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    PAK-FA, T-50: News #4

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    Austin


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    PAK-FA, T-50: News #4 - Page 10 Empty Re: PAK-FA, T-50: News #4

    Post  Austin Wed Aug 30, 2017 7:31 am

    Air International Issue some snippets on PAK-FA from Piotr Butowski

    PAK-FA, T-50: News #4 - Page 10 Su-57_10
    PAK-FA, T-50: News #4 - Page 10 Su-57-10
    PAK-FA, T-50: News #4 - Page 10 Pak-fa10
    kvs
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    Post  kvs Wed Aug 30, 2017 6:25 pm

    The top speed of the SU-57 is a state secret so naturally the above estimate is strictly propaganda BS. There is simply
    no physical reason why the SU-57 would be limited by Mach 2 vs. Mach 2.25 for the F-22. But then again, the retards who
    publish this magazine called the S-57 a "Raptorski". The SU-57 and F-22 are clearly not from the same design template.
    Those ridiculously huge tail rudders on the F-22 make it look like a joke when talking about "stealth".
    ZoA
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    PAK-FA, T-50: News #4 - Page 10 Empty Re: PAK-FA, T-50: News #4

    Post  ZoA Wed Aug 30, 2017 8:35 pm

    MOSCOW, August 30. /TASS/. Russia’s Defense Ministry expects to sign a contract for a pilot batch of fifth-generation Su-57 fighter jets next year and troops should receive these cutting-edge aircraft in 2019, Deputy Defense Minister Yuri Borisov said on Wednesday.
    ...
    "We are now considering signing a contract for the delivery of a pilot batch of these fighter jets in 2018 with their dispatch to the troops in 2019," he said.


    More:
    http://tass.com/defense/962787
    PapaDragon
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    PAK-FA, T-50: News #4 - Page 10 Empty Re: PAK-FA, T-50: News #4

    Post  PapaDragon Sun Sep 10, 2017 3:46 pm

    '
    No 11 over Novosibirsk
    PAK-FA, T-50: News #4 - Page 10 217632

    PAK-FA, T-50: News #4 - Page 10 F_c2RlbGFub3VuYXMucnUvdXBsb2Fkcy82LzMvNjM1MTUwNTAzODA2MV9vcmlnLmpwZWc_X19pZD05NzgxMA==
    AMCXXL
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    PAK-FA, T-50: News #4 - Page 10 Empty Re: PAK-FA, T-50: News #4

    Post  AMCXXL Sun Sep 10, 2017 11:50 pm

    kvs wrote:The top speed of the SU-57 is a state secret so naturally the above estimate is strictly propaganda BS.   There is simply
    no physical reason why the SU-57 would be limited by Mach 2 vs. Mach 2.25 for the F-22.    But then again, the retards who
    publish this magazine called the S-57 a "Raptorski".    The SU-57 and F-22 are clearly not from the same design template.
    Those ridiculously huge tail rudders on the F-22 make it look like a joke when talking about "stealth".

    The max. speed for Su-57 is about 2500-2600 Km/h (or will be when the final engine is deployed) or 2,32-2,4 mach at altitude
    The number of Mach 2,25 for F-22 is to divide 2410 km/h between 297,5 m/s, this is about of 10000 metrers of altitude
    The Mach number depends of altitude
    At sea level, sound speed is 340m/s or 1225 Km/h.
    The usual mistake is to divide the max speed with the sound speed at sea level (or multiplicate mach number with the mach speed at sea level)
    That article has counted as T-50 speed 2450 Km/h and has divided between 1225 Km/h or mach speed at sea level
    at 10.000 metres of altitude sound speed is about 300 m/s or 1060 Km/h
    In fact , none airplane can reach 2 or 2,5 mach at sea level
    The faster airplanes at sea level often have variable wings

    Of course the performance of these airplanes is military secret
    This numbers are published as reference, could be other at different altitudes or diferent payload


    Last edited by AMCXXL on Mon Sep 11, 2017 1:13 pm; edited 2 times in total
    George1
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    PAK-FA, T-50: News #4 - Page 10 Empty Re: PAK-FA, T-50: News #4

    Post  George1 Mon Sep 11, 2017 1:04 am

    Aircraft T-50-11 arrived in Zhukovsky

    Spotters report that on September 10, 2017, on the airfield of the Gromov Flight Research Institute JSC in Zhukovsky outside Moscow for testing came from a self-sustained flight from Komsomolsk-on-Amur across Russia, the ninth flight prototype of a fifth fighter generation PAK FA (Su-57) - the aircraft T-50-11 (the side number "511").

    The T-50-11 airplane flew with hanging tanks with an intermediate landing in Novosibirsk, which enabled the spoters to take numerous photographs of it - earlier T-50-11 photos were not published in open sources.

    https://bmpd.livejournal.com/2839953.html
    PapaDragon
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    PAK-FA, T-50: News #4 - Page 10 Empty Re: PAK-FA, T-50: News #4

    Post  PapaDragon Mon Sep 11, 2017 8:54 pm

    PAK-FA, T-50: News #4 - Page 10 CzAxOS5yYWRpa2FsLnJ1L2k2MTUvMTcwOS84Ni9jZjUyM2QxOGNlMDQuanBnP19faWQ9OTc4Mzg=

    PAK-FA, T-50: News #4 - Page 10 AWMucGljcy5saXZlam91cm5hbC5jb20vYm1wZC8zODAyNDk4MC80NjY2ODY1LzQ2NjY4NjVfb3JpZ2luYWwuanBn
    KomissarBojanchev
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    PAK-FA, T-50: News #4 - Page 10 Empty Re: PAK-FA, T-50: News #4

    Post  KomissarBojanchev Tue Sep 12, 2017 2:35 am

    Is the Su-57 targeting pod ready? If yes, is it a stealth disadvantage if its external and the F-22's is internal? Also why are there no operational targeting pods in the VVS? Its 2 decade old tech. If Russia can make anti-stealth radars and TV guided AGMs then it should've made targeting pods long ago.
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    PAK-FA, T-50: News #4 - Page 10 Empty Re: PAK-FA, T-50: News #4

    Post  flamming_python Tue Sep 12, 2017 9:29 am

    Whats a targetting pod needed for?
    marcellogo
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    PAK-FA, T-50: News #4 - Page 10 Empty Re: PAK-FA, T-50: News #4

    Post  marcellogo Tue Sep 12, 2017 9:40 am

    KomissarBojanchev wrote:Is the Su-57 targeting pod ready? If yes, is it a stealth disadvantage if its external and the F-22's is internal? Also why are there no operational targeting pods in the VVS? Its 2 decade old tech. If Russia can make anti-stealth radars and TV guided AGMs then it should've made targeting pods long ago.
    Because in the attack dedicated planes like Su-24, Su-34 and the Su-25 they just have integral targeting devices, so no need of a pod, same happen in the west with planes like Tornado and now F-35.
    In the case of Su-57 and the other that would swap between A2A and A2G missions a detachable pod to be carried just in the attack ones are a wise choice.
    GarryB
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    PAK-FA, T-50: News #4 - Page 10 Empty Re: PAK-FA, T-50: News #4

    Post  GarryB Tue Sep 12, 2017 10:59 am

    What internal targeting pod does the F-22 have?

    AFAIK it does not even have IRST let alone targeting pod.
    PapaDragon
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    PAK-FA, T-50: News #4 - Page 10 Empty Re: PAK-FA, T-50: News #4

    Post  PapaDragon Tue Sep 12, 2017 11:52 am

    KomissarBojanchev wrote:Is the Su-57 targeting pod ready? If yes, is it a stealth disadvantage if its external and the F-22's is internal? Also why are there no operational targeting pods in the VVS? Its 2 decade old tech. If Russia can make anti-stealth radars and TV guided AGMs then it should've made targeting pods long ago.

    That thing is brand spanking new and stocked full.

    Even if they somehow needed targeting pods what tech could they install on that pod that isn't already installed on aircraft itself?
    ATLASCUB
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    PAK-FA, T-50: News #4 - Page 10 Empty Re: PAK-FA, T-50: News #4

    Post  ATLASCUB Tue Sep 12, 2017 11:55 pm

    GarryB wrote:What internal targeting pod does the F-22 have?

    AFAIK it does not even have IRST let alone targeting pod.

    I thought they were getting that upgrade? Or am I mistaking planes?
    Cheetah
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    Post  Cheetah Wed Sep 13, 2017 12:08 am

    Hold on, If the Su-57 isn't going to need a targeting pod, what was all that business about the 101KS-N?

    PAK-FA, T-50: News #4 - Page 10 MAKS_Airshow_2013_%28Ramenskoye_Airport%2C_Russia%29_%28523-45%29
    miketheterrible
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    Post  miketheterrible Wed Sep 13, 2017 12:24 am

    It will have a targeting pod. That pod will also be used for all other jets too.
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    Post  Svyatoslavich Wed Sep 13, 2017 12:42 am

    GarryB wrote:What internal targeting pod does the F-22 have?

    AFAIK it does not even have IRST let alone targeting pod.
    F-22 can't carry any targeting pod. It has very limited A2G capabilities.
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    Post  Nasr Hosein Wed Sep 13, 2017 4:37 am

    As far as I can tell, a targeting pod has been in use for many years on what is known in the West as "legacy aircraft". Since the approach there has been to acquire "multi-role" capability from a single platform. And also, the legacy aircraft such as F-16s, F-15s, F/A-18s used a variety of independent systems which merged together on the platform. The targeting pod was integrated with the platform as yet another tech-capability added on. Targeting pods didn't exist at the time when these legacy aircraft were designed. Whereas aircraft designed and developed post-legacy era, i.e Eurofighters, Rafales, Gripen-NGs and etc, seemed to have carried on with the "add-on" targeting pod concept. It is only when the fifth-gen fighter was conceptualized, that a concerted effort (in some 5th-Gen aircraft, not all) was integrated into the design and architecture of the aircraft. Of course various aircraft design & manufacturing bureaus/corporations taken different approach in how they design and develop aircraft. It isn't a "set in stone" rule to follow.

    Just my two cents on the subject.
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    Post  Austin Wed Sep 13, 2017 7:37 am

    PAK-FA, T-50: News #4 - Page 10 46668610
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    Post  Austin Wed Sep 13, 2017 7:48 am

    Interview with United Engine Corporation Chief on New features of 117 Engine currently on PAK-FA compared to 117S Engine on Su-35 and AL-31F on Su-30

    http://vpk-news.ru/articles/8228

    1 ) there will be new ceramic materials can withstand very high temperatures.
    2 ) High-pressure turbine can operate without cooling blades, bearings - no lubrication.
    3 ) Inlet temperature exceeds the temperature of the combustion theater kerosene at 2300 degrees.
    4 ) The engine is a new low-pressure compressor.
    5 ) Substantially upgraded high-pressure compressor.
    6 ) The new combustion chamber.
    7 ) The new turbine.
    8 ) Almost all new units 80 % new parts compared to 117S
    9 ) Weight Reduction of 150 kg link
    10 ) Fundamentally new system of automatic control system (ACS) - fully digital, with full responsibility. For the first time it will be built at the Russian element basis. Architecture of the system, the control algorithm and its Russian counterparts
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    Post  Austin Wed Sep 13, 2017 1:46 pm

    kvs or anybody any thing on HPT without cooled blades and 2300deg TIT discussion we are having here , If the translation is correct is this a breakthrough for 117 engine ?

    https://forums.bharat-rakshak.com/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=6811&start=1920#p2212703
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    Post  Austin Thu Sep 14, 2017 3:18 pm

    Found this comment here

    http://www.f-16.net/forum/viewtopic.php?f=36&t=24232&sid=1a68e398f2c841829350c11aaecd4068

    To come back to the original question the answer is of course yes. The T-50 has a level of instability between 10-12% which is about twice that of the Su-30MKI and other canarded Flanker derivatives. One of the main rationals behind this particularly high level of instability is to vastly improve the maneuverability in the supersonic regime. The pressure point moves aft as the aircraft goes faster and the aircraft will become more stable in supersonic flight. On stable or marginally unstable designs that situations causes a pitch down moment which must be compensated by trimming the control surfaces to maintain level flight or larger control surface deflections to maneuver. The result is a considerable drag penalty at higher supersonic speeds and reduce maneuverability. Aircraft like the F-22 or Typhoon were the first to place emphasis on supersonic maneuverability as its benefits for BVR engagements were recognised throughout the 1970s in simulation studies. The maneuverability at supersonic speeds is one of the main differences between these newer designs and older ones when it comes to maneuver performance, while performance gains at subsonic speeds are smaller in comparison
    thegopnik
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    PAK-FA, T-50: News #4 - Page 10 Empty 101ks-o DIRCM or just sensors?

    Post  thegopnik Wed Sep 20, 2017 5:42 am

    I want to smash my head repeatedly against the wall. Does Su-57 have 2 fucking DIRCMs? or is this 101ks-0 simply talking about sensors in turrets and are those sensors using passive infrared detection. F-35 talks about using 6 infrared sensors EO DAS.....What is bothering me is why go UV? I believe that the SU-57 also has infrared sensors. Or is the ols-50m by passive detection meaning its using a 360 degree infrared coverage, is the 101-ks-o with 2 sensors covering top and bottom or just DIRCMs, or the SU-57 has no 360 degree infrared coverage period? IRSTs for su-35 and mig-35 cover 180 degrees and do have elevation mentions what about the ols-50m? Its ok if no one has an answer.
    Pierre Sprey
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    Post  Pierre Sprey Fri Sep 22, 2017 5:38 am

    KomissarBojanchev wrote:Is the Su-57 targeting pod ready? If yes, is it a stealth disadvantage if its external and the F-22's is internal? Also why are there no operational targeting pods in the VVS? Its 2 decade old tech. If Russia can make anti-stealth radars and TV guided AGMs then it should've made targeting pods long ago.

    The f 22 just doesn't have one. They were making an external one which was going to be a little windowed bump on the bottom. But a few of these details got scrapped. The fancy hide-away sensor tubes were scrapped too.

    As for the su 57's pod. Theoretically it would be more stealthy if it wasnt there. Just like it would be theoretically more aerodynamic without it there too. But no. It is not a big enough increase in RCS to compromise the stealth. And remember. Sukhoi put a premium on frontal stealth. The face of the pod does a 180 so that when its not in use, a radar absorbant material is facing out.
    miketheterrible
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    Post  miketheterrible Fri Sep 22, 2017 5:56 am

    People forget a major factor here. The pod would only work within a very short distance, like the other pods. What this means is that by the ranges the PAK FA would be flying into with the pod to do air to ground operations, it wouldn't be too hard for the ground based assets to spot the Su-57 and shoot at it or shoot it down. Ideally the pod would work better for bomb trucks like the Su-34 or Su-30.
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    Post  AMCXXL Sat Sep 23, 2017 12:11 am

    miketheterrible wrote:People forget a major factor here.  The pod would only work within a very short distance, like the other pods.  What this means is that by the ranges the PAK FA would be flying into with the pod to do air to ground operations, it wouldn't be too hard for the ground based assets to spot the Su-57 and shoot at it or shoot it down.  Ideally the pod would work better for bomb trucks like the Su-34 or Su-30.

    Main role of Su-57 is not to be a bomber
    For that job, Russia built the Su-34 and for mixed role the Su-30SM

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