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    Syrian Civil War: News #8

    sepheronx
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    Post  sepheronx on Wed Jun 22, 2016 3:28 pm

    KiloGolf wrote:
    sepheronx wrote:Who Is th Ibra twit account? First he said Russia didn't help, then said they helped but very limited, claimed SyAF helped. But no reference. And spreading rumors that Russia is downsizing the base more (pulling more assets out). This guy can't get it straight.

    I've been watching him. He's generally pro-Assad and pro-Iran.
    Some people tend to easily put the blame on others when their team screws up. Also some think CAS is panacea. angry

    PS. I sees you rusnews clown

    PS2. ask why SyAAF is hardly using their numerous Hinds/Gazelles and did not forward deploy them

    He responded more or less as "I know" in a form of he was mad.
    Dima
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    Post  Dima on Wed Jun 22, 2016 3:37 pm

    The Syrian campaign went really great in the first half with those limited number of aircrafts and the momentum was strong......then came the surprise "mission accomplished" and with that Aleppo offensive which was ongoing at that time came to a dead halt..... has anyone actually tried to understand under what circumstances Russia had to to pull out?? I think there is something that we don't know in the open...

    What happened with US-Russia ceasefire in Syria is what exactly happened in Donesk earlier. When the momentum was strong and in favour of the anti-murican-nazi/kiev forces who could have taken Mariapol, a ceasefire was imposed there by halting the momentum and then withdrawal. Now the East Ukranians will have to loose men to repeat/take whatever they had gained and was let go due to the ceasefire. Same case with Syria.

    The "ceasefire" started to fall apart after the successful campaign of Palmyra and anyone with commonsense could see that Team A (FSA terrorists & co) and Team B (ISIS) was complimenting each other to relieve the Syrian pressure on Team B...

    Even after so much blood spilling during the Syrian "ceasefire", Russia was into "honouring" the agreement (we actually don"t know why Russia was so committed to this murican farse called ceasefire) and there was almost nothing happening in support of the Aleppo operation and without any effective (read Russia) air support the allied forces (SAA/NDF/Hezbollah/IRGC/Iraqi's) were loosing men to the well entrenched and supported FSA terrorists & co. But we saw the "ceasefire" stick....

    Then, in parallel, came the murican & co supported SDF offensive to Raqqa and what we see is an offensive formation getting readied from the Syrian side for an assault on Raqqa. The media was screaming "Race to Raqqa" with murican supported SDF from the north and Russian supported SAA allies from the south.

    But then once this operation to Raqqa started, we see Russia all of a sudden starting its air strikes in Aleppo and intensifying it...
    lack of coordination or (more likely) lack of aircrafts to service two fronts?

    South Aleppo situation is bad as such and it could be the reason why Russia might have diverted almost all their very limited air contingent there with none left for Raqqa offensive (as might have been agreed upon before the start of the campaign).....

    The remedy for such situation is only to increase the VKS strength to atleast the pre-"ceasefire" level which anyway was very effective and made the terror sponsors tol watch in disbelief what VKS was doing and the gains made by SAA & allies

    There is no point in repeatedly asking stupid questions like where is Syrian and Iranian airforces, questions like these are just trolling and shows the complete lack of elementary knowledge of the situation. None of the two is as capable as the VKS and even the daily strikes carried out by SyAAF maynot be as effective as those by the VKS. Iran maynot be even in the scene with their old aircrafts and complete lack of experience. Their presence might only allow the terrorists to increase their scores in shooting down aircrafts with unnecessary & avoidable causalities/losses. The better solution would have been to allow Iran buy or upgrade their Su-24 to VKS level and make effective use of it.

    Also, if Syria had the capability to withstand the onslaught by the well armed and supported international terrorists even after 4-5 years, they would not have asked for Russian help.
    Fact that need to be remembered is that Syria lost major chunk of their territory coz SyAAF not able to provide effective support to the ground forces coz they were constantly threatened & restricted by the Turkish/Israeli forces from across the border in support of the terrorists. SyAAF have lost many aircrafts over the course of this war and continue to loose them....


    It is high time Russia started using their heads properly and stop believing in the myth of a fair game from the muricans and trusting them. A lost battle in Syria wont stop in Damascus, it will end only in Moscow and that's the gameplan.
    Syria/Ukraine/Iran (a murican Shah kind of Iran will be a severe blow)/Olympic doping etc all are means to pressure and keep Russia engaged on multiple fronts to break the Russian morale.

    I really pity those who consider this Syrian war to be born out in isolation.

    I have been constantly saying that as long as Russia can postpone a direct war, the better. Coz Russia needs time and a great power cannot take the battle to the opponents yard without a strong navy. It doesn't have to necessarily mean operating in the opponents waters, but to have the ability to strike the nodes that's critical for opponents, the realization of which will allow the opponents to have some sense and tone down their approach against Russia.
    calm
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    Post  calm on Wed Jun 22, 2016 3:45 pm

    Hezbollah
    South Aleppo.

    PapaDragon
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    Post  PapaDragon on Wed Jun 22, 2016 3:54 pm

    Dima wrote:The Syrian campaign went really great in the first half with those limited number of aircrafts and the momentum was strong......then came the surprise "mission accomplished" and with that Aleppo offensive which was ongoing at that time came to a dead halt..... has anyone actually tried to understand under what circumstances Russia had to to pull out?? I think there is something that we don't know in the open..................................

    Circumstances were simple: Russia said that they plan to do this full scale for 3 of 4 month tops. This was more than plenty of time for SAA morons to finish the job.

    Problem is that local clowns did not feel like risking their necks and they sat on their asses and expected VKS to spend next several years doing their job while they stroll in the ruins and proclaim "mission accomplished", take selfies, try not to get their fancy gear dirty and pretend to have fought the war.  

    Russia has different concept of war, just like any other remotely intelligent country. They actually fight it.
    calm
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    Post  calm on Wed Jun 22, 2016 3:58 pm

    nglish translation of the Suqur Al Sahraa statement on the withdrawal from several areas in Western Raqqa CS wrote:

    Syrian Civil War: News #8 - Page 22 ClkN9h-UsAAfLlQ
    Suspect
    PapaDragon
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    Post  PapaDragon on Wed Jun 22, 2016 4:06 pm


    The 3 Key Disagreements Between Putin and Assad

    http://russia-insider.com/en/politics/3-key-disagreements-between-putin-and-assad/ri15125

    Too much emphasis on diplomacy but underlying issues are spot on.



    Assad and Ayatollah thought that Russia will be doing their job for them while they sit on their asses, buy US hardware and wait for whole thing to end so they can proclaim victory.

    I thought that keeping Assad in power would be nice way to troll Uncle Sam but now I firmly believe that he should suffer tragic skiing accident sooner rather than later.

    And let's not forget all those "sieges" around the Syria. Basically we have SAA pussies doing their WW1 thing, sitting in bunkers and trying to not get killed while someone else does all the work while they run their little black marked business with their cousins on the other side. And of they do plan on going over the line they want VKS to level the place first and take the media flak for dead civilians. Anything to avoid risking their asses.  

    Given what we now know about SAA, I can say that pulling the plug was definitely right thing to do. Now Syrians and Iranians are free to show their "skills".

    Russia already has best realestate in the bag anyway.
    Dima
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    Post  Dima on Wed Jun 22, 2016 4:08 pm

    Few tweets that unfolded around Tabqa

    Leith Abou Fadel ‏@leithfadel  16 hours ago
    I am literally sick to my stomach after hearing what happened in west Raqqa. Some of these commanders should be court marshaled.

    555th Regiment is the regular SAA and looks like they held the ground and took the most casualities. Desert Hawks is a paramilitary unit and Syrian marines are new addition after the Russians came. Both of these units are heavily supplied by Russia and Desert Hawks having quite a number of T-90s at their disposal. What could have made these two to leave the battleground??

    Leith Abou Fadel ‏@leithfadel  16 hours ago
    Desert Hawks and Syrian Marines left the 555th Regiment at Sufiyah and withdrew all the way to Zakiyah, leaving our men trapped.

    Leith Abou Fadel ‏@leithfadel  16 hours ago
    23 soldiers are confirmed dead. Dozens MIA. 49 wounded.


    Ibrahim Joudeh ‏@Ibra_Joudeh  2 hours ago
    Brigadier Hasan Saado 10th division Chief of Staff was martyred today in fight against ISIS in west Raqqa
    Syrian Civil War: News #8 - Page 22 ClkliHBXIAA5hN_

    I completely agree with this and what I mentioned yesterday. The main difference between a successful campaign taking a bigger area like Palmyra and Tabqa was the choppers. I'm still wondering what happened with choppers from VKS/SyAAF and why they were not available for this campaign....

    Ibrahim Joudeh ‏@Ibra_Joudeh 6h6 hours ago
    @Ibra_Joudeh Helicopters support in that area is very crucial , would have put SAA in Tabqa already if it happened


    No surprise there and the SAA & allies will need to be prepared to protect them from more such attacks as they move towards Raqqa/Idlib.

    ISIS used nerve gas against Syrian Army outside Raqqa
    22/06/2016
    https://www.almasdarnews.com/article/isis-used-nerve-gas-syrian-army-outside-raqqa/ | Al-Masdar News
    PapaDragon
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    Post  PapaDragon on Wed Jun 22, 2016 4:12 pm

    calm wrote:

    Syrian Civil War: News #8 - Page 22 ClkN9h-UsAAfLlQ
    Suspect



    "We are not retreating—we are advancing in another direction." lol1

    — General Douglas MacArthur



    I am not big fan of Dougie but this one nailed it. Cool
    Dima
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    Post  Dima on Wed Jun 22, 2016 4:39 pm

    PapaDragon wrote:Circumstances were simple: Russia said that they plan to do this full scale for 3 of 4 month tops. This was more than plenty of time for SAA morons to finish the job.

    Problem is that local clowns did not feel like risking their necks and they sat on their asses and expected VKS to spend next several years doing their job while they stroll in the ruins and proclaim "mission accomplished", take selfies, try not to get their fancy gear dirty and pretend to have fought the war.  

    Russia has different concept of war, just like any other remotely intelligent country. They actually fight it.
    If you can show me a time period that was officialy stated as the length of the campaign, I will take it.

    And you are really something man. In 3-4 months with just 2-3-dozen fighters giving proper combat support, SAA should have taken the entire lost ground? You damn serious?  

    Can you give me something parallel to make a fair judgement?


    Nothing personal, but your problem is the one highlighted below....
    PapaDragon wrote:SAA are better armed than ever. Problem is the fact that every last one of them is incompetent idiot who runs away at first sign of trouble and expect others to bleed for them.

    Other than different flavor of Koran they are no different than the Saudis.
    ...that mindset...maybe its due to the scar left from the Serbian war - a strong bias and hatred  for muslims. Your view of Syria and SAA is likely through that prism and I don't expect you to change.
    calm
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    Post  calm on Wed Jun 22, 2016 4:52 pm

    Syrian Civil War: News #8 - Page 22 Clj8FYkWAAAsN-1
    Syrian Civil War: News #8 - Page 22 CllASJTWQAIjxnO
    PapaDragon
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    Post  PapaDragon on Wed Jun 22, 2016 4:54 pm

    Dima wrote:......................
    ...that mindset...maybe its due to the scar left from the Serbian war - a strong bias and hatred  for muslims. Your view of Syria and SAA is likely through that prism and I don't expect you to change.

    I'll stop you right there. If there was some "strong bias and hatred for Muslims" here in Serbia we would not be most popular transit route for predominantly Muslim immigrants. Not to mention the fact that our Muslims are just fine.

    Don't confuse local vendettas and old feuds with some religious holy war. They could be Buddhists and beef would still be on.
    calm
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    Post  calm on Wed Jun 22, 2016 5:04 pm

    PapaDragon
    Нисам видео да си Србин.
    Има ли нас још овде? Laughing

    New isis video
    Attacking Palmyra
    http://amaqagency.ch/v/2b22062016-720.mp4
    sepheronx
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    Post  sepheronx on Wed Jun 22, 2016 5:15 pm

    Dima, Papa is correct. Original call for the campaign was only supposed to be roughly 3 - 5 months at most. So they actually stuck to their word, partially. They still operate in Syria and still bomb, but it isn't part of their obligation to fight Syria's military fight. Essentially, why should Russia save the country if they cannot save themselves? Russia has their trained men there, and they unfortunately pulled out first from Raqqa campaign for potential various reasons. Point is though, Russia cannot simply fight for them, that would actually make them invaders. Instead, they supply support and the agreements were for Aleppo at the moment. But what makes it so funny about this, is that many are trying to state that this Raqqa fight was actually Russia's idea, but before this whole thing went to shit in Raqqa, it was mentioned by warisboring that it wasn't in Russias interest for Raqqa but Aleppo. SyAF has far more assets in their own country than what Russia currently has. Syria also has modernized Su-24M's to be able to fight in this fight, that are as capable as the ones Russia uses. So why are they not using those? They have Su-22's that are dedicated strike aircrafts, so same thing. Helicopters? Russian helicopters are based at Hmeymim base is quite a ways away for helicopters to simply fly there.
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    Post  PapaDragon on Wed Jun 22, 2016 5:34 pm

    calm wrote:PapaDragon
    Нисам видео да си Србин.
    Има ли нас још овде?  Laughing
    .....................

    Ma ima nas k'o govana znas kakvi smo ti mi... lol1

    Militarov je od nasih. I Monarchist nazalost... ima garant jos neki.

    "Znam ja nas , jeb'o ti nas" -Branko Ćopić

    Sorry for Serbian, I had to!!! Cool
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    Post  KiloGolf on Wed Jun 22, 2016 6:07 pm

    Dima wrote:Leith Abou Fadel ‏@leithfadel  16 hours ago
    555th Regiment is the regular SAA and looks like they held the ground and took the most casualities. Desert Hawks is a paramilitary unit and Syrian marines are new addition after the Russians came. Both of these units are heavily supplied by Russia and Desert Hawks having quite a number of T-90s at their disposal. What could have made these two to leave the battleground??

    Leith Abou Fadel ‏@leithfadel  16 hours ago
    Desert Hawks and Syrian Marines left the 555th Regiment at Sufiyah and withdrew all the way to Zakiyah, leaving our men trapped.

    False. Russian journalist from the ground denies any forces being left behind/encircled.
    Leith is just skewing the situation to defend the undefendable (the SAA).

    Dima wrote:ISIS used nerve gas against Syrian Army outside Raqqa
    22/06/2016
    https://www.almasdarnews.com/article/isis-used-nerve-gas-syrian-army-outside-raqqa/ | Al-Masdar News

    Unverified, 99.9% false.
    SOP for almasdar, make something up to cover SAA troop and officer responsibility.
    Videos show them retreating and maps show their blunder.

    Dima wrote:Can you give me something parallel to make a fair judgement?

    Rojava expansion around Manbij, in less than one month.

    sepheronx wrote:Russia has their trained men there, and they unfortunately pulled out first from Raqqa campaign for potential various reasons.

    It's not as if von Bock's Army Group Center attacked and overrun that poor little regiment. A frickin Regiment, not 3 guys and a goat. The fact that they were overrun by 6,7 or 10 VBIEDs and a few hundred beardies, within 24 hours is SAA's problem. They have Hinds, jets, artillery and tanks. And planners too. If any unit is set to withdraw, it most definitely wasn't sudden or unplanned. The other unit commanders had full knowledge and time to adapt. More importantly the safety of SAA units is bared by SAA command. Russians have more important things to do than worry when said Sunni farmer will feel scared and flee his position or the SAA's 69th selfie operations detachment runs out of steroids and mama's protein shake.

    And then there's the fact that SAA is ridden with spies that leak everything with their cell phones for some hard currency. Or when simple troops and NCOs send pics and reports to their social media fan clubs. In short, SAA fanboys need to accept this was solely an SAA defeat and move on. Their Army, their country, their responsibility.
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    Post  JohninMK on Wed Jun 22, 2016 6:56 pm

    A Kalerab post in the other place. Assume it is his translation.

    Interesting article re Manbij offensive. Claims that

    - US negotiated meeting between SDF and Turkey commanders on Incirlik base
    - Turkey allowed attack to commence in exchange for PKK halting its operation around Diyarbakir
    - Turkey agreed to transfer Ocalan from Imrali and re-open peace talks
    - General Votel in Kobane set up tactic for launching Raqqah operation, which was always intended to be diversion tactic with real target being Manbij and eastern Aleppo. ISIS ate it.
    - decision came after Turkish backed rebels failed to take control of Rai, which was supposed to be stepping stone in assault on eastern Aleppo

    http://assafir.com/Article/499559/


    Followed by FulcrumKAF

    Some Kurdish media outlets reported the first two points not so long ago (in addition, that SDF will get the green light for connecting Afrin and Kobane if PKK sends their fighters to Rojava/Qandil)
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    Post  KiloGolf on Wed Jun 22, 2016 7:50 pm

    Ivan Sidorenko is back!
    yay SAA back to selfie mode, back to work people, they got this lol1

    Syrian Civil War: News #8 - Page 22 Cll6vOJXIAIEyvp
    Ivan Sidorenko ‏@IvanSidorenko1  11m
    #Syria #Aleppo #SAA #SyrianArabArmy #SyrianArmy #Russia #Russian #RUS Liwa Al Quds #Palestinians #Palestinian


    Last edited by KiloGolf on Wed Jun 22, 2016 7:52 pm; edited 1 time in total
    calm
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    Post  calm on Wed Jun 22, 2016 7:50 pm

    Laughing
    As I said before, to Damascus.
    Syrian Civil War: News #8 - Page 22 Cll4gIsWMAAt5pt

    Sidorenko is back.

    calm
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    Post  calm on Wed Jun 22, 2016 7:52 pm

    KiloGolf wrote:yay SAA back to selfie mode Shocked

    Tabqa...


    Meanwhile in Aleppo
    Syrian Civil War: News #8 - Page 22 Cll8qnaWQAAA8md
    Syrian Civil War: News #8 - Page 22 Cll8puYWAAAv1KK

    What a crazy war.


    Last edited by calm on Thu Jun 23, 2016 4:29 am; edited 1 time in total
    KiloGolf
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    Post  KiloGolf on Wed Jun 22, 2016 7:54 pm

    calm wrote:Laughing
    As I said before, to Damascus.
    Syrian Civil War: News #8 - Page 22 Cll4gIsWMAAt5pt

    Sidorenko is back.


    So much for OPSEC lol!

    PS. machine guns regiment (...)

    calm wrote:Syrian Civil War: News #8 - Page 22 Cll8qnaWQAAA8md

    Sums it all up really pwnd
    sepheronx
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    Post  sepheronx on Wed Jun 22, 2016 8:01 pm

    Desert Hawks/Falcons seem to be the only real fighting force in Syria, and they are either mercenaries or voluntaries trained by Russia and funded by various groups. I figure they need to increase their numbers from the 5,000 or so to even more. Much like how VDV is a massive force in itself, get these guys to be a massive force like the NDF is. Not necessarily need better equipment but maybe transfer various industries that play around with equipment (T-55's, etc) to convert them like they did before (S-60 on T-55's as example) so that they are better to fighting such insurgency.

    Or at least come up with a new training program for the SAA.
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    Post  KiloGolf on Wed Jun 22, 2016 8:42 pm

    And the tragic comedy continues, after it's impossible to make excuses for SAA we get this:

    Leith Abou Fadel
    ‏@leithfadel Leith Abou Fadel Retweeted Al-Masdar News
    Syrian Armed Forces withdraw from final points in west Raqqa. Offensive over.

    lol1 lol1

    And it's funny how people in comments blame Russia for it, and claim that Putin wants a stalemate and waits for Trump to get elected.
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    Post  PapaDragon on Wed Jun 22, 2016 8:43 pm

    KiloGolf wrote:........ Russians have more important things to do than worry when said Sunni farmer will feel scared and flee his position or the SAA's 69th selfie operations detachment runs out of steroids and mama's protein shake.
    ............

    lol1

    Dude, you are my idol!!!



    KiloGolf wrote:Ivan Sidorenko is back!
    yay SAA back to selfie mode, back to work people, they got this lol1

    Syrian Civil War: News #8 - Page 22 Cll6vOJXIAIEyvp
    .......

    I gotta say those SAA guys may not know much about fighting a war but when it comes to making selfies they are better than all of us here combined... Very Happy
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    Post  KiloGolf on Wed Jun 22, 2016 8:49 pm

    newflash to all. Russian journalist on the ground have twitter page now in english!
    And already they started schooling people like pros pirat
    link: @SyriaWarReports

    example:


    Syrian Civil War: News #8 - Page 22 CllIDiNWkAAAstP
    Syria frontlines ‏@SyriaWarReports  5h5 hours ago
    #AlMasdar map is wrong. Now #SAA and #DesertHawks are in 15-20 km from #Athria, not like they did it.

    note Dessert hawks is the unit blamed by misguided SAA fanboys as having fled all the way to Ithiriya.

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    Post  Resistance on Wed Jun 22, 2016 9:08 pm

    Why can't Russia give air support to SAA the way the US gives air support to Kurds, day in, day out, 365 days a year, unlimited time frame? Russia can. Russia should. Syria is 1 of only 11 countries that recognized Crimea referendum at the UNGA. If Syria falls, Russia will have no ally left in the ME. Russia must save Syria from cannibals, at any cost. An attack on Syria is an attack on Russia.

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