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    Su-57 Stealth Fighter: News #6

    Hole
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    Post  Hole on Wed Oct 07, 2020 8:14 pm

    Isos wrote:I don't see the IIR optic under the nose. The one they presented had it.

    The one with optics is an even newer version.
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    Post  Isos on Wed Oct 07, 2020 9:36 pm

    Hole wrote:
    Isos wrote:I don't see the IIR optic under the nose. The one they presented had it.

    The one with optics is an even newer version.

    I guess it's not ready then if they buy this one.

    IIR would be need because modern radar have a narrow beam and could detect the missile and turn off. The iir will catch the hot signature of the radar even turned off.
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    Post  GarryB on Thu Oct 08, 2020 5:20 am

    Since it entered service the AS-11 missile could not be carried by just any aircraft.... only a select few were able to carry and use it, and it came with a targeting pod that detected the target signals and triangulated the target location before launch.

    If the target turned off their radar signal mid flight the missile will still land amongst the target vehicles and with a 150kg HE frag warhead likely have damaged the antenna effectively enough.

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    Post  Hole on Thu Oct 08, 2020 12:10 pm

    Su-57 Stealth Fighter: News #6 - Page 19 Su-57_17
    Su-57 Stealth Fighter: News #6 - Page 19 Su-57_18

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    Hole
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    Post  Hole on Sat Oct 10, 2020 9:26 pm

    Su-57 Stealth Fighter: News #6 - Page 19 Su57_s10

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    magnumcromagnon
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    Post  magnumcromagnon on Sun Oct 11, 2020 1:23 am

    Hole wrote:Su-57 Stealth Fighter: News #6 - Page 19 Su57_s10
    It would be cool if future versions of the Su-57 had the 2 main bomb bays be unified in to one large bomb bay for much longer munitions, but also have optional modular munition place holders that would naturally be of shorter length with shorter bomb bay doors for smaller munitions.

    The smaller munition place holder would be necessary because it would ideally block off the rest of the internal space from compromising the RCS, additionally the smaller munitions means they would have shorter range and the Su-57 would have to launch them closer to the target and would be more susceptible to be detected by tactical level radars, so it would have a radar blocker near the end of the munition place holders length (the end extending to other side of the bombay). The unified bay munitions would have much greater range than the former, and the Su-57 would be less likely to be detected when it's launching the longer range munition. Now imagine if the Su-57 launch modified versions of the Kh-101/102 or Zircon/Khinzal closer to their original lengths! Twisted Evil
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    Post  LMFS on Sun Oct 11, 2020 1:36 am

    magnumcromagnon wrote:
    It would be cool if future versions of the Su-57 had the 2 main bomb bays be unified in to one large bomb bay for much longer munitions, but also have optional modular munition place holders that would naturally be of shorter length with shorter bomb bay doors for smaller munitions.

    That is probably not going to happen, the plane's structure relies heavily on that central section between the bays to distribute the loads.

    Su-57 Stealth Fighter: News #6 - Page 19 50-57-10
    magnumcromagnon
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    Post  magnumcromagnon on Mon Oct 12, 2020 12:26 am

    LMFS wrote:
    magnumcromagnon wrote:
    It would be cool if future versions of the Su-57 had the 2 main bomb bays be unified in to one large bomb bay for much longer munitions, but also have optional modular munition place holders that would naturally be of shorter length with shorter bomb bay doors for smaller munitions.

    That is probably not going to happen, the plane's structure relies heavily on that central section between the bays to distribute the loads.

    Su-57 Stealth Fighter: News #6 - Page 19 50-57-10

    I'm not proposing anything extreme here, just utilizing the (small) space in between the 2 bomb bays, so they can launch extra-long range munitions when they need to. When they don't need to use extreme long weapons, they can place smaller compartments back in the space to restore whatever lost functionality. The extreme long range munition will be launched (with the right tactics) far beyond the enemies capacity to intercept the Su-57, so whatever temporary loss in the fuselages' structural stability, it'll be a small price to pay as it's very unlikely to dog fight (and thus experience high g-forces) during that sortie.
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    Post  GarryB on Mon Oct 12, 2020 6:48 am

    If the weapon is extreme long range then stealth becomes less important so carry it externally... or better still put it on an Su-30 or Su-35...

    Personally I would rather see a new version of the Su-57 that is like a new stealthy Su-34 version of the Su-57 that is the equivalent to the Su-34 is to the Su-35.

    Not designed for such high speed but with the engines located two or three times further apart and with much bigger internal weapon bays and perhaps not designed for supersonic flight but with all internal weapons...
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    Post  magnumcromagnon on Mon Oct 12, 2020 3:43 pm

    GarryB wrote:If the weapon is extreme long range then stealth becomes less important so carry it externally... or better still put it on an Su-30 or Su-35...

    Personally I would rather see a new version of the Su-57 that is like a new stealthy Su-34 version of the Su-57 that is the equivalent to the Su-34 is to the Su-35.

    Not designed for such high speed but with the engines located two or three times further apart and with much bigger internal weapon bays and perhaps not designed for supersonic flight but with all internal weapons...

    Sure, extreme range weapons won't need the platform to be as stealthy as possible, but with it stored internally the vehicle will be less affected by drag, so ideally the munition can be launched as high and as fast as possible.
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    Post  PapaDragon on Mon Oct 12, 2020 8:49 pm

    magnumcromagnon wrote:It would be cool if future versions of the Su-57 had the 2 main bomb bays be unified in to one large bomb bay for much longer munitions...

    I think the are saving that feature for MiG-41/PAK DP

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    Post  GarryB on Tue Oct 13, 2020 7:28 am

    The MiG-41 would certainly offer the best performance boost in terms of launch speed and altitude... a bit like taking old nonupgraded MiG-31s to carry Kinzhal.

    There are photos of the MiG-31K carrying bigger missiles for anti satellite or perhaps emergency satellite launch capacity to fill any gaps that might exist with a temporary satellite or to replace those lost in combat...
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    Post  Gomig-21 on Tue Oct 13, 2020 8:14 pm

    BTW, talking to a couple of other fellas on another military forum and I expressed my displeasure at the complete disrespect and insulting of this amazing aircraft by NATO to give it the disgusting nickname "Felon." Whomever came up with that is a full blown jerk, but so are all the other who agreed and/or voted for that name to be the NATO designation for this aircraft. Despicable.

    Some of the previous names weren't so flattering, either, such as "Frogfoot" or "Fagot" or even "Fishbed", but this one has to take the cake. Felon? Really?
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    Post  Hole on Tue Oct 13, 2020 9:08 pm

    The name should be F-ucker. Laughing F for fighter (like in F-15, F-16 and so on)

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    Post  magnumcromagnon on Tue Oct 13, 2020 9:30 pm

    They should give the F-35 the designation 'Turd Burglar.'

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    Post  PapaDragon on Tue Oct 13, 2020 10:08 pm

    Gomig-21 wrote:...Some of the previous names weren't so flattering, either, such as "Frogfoot" or "Fagot" or even "Fishbed", but this one has to take the cake.  Felon?  Really?

    I like it

    It has a touch of bravado, a daring do

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    Post  lyle6 on Tue Oct 13, 2020 10:30 pm

    Gomig-21 wrote:BTW, talking to a couple of other fellas on another military forum and I expressed my displeasure at the complete disrespect and insulting of this amazing aircraft by NATO to give it the disgusting nickname "Felon."  Whomever came up with that is a full blown jerk, but so are all the other who agreed and/or voted for that name to be the NATO designation for this aircraft.  Despicable.

    Some of the previous names weren't so flattering, either, such as "Frogfoot" or "Fagot" or even "Fishbed", but this one has to take the cake.  Felon?  Really?
    Its awesome. How sick of a burn would it be to hear the famous MJ catch after getting shot down by a Su-57:
    "YOUVE BEEN HIT BY - YOUVE BEEN STRUCK BY - A SMOOTH CRIMINAL"?

    In comparison, NATO nicknames for their own aircraft are just plain boring, like someone ran them through a focus group, which they totally have. The F-35 didn't even get its own nickname, and the raptor, oh don't get me started on that. Who names their aircraft after extinct lizards? Squares, that's who.

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    Post  Gomig-21 on Wed Oct 14, 2020 12:42 am

    You guys realize a felon is a person who has been convicted of a felony, right? A felony is a crime in most civilized societies that use that term lol. There's nothing cool or badass or tough or complimentary in any way, shape or form. It's nothing short of an insult, really. And it's obvious that they did it on purpose, of course, which makes it even more irritating.

    A smooth criminal might be a stretch.

    They had to label it negatively because they still need to make a villain out of Russia, and for it to still be the enemy to make NATO relevant after the end of the Soviet Union and the Cold War.

    If needing to stick with the letter F for a starter, then looking at the list there's plenty:
    Fire
    Fierce
    Force
    Freedom
    Future
    etc.
    So many better ones that friggin Felon!

    Ok, I've vented enough about that.
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    Post  lyle6 on Wed Oct 14, 2020 3:49 am

    Gomig-21 wrote:You guys realize a felon is a person who has been convicted of a felony, right?  A felony is a crime in most civilized societies that use that term lol.  There's nothing cool or badass or tough or complimentary in any way, shape or form.  It's nothing short of an insult, really.  And it's obvious that they did it on purpose, of course, which makes it even more irritating.  

    A smooth criminal might be a stretch.

    They had to label it negatively because they still need to make a villain out of Russia, and for it to still be the enemy to make NATO relevant after the end of the Soviet Union and the Cold War.  

    If needing to stick with the letter F for a starter, then looking at the list there's plenty:
    Fire
    Fierce
    Force
    Freedom
    Future
    etc.
    So many better ones that friggin Felon!

    Ok, I've vented enough about that.
    I'm of the opinion that its better to be openly reviled than lured in by false notions of friendship. Besides, being called a felon is practically a term of endearment in today's America, what with its open endorsement of criminals and criminal behaviour. You'd just have to forgive them for their preference.

    Also, most of those words you suggest won't fly - the Su-57 is a jet so it needs two syllables. So we can scratch fire (a well used verb in combat chatter), fierce, and force (also words that aren't out of place in combat chatter either i.e. "fierce resistance", or "enemy force up ahead"). Freedom is patented American, and future is just way too vague. Something like flechette sounds better and really describes how a Su-57 is meant to perform in combat but its not as strong sounding.

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    Post  GarryB on Wed Oct 14, 2020 9:50 am

    It is not a HATO code AFAIK, they use it, but they don't decide it... it used to be the Air Standards Coordination Committee, or ASCC that used to decide on the code name which is made up of what has become the five eyes group of bastards... US, UK, Canada, Australia, New Zealand...

    I think the name is petty and shows the childish nature of the countries that chose the name and how spiteful they are... just a reminder to Russia how lucky they are to not be on good relations with such spoiled self absorbed arseholes.

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    Post  Isos on Wed Oct 14, 2020 10:28 am

    GarryB wrote:It is not a HATO code AFAIK, they use it, but they don't decide it... it used to be the Air Standards Coordination Committee, or ASCC that used to decide on the code name which is made up of what has become the five eyes group of bastards... US, UK, Canada, Australia, New Zealand...

    I think the name is petty and shows the childish nature of the countries that chose the name and how spiteful they are... just a reminder to Russia how lucky they are to not be on good relations with such spoiled self absorbed arseholes.

    And they probably pay them 3000-4000$ per month to pick up names... because they found that job thanks to a friend or family member.

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    Post  Gomig-21 on Wed Oct 14, 2020 7:26 pm

    GarryB wrote:It is not a HATO code AFAIK, they use it, but they don't decide it... it used to be the Air Standards Coordination Committee, or ASCC that used to decide on the code name which is made up of what has become the five eyes group of bastards... US, UK, Canada, Australia, New Zealand...

    New Zealand, too? NATO must have something to do with it if they call it a "NATO designation".
    I think it's pretty clear through all the decades since its creation who's been driving that organization because of the money it was putting into it giving it the most clout. Except you can't say the US was much involved in this recent naming since it pulled out back in 2017 IIRC. So this is from the current members sans the US.

    GarryB wrote:I think the name is petty and shows the childish nature of the countries that chose the name and how spiteful they are... just a reminder to Russia how lucky they are to not be on good relations with such spoiled self absorbed arseholes.

    There you go! This is the kind of anger I was thinking most would be feeling about this. I think it's such a disgraceful thing to do and this is probably the worst designation to date! Bastards. lol
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    Post  JohninMK on Wed Oct 14, 2020 7:40 pm

    Love the name. Felon, the invisible thief in the night, your goodies and valuables are gone, just a mess left behind and your alarms detected nothing.

    The namers certainly had more nous that those coming up with Faggot.

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    Post  The-thing-next-door on Wed Oct 14, 2020 9:33 pm

    Gomig-21 wrote:
    There you go!  This is the kind of anger I was thinking most would be feeling about this.  I think it's such a disgraceful thing to do and this is probably the worst designation to date!  Bastards. lol

    The worst to date is thier term for the Sarmat, childish as hell and if you fail to see how ironic it is then you are retarded. I would have said the R-36 but that is not as retardedly ironic as them giving the name to a modern Russian missile.

    The whole alternate designation system is retarded, childish and completely pointless.

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    Post  PapaDragon on Wed Oct 14, 2020 9:43 pm

    JohninMK wrote:Love the name. Felon, the invisible thief in the night, your goodies and valuables are gone, just a mess left behind and your alarms detected nothing...

    People keep forgetting that the whole gangsta' ghetto thing is considered cool in USA these days and that this name is definitely considered more flattering by those who came up with it than most people think



    The-thing-next-door wrote:The worst to date is thier term for the Sarmat, childish as hell and if you fail to see how ironic it is then you are retarded. I would have said the R-36 but that is not as retardedly ironic as them giving the name to a modern Russian missile.

    Sarmat doesn't have NATO designation yet

    If you are talking about SS-18 Satan it's the coolest name for a weapon ever given


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