Russia Defence Forum

Would you like to react to this message? Create an account in a few clicks or log in to continue.

Military Forum for Russian and Global Defence Issues


    Russian defence against drone swarms

    Isos
    Isos

    Posts : 6683
    Points : 6673
    Join date : 2015-11-06

    Russian defence against drone swarms - Page 7 Empty Re: Russian defence against drone swarms

    Post  Isos on Fri Oct 30, 2020 10:48 am

    Hmeimim is a base. Now facing a drone attack on the front where your AD are not 100m away from the target but further away and in less numbers makes the interception a bit harder.

    But then if you face only drones means the enemy is quite weak and will face real aviation which mean enemy important target will be destroyed the first day.

    AD is just a way of dealing with them. The other one is to attack those drones and their operating centers on the ground. And fir that Russia needs more ELINT plateform. Tu-214R is very good at detection them but is also a large aircraft. Thry can now invest in a smaller one like the su-80 or use ELINT drones.
    magnumcromagnon
    magnumcromagnon

    Posts : 6477
    Points : 6628
    Join date : 2013-12-05
    Location : Pindos ave., Pindosville, Pindosylvania, Pindostan

    Russian defence against drone swarms - Page 7 Empty Re: Russian defence against drone swarms

    Post  magnumcromagnon on Fri Nov 06, 2020 1:26 pm

    SPB Spetznas, (Presidential Security) armed with Anti-Drone weapon
    Russian defence against drone swarms - Page 7 EmIUeGIU8AYgfnl?format=jpg&name=900x900

    kvs likes this post

    kvs
    kvs

    Posts : 7521
    Points : 7668
    Join date : 2014-09-11
    Location : Canuckistan

    Russian defence against drone swarms - Page 7 Empty Re: Russian defence against drone swarms

    Post  kvs on Fri Nov 06, 2020 7:21 pm

    Russia knows what it needs to do with drones.

    magnumcromagnon
    magnumcromagnon

    Posts : 6477
    Points : 6628
    Join date : 2013-12-05
    Location : Pindos ave., Pindosville, Pindosylvania, Pindostan

    Russian defence against drone swarms - Page 7 Empty Re: Russian defence against drone swarms

    Post  magnumcromagnon on Sat Nov 07, 2020 11:37 pm

    9F60213 'Adjutant' full-scope all-aspect training system of Air Defence formations.
    Russian defence against drone swarms - Page 7 EmL8zshW8AEos27?format=jpg&name=4096x4096Russian defence against drone swarms - Page 7 EmL807eWEAI0xTC?format=jpg&name=4096x4096Russian defence against drone swarms - Page 7 EmL81mjWEAEf5QB?format=jpg&name=4096x4096

    GarryB, dino00, LMFS and lyle6 like this post

    Hole
    Hole

    Posts : 3418
    Points : 3416
    Join date : 2018-03-24
    Age : 44
    Location : Merkelland

    Russian defence against drone swarms - Page 7 Empty Re: Russian defence against drone swarms

    Post  Hole on Sun Nov 08, 2020 11:46 am

    Russian defence against drone swarms - Page 7 000434
    Russian defence against drone swarms - Page 7 000530
    Russian defence against drone swarms - Page 7 000621
    VM-R drone

    dino00, magnumcromagnon and LMFS like this post

    Hole
    Hole

    Posts : 3418
    Points : 3416
    Join date : 2018-03-24
    Age : 44
    Location : Merkelland

    Russian defence against drone swarms - Page 7 Empty Re: Russian defence against drone swarms

    Post  Hole on Sun Nov 08, 2020 11:47 am

    Russian defence against drone swarms - Page 7 000163
    Russian defence against drone swarms - Page 7 000262
    VM-S drone

    magnumcromagnon likes this post

    Hole
    Hole

    Posts : 3418
    Points : 3416
    Join date : 2018-03-24
    Age : 44
    Location : Merkelland

    Russian defence against drone swarms - Page 7 Empty Re: Russian defence against drone swarms

    Post  Hole on Sun Nov 08, 2020 11:49 am

    Russian defence against drone swarms - Page 7 000263
    VM-SR
    Russian defence against drone swarms - Page 7 Vm-v10
    and the ´lil helicopter VM-V

    magnumcromagnon likes this post

    Hole
    Hole

    Posts : 3418
    Points : 3416
    Join date : 2018-03-24
    Age : 44
    Location : Merkelland

    Russian defence against drone swarms - Page 7 Empty Re: Russian defence against drone swarms

    Post  Hole on Sun Nov 08, 2020 8:43 pm

    Back to anti-drone weapons: Ataka-Trofi

    Russian defence against drone swarms - Page 7 Ataka-10
    Russian defence against drone swarms - Page 7 Ataka-11
    Russian defence against drone swarms - Page 7 Ataka-12
    kvs
    kvs

    Posts : 7521
    Points : 7668
    Join date : 2014-09-11
    Location : Canuckistan

    Russian defence against drone swarms - Page 7 Empty Re: Russian defence against drone swarms

    Post  kvs on Mon Nov 09, 2020 12:12 am

    Remote control is a real weakness of drones, especially small non-autonomous ones that are used for purposes where they
    cannot be made autonomous. Whatever control signal they have can be localized rapidly and even it is quantum encripted it
    can be jammed. And local jamming can be very effective since the control signal amplitude cannot be arbitrarily dialed
    to overcome it.

    Too much Hollywood cheesy scifi permeates the "thinking" of fanbois on the subject of drone swarms.

    GarryB
    GarryB

    Posts : 26675
    Points : 27207
    Join date : 2010-03-30
    Location : New Zealand

    Russian defence against drone swarms - Page 7 Empty Re: Russian defence against drone swarms

    Post  GarryB on Mon Nov 09, 2020 10:28 am

    More effective than jamming.... shelling or bombing the source of the signal will get rid of the nerds supporting drone operations which is the first step to draining the swamp...

    lyle6 likes this post

    lyle6
    lyle6

    Posts : 146
    Points : 148
    Join date : 2020-09-14

    Russian defence against drone swarms - Page 7 Empty Re: Russian defence against drone swarms

    Post  lyle6 on Mon Nov 09, 2020 1:25 pm

    GarryB wrote:More effective than jamming.... shelling or bombing the source of the signal will get rid of the nerds supporting drone operations which is the first step to draining the swamp...

    I remember following the events in Donbass (pol, or maybe was it wm? I forgot), and there was this group of enterprising Ukrainians who have this bright idea of procuring jammers against micro UAVs. These same drones you see, have been instrumental in the Russians blowing their shit up left and right and its about time they have had enough of. So, in the jammer arrives, and the Orlan-10s start dropping just as planned - but not that much later, and lo and behold they still get artillery and rocket salvos right where these jammers are stationed! Turns out the Russians have emitter locators nearby just waiting for this sort of thing to occur. In their haste to counter the salient threat, the Ukrainians just exposed themselves to yet another one. That's some crazy advanced getting in you enemy's OODA loop stuff, and shows why the Russians are handily winning when they themselves know what the enemy is doing before he could even realize it on his own.

    GarryB, kvs, miketheterrible and LMFS like this post

    Isos
    Isos

    Posts : 6683
    Points : 6673
    Join date : 2015-11-06

    Russian defence against drone swarms - Page 7 Empty Re: Russian defence against drone swarms

    Post  Isos on Mon Nov 09, 2020 2:16 pm

    Jammer are no different than radar. It send a signal and can be triangulated just like any source of EM waves with the right tool.

    Now they mount such ELINT stuff on drones but it would be better if they had a small aircraft with 2 or 3 operators inside since drones are easy fool/jamm/destroy, specially to big drone that carry such stuff.

    They have the il-112 that can be equiped with a lot of EW/ELINT packages and turn around the front line and listen to enemy signals.

    They have the tu-214R but it's a big aircraft and have only 2 or 3 of them. You don't always need such big plateforme for such mission all the time.

    We saw that they need such aircraft pretty much anywhere where there are tensions. IMO some 15 il-112 would be nice to back up the tu-214R which is more expensive to operate.

    They could even use a smaller plateforme like the sukhoi s-80.

    Small countries would also be interested by like Algeria, India, Vietnam... they can easily sell some 15-20 which is a good number for an ELINT aircraft.
    GarryB
    GarryB

    Posts : 26675
    Points : 27207
    Join date : 2010-03-30
    Location : New Zealand

    Russian defence against drone swarms - Page 7 Empty Re: Russian defence against drone swarms

    Post  GarryB on Tue Nov 10, 2020 1:58 am

    You could also develop artillery rockets with seeker heads that home in on the jammer signal... when you launch your drones get your rocket artillery ready to fire in any direction you detect a jammer signal... or your drone detects the jammer signal... just because your drone has been jammed does not mean it can't send a radio signal indicating its location and the direction of the jamming. Most modern real drones (as opposed to remotely piloted drones flown like model planes) can usually return to base on autopilot when their communications signal is jammed.

    As soon as jamming is detected the rockets can be launched to deal with the problem... if they get their quickly enough the mission might not even need to be aborted...

    The reality is that poor countries can buy all sorts of drones and drown launched weapons, but it is the richer more powerful countries that can buy all the extra kit that makes the drones safer and using drones against them much more dangerous and expensive in terms of lives.
    magnumcromagnon
    magnumcromagnon

    Posts : 6477
    Points : 6628
    Join date : 2013-12-05
    Location : Pindos ave., Pindosville, Pindosylvania, Pindostan

    Russian defence against drone swarms - Page 7 Empty Re: Russian defence against drone swarms

    Post  magnumcromagnon on Mon Nov 16, 2020 3:18 pm

    kvs likes this post

    kvs
    kvs

    Posts : 7521
    Points : 7668
    Join date : 2014-09-11
    Location : Canuckistan

    Russian defence against drone swarms - Page 7 Empty Re: Russian defence against drone swarms

    Post  kvs on Mon Nov 16, 2020 5:02 pm

    Jammers are far from useless. The enemy will be attacking all of your assets anyway. So there is no incremental cost in
    operating jamming systems. If jamming systems is all you have, then you are not going to win anyway. The idea that
    some US-style enemy is going to be picking off Russian assets without effort is BS.

    The above video shows a large jamming system. Small portable ones are not useless either and are more than likely being
    developed. Having a thousand points of light jamming makes it hard for the enemy to take them all out.



    Isos
    Isos

    Posts : 6683
    Points : 6673
    Join date : 2015-11-06

    Russian defence against drone swarms - Page 7 Empty Re: Russian defence against drone swarms

    Post  Isos on Mon Nov 16, 2020 5:33 pm

    Jamm the GPS and all NATO moving harware becomes useless.

    They will just start hitting their own troops.

    As long as Russia has GPS jammers all over the battlefield they will win.

    Even their laser guided bombs need GPS because the ground soldier use it to tell enemy positions. If he can't locate the GPS coordinate of the enemy then the fighter/bomber or the drone will need to come closer to spot the enemy and its 1 million $ bomb can't be used in the guided mode, only free fall but with its "wings" it won't fall like a free fall bomb.

    Sponsored content

    Russian defence against drone swarms - Page 7 Empty Re: Russian defence against drone swarms

    Post  Sponsored content


      Current date/time is Mon Nov 30, 2020 6:56 pm