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67 posters

    S-70 "Okhotnik" UCAV

    GarryB
    GarryB


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    Post  GarryB Mon Dec 20, 2021 3:16 am

    From 10km altitude the targets on the ground may have no idea the drone is even there and even if they did no way to reach it with MANPADS, and with onboard radar it might be precision dropping bombs through the clouds... what is not to like...

    Launch a half million dollar Kh-50 cruise missile to fly 1,500km with a 400kg HE payload to hit a target, or a 2K dollar a flight hour drone to fly 2,000km out with a 500kg dumb bomb that can be released from 10km altitude with precision to hit the target and then fly all the way back with video and radar footage of the attack and the results... or indeed take two bombs and hit two targets and fly back for your next mission.

    When targets don't have their own airforces or even if they do it is a useful tool for specific situations.

    A target in Afghanistan for instance with a ZAB incendiary bomb for a poppy field perhaps... this thing could be carrying an R-77M and might be able to operate with other drones that can fight their way in and out, or they might rely on stealth...

    Either way an interesting new capability... essentially an unmanned F-117 really... but with probably double the flight range and better payload options and no pilot.

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    Hole
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    Post  Hole Mon Dec 20, 2021 8:30 am

    This is how weapon testing develops: begin with simple unguided bomb. In half a year we will see videos of cruise missiles launched from Okhotnik. thumbsup

    TMA1, jon_deluxe and Krepost like this post

    Krepost
    Krepost


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    Post  Krepost Mon Dec 20, 2021 12:38 pm

    Hole wrote:This is how weapon testing develops: begin with simple unguided bomb. In half a year we will see videos of cruise missiles launched from Okhotnik. thumbsup

    Precisely.
    All the spectrum of weapons that can fit in the internal bay will be used. Including:
    - Gravity bombs, glide bombs, precision guided ordonnance (laser guided, IR guided, TV guided, satellite guided etc.)
    - Anti-ship missiles
    - Cruise missiles
    - Small hypersonic missiles
    etc.

    Oh, I forgot... Please include barrel bombs and don't forget S-80 unguided rockets Wink

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    Atmosphere
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    Post  Atmosphere Mon Dec 20, 2021 12:53 pm

    PapaDragon wrote:
    thegopnik wrote:Well great news on two things, 1. we will get a production number estimate in 6 months. 2. it appears its an all aspect stealth drone because I think that image is showing a flat nozzle. ...

    Did anyone at any point actually think that this thing will not get new nozzle?


    if you visit certain forums you would be highly surprised, and people who thought that this thing would not get an appropriate nozzle would seem semi-rational infront of the people who speculated that the russian fifth generation fighter would never have any kind of long range missile warning or data link, or people who implied that it was less agile in dogfights compared to the F22 by visually looking at the wing sweep angle.

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    Hole
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    Post  Hole Mon Dec 20, 2021 2:50 pm

    Krepost wrote:
    Hole wrote:This is how weapon testing develops: begin with simple unguided bomb. In half a year we will see videos of cruise missiles launched from Okhotnik. thumbsup

    Precisely.
    All the spectrum of weapons that can fit in the internal bay will be used. Including:
    - Gravity bombs, glide bombs, precision guided ordonnance (laser guided, IR guided, TV guided, satellite guided etc.)
    - Anti-ship missiles
    - Cruise missiles
    - Small hypersonic missiles
    etc.

    Oh, I forgot... Please include barrel bombs and don't forget S-80 unguided rockets Wink

    Air-to-air missiles.
    Smaller drones.
    Nuclear bombs.

    jon_deluxe likes this post

    GarryB
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    Post  GarryB Mon Dec 20, 2021 9:28 pm

    Looking at the impact on target why would they bother with guided bombs?

    When cheap dumb bombs are accurate enough I suspect guided weapons would be tested only for standoff use and sneaky stuff with glide bombs.

    @atmosphere, those western experts were predicting the end of MiG and Sukhoi in the 1990s and that by now Russia would be begging for cast off HATO planes to patrol their airspace...

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    Atmosphere
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    Post  Atmosphere Tue Dec 21, 2021 1:10 am

    GarryB wrote:Looking at the impact on target why would they bother with guided bombs?

    When cheap dumb bombs are accurate enough I suspect guided weapons would be tested only for standoff use and sneaky stuff with glide bombs.

    @atmosphere, those western experts were predicting the end of MiG and Sukhoi in the 1990s and that by now Russia would be begging for cast off HATO planes to patrol their airspace...

    It really is the same snobbery taking different forms over time, it has no end.

    Speaking of dumb bombs, this is the idea, modern fire control systems make dumb bombs much more cost effective, while smart bombs fill their appropriate niche, a flight of S70s trucking around cheap bombs could be as accurate, but much more devastating in raw power because dumb bombs have a higher explosives to weight and volume ratio, all while being way less expensive.

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    GarryB
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    Post  GarryB Tue Dec 21, 2021 9:48 pm

    The core point is that with dumb bomb they are still managing to get the job done because there is nothing cheap and basic about the bombing/navigation system they are using, but it means they get comparable capabilities to the best the west can manage, but at a price that Russia can actually afford.
    Off topic rant:
    The US is killing itself with its military... eventually working out that they are not paying top dollar for the absolute best, they are paying the highest bribes on the planet and getting second rate stuff that does not work out of the box.

    Complaints about the Russian navy are amusing... why is it taking so long, why can't we have it now?

    Well looking at the F-35 and many other US products you pay absolute top dollar for getting it faster, and the delight of getting it quickly is stained by the problems that are not fixed yet and likely wont get fixed because their focus is making parts cheaper and also making them faster... which in both cases is making it all worse.

    The parts are expensive because of the scheme of putting production in places of low employment in the districts that vote for the senators and congressmen that have positions on committees that decide Pentagon funding so they are not centralised or optimised... they are all over the placed with workers who may never have done this sort of work before.

    Not to case doubt on the workers though, I am sure they are very glad to get jobs that pay well, but the point is that the extra costs that make these parts more expensive are not going into tooling to achieve better precision, or better materials to get better quality... it is money going in to peoples pockets and votes being directed at people who otherwise don't really deserve votes... you know... corruption.

    When the US wakes up.... and it has to eventually... it will realise it is a big and powerful economy but it is leaching money to billionaires like Russia was leaching money to the west in the 1990s... they need to look at all their spending and cut hard, but you know they will cut all the wrong things... health and education and infrastructure, when that is the place they should be focusing their money.

    America is the richest country in the world and money is power and they say all power corrupts so it is probably natural that the US is also the most corrupt country on the planet. The people are not evil, but their government is. They wont bat an eyelid putting sanctions on countries like Iran and Venezuela simply for not being their bitch. They will cry about the plight of gay and transgender people, but cancer patients in Iran or Venezuela who can't get life saving medication because of US sanctions can just die... the irony is that if you took an average American and showed them an Iranian or Venezuelan and told them it was their decision to let them have life saving medication or not, most would say let them have it, but the American government wont even let them buy it.


    Russia now has murder bots just like American murder bots... expect calls for limits and restrictions on their use internationally...

    Sorry about the rant... rather than move it I will hide it so if you are not interested in one of my boring off topic rants then ignore that spoiler...

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    Podlodka77
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    Post  Podlodka77 Wed Jan 12, 2022 8:53 am

    dimensions

    S-70 "Okhotnik" UCAV - Page 21 Russia10
    S-70 "Okhotnik" UCAV - Page 21 Tp5qsw10
    S-70 "Okhotnik" UCAV - Page 21 S-70-210

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    thegopnik
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    Post  thegopnik Wed Jan 12, 2022 11:01 am

    we havent seen those pictures before Rolling Eyes
    avatar
    ALAMO


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    Post  ALAMO Wed Jan 12, 2022 11:16 am

    We did.
    Those are cadres from Wojenna Prijomka, the episode is a month+ old at least.
    Last one either, but combined with some older pic and added numbers.

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    Hole
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    Post  Hole Wed Jan 12, 2022 3:02 pm

    That´s why thegopnik used the Rolling Eyes

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    GarryB
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    Post  GarryB Wed Jan 12, 2022 7:48 pm

    Is that supposed to be a new enlarged version... because looking at that image where you can see the wing of the Su-57 it looks to be four or more times bigger than the Su-57 but the normal S-70 we have seen is about the same size as the Su-57.

    Is this distortion because of a fish eye lens or a new drone based on the S-70 but scaled up a couple of times?

    When they were talking about the S-70 they did mention being able to scale it up to larger sizes... but that would mean much lower flight performance or a different engine... perhaps an upgraded NK-32?

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    Mir
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    Post  Mir Thu Jan 13, 2022 2:14 am

    GarryB wrote:Is that supposed to be a new enlarged version... because looking at that image where you can see the wing of the Su-57 it looks to be four or more times bigger than the Su-57 but the normal S-70 we have seen is about the same size as the Su-57.

    Is this distortion because of a fish eye lens or a new drone based on the S-70 but scaled up a couple of times?

    When they were talking about the S-70 they did mention being able to scale it up to larger sizes... but that would mean much lower flight performance or a different engine... perhaps an upgraded NK-32?

    The S-70 marked "071" is the first prototype. The guy on the wing is the presenter from Combat Approved - he is quite short.
    The bottom S-70 marked "S-70-2" in the picture is the second prototype and is larger than the first prototype. This sample use a lot more composite material to reduce weight.
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    Post  calripson Thu Jan 13, 2022 5:13 pm

    Mir wrote:
    GarryB wrote:Is that supposed to be a new enlarged version... because looking at that image where you can see the wing of the Su-57 it looks to be four or more times bigger than the Su-57 but the normal S-70 we have seen is about the same size as the Su-57.

    Is this distortion because of a fish eye lens or a new drone based on the S-70 but scaled up a couple of times?

    When they were talking about the S-70 they did mention being able to scale it up to larger sizes... but that would mean much lower flight performance or a different engine... perhaps an upgraded NK-32?

    The S-70 marked "071" is the first prototype. The guy on the wing is the presenter from Combat Approved - he is quite short.
    The bottom S-70 marked "S-70-2" in the picture is the second prototype and is larger than the first prototype. This sample use a lot more composite material to reduce weight.

    He is 170 cm in height for reference. He stated that on one of the shows.
    Atmosphere
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    Post  Atmosphere Thu Jan 13, 2022 6:04 pm

    There's just something very appealing about the S-70 being this massive and bulky, and being able to lift that much, compared to other similar drones.
    It's like the feeling you get when comparing an SMG to a carabine of similar weight and dimensions
    LMFS
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    Post  LMFS Thu Jan 13, 2022 6:11 pm

    Atmosphere wrote:There's just something very appealing about the S-70 being this massive and bulky, and being able to lift that much, compared to other similar drones.
    It's like the feeling you get when comparing an SMG to a carabine of similar weight and dimensions

    Definitely is not a toy, it is the equivalent of a tactical bomber, only with twice or thrice the range and endurance, very low RCS and much more expendable. A 100% valid alternative to the Su-34/24 for the VKS for the reconnaissance and strike roles in the future
    PapaDragon
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    Post  PapaDragon Fri Jan 14, 2022 12:21 am

    Atmosphere wrote:There's just something very appealing about the S-70 being this massive and bulky, and being able to lift that much, compared to other similar drones.
    It's like the feeling you get when comparing an SMG to a carabine of similar weight and dimensions

    Wanna hear something fun? They are working on larger bomber version of S-70

    Have a nice day

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    Atmosphere
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    Post  Atmosphere Fri Jan 14, 2022 12:44 am

    LMFS wrote:
    Atmosphere wrote:There's just something very appealing about the S-70 being this massive and bulky, and being able to lift that much, compared to other similar drones.
    It's like the feeling you get when comparing an SMG to a carabine of similar weight and dimensions

    Definitely is not a toy, it is the equivalent of a tactical bomber, only with twice or thrice the range and endurance, very low RCS and much more expendable. A 100% valid alternative to the Su-34/24 for the VKS for the reconnaissance and strike roles in the future

    At a much cheaper cost as well. The cost effectiveness of this thing would skyrocket.
    Atmosphere
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    Post  Atmosphere Fri Jan 14, 2022 12:45 am

    PapaDragon wrote:
    Atmosphere wrote:There's just something very appealing about the S-70 being this massive and bulky, and being able to lift that much, compared to other similar drones.
    It's like the feeling you get when comparing an SMG to a carabine of similar weight and dimensions

    Wanna hear something fun? They are working on larger bomber version of S-70

    Have a nice day

    This is way better knowing that a large bomber can also become a large EW or recon airplane since that size allows for heavier gear. It's an excellent spotter since it's a low RCS airplane with massive radars on the slats and what not.
    GarryB
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    Post  GarryB Fri Jan 14, 2022 3:34 am

    [qutoe]A 100% valid alternative to the Su-34/24 for the VKS for the reconnaissance and strike roles in the future
    [/quote]

    Nahh.... more like total replacement for any need for an F-117 in the Russia military.

    Sort of like a reusable stealthy cruise missile that could take on multiple targets in one flight with cheap dumb bombs...

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