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    Project 22350: Admiral Sergei Gorshkov #2

    GarryB
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    Post  GarryB on Sat May 02, 2020 2:00 pm

    They currently have two Kirov class cruisers, and about 3 Slava class cruisers and a dozen or so Sovs and Udaloys... eventually they will need to be replaced, and making one new Destroyer type to replace the destroyers and one Cruiser type to replace all the Cruisers is not that big a deal.
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    Post  Rodion_Romanovic on Sat May 02, 2020 2:27 pm

    Arrow wrote:


    They won't build such a fleet even in 50 years.

    Well in Zaliv (the shipyard in Kerch, Crimea) they built several of the krivak 1 class frigates between 1968 and 1980 and also, from 1980 to the end of soviet union, 8 of the Krivak III class (all the destined to the Soviet border guards, except the last one that became the flagship of the Ukrainian navy).

    As said before there is the capacity to build them.

    Even Yantar shipyard (that papadragon always criticizes) has been recently able to build and commission Krivak IV class frigates (indian Taiwar class and russian Grigorovich class) in a decent timeframe (about 3 years).

    If they had availability of engines Russia could build grigorovich class frigates (not inferior to the Chinese 054A class) with a very high pace. And that was the reason that motivated the russian navy to order those for the black sea fleet, since they are decent ships (even if not comparable to Gorshkov class) and using proven and tested technology.

    Later problems and delays were only due to the non delivery of the engines.


    The lack of engines also caused a delay for the 3th and 4th ship of the Gorshkov class, the work for which was delayed for a few years.

    Anyway, the engines were not the cause of the delays for Gorshkov and Kasanatov frigates....(the pilot ship and the first serial ship)...the problems for Gorshkov class, as it has been written many times, were mainly due to the novelty of sensors and weapon systems, and the fact that the pilot ship was practically used as test platform for all the new technologies that Russia wanted to introduce.

    The engines issue should be solved for Gorshkov class, and the novel technologies have now all been developed and tested, so I do not see why they should not be able to build them at a decent pace and possibly in more than one shipyard. The only thing needed for this is money to be spent, and priority given among the orders in the various shipyards.
    George1
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    Post  George1 on Fri May 08, 2020 9:52 pm

    3rd-built and second serial-produced Project 22350 frigate "Admiral Golovko" has been prepared for its float-out, a source in the shipbuilding industry told TASS on Friday.

    https://tass.com/defense/1154399
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    Post  Big_Gazza on Sat May 09, 2020 4:03 am

    George1 wrote:3rd-built and second serial-produced Project 22350 frigate "Admiral Golovko" has been prepared for its float-out, a source in the shipbuilding industry told TASS on Friday.

    https://tass.com/defense/1154399

    ...and first with domestically built gas turbine powerplant Very Happy

    Suck on that Ukro trash. Good riddance.
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    Post  dino00 on Wed May 20, 2020 9:05 pm

    Source: Severnaya Verf Shipyard will launch Admiral Golovko frigate on May 22

    https://tass.ru/armiya-i-opk/8522059
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    Post  Arrow on Wed May 20, 2020 10:05 pm

    The question is when it will be laid down for the next two 22350 frigates?
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    Post  dino00 on Wed May 20, 2020 10:30 pm

    Arrow wrote:The question is when it will be laid down for the next two 22350 frigates?

    Surely before your Polish "Navy"...has anything that can be called a modern frigate
    Isos
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    Post  Isos on Wed May 20, 2020 11:55 pm

    As soon as the ones being build right now free space in shipyards after the first stage of their construction, they will start new ones.

    I guess the "assembly line" is full right now. It seems they have space to start only two at the same time.

    Just saw the dates of the one already build, they needed around 5 years to launch the first two but 8 years for the 3rd one Golovko. Wtf happened ?
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    Post  PapaDragon on Thu May 21, 2020 12:12 am

    Isos wrote:As soon as the ones being build right now free space in shipyards after the first stage of their construction, they will start new ones.

    I guess the "assembly line" is full right now....

    It's not full, delay is due to pandemic

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    Post  ultimatewarrior on Thu May 21, 2020 4:25 am

    dino00 wrote:Source: Severnaya Verf Shipyard will launch Admiral Golovko frigate on May 22

    https://tass.ru/armiya-i-opk/8522059

    I thought Russia is shut down by COVID? Is it still working? Shocked
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    Post  Big_Gazza on Thu May 21, 2020 1:15 pm

    ultimatewarrior wrote:I thought Russia is shut down by COVID? Is it still working? Shocked

    Russophobic fuktardery from NYT, CNN, WaPo and other elite-owned pro-establishment fake-news-factories.
    Big_Gazza
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    Post  Big_Gazza on Thu May 21, 2020 1:31 pm

    Isos wrote:Just saw the dates of the one already build, they needed around 5 years to launch the first two but 8 years for the 3rd one Golovko. Wtf happened ?

    Lack of engines. They needed the components delivered before the Banderite putsch for the first 2 units, then needed 5 years to develop their own MGTs and gearboxes. One advantage of the forced delay is that had the time to thoroughly debug the many brand new sensor & weapon systems on the 1st pre-serial unit, and now the RuN will receive a series of robust and effective warships without an absurdly-long Zumwalt/Ford-style defect list.
    ultimatewarrior
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    Post  ultimatewarrior on Thu May 21, 2020 2:58 pm

    Big_Gazza wrote:
    ultimatewarrior wrote:I thought Russia is shut down by COVID? Is it still working? Shocked

    Russophobic fuktardery from NYT, CNN, WaPo and other elite-owned pro-establishment fake-news-factories.

    We see if it is launched tomorrow. Who lies?
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    Post  Big_Gazza on Fri May 22, 2020 1:23 am

    ultimatewarrior wrote:
    Big_Gazza wrote:
    ultimatewarrior wrote:I thought Russia is shut down by COVID? Is it still working? Shocked

    Russophobic fuktardery from NYT, CNN, WaPo and other elite-owned pro-establishment fake-news-factories.

    We see if it is launched tomorrow. Who lies?

    Tomorrow, the day after, next Tuesday after lunch...  whenever....  what difference does it make?  Suspect

    Russia isn't "shutdown" by COVID-19, anymore than its a "gas station masquerading as a nation". Its just stupid nonsense intended for consumption by empty-headed idiots who have never traveled beyond the town of their birth. Smears and innuendo in continuance of long-standing editorial policy.
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    Post  marat on Fri May 22, 2020 4:50 pm

    https://tass.com/defense/1159349

    ST. PETERSBURG, May 22. /TASS/. The St. Petersburg-based Severnaya Shipyard (part of the United Shipbuilding Corporation) floated out the Project 22350 third-built and second serial-produced frigate Admiral Golovko, the Shipyard told TASS on Friday.
    Hole
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    Post  Hole on Fri May 22, 2020 9:12 pm

    Project 22350: Admiral Sergei Gorshkov #2 - Page 25 22350_12
    Project 22350: Admiral Sergei Gorshkov #2 - Page 25 22350_13

    ultimatewarrior
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    Post  ultimatewarrior on Fri May 22, 2020 11:07 pm

    marat wrote:https://tass.com/defense/1159349

    ST. PETERSBURG, May 22. /TASS/. The St. Petersburg-based Severnaya Shipyard (part of the United Shipbuilding Corporation) floated out the Project 22350 third-built and second serial-produced frigate Admiral Golovko, the Shipyard told TASS on Friday.

    Well, I'll be damned. Russia is still working. Never write Russia off I say Cool
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    Post  Hole on Sat May 23, 2020 11:02 am

    Project 22350: Admiral Sergei Gorshkov #2 - Page 25 22-86610
    George1
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    Post  George1 on Sat May 23, 2020 12:24 pm

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    Post  mnztr on Sun May 24, 2020 7:10 am

    It will be interesting to watch the sea trials of this one with the Russian built turbines. The 22350s are really sharp looking ships.
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    Post  GarryB on Sun May 24, 2020 7:20 am

    Well, I'll be damned. Russia is still working. Never write Russia off I say

    Yet you so often do...

    You do understand that if they didn't lay down these ships that doesn't mean they were lying... it means they changed their plans.

    If I say I am going to the beach tomorrow and then tomorrow comes and it is pissing down rain and I don't go, that does not make me a liar... it just makes me wrong.

    BTW if it is pissing down rain and I go to the beach anyway because I said I was going makes me a fucking idiot...

    You could argue that I should have looked at the weather forecast before I made my plans, but in this case who could possibly have foreseen a global pandemic?

    Even right now we don't know when things will go back to normal, so making any new plans right now would be a nightmare...

    Planning things is not simply a question of desire... I might really really want to go to the beach, but it makes no sense if it is raining and cold and I wont enjoy it.

    For laying down a ship you need somewhere that can lay the ship down and there are not a lot of options there because they are not just laying it down and building the hull... they need the stuff that goes in to it to be ready to go in to it... there is no point laying down the hull of a ship if the engine and transmission wont be ready for 5 years... what that results in is a hull sitting there taking up space where other ships could be built while you are waiting for the components you need. Obviously you also need a workforce to do the work and you also need to organise all the materials you need for the build... the steel... the cabling... the electronics and pipes and of course all the computers and sensors and weapons and other bits and pieces to be ready when they are needed.

    Shifting the laying down time is a pain because it shifts all the other times around too, but if it can't be helped then it can't be helped.

    Plans are never set in stone and not being able to change plans leads to terrible situations... like getting a fighter plane that can't go supersonic for instance... or a new aircraft carrier that can't operate aircraft except helicopters despite it being 100 thousand tons and 16 billion dollars worth... for seagulls to shit on.
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    Post  mnztr on Sun May 24, 2020 6:10 pm

    [quote="GarryB"]
    W
    Plans are never set in stone and not being able to change plans leads to terrible situations... like getting a fighter plane that can't go supersonic for instance... or a new aircraft carrier that can't operate aircraft except helicopters despite it being 100 thousand tons and 16 billion dollars worth... for seagulls to shit on.

    Yup Ford Class, Littoral ships (pretty much in the dustbin at this point) Zumwalt class so many concepts that just did not work out ..Now a couple Virgina class are in dock for 2 years to fix some welds on the reactors even though they are "commissioned" this is just not easy stuff. 22350 is a huge leap in Russian naval warfare, as is Yassen class and Borei class. The progress is really immense. The nuke subs are arriving and a good clip, corvettes at a decent clip only the larger surface ships are problematic and just as they were ready to ramp up 22350 the engine supply dried up. I am still not convinced the engine supply is fully fixed. I think they will test this one, work out the bugs.. and THEN ramp up engines.
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    Post  dino00 on Sun May 31, 2020 11:16 pm

    Sea of ​​change: Admiral Gorshkov frigate awaits modernization

    Carriers of Zircon missile systems will receive new weapons systems and equipment


    Modern Russian frigates of project 22350 are being modernized. The first in line is Admiral Gorshkov. It plans to improve electronic equipment: radars, reconnaissance equipment and electronic warfare systems. They will also update the electronic filling - it will ensure the reliable operation of Zircon missile systems. Changes were made following the operation of two ships of this series. Experts note that frigates will become more powerful and reliable.

    First in a series

    It is planned that similarly all frigates of project 22350 will be finalized, sources in the Ministry of Defense told Izvestia. New ships of this type will be built taking into account the experience of operating weapons systems, life support and control on existing combat units.


    Full Article
    https://iz.ru/1017484/aleksei-ramm-bogdan-stepovoi/more-peremen-fregat-admiral-gorshkov-zhdet-modernizatciia
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    Post  Big_Gazza on Mon Jun 01, 2020 4:46 am

    dino00 wrote:Sea of ​​change: Admiral Gorshkov frigate awaits modernization

    Carriers of Zircon missile systems will receive new weapons systems and equipment


    Modern Russian frigates of project 22350 are being modernized. The first in line is Admiral Gorshkov. It plans to improve electronic equipment: radars, reconnaissance equipment and electronic warfare systems. They will also update the electronic filling - it will ensure the reliable operation of Zircon missile systems. Changes were made following the operation of two ships of this series. Experts note that frigates will become more powerful and reliable.

    First in a series

    It is planned that similarly all frigates of project 22350 will be finalized, sources in the Ministry of Defense told Izvestia. New ships of this type will be built taking into account the experience of operating weapons systems, life support and control on existing combat units.


    Full Article
    https://iz.ru/1017484/aleksei-ramm-bogdan-stepovoi/more-peremen-fregat-admiral-gorshkov-zhdet-modernizatciia

    Good news and unsurprising given that Gorshkov was laid down in 2006. This represents the typical evolutionary improvement of technologies (plus design improvements made during the protracted commissioning of Gorshkov), those systems that will be rolled out on the serial builds (Golovko onwards?) are being retrospectively applied to Gorshkov and maybe Kasanatov.
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    Post  GarryB on Mon Jun 01, 2020 5:37 am

    Good news and unsurprising given that Gorshkov was laid down in 2006. This represents the typical evolutionary improvement of technologies (plus design improvements made during the protracted commissioning of Gorshkov), those systems that will be rolled out on the serial builds (Golovko onwards?) are being retrospectively applied to Gorshkov and maybe Kasanatov.

    So essentially they are going to upgrade the electronics and systems... which would be the sort of thing you would do just before you start putting it in to serial production...

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