Russia Defence Forum

Would you like to react to this message? Create an account in a few clicks or log in to continue.

Military Forum for Russian and Global Defence Issues


+68
Krepost
ALAMO
Broski
marcellogo
Azi
auslander
miroslav
thegopnik
Finty
Mir
mavaff
Russian_Patriot_
Lurk83
Kiko
nero
flamming_python
PapaDragon
The_Observer
RTN
gbu48098
thedrunkengeneral
Firebird
ARYGER
zardof
limb
bren_tann
lyle6
slasher
mnztr
The-thing-next-door
Backman
calripson
AMCXXL
Big_Gazza
kvs
Sujoy
lancelot
Gomig-21
ult
LMFS
medo
owais.usmani
TheArmenian
ultimatewarrior
Arrow
Mindstorm
franco
d_taddei2
Viktor
JohninMK
walle83
Austin
PhSt
Tsavo Lion
magnumcromagnon
Gibraltar
Rodion_Romanovic
George1
Cyberspec
dino00
Singular_Transform
Vann7
Hole
hoom
miketheterrible
x_54_u43
marat
SeigSoloyvov
72 posters

    Russian Navy: Status and News #5

    Rodion_Romanovic
    Rodion_Romanovic


    Posts : 1801
    Points : 1785
    Join date : 2015-12-30
    Location : Merkelland

    Russian Navy: Status and News #5 - Page 14 Empty Re: Russian Navy: Status and News #5

    Post  Rodion_Romanovic Wed Jul 15, 2020 12:33 am

    SeigSoloyvov wrote:
    ultimatewarrior wrote:
    SeigSoloyvov wrote:They don't need four carriers by 2036, just four would be enough.

    Four is not enough. They need 6 carriers by 2030 to take on US at Taiwan.


    No they don't considering where taiwan is located
    yeah, Taiwan is less than 200 km from chinese mainland (and even further away point is about 400 km). They are well in range of land based aviation.
    The thing that they would really need is instead landing ships and amphibious assault ships, and as far as I remember, they are building those.


    By the way Tu22M would be much more useful than carrier based aviation for such an operation... if they really wanted to buy something from Russia.

    Anyway I really doubt that Russia would consider selling the Kuznetov before 2035... after two modern carriers are commissioned, they could do that, but before that is really improbable... at least they can keep it as a training ship to help maintaining a carrier based aviation. (The land based training facilities in Yevsk and Saki of course help, but cannot substitute real carrier operations)

    GarryB likes this post

    GarryB
    GarryB


    Posts : 35307
    Points : 35831
    Join date : 2010-03-30
    Location : New Zealand

    Russian Navy: Status and News #5 - Page 14 Empty Re: Russian Navy: Status and News #5

    Post  GarryB Wed Jul 15, 2020 8:34 am

    With Admiral Kuznetsov due to retire in a few years and sold to China, these LHD will be Russia navy's biggest warships at about 25,000 tons displacement. They will be escorted by frigates like Admiral Gorshkov.

    It is currently undergoing a deep modernisation... it will be used operationally for the next 30 years... as a carrier till a new CVN is built and then as a training carrier after that.

    Indeed, Why would China even purchase the old hull at this stage they are building more modern CV's, makes no sense to buy a soviet era ship for them anymore.

    It is currently getting a deep modernisation, so a lot of bits would be very much of interest to them, but it wont be for sale anyway so the subject is moot.

    Russia with the money (easily 4 billion $ on the export market for the ship) could start a new Lamantin carrier.

    Which does not make sense... even if they needed the money it would be 10 years before a new carrier would be in the water... the Kuznetsov would have more value as a carrier at sea than euros in a bank account.

    Russia is downsizing and getting rid of carriers, Kirov class cruisers, because of high cost. China will buy Admiral Kuznetsov, refurbish it, and commissioned it by the late 2020s.

    Russia is upgrading the Kuznetsov and two Kirovs for Russian use... they are not for sale.

    No, they wouldn't buy it, they are very unhappy with the other one they bought as is.

    Of course they were unhappy with the purchase... they bought it from the Ukraine and probably expected help and support and for it to be in a reasonable state but it was a derelict and most of the technology on board was Russian so Ukraine couldn't help them with it.

    The Chinese moved away from wanting to buy foreign ships.

    Until they got the ship they didn't know what they wanted... this vessel gave them a baseline...

    MAYBE if the Russians would sell it for dirt cheap, the Chinese would be like "Ehhhh I guess" but for what the Russians would want for the thing even if they wanted to sell it, the Chinese would never pay.

    There is no interest in selling.

    There's no way China can build 6 carriers by 2030. 4 maybe. But not 6. That's why they bought their first carrier and they will be Admiral Kuznetsov and refurnish it. For now they need the numbers game to counter US in the Pacific. Remember. 6. Aircraft. Carriers. 6.

    What... does someone have a gun to your head.... blink twice and we will know because I was expecting you to say China could build 10 carriers by 2030...

    Of course the real problem is that if you want 6 carrier groups by 2030 then you are going to need at least 50 destroyers and probably 18 cruisers to go with them and of course frigates and support ships too...

    Four is not enough. They need 6 carriers by 2030 to take on US at Taiwan.

    They would be better off with SSNs and ballistic missiles tipped with anti ship weapons and of course Tu-16 aircraft with long range supersonic anti ship missiles...

    Or maybe Tu-22M3s licence produced in China with inflight refuelling probes and Kh-32 missiles... or a Chinese IRBM converted to aircraft use...

    Tsavo Lion
    Tsavo Lion


    Posts : 5780
    Points : 5762
    Join date : 2016-08-15
    Location : AZ, USA

    Russian Navy: Status and News #5 - Page 14 Empty Re: Russian Navy: Status and News #5

    Post  Tsavo Lion Sun Jul 19, 2020 6:52 pm

    https://www.forbes.com/sites/hisutton/2020/07/19/new-intelligence-reveals-russian-submarine-heading-into-english-channel/#11f1a1aa5abe

    Nice tit-for-tat: NATO ships enter & rotate in/out of the Black Sea, sometimes staying there over 21 days.
    Hole
    Hole


    Posts : 8400
    Points : 8388
    Join date : 2018-03-24
    Age : 46
    Location : Scholzistan

    Russian Navy: Status and News #5 - Page 14 Empty Re: Russian Navy: Status and News #5

    Post  Hole Sun Jul 19, 2020 9:44 pm

    Nice targets for russian anti-ship missiles.
    Viktor
    Viktor


    Posts : 5814
    Points : 6449
    Join date : 2009-08-25
    Age : 42
    Location : Croatia

    Russian Navy: Status and News #5 - Page 14 Empty Re: Russian Navy: Status and News #5

    Post  Viktor Tue Jul 21, 2020 11:59 pm

    Yesterday Russia laid down 90k tons of warships Laughing
    dino00
    dino00


    Posts : 1677
    Points : 1714
    Join date : 2012-10-12
    Age : 35
    Location : portugal

    Russian Navy: Status and News #5 - Page 14 Empty Re: Russian Navy: Status and News #5

    Post  dino00 Wed Jul 22, 2020 12:03 am

    Viktor wrote:Yesterday Russia laid down 90k tons of warships  Laughing

    The weight of an aircraft carrier, but much more useful and cheaper Very Happy
    George1
    George1


    Posts : 17888
    Points : 18393
    Join date : 2011-12-22
    Location : Greece

    Russian Navy: Status and News #5 - Page 14 Empty Re: Russian Navy: Status and News #5

    Post  George1 Sun Aug 09, 2020 2:56 pm

    Russian Navy ship with 308 evacuees leaves war-torn Yemen


    This was stated by the official representative of the Ministry of defense of Russia

    MOSCOW, April 12. /TASS/. A Russian Navy ship with 308 people evacuated from war-torn Yemen, including 45 Russian nationals, has arrived in Djibouti, Russia’s Defense Ministry spokesman, Maj.-Gen. Igor Konashenkov said on Sunday.

    "The Priazovye ship of the Russian Navy with 308 citizens from 19 states evacuated the other day from the zone of military operations in the area of Aden [Yemen] has arrived at the port of Djibouti," the spokesman said.

    The Priazovye evacuated citizens of different states from the Yemeni coast on Saturday, including 45 Russian citizens, 18 US nationals, 5 UK citizens, one Bulgarian, 6 Estonians, 14 Ukrainians, 9 Belarusians, 3 Turkmens, 8 Uzbekistanis, 5 Azerbaijanis, one citizen of Bahrein, 5 citizens of Djibouti, 158 Yemenis, one citizen of Somalia, 3 Palestinians, 13 Jordanians, 9 Cubans, 2 Egyptians and one citizen of Saudi Arabia, the spokesman said.

    https://tass.com/world/788706?utm_source=tass.com_internal&utm_medium=internal&utm_campaign=tass.com_internal&utm_content=44291847&utm_term=309113&ce=SPAN.
    avatar
    hoom


    Posts : 2353
    Points : 2341
    Join date : 2016-05-06

    Russian Navy: Status and News #5 - Page 14 Empty Re: Russian Navy: Status and News #5

    Post  hoom Sat Aug 15, 2020 11:05 am

    Seems to be some kind of interesting comparative test brewing up in White sea:
    Odintsovo 22800, Zeleny Dol 21631 & Vasily Bykov 22160 have all recently transitioned there for weapons testing via canal system.
    Odintsovo being the first 22800 with Pantsir-M has clearly valid reasons for needing weapon testing up there but the others don't really have anything much needing tests so it seems like they may be there for some kind of direct comparison of handling etc?

    Could be coincidental though, maybe finally testing containerised Kalibr in 22160? Anti-ship missiles on 21631?
    LMFS
    LMFS


    Posts : 5014
    Points : 5014
    Join date : 2018-03-03

    Russian Navy: Status and News #5 - Page 14 Empty Re: Russian Navy: Status and News #5

    Post  LMFS Sat Aug 15, 2020 12:45 pm

    hoom wrote:Seems to be some kind of interesting comparative test brewing up in White sea:
    Odintsovo 22800, Zeleny Dol 21631 & Vasily Bykov 22160 have all recently transitioned there for weapons testing via canal system.
    Odintsovo being the first 22800 with Pantsir-M has clearly valid reasons for needing weapon testing up there but the others don't really have anything much needing tests so it seems like they may be there for some kind of direct comparison of handling etc?

    Could be coincidental though, maybe finally testing containerised Kalibr in 22160? Anti-ship missiles on 21631?

    Bingo!

    https://iz.ru/1047958/roman-kretcul-aleksei-ramm/vyzvali-patrul-novoe-rossiiskoe-oruzhie-ispytaiut-v-severnykh-moriakh
    Big_Gazza
    Big_Gazza


    Posts : 4098
    Points : 4096
    Join date : 2014-08-25
    Location : Melbourne, Australia

    Russian Navy: Status and News #5 - Page 14 Empty Re: Russian Navy: Status and News #5

    Post  Big_Gazza Sat Aug 15, 2020 1:41 pm

    LMFS wrote:Bingo!

    https://iz.ru/1047958/roman-kretcul-aleksei-ramm/vyzvali-patrul-novoe-rossiiskoe-oruzhie-ispytaiut-v-severnykh-moriakh

    Interesting details in this article:

    RTOs "Zeleny Dol" and "Odintsovo" are likely to take part in testing missile systems, the expert added.

    It is not excluded that they will fire Onyx anti-ship missiles. These RTOs are declared as carriers of such systems, but in practice they have not yet been used, - said Dmitry Boltenkov.

    It's always been assumed that the 22800 and 21631 could fire Onix as well as Kalibres (and have the required system software), but now we have confirmation.  thumbsup
    PapaDragon
    PapaDragon


    Posts : 12706
    Points : 12764
    Join date : 2015-04-26
    Location : Fort Evil, Serbia

    Russian Navy: Status and News #5 - Page 14 Empty Re: Russian Navy: Status and News #5

    Post  PapaDragon Sat Aug 15, 2020 11:16 pm

    hoom wrote:.....Could be coincidental though, maybe finally testing containerised Kalibr in 22160? Anti-ship missiles on 21631?

    There is no reason for 22160 to be up there other than testing containerized Kalibr

    I think you are right

    Tsavo Lion
    Tsavo Lion


    Posts : 5780
    Points : 5762
    Join date : 2016-08-15
    Location : AZ, USA

    Russian Navy: Status and News #5 - Page 14 Empty Re: Russian Navy: Status and News #5

    Post  Tsavo Lion Sun Aug 16, 2020 8:56 am

    https://www.forbes.com/sites/hisutton/2020/08/15/russias-giant-battle-cruiser-will-return/#7e0da57c66ea
    magnumcromagnon
    magnumcromagnon


    Posts : 8158
    Points : 8303
    Join date : 2013-12-05
    Location : Pindos ave., Pindosville, Pindosylvania, Pindostan

    Russian Navy: Status and News #5 - Page 14 Empty Re: Russian Navy: Status and News #5

    Post  magnumcromagnon Thu Sep 03, 2020 4:37 am

    Uran-9 naval edition Cool
    Russian Navy: Status and News #5 - Page 14 BCGsbG1

    CyberBoat-330 UNV/USV drone
    Russian Navy: Status and News #5 - Page 14 Lodka_1_d_850

    Also new landing craft with 57mm turret, probably Kurganets based
    Russian Navy: Status and News #5 - Page 14 339693

    LMFS likes this post

    LMFS
    LMFS


    Posts : 5014
    Points : 5014
    Join date : 2018-03-03

    Russian Navy: Status and News #5 - Page 14 Empty Re: Russian Navy: Status and News #5

    Post  LMFS Thu Sep 03, 2020 5:19 am

    We saw the amphibious vehicle before, where do the pictures come from? It would be nice to know if the project is progressing...
    avatar
    walle83


    Posts : 918
    Points : 930
    Join date : 2016-11-13
    Location : Sweden

    Russian Navy: Status and News #5 - Page 14 Empty Re: Russian Navy: Status and News #5

    Post  walle83 Thu Sep 03, 2020 12:35 pm

    Isos wrote:
    SeigSoloyvov wrote:.....I can't even begin to understand, how you think anything you said makes any degree of sense.

    He is not wrong. China could be very well interested by the Kuznetsov, even more if they offer mig29K with it. That's the sister ship of the one they already operate and they are in need for such ships. They could modernize it for a fraction of the time they spent building new ones.

    The stupid part is believing that Russia would sell it.

    China has no intrest in the Kuznetsov class, they moved on to larger vessels with catapults now. Also they have the blueprint so they can now build the class themself if they wanted to.
    They could possibly be intrested in the MiG-29K but they probably rather develop thier own fixed carrier wings like the J-31 stealth fighter insted.
    magnumcromagnon
    magnumcromagnon


    Posts : 8158
    Points : 8303
    Join date : 2013-12-05
    Location : Pindos ave., Pindosville, Pindosylvania, Pindostan

    Russian Navy: Status and News #5 - Page 14 Empty Re: Russian Navy: Status and News #5

    Post  magnumcromagnon Thu Sep 03, 2020 5:03 pm

    LMFS wrote:We saw the amphibious vehicle before, where do the pictures come from? It would be nice to know if the project is progressing...

    The photos are from Army-2020. As far as progress goes, I posted back in 2017 about the BMMP, which was originally wheeled and they decided to make it tracked. They progressed from being just digital renderings to small scale models, for whatever that's worth.

    LMFS likes this post

    Isos
    Isos


    Posts : 10502
    Points : 10488
    Join date : 2015-11-07

    Russian Navy: Status and News #5 - Page 14 Empty Re: Russian Navy: Status and News #5

    Post  Isos Thu Sep 03, 2020 5:30 pm

    https://mobile.twitter.com/RALee85/status/1301525604072857600

    Floating dock moved by a typhoon hits submarines, ships in the pacific fleet.

    Another failure for their navy.
    miketheterrible
    miketheterrible


    Posts : 7403
    Points : 7377
    Join date : 2016-11-07

    Russian Navy: Status and News #5 - Page 14 Empty Re: Russian Navy: Status and News #5

    Post  miketheterrible Thu Sep 03, 2020 6:07 pm

    Russia isn't god and cant prevent Typhoon. Dont think they expected it. Anyway, it will get repaired so who cares?
    avatar
    owais.usmani


    Posts : 1554
    Points : 1552
    Join date : 2019-03-27
    Age : 36

    Russian Navy: Status and News #5 - Page 14 Empty Re: Russian Navy: Status and News #5

    Post  owais.usmani Thu Sep 03, 2020 6:56 pm

    miketheterrible wrote:Russia isn't god and cant prevent Typhoon.  Dont think they expected it.  Anyway, it will get repaired so who cares?

    Certainly they are not God but they would have known about the incoming Typhoon and the dock should have been properly tied to the pier. The damage can be repaired but that would cost money which should not be spent on needless repairs.

    That being said, from the video it doesn't look like there is major / extensive damage to any vessel it hit.
    Isos
    Isos


    Posts : 10502
    Points : 10488
    Join date : 2015-11-07

    Russian Navy: Status and News #5 - Page 14 Empty Re: Russian Navy: Status and News #5

    Post  Isos Thu Sep 03, 2020 7:35 pm

    A storm is coming, you make sure ships won't be destroyed by it. That's the basics even for the random guy that owns a boats of 4m.

    Even you can know if a storm is coming on the net.

    That's amateurism and some will probably loose their jobs. I recall they fired some admirals in the baltic because of their incompetences.
    Tsavo Lion
    Tsavo Lion


    Posts : 5780
    Points : 5762
    Join date : 2016-08-15
    Location : AZ, USA

    Russian Navy: Status and News #5 - Page 14 Empty Re: Russian Navy: Status and News #5

    Post  Tsavo Lion Thu Sep 03, 2020 9:45 pm

    Update on Oscar modernization & opinion which I share: 
    https://vz.ru/society/2020/9/3/1058182.html
    miketheterrible
    miketheterrible


    Posts : 7403
    Points : 7377
    Join date : 2016-11-07

    Russian Navy: Status and News #5 - Page 14 Empty Re: Russian Navy: Status and News #5

    Post  miketheterrible Thu Sep 03, 2020 10:38 pm

    Yeap, some will be fired. To be honest, I think they should also have future wages garnished to pay for damages. But yeah, these don't look extensive so it will make a shipyard happy as it will get more work
    GarryB
    GarryB


    Posts : 35307
    Points : 35831
    Join date : 2010-03-30
    Location : New Zealand

    Russian Navy: Status and News #5 - Page 14 Empty Re: Russian Navy: Status and News #5

    Post  GarryB Fri Sep 04, 2020 8:35 am

    A storm is coming, you make sure ships won't be destroyed by it. That's the basics even for the random guy that owns a boats of 4m.

    But doesn't everyone get warnings of typhoons these days, yet they still manage to cause billions of dollars in damage.

    Would be interested in hearing your advice as to what they should have done... perhaps manned every vessel and barge and sail them out to deep water to ride out the storm... or perhaps these barges were like rubber ducks in a bath... just take them out... towel them down to dry them off and stick them in a nice safe building until the typhoon passes... and just hope the building you put them in doesn't collapse...

    Wasn't there lots of F-16s that got damaged in the US because of weather related problems?

    I personally think you are overestimating what they could have done.

    Or just fire everyone...
    Tsavo Lion
    Tsavo Lion


    Posts : 5780
    Points : 5762
    Join date : 2016-08-15
    Location : AZ, USA

    Russian Navy: Status and News #5 - Page 14 Empty Re: Russian Navy: Status and News #5

    Post  Tsavo Lion Mon Sep 07, 2020 7:26 am

    Tu-142 performed reconnaissance in the Arctic https://www.vesti.ru/article/2454176
    George1
    George1


    Posts : 17888
    Points : 18393
    Join date : 2011-12-22
    Location : Greece

    Russian Navy: Status and News #5 - Page 14 Empty Re: Russian Navy: Status and News #5

    Post  George1 Thu Sep 17, 2020 12:07 am

    Forgotten Atlantic

    navy_korabel
    September 14th, 19:30
    ...
    Surprisingly, there is still an opinion that "our fleet is securely attached to its shores" ( ref. 1 ). To be convinced of the opposite, it is enough to look at the map of the naval presence of the Russian Federation in 2017 ( link 2 ) (unfortunately, due to the high complexity of materials of this kind, data for 2018 and 2019 were not published, but this does not mean that the topic will not be continued). At the same time, the map clearly demonstrates the priorities of the main command of the Navy - these are the Mediterranean Sea and the waters of the four oceans washing the coast of Eurasia (North-Western Europe, the Northern Sea Route, the Asia-Pacific region, the northern part of the Indian Ocean with the Red Sea) and ,to a lesser extent, Africa. At the same time, the Atlantic Ocean as such and all of America remain behind the scenes.

    Anyone who closely monitors the training and combat activities of the Russian Navy may argue that this is not so, and the Atlantic is not forgotten at all . Indeed, not later than last summer (in the period 13-29.06), the SF detachment led by "Admiral Gorshkov", after entering Ecuador, followed the Panama Canal to the Caribbean Sea and further to Havana. That's right, but, in fact, it was just a transit , a short episode of a global event - a voyage around the world predicted (or initiated) by the author of the blog ( link 3 ).

    Apart from the SRZK and the GUGI ships, the last purposeful transatlantic crossing was made by the TFR "Yaroslav the Wise" about four years ago (26.10-17.11.2016 Havana, Trinidad and Tobago). Three years before that, a more representative action took place - 08/03/2013 the GRKR "Moskva" and the BOD "Vice-Admiral Kulakov" entered the capital of Cuba, then, already alone, "Moscow" visited Nicaragua (passing through a channel to the Pacific Ocean) and Venezuela ... Against the background of annual trips to the NWM, the North Sea, along the NSR and in the APR, this looks very modest. Taking into account the abruptly increased activity of the NATO Navy and Air Force in the waters and over the waters of all seas without exception,

    adjacent to the territory of Russia (including the Barents, East Siberian and even Okhotsk), it is probably time to think about an adequate symmetric response, namely, to demonstrate on a regular basis a commitment to free navigation ( demonstrate freedom of navigation - link 4 ) in the Caribbean Sea and Gulf of Mexico. There are opportunities for this right now. Moscow, which recently passed the VTG, is preparing for the Caucasus-2020 exercise ( link 5 ), and Kulakov is operating in the SPM ( link 6 ). It would be nice if, at the end of the exercises, which will be held on September 21-26, the Navy General Committee formed a tactical group and sent it with love from Russia to the US East Coast.■

    https://navy-korabel.livejournal.com/249353.html

    Sponsored content


    Russian Navy: Status and News #5 - Page 14 Empty Re: Russian Navy: Status and News #5

    Post  Sponsored content


      Current date/time is Sat Jan 28, 2023 1:24 am