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    Russian military intervention and aid to Syria #9

    KoTeMoRe
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    Post  KoTeMoRe Wed May 25, 2016 10:20 am

    Also the basic thing any artilleryman does is maths.

    Main Runway is checked at 3.4/3.5km. Helicopter pad, 650/700m.

    Most outer ring fortifications are at 5 km around the impact point. ISIS has never been closer than 5 km from base. We don't know what that means actually. If it was 5km from the perimeter or from runway. However one map pictures this...

    Russian military intervention and aid to Syria #9 - Page 13 East-Homs-12-May-2016

    This clicks at 7km from helicopters and supply area. With no LOS under fire. Sure, ISIS burnt those Helicopters...with Photoshop.


    Anyway, there's this...


    Russian military intervention and aid to Syria #9 - Page 13 CjSXKGcWYAAVisC

    https://twitter.com/WarfareWW/status/735378840411885569


    And, now the usual suspects are doing their job. First picture reveals two Crocodiles look like Copy paste. Russians are slow starters for sure.
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    Post  Guest Wed May 25, 2016 10:55 am

    sepheronx wrote:As Militarov and Kote have pointed out (both who have served and have experience in such fields) this whole thing is far too sketchy to be real.  Even after viewing the photos again, it seems odd that all areas around the equipment seem untouched yet fire hit all the equipment.  And if artillery strike from 5km away (what kinda of weapon does ISIS have that would reach that far?) wouldn't have 100% accuracy and thus would have left more craters.  As well, once the first initial firings happened, those Mi-24's would be up and running.  So even if it was a "fire" the fire would show devistation all around, not just specific parts.  Even the MiG-25 damage would show far more damage than just a burn and what looks like damage from an explosions.

    It is all BS and US is just pushing it too.  Since it was stratfor.  They were apparently selling the photos too.  Or someone was as was pointed out earlier.  Bringing further "legitimacy" of it into question.

    What raises more issues that such satelite images were released some months ago in almost identical manner, but without any damage. Someone with experience in PS could more than easily alter them to suit any needs possible, while i am not sure if Straf would do that on their own, they might have been fed with such BS data.

    ISIS does have some artillery around still, D30s and GRADs, so they possibly could reach it, question stays how did they manage to hit it so "cleanly". IMHO there is something wrong here big time, but time will show on which points we were right.
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    Post  Azi Wed May 25, 2016 11:34 am

    This is pretty sure a fake! Take a look at the soot on the ground. At the depot it seems the wind comes from northwest, but at heli-position it seems the wind comes from south. Wind from two directions at the same place at same time? pwnd The vegetation between the two fire positions is intact, so this pic looks very strange. pwnd

    Russian military intervention and aid to Syria #9 - Page 13 Syria-russia-airbase-struck-by-isis-focal-point

    If it was a fire, the helis would never burn, it's a distcance over 300 m. A fire igniting just wood over a distance of 300 m, the column of soke could be seen normally over 50 km and easily from space (satellite). If it was artillery fire...where are the crates? A few flying tiny smithereens from a explosion wouldn't penetrate helicopters, because these are attack helicopters not civilian sightseeing helicopters!

    The photoshop-guy had too much Hollywood in mind!
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    Post  Guest Wed May 25, 2016 11:43 am

    The Russian military distributed humanitarian aid to civilians in Jayrud & Al Atna in Damascus:

    Russian military intervention and aid to Syria #9 - Page 13 CjO6smzUgAA4TWc

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    Post  Azi Wed May 25, 2016 11:53 am

    Militarov wrote:
    ISIS does have some artillery around still, D30s and GRADs, so they possibly could reach it, question stays how did they manage to hit it so "cleanly". IMHO there is something wrong here big time, but time will show on which points we were right.
    The point is you will in western media NEVER never never read the truth! The bullshit was spread and everyone should think "this is the fair punishment for the bad russian", many western media are maniac to take this shit and present it in a hysterical way, but you wil never see a against presentation in this media. For example in Germany it was published at spiegel online (online portal of the big weekly newsmagazine "Spiegel") at the top, for 5 hours topnews no. 1, also a few other newspaper published this bullshit. But you will never read from Spiegel or other newspaper "we are sorry for publishing fake news" and "we swear it will never happen again". But to be fair, the big pubic TV and radiostations didn't spread this bs. Spiegel is infamous for anti-russian propaganda! angry

    And the pictures you posted with humanitarian aid form Russia are also nonexisting for western media, because Russia bombs only thousands of hospital. Ok, but that's the way it is...it's propagandatime. This makes me sad to see my homeland and other western countries ideological back in the 60'ies.
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    Post  KoTeMoRe Wed May 25, 2016 12:37 pm

    https://imgur.com/h5YrSwj

    Crates behind Mil Mi are empty for the most part...
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    Post  JohninMK Wed May 25, 2016 12:55 pm

    Someone at another site, (Hi DasVivo Very Happy ) possibly commenting on my earlier comment here about the state of the Mi-8, thought that the 'missing' rotor arm might just be in line with the tail. That only seems possible if the Mi-8 has folding rotors. Does it?

    Russian military intervention and aid to Syria #9 - Page 13 Syria-russia-airbase-struck-by-isis-focal-point-3_0
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    Post  PapaDragon Wed May 25, 2016 12:56 pm


    ''Syrian Armed Groups Urge Russia to Halt Strikes Until Nusra Front Routed''

    http://sputniknews.com/middleeast/20160525/1040213829/russia-syria-nusra-front.html
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    Post  Guest Wed May 25, 2016 12:59 pm

    Nope Smile
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    Post  JohninMK Wed May 25, 2016 1:12 pm

    Don't watch this if you have epilepsy. Before/after photos merged/animated

    Russian military intervention and aid to Syria #9 - Page 13 TGRIa

    This is a fairly high def version of the POL or ammo store area, possibly POL as from the length of the trucks they look like local fuel tankers, like the ones in the ISIS convoys. Don't know if any of you have driven trucks but some of the trucks in the picture look as if they were on a one way trip from the access road with no easy way, apart from pretty difficult reversing manoeuvrers, to get back out. It is a definitely non military layout. Is this a Syrian set up or would Russian military do this?

    What fuel does the Mi-24 use?

    Russian military intervention and aid to Syria #9 - Page 13 CjN3HlyWUAATXjF


    Based on hardening evidence that the sat photos are kosher, FP's latest comment at the other site is that it looks increasingly like an ISIS sabotage operation, hence the accuracy and comments all round that there was a fire there. Perhaps we should not underestimate some of the training and munitions that ISIS SF may have received.
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    Post  Guest Wed May 25, 2016 1:32 pm

    Gas turbine, standard aviation fuel. Tho in case of emergency you could probaby burn whatever in it.
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    Post  KoTeMoRe Wed May 25, 2016 1:54 pm

    JohninMK wrote:Don't watch this if you have epilepsy. Before/after photos merged/animated

    Russian military intervention and aid to Syria #9 - Page 13 TGRIa

    This is a fairly high def version of the POL or ammo store area, possibly POL as from the length of the trucks they look like local fuel tankers, like the ones in the ISIS convoys. Don't know if any of you have driven trucks but some of the trucks in the picture look as if they were on a one way trip from the access road with no easy way, apart from pretty difficult reversing manoeuvrers, to get back out. It is a definitely non military layout. Is this a Syrian set up or would Russian military do this?

    What fuel does the Mi-24 use?

    Russian military intervention and aid to Syria #9 - Page 13 CjN3HlyWUAATXjF


    Based on hardening evidence that the sat photos are kosher, FP's latest comment at the other site is that it looks increasingly like an ISIS sabotage operation, hence the accuracy and comments all round that there was a fire there. Perhaps we should not underestimate some of the training and munitions that ISIS SF may have received.

    Nope first images are not Kosher. The Mil Mi pictures are doctored. Crocodile 1 and 2 is the same helicopter and has been added on runway, probably the two others as well from previous satellite pictures. What happened on the Tarmac and on the HAS behind is still completely TBD. Also I don't see any Russian military truck on the HAS. I see AFV trailers...Also this is a 30/50m def of the area, not high def...the pictures from Digital Globe are clearly "special"...Google has 10m def but it dates from February this year...


    Last edited by KoTeMoRe on Wed May 25, 2016 2:01 pm; edited 1 time in total
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    Post  JohninMK Wed May 25, 2016 1:58 pm

    Militarov wrote:Gas turbine, standard aviation fuel. Tho in case of emergency you could probaby burn whatever in it.
    Thanks, so its diesel not petrol.
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    Post  NationalRus Wed May 25, 2016 1:59 pm

    a accident? looks like it, looks to precise for a artillery strike/MRLS strike by some goat man
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    Post  JohninMK Wed May 25, 2016 2:02 pm

    KoTeMoRe wrote:
    Nope first images are not Kosher. The Mil Mi pictures are doctored. Crocodile 1 and 2 is the same helicopter and has been added on runway, probably the two others as well from previous satellite pictures. What happened on the Tarmac and on the HAS behind is still completely TBD. Also I don't see any Russian military truck on the HAS. I see AFV trailers...
    Thanks, the more views on this the better. Forgive my ignorance but what do TBD and AFV mean?
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    Post  DasVivo Wed May 25, 2016 2:03 pm

    JohninMK wrote:Someone at another site, (Hi DasVivo  Very Happy ) possibly commenting on my earlier comment here about the state of the Mi-8, thought that the 'missing' rotor arm might just be in line with the tail. That only seems possible if the Mi-8 has folding rotors. Does it?

    Russian military intervention and aid to Syria #9 - Page 13 Syria-russia-airbase-struck-by-isis-focal-point-3_0

    Hey John! Indeed I saw your post and figured it may sooner or later be mentioned on the topic... (Though it seems if Militarov is answering your question then it seems the possibility of folding blades is a negative...)
    The next question would be, would there be any reason for removal of a blade in daily maintenance and operations?


    I know I may be outspoken here on this but in general the idea everyones making this up just doesn't sit as easily with me as the possibility that something, somehow may have just happened..
    Does it mean the claims that ISIS launched an attack and destroyed all this are accurate? Not necessarily... Does it necessarily mean they are Russian Aircraft? Not really, and the pictures of the trucks sure doesn't make them look like Russian Military at all

    Whilst STRATFOR has a somewhat questionable reputation to say the least, something potentially quite easily investigated (though perhaps not by your average joe) is awfully risky to bet your repuation on (and as the imagery provider) should an news organisation or collective group decide to pool resources and do their own investigation. Granted you can argue people won't do that, and in most cases that's right... But it'd be just as easy for the Russian Government were it so big stitch up job to simply demonstrate otherwise (hell even using non russian imagery providers)..

    As for the imagery itself, I figure you can hand wave certain optical aspects at times due to limited resolution and perhaps slight angle etc (nevermind your own eyesight)... But there are certainly aspects to the whole story that sit well frankly very strangely compared to general trends we've been seeing....

    ISIS if they were making any attack that was frankly within LOS would surely have filmed the result (especially if they were confirming immediately, which apprently they did) the resulting destruction to Helicopters etc.... Yet there is none. And some of their reports were simply of a fire, not necessarily their fire..

    Then you have the SAA and Russian side of things, namely throughout both Syria and Ukraine (People of both sides) conflicts people are very willing to film/photograph themselves for Twitter, Instagram, VK, Youtube and whatever else.... Sitting around the base? Photograph it... Having Lunch? Photograph it... Major battle ongoing? It'll get twittered....

    Yet there seems to be an absence of this to what I can tell, of people reporting a battle, filming it and depicting any after math.... Unless someone literally popped out dropped a couple mortars and scored some incredible hits on differing targets then faded off.... Something is very amiss

    My general take would be to watch for any footage and reports in coming days... Anything from the Airbase or of Hinds operating (apparently there were some russian ones there)..
    Do we know how many Russian Mi-24s are in Syria and what their bort/serial numbers are? The sooner Hinds start wheeling and dealing damage in the area again (and in numbers we've seen) the sooner it may appear very untrue...
    The longer they remain inactive, the more questions it provokes..

    YMMV

    Cheers

    (the whole bloody incident is frankly - bizarre, and caught basically EVERYONE by su
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    Post  KoTeMoRe Wed May 25, 2016 2:07 pm

    Again, it's dead sure the helicopters on launch pad were added. So while SOMETHING might have happened, the initial image from Stratfor has been doctored.
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    Post  KoTeMoRe Wed May 25, 2016 2:10 pm

    JohninMK wrote:
    KoTeMoRe wrote:
    Nope first images are not Kosher. The Mil Mi pictures are doctored. Crocodile 1 and 2 is the same helicopter and has been added on runway, probably the two others as well from previous satellite pictures. What happened on the Tarmac and on the HAS behind is still completely TBD. Also I don't see any Russian military truck on the HAS. I see AFV trailers...
    Thanks, the more views on this the better. Forgive my ignorance but what do TBD and AFV mean?

    TBD= To be determined.
    AFV= Armoured fighting vehicle.
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    Post  JohninMK Wed May 25, 2016 2:42 pm

    KoTeMoRe wrote:
    JohninMK wrote:
    KoTeMoRe wrote:
    Nope first images are not Kosher. The Mil Mi pictures are doctored. Crocodile 1 and 2 is the same helicopter and has been added on runway, probably the two others as well from previous satellite pictures. What happened on the Tarmac and on the HAS behind is still completely TBD. Also I don't see any Russian military truck on the HAS. I see AFV trailers...
    Thanks, the more views on this the better. Forgive my ignorance but what do TBD and AFV mean?

    TBD= To be determined.
    AFV= Armoured fighting vehicle.
    Thanks. So you think that many of the long tracker/trailer units (artics in England, short for articulated) are what I would call tank transports. Its odd that all the artics have white tractor units. There looks to be only one military coloured truck there, 6x6 kind of size, to the right of the HAS, and it appears undamaged after the 'event'.
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    Post  JohninMK Wed May 25, 2016 2:44 pm

    DasVivo wrote:

    Hey John! Indeed I saw your post and figured it may sooner or later be mentioned on the topic... (Though it seems if Militarov is answering your question then it seems the possibility of folding blades is a negative...)

    I know I may be outspoken here on this but in general the idea everyones making this up just doesn't sit as easily with me as the possibility that something, somehow may have just happened..


    YMMV

    Cheers

    (the whole bloody incident is frankly - bizarre, and caught basically EVERYONE by su
    Brilliant to see you posting here.
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    Post  KoTeMoRe Wed May 25, 2016 2:50 pm

    JohninMK wrote:
    KoTeMoRe wrote:
    JohninMK wrote:
    KoTeMoRe wrote:
    Nope first images are not Kosher. The Mil Mi pictures are doctored. Crocodile 1 and 2 is the same helicopter and has been added on runway, probably the two others as well from previous satellite pictures. What happened on the Tarmac and on the HAS behind is still completely TBD. Also I don't see any Russian military truck on the HAS. I see AFV trailers...
    Thanks, the more views on this the better. Forgive my ignorance but what do TBD and AFV mean?

    TBD= To be determined.
    AFV= Armoured fighting vehicle.
    Thanks. So you think that many of the long tracker/trailer units (artics in England, short for articulated) are what I would call tank transports. Its odd that all the artics have white tractor units. There looks to be only one military coloured truck there, 6x6 kind of size, to the right of the HAS, and it appears undamaged after the 'event'.

    I see 3 tankers (left side 2, bottom 1) all the rest are logistic trucks and trailers. The truck that appears unharmed is actually a burnt out earthmover/dumptruck/.
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    Post  DasVivo Wed May 25, 2016 3:03 pm

    Anyone got an idea on how many Mi-24s (I think most are Mi-24P?) the Russian Military has in service in Syria?

    I've thus far been able to count 5 different numbers operating in Syria thus far... That said whether or not there is any repetition and or its of any use I frankly wouldn't be able to gauge
    03, 22, 23, 30, 40

    But I think there were at least 8 or so IIRC? (its late so I'm going to bed, or else I'd probably do a little digging things up)

    Cheers
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    Post  Guest Wed May 25, 2016 3:28 pm

    DasVivo wrote:Anyone got an idea on how many Mi-24s (I think most are Mi-24P?) the Russian Military has in service in Syria?

    I've thus far been able to count 5 different numbers operating in Syria thus far... That said whether or not there is any repetition and or its of any use I frankly wouldn't be able to gauge
    03, 22, 23, 30, 40

    But I think there were at least 8 or so IIRC? (its late so I'm going to bed, or else I'd probably do a little digging things up)

    Cheers

    All that were used in Syria are Mi-24P, other variants were not deployed, except Syrian operated ones.

    There were 12 Mi-24P at the peak of operations, not sure about now how many are still in Syria.
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    Post  Dima Wed May 25, 2016 7:07 pm

    The international terrorists camp is really desperate which shows with the contents of coming off their propaganda outlet.
    Good job KTM and Militarov for refuting those... thumbsup

    Though we are yet to get the real thing, Russian MoD refuted those claims my propaganda outlets that such losses were not there and we need to believe them. And we don't need to believe them blindly also.... Just take a look at all the actions that happened in the past years. Has anything gone unreported on Twitter? Hardly any, if I can so so.

    If such an attack would have indeed happened and such a loss, we would have known about it through Syrian twitter handles (in addition to terrorists twitter) who have many fighting men giving updates to them (which I personally don't like much and have expressed it earlier also).


    Btw, we have been sort of frustrated due to lack of Russian fireworks like before, but it looks like the international terrorists are even more frustrated and worried about Russia coming back to their past levels...

    U.S. Embassy Syria ‏@USEmbassySyria May 23
    Statement by US Special Envoy for #Syria Michael Ratney to Armed Syrian Opposition Factions:
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    Post  Vann7 Wed May 25, 2016 8:01 pm

    I don't know about the claims of stratfor it could be fake propaganda or not.
    What i do know is the Syrian civil war is not a civil war but a US and allies proxy war against Russia and Syria. So i will say ,im surprised we have not seen yet hundreds if not thousands
    of Russian killed in that military base. Because from Turkey border , Artillery can hit Russian positions . and Erdogan is a muslin crazy fanatic ,so you cannot reason with their logic.

    Russia should have basic protection to all its planes and hellicopters in that base against
    artillery , regardless if the attack on the base is real or fake.  Should have reinforced concrete hangars for all its airforce. Why they have not done anything and leave their planes or hellicopters on open air , is unbelievable stupid. More evidence of Russia government idiocy ,
    that always , ALWAYS is underestimating its enemies determination to attack them.

    Regardless of what happened , it looks fake Stratform evidence. the fact remains ,
    that Russia continues with its Idiotic and retarded policy of underestimating its enemies.
    Already the imbecile Putin , underestimated Erdogan determination to attack
    Russia even if that means war. And the more hopeless Erdogan feel in Turkey to get what he
    wants in Syria ,the more dangerous he will be. Same with Americans.

    So its military base have been always a major target to hit for NATO . the motives were there ,
    the only question was how to do it in a way ,NATO cannot be blamed for it. So something like smuggling long range precision artillery in IDLIB can do the job .So if nothing happened before ,it will be a matter of time it will. Russia policy should be one of never allow its enemies to even try anything ,that they think is impossible for them to do. as soon they moved to Syria (if not months before )they should have started building fortifications for its soldiers and airforce there ,and Putin not just sit down with its thumbs on its ass in Moscow and give an opportunity to its enemies to attack them. not wait artillery shell or cruise missile from nowhere by "Accident" to wipes their airforce. neither rely on s-400s to do all the job. and Russia security should have protected any city near its base too at very least ,something they ALSO Failed to do.

    Perhaps now at least after the terrorist attack close to its base, Russia will now consider increasing their security around the base.

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