied with the claim that the evil Russians are purposely targeting innocents, or using views from drones watching attacks but not guiding munitions as evidence of how inaccurate their so called guided weapons are, but when you see these videos you can see this is not hit and miss, this is hitting what they want to hit and not the carpet bombing the west enjoyed not that long ago, but Russia really has to stop caring what the CNN and BBC fed western audience think...

It is of course ironic because if Russia had never stepped in in Syria and Syria had turned in to a lawless shit hole like Libya currently is the migrant crisis would be more than doubled because the majority of the Syrian population would want to leave...

These laser guided shells are actually rather cheap and as you can clearly see are very accurate... they get much better value for money than HATO countries do.

The French were going to buy Russian 155mm artillery shells.... the Krasnopol-M was specifically developed for them... is compatible with French and NATO laser target markers... but from what I can tell the French backed out of the deal as usual...

Technology SITREP: How Russian engineering made the current operation in Syria possible

SVP stands for “специализированная вычислительная подсистема” or “special computing subsystem”.  What this system does is that it constantly compares the position of the aircraft and the target (using the GLONASS satellite navigation system), it measures the environmental parameters (pressure, humidity, windspeed, speed, angle of attack, etc.).  

It can also receive additional information from datalinks from AWACs aircraft, ground stations, and other aircraft.  The SVP-24 then computes an “envelope” (speed, altitude, course) inside which the dumb bombs are automatically released exactly at the precise moment when their unguided flight will bring them right over the target (with a 3-5m accuracy).

In practical terms this means that every 30+ year old Russian “dumb” bomb can now be delivered by a 30+ year old Russian aircraft with the same precision as a brand new guided bomb delivered by a top of the line modern bomber.

Not only that, but the pilot does not even have to worry about targeting anything.  He just enters the target’s exact coordinates into his system, flies within a defined envelope and the bombs are automatically released for him.  He can place his full attention on detecting any hostiles (aircraft, missiles, AA guns).  And the best part of this all is that this system can be used in high altitude bombing runs, well over the 5000m altitude which MANPADs cannot reach.  Finally, clouds, smoke, weather conditions or time of the day play no role in this whatsoever.

Last, but not least, this is a very *cheap* solution.  Russian can now use the huge stores of ‘dumb’ bombs they have accumulated during the Cold War, they can bring an infinite supply of such bombs to Syria and every one of them will strike with phenomenal accuracy.  And since the SVP-24 is mounted on the aircraft and not the bomb, it can be reused as often as needed.

http://thesaker.is/technology-sitrep-how-russian-engineering-made-the-current-operation-in-syria-possible/

very cost control way with a cheap bombs against terrorists

ahmedfire wrote:very cost control way with a cheap bombs against terrorists

MOD has invested heavily in to inertial guidance, and has applied said technology to just about everything. The new GLATGM's being introduced for Russian MBT's will have inertial guidance integration, to allow them to hit targets at much greater ranges than 5km (presumably beyond 10km).

magnumcromagnon wrote:

ahmedfire wrote:very cost control way with a cheap bombs against terrorists

MOD has invested heavily in to inertial guidance, and has applied said technology to just about everything. The new GLATGM's being introduced for Russian MBT's will have inertial guidance integration, to allow them to hit targets at much greater ranges than 5km (presumably beyond 10km).

But this is different from inertial guidance , i mean it's a free fall but it's previously calculated , the bomb it self neither navigate nor have any flight correction ways like inertial guidance

ahmedfire wrote:

magnumcromagnon wrote:

ahmedfire wrote:very cost control way with a cheap bombs against terrorists

MOD has invested heavily in to inertial guidance, and has applied said technology to just about everything. The new GLATGM's being introduced for Russian MBT's will have inertial guidance integration, to allow them to hit targets at much greater ranges than 5km (presumably beyond 10km).

But this is different from inertial guidance , i mean it's a free fall but it's previously calculated , the bomb it self neither navigate nor have any flight correction ways like inertial guidance

The guidance is in the aircraft and is reusable. That's what make it cheap solution.

But the drawback is that it is pretty useless against moving targets like tanks. They will use it against only static targets. That's why they are developing many guided bombs/missiles like the newest kab-250 which is laser guided but also smaller than kab-500 reducing the price. Because it is guided a 250kg or even a 100-150kg will be enough against 100% of the targets they will find on the front. Kab-500 and bigger are used for wider targets like camp or tank groups but then 2 or 3 free fall fab 500 used with SVP 24 do the job for cheaper.

Big_Gazza wrote:

JohninMK wrote:Green for us says Erdogan. No way Jose says Syria.

Map is well obsolete.  Doesn't show any of the recent SAA gains in Turkorat Idlibistan.

I know, that was not the point I was making in what I wrote.