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Well they are definitely going to need new floating dry docks now, both to replace those lost, but also to deal with a future increase in production of larger ships which will also need dry dock facilities too...
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Russian Navy: Status and News #5
GarryB- Posts : 33171
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kvs- Posts : 12869
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d_taddei2 wrote:Not a big loss but still better to scrap than leave it as a potential environmental problem
DEC 15, 09:11Updated 09:25
The sunken and surfaced submarine in Sevastopol is disposed of
The floating dock PD-16 and the hull of the submarine that was in it were decommissioned for more than 10 years, the press service of the Southern Military District said
A decommissioned B-380 Black Sea Fleet sunken with a floating dock, which then surfaced, is preparing to be towed to the disposal site, the Southern Military District Press Service information department told reporters.
"Currently, technical work is underway to prepare for towing to the disposal site. The floating dock PD-16 and the hull of the submarine, which was in it, were decommissioned from the fleet more than 10 years ago and must be disposed of," it was reported.
According to a TASS correspondent, the floating dock PD-16 remains above the water only a quarter of the surface part, while the submarine inside the dock turned over on its side. Only the upper part of the floating dock remained above the water - about 2 meters. This is not more than a quarter of the height of that part of the structure, which in a normal position is above the water.
Submarine B-380 remains in the dock. She is lying on her side. Around work auxiliary vessels. The embankment of the South Bay near the dock is patrolled by the military police. In particular, its employees prohibit taking pictures of the bay.
The PD-16 floating dock - a pontoon metal structure for repair of submarines, destroyers, minesweepers, support vessels with a displacement of up to 5 thousand tons - was laid down in 1938 and, according to a TASS source in emergency services of Sevastopol, went under water in its South bay on the night of December 15th. The dock for many years under repair was a large diesel-electric submarine of Project 641B Som B-380 (formerly the Gorky Komsomolets), which, since the spring of 2016, has been included in the tender of the Ministry of Defense for disposal
https://tass.ru/proisshestviya/7350509
1938! That is a freaking long time for any steel structure in salt water without proper maintenance. Russia is experiencing
a large burden from from long-past-use date structures that were not replaced due to the endless economic turmoil. With the
current plateau of stability, they can hopefully catch up with all the needed rebuilding.
d_taddei2- Posts : 2523
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kvs wrote:d_taddei2 wrote:Not a big loss but still better to scrap than leave it as a potential environmental problem
DEC 15, 09:11Updated 09:25
The sunken and surfaced submarine in Sevastopol is disposed of
The floating dock PD-16 and the hull of the submarine that was in it were decommissioned for more than 10 years, the press service of the Southern Military District said
A decommissioned B-380 Black Sea Fleet sunken with a floating dock, which then surfaced, is preparing to be towed to the disposal site, the Southern Military District Press Service information department told reporters.
"Currently, technical work is underway to prepare for towing to the disposal site. The floating dock PD-16 and the hull of the submarine, which was in it, were decommissioned from the fleet more than 10 years ago and must be disposed of," it was reported.
According to a TASS correspondent, the floating dock PD-16 remains above the water only a quarter of the surface part, while the submarine inside the dock turned over on its side. Only the upper part of the floating dock remained above the water - about 2 meters. This is not more than a quarter of the height of that part of the structure, which in a normal position is above the water.
Submarine B-380 remains in the dock. She is lying on her side. Around work auxiliary vessels. The embankment of the South Bay near the dock is patrolled by the military police. In particular, its employees prohibit taking pictures of the bay.
The PD-16 floating dock - a pontoon metal structure for repair of submarines, destroyers, minesweepers, support vessels with a displacement of up to 5 thousand tons - was laid down in 1938 and, according to a TASS source in emergency services of Sevastopol, went under water in its South bay on the night of December 15th. The dock for many years under repair was a large diesel-electric submarine of Project 641B Som B-380 (formerly the Gorky Komsomolets), which, since the spring of 2016, has been included in the tender of the Ministry of Defense for disposal
https://tass.ru/proisshestviya/7350509
1938! That is a freaking long time for any steel structure in salt water without proper maintenance. Russia is experiencing
a large burden from from long-past-use date structures that were not replaced due to the endless economic turmoil. With the
current plateau of stability, they can hopefully catch up with all the needed rebuilding.
I believe it was decommissioned although a sub was in it so it tells me they were using it to scrap the sub I don't understand why it takes so long to scrap the sub apparently the started it in 2010 now it's just going to rot on shores causing environmental issue instead of being recycled and money for scrap lost. If they had no intention of scrapping should have just dragged it out to sea and test fired a missile on it.
Isos- Posts : 9398
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If they had no intention of scrapping should have just dragged it out to sea and test fired a missile on it.
Or test some new torpedo against it when submerged.
Isos- Posts : 9398
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Join date : 2015-11-06
Marchal Ustinov, a Slava class cruiser goes into the Black Sea. That's weired. What is it going to do in the black sea ?
They should remove even the Moskva out of there. Their place is in the the north and pacific to face the US carriers not in the black sea.
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@YorukIsik
·
15h
Russia brings real fire power to BlackSea: #ВМФ Project 1164, Severomorsk based #Cф Northern Fleet’s Slava (NATO:Atlant) Marshal Ustinov trandits Bosphorus towards BlackSea. 055’s refit & modernisation at Zvezdochka in 2011-16 included new air/surface search radars.
@BenKendim1
They should remove even the Moskva out of there. Their place is in the the north and pacific to face the US carriers not in the black sea.
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@YorukIsik
·
15h
Russia brings real fire power to BlackSea: #ВМФ Project 1164, Severomorsk based #Cф Northern Fleet’s Slava (NATO:Atlant) Marshal Ustinov trandits Bosphorus towards BlackSea. 055’s refit & modernisation at Zvezdochka in 2011-16 included new air/surface search radars.
@BenKendim1
Isos- Posts : 9398
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That's weired... something is going on with this ship.
Capt(N)
@Capt_Navy
·
1h
It seems that the
RFS 055 ‘Marshal Ustinov’, a Slava Class CG cruiser does not enter #Sevastopol because it’s shadowing of the 
USS Ross DDG-71 Arleigh Burke Class destroyer in the western part of the Black Sea.
Capt(N)
@Capt_Navy
·
1h
It seems that the
RFS 055 ‘Marshal Ustinov’, a Slava Class CG cruiser does not enter #Sevastopol because it’s shadowing of the USS Ross DDG-71 Arleigh Burke Class destroyer in the western part of the Black Sea.
Isos- Posts : 9398
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More firepower in the black sea, an Udaloy is there too.
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@YorukIsik
· 1h
Russia brings real fire power to Black Sea: Backbone of the Fleet: #ВМФ Project 1155 Northern Fleet Сф Udaloy class destroyer, armed with SA-N-9 Gauntlet/Kinzhal & SS-N-14 Silex/Rastrub & 533mm torpedoes, Vice-Admiral Kulakov 626 transited Bosphorus en route to Sevastopol 14:30Z
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@YorukIsik
· 1h
Russia brings real fire power to Black Sea: Backbone of the Fleet: #ВМФ Project 1155 Northern Fleet Сф Udaloy class destroyer, armed with SA-N-9 Gauntlet/Kinzhal & SS-N-14 Silex/Rastrub & 533mm torpedoes, Vice-Admiral Kulakov 626 transited Bosphorus en route to Sevastopol 14:30Z
Isos- Posts : 9398
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Isos- Posts : 9398
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Join date : 2015-11-06
Maybe will go off Syrian coast to watch for possible Israeli attacks in the US-Iran mini-war.
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@YorukIsik
#ВМФ Project 1164, Severomorsk based #Cф Northern Fleet’s Slava (NATO:Atlant) class guided missile destroyer Marshal Ustinov, armed with Vulkan (NATO:SS-N-12B Sandbox) missiles, transited Bosphorus towards Marmara. 055’s refit at Zvezdochka was completed between 2011-16
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@YorukIsik
#ВМФ Project 1164, Severomorsk based #Cф Northern Fleet’s Slava (NATO:Atlant) class guided missile destroyer Marshal Ustinov, armed with Vulkan (NATO:SS-N-12B Sandbox) missiles, transited Bosphorus towards Marmara. 055’s refit at Zvezdochka was completed between 2011-16
JohninMK- Posts : 10795
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Isos wrote:Maybe will go off Syrian coast to watch for possible Israeli attacks in the US-Iran mini-war.
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@YorukIsik
#ВМФ Project 1164, Severomorsk based #Cф Northern Fleet’s Slava (NATO:Atlant) class guided missile destroyer Marshal Ustinov, armed with Vulkan (NATO:SS-N-12B Sandbox) missiles, transited Bosphorus towards Marmara. 055’s refit at Zvezdochka was completed between 2011-16
Or check out the US Amphibious Ready Group LH5 USS Bataan that is heading east in the Med.
It certainly made sense to move one of the Slavas out of the Black sea.
Isos- Posts : 9398
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It would make more sense to move both IMO.
Their targets are carrier group and there will never be one in the black sea.
Their targets are carrier group and there will never be one in the black sea.
walle83- Posts : 732
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Isos wrote:
Whats the deal with the Kerch? After the fire in 2014 it just sits there, not getting repaired, laid up or getting ready for scrap.
Whats the story there?
Big_Gazza- Posts : 3401
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I suspect that the RuN doesn't know what it wants yet regrading the Kerch. She's an unmodernised Soviet-era cruiser so her weapons and sensors will be obsolete, plus she's a one-of-a-kind. Not really worth upgrading, and probably not repairting given her limited combat capabilities.
They have better things to spend money on so will leave her tied up at wharf and thereby defer both a final decision and funds for breaking.
Maybe they will turn her into a museum ship?
They have better things to spend money on so will leave her tied up at wharf and thereby defer both a final decision and funds for breaking.
Maybe they will turn her into a museum ship?
walle83- Posts : 732
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Big_Gazza wrote:I suspect that the RuN doesn't know what it wants yet regrading the Kerch. She's an unmodernised Soviet-era cruiser so her weapons and sensors will be obsolete, plus she's a one-of-a-kind. Not really worth upgrading, and probably not repairting given her limited combat capabilities.
They have better things to spend money on so will leave her tied up at wharf and thereby defer both a final decision and funds for breaking.
Maybe they will turn her into a museum ship?
Funny enough she is about 5 years younger then the destroyer Smetlivy but never recived any kind of modification to talk about. Gessing that after the Ochakov fiasko the navy wasnt so willing spending more money on a Kara-cruiser.
Intresting fact is that after the Kirovs and Slava cruisers she is actually the largest surface warship in the Russian navy today.
franco- Posts : 5118
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Big_Gazza wrote:I suspect that the RuN doesn't know what it wants yet regrading the Kerch. She's an unmodernised Soviet-era cruiser so her weapons and sensors will be obsolete, plus she's a one-of-a-kind. Not really worth upgrading, and probably not repairting given her limited combat capabilities.
They have better things to spend money on so will leave her tied up at wharf and thereby defer both a final decision and funds for breaking.
Maybe they will turn her into a museum ship?
That is the plan apparently. Read that at least one engine is fairly new and will be salvaged.
JohninMK- Posts : 10795
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Back to two Slavas in the Black Sea.
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Verified account @YorukIsik
53m53 minutes ago
#ВМФ Project 1164, #Cф Northern Fleet’s Slava (NATO:Atlant) class guided missile cruiser Marshal Ustinov gives up on port call due to weather and transits Bosphorus back to Black Sea. With its powerful Bazalt missile system, the ship is among the most powerful in the Russian Navy
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Verified account @YorukIsik
53m53 minutes ago
#ВМФ Project 1164, #Cф Northern Fleet’s Slava (NATO:Atlant) class guided missile cruiser Marshal Ustinov gives up on port call due to weather and transits Bosphorus back to Black Sea. With its powerful Bazalt missile system, the ship is among the most powerful in the Russian Navy
Isos- Posts : 9398
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Putin aboard Ustinov. Are those containers carrying weapons ? It makes think about naval mines and they are near the rails for mines.
https://mobile.twitter.com/Capt_Navy/status/1215326389529972736
https://mobile.twitter.com/Capt_Navy/status/1215326389529972736
Big_Gazza- Posts : 3401
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They look like canisters holding inflatable life-rafts.
GarryB- Posts : 33171
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Yeah, they are life rafts... standard on Russian and Soviet military vessels...
from here:
https://www.marineinsight.com/marine-safety/life-raft-on-ships-a-general-overview/
(scroll down the page for the above image...)
from here:
https://www.marineinsight.com/marine-safety/life-raft-on-ships-a-general-overview/
(scroll down the page for the above image...)
JohninMK- Posts : 10795
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The green lines are the World's undersea cable network.
The Pentagon has released a map showing areas of increased Russian and Chinese naval activities, as well as the locations of major undersea cables, around the world as part of its most recent budget request for the 2021 Fiscal Year. This is perhaps the most granular detail on these subjects that the U.S. government has provided to date after years of warning about the threats that these patrols, especially by Russian submarines, pose to American national interests. Just last week, we reported that a senior U.S. Navy officer stated that Russian submarine sorties had become such an issue that the service no longer treats the East Coast of the United States as "uncontested" and would no longer view it as a guaranteed "safe haven" in a crisis.
The U.S. military released the annotated map in a 134-page overview report accompanying its 2021 Fiscal Year budget proposal. The graphic is part of a section describing new and emerging security concerns, especially with regards to so-called "great power competitors," such as the Russians and the Chinese. The Trump Administration does not appear to have included any similar map in the documentation that went along with its previous budget requests for the 2018, 2019, or 2020 Fiscal Years.
https://www.thedrive.com/the-war-zone/32145/new-pentagon-map-shows-huge-scale-of-worrisome-russian-and-chinese-naval-operations
The Pentagon has released a map showing areas of increased Russian and Chinese naval activities, as well as the locations of major undersea cables, around the world as part of its most recent budget request for the 2021 Fiscal Year. This is perhaps the most granular detail on these subjects that the U.S. government has provided to date after years of warning about the threats that these patrols, especially by Russian submarines, pose to American national interests. Just last week, we reported that a senior U.S. Navy officer stated that Russian submarine sorties had become such an issue that the service no longer treats the East Coast of the United States as "uncontested" and would no longer view it as a guaranteed "safe haven" in a crisis.
The U.S. military released the annotated map in a 134-page overview report accompanying its 2021 Fiscal Year budget proposal. The graphic is part of a section describing new and emerging security concerns, especially with regards to so-called "great power competitors," such as the Russians and the Chinese. The Trump Administration does not appear to have included any similar map in the documentation that went along with its previous budget requests for the 2018, 2019, or 2020 Fiscal Years.
https://www.thedrive.com/the-war-zone/32145/new-pentagon-map-shows-huge-scale-of-worrisome-russian-and-chinese-naval-operations
GarryB- Posts : 33171
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The map would have rather more impact if all the new Russian and Chinese activity centred around those cable locations but it clearly does not.
They are clearly pulling this shit out of their ass... how can we get politicians who don't give a shit about what we think is important to care?
We can't make it about money because we want them to spend a shit load more money on the services we provide, so lets make it about some national security thing... so either communications or nuclear weapons... lets go for communications...
The huge irony is that any extra money given will just get us closer to more direct confrontations and aggression from the west which might lead to their hoped for nuclear conflagaration... which is going to lead to lots of nuclear explosions that will do more to effect world wide communications than anything the Chinese or Russian navies are actually doing.
In this case the crime of the Russian and Chinese navies that requires lots and lots of taxpayers money is that they are sailing in international waters... I mean have you guys even looked at that map... what do the dots mean... is each the terminator in a Russian and Chinese patrol where they stopped there and observed western shipping and naval activity? Or are they multiple points on what are clearly Russian and Chinese ship related trips to south America in the Pacific and Russian trips to Cuba and Venezuela in the Atlantic... would would equate to normal commerical and military interests and therefore nothing out of the ordinary requiring extra funding or action.
They are clearly pulling this shit out of their ass... how can we get politicians who don't give a shit about what we think is important to care?
We can't make it about money because we want them to spend a shit load more money on the services we provide, so lets make it about some national security thing... so either communications or nuclear weapons... lets go for communications...
The huge irony is that any extra money given will just get us closer to more direct confrontations and aggression from the west which might lead to their hoped for nuclear conflagaration... which is going to lead to lots of nuclear explosions that will do more to effect world wide communications than anything the Chinese or Russian navies are actually doing.
In this case the crime of the Russian and Chinese navies that requires lots and lots of taxpayers money is that they are sailing in international waters... I mean have you guys even looked at that map... what do the dots mean... is each the terminator in a Russian and Chinese patrol where they stopped there and observed western shipping and naval activity? Or are they multiple points on what are clearly Russian and Chinese ship related trips to south America in the Pacific and Russian trips to Cuba and Venezuela in the Atlantic... would would equate to normal commerical and military interests and therefore nothing out of the ordinary requiring extra funding or action.
hoom- Posts : 2353
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Jebus chribes US has become unbelievably orwellianThe green lines are the World's undersea cable network.
Correlation != causation.
And random Iran! and Best Korea! wtf.
Ships and cables take the shortest route OMG whodathunkit.
Isos- Posts : 9398
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There is like 500km btw the ships and cables. They could have opened Paint and change it to match their propaganda. Not even need for photoshop 
.
However it would be weired if Russia doesn't monitor such strategic assests like submarine cable that connect Europe to USA. That's totally normal, that's why they have intel ships ... but saying they spend all the time doing this is stupid. The cables don't move.
.However it would be weired if Russia doesn't monitor such strategic assests like submarine cable that connect Europe to USA. That's totally normal, that's why they have intel ships ... but saying they spend all the time doing this is stupid. The cables don't move.
GarryB- Posts : 33171
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It is really paranoia because for most of the cold war the west sent secret missions with subs to tap in to under sea cables used by the Russian military to communicate with its allies and fleet, so being total 
they just assume Russia and China will do the same to them... except the volume of western traffic on those cables would require enormous amounts of computing power... humint is much more effective... like Assange and Snowden, who reveal to the world all the dirty secrets of the west, not for money or loyalty to the Kremlin, but based on actual western values of right and wrong they know western governments are doing wrong and want the world to know because they think their might be a backlash and things will get fixed... the reality is that as long as things are going OK most westerners don't give a fuck.
Very simply to become a millionaire or billionaire you need to have screwed a lot of people and also avoided a lot of bad people who wanted to take what you had... you can't become a billionaire and be a good person.... give me a billion dollars and I would be a millionaire in months... I would be buying expensive equipment for the local hospital and paying off peoples debts, giving money to people over 30 years old who still work in minimum wage jobs... I don't know how people can spend 10,000 dollars on a fucking watch... mine cost $13... and it works fine.
they just assume Russia and China will do the same to them... except the volume of western traffic on those cables would require enormous amounts of computing power... humint is much more effective... like Assange and Snowden, who reveal to the world all the dirty secrets of the west, not for money or loyalty to the Kremlin, but based on actual western values of right and wrong they know western governments are doing wrong and want the world to know because they think their might be a backlash and things will get fixed... the reality is that as long as things are going OK most westerners don't give a fuck.Very simply to become a millionaire or billionaire you need to have screwed a lot of people and also avoided a lot of bad people who wanted to take what you had... you can't become a billionaire and be a good person.... give me a billion dollars and I would be a millionaire in months... I would be buying expensive equipment for the local hospital and paying off peoples debts, giving money to people over 30 years old who still work in minimum wage jobs... I don't know how people can spend 10,000 dollars on a fucking watch... mine cost $13... and it works fine.
Isos- Posts : 9398
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Funny part is that the map shows chinese activity in russian territorial waters near ssbn bases
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