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    Udaloy and Sovremennyy destroyers

    zardof
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    Post  zardof on Sun Dec 13, 2020 6:23 am

    GarryB wrote:According to the article above:

    Now the Navy has eight ships of project 1155. "Marshal Shaposhnikov", "Admiral Vinogradov", "Admiral Panteleev" and "Admiral Tributs" are part of the Pacific fleet. "Vice Admiral Kulakov", "Severomorsk" and "Admiral Levchenko" are assigned to the Northern fleet. "Admiral Kharlamov" is in the sump. And "Admiral Chabanenko" - improved project 1155.1 - at the ship repair plant.

    So four in the Pacific Fleet and three in the Northern Fleet and one at the repair plant...

    Any news from 610 Nastoychivyy sovr class who were supposed to join back Baltic fleet after modernisation end 2020 ?
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    Post  George1 on Tue Dec 15, 2020 2:32 pm

    "Marshal Shaposhnikov" began testing weapons systems

    https://en.topwar.ru/178160-modernizirovannyj-fregat-marshal-shaposhnikov-nachal-ispytanija-sistem-vooruzhenija.html
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    Post  mnztr on Mon Dec 21, 2020 6:41 pm

    http://www.navyrecognition.com/index.php/news/defence-news/2020/december/9448-russia-plans-to-upgrade-admiral-vinogradov-antisubmarine-ship.html

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    PapaDragon
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    Post  PapaDragon on Mon Dec 21, 2020 11:16 pm

    mnztr wrote:http://www.navyrecognition.com/index.php/news/defence-news/2020/december/9448-russia-plans-to-upgrade-admiral-vinogradov-antisubmarine-ship.html

    Outstanding, keep going thumbsup

    First large batch orders for corvettes and supply ships and now this

    Only thing left is to sort out whole Gorshkov clustefuck and we will be able to say that surface fleet is finally getting it's shit together

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    Post  LMFS on Tue Dec 22, 2020 8:27 am

    The destroyer of the Northern Fleet "Admiral Ushakov" will return to the Northern Fleet

    The destroyer "Admiral Ushakov" will return to the Northern fleet, The Ministry of Defense has decided to repair the ship. Reported by "News" with reference to a source in the military.
    Udaloy and Sovremennyy destroyers - Page 19 1608624968_1608624891

    The decision to repair the destroyer has already been made; engines, main components and mechanisms will be updated on the ship. Electronic systems will also be partially replaced. The ship's armament will not undergo any changes. The repair will be carried out at the Zvezdochka shipyard, where the ship is currently located. Commissioning of the repaired destroyer is planned at the end of next year.

    Note that due to technical problems, "Admiral Ushakov" did not go to sea since 2018. Some time ago, the question of its complete write-off was raised.

    "Admiral Ushakov" - Project 956 "Sarych" destroyer, one of the three remaining in the ranks of the Russian Navy. In addition to him, the Baltic Fleet carries out the service "Persistent", which is currently being repaired, and "Bystry", which is serving in the Pacific Fleet.

    The ship was commissioned in 1994 under the name "Fearless", in 2004 it was renamed "Admiral Ushakov". The crew is 296 people. Autonomy - 30 days. Maximum travel speed - 33,4 knots. The cruising range at maximum speed is about 1350 miles. Able to carry a Ka-27PL helicopter. Armament: 2x2 AK-130/54, 4x6 30-mm ZAU AK-630, 2x4 Moskit-M anti-ship missiles, 2x1 Uragan-Tornado air defense missile systems, 2x6 RBU-1000, 2x2 torpedo tubes of 533 mm caliber.

    https://en.topwar.ru/178404-jesminec-severnogo-flota-admiral-ushakov-vernetsja-v-sostav-severnogo-flota.html

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    Post  walle83 on Tue Dec 22, 2020 10:25 am

    LMFS wrote:The destroyer of the Northern Fleet "Admiral Ushakov" will return to the Northern Fleet

    The destroyer "Admiral Ushakov" will return to the Northern fleet, The Ministry of Defense has decided to repair the ship. Reported by "News" with reference to a source in the military.
    Udaloy and Sovremennyy destroyers - Page 19 1608624968_1608624891

    The decision to repair the destroyer has already been made; engines, main components and mechanisms will be updated on the ship. Electronic systems will also be partially replaced. The ship's armament will not undergo any changes. The repair will be carried out at the Zvezdochka shipyard, where the ship is currently located. Commissioning of the repaired destroyer is planned at the end of next year.

    Note that due to technical problems, "Admiral Ushakov" did not go to sea since 2018. Some time ago, the question of its complete write-off was raised.

    "Admiral Ushakov" - Project 956 "Sarych" destroyer, one of the three remaining in the ranks of the Russian Navy. In addition to him, the Baltic Fleet carries out the service "Persistent", which is currently being repaired, and "Bystry", which is serving in the Pacific Fleet.

    The ship was commissioned in 1994 under the name "Fearless", in 2004 it was renamed "Admiral Ushakov". The crew is 296 people. Autonomy - 30 days. Maximum travel speed - 33,4 knots. The cruising range at maximum speed is about 1350 miles. Able to carry a Ka-27PL helicopter. Armament: 2x2 AK-130/54, 4x6 30-mm ZAU AK-630, 2x4 Moskit-M anti-ship missiles, 2x1 Uragan-Tornado air defense missile systems, 2x6 RBU-1000, 2x2 torpedo tubes of 533 mm caliber.

    https://en.topwar.ru/178404-jesminec-severnogo-flota-admiral-ushakov-vernetsja-v-sostav-severnogo-flota.html

    Wouldnt it be a easy fix to replace the moskits with Kh-35s like on the modifed Udaloy.
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    Post  PapaDragon on Tue Dec 22, 2020 11:54 am

    walle83 wrote:...Wouldnt it be a easy fix to replace the moskits with Kh-35s like on the modifed Udaloy.

    They don't want to bother with it

    Even with this overhaul it doesn't have much time left

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    Post  walle83 on Tue Dec 22, 2020 1:01 pm

    PapaDragon wrote:
    walle83 wrote:...Wouldnt it be a easy fix to replace the moskits with Kh-35s like on the modifed Udaloy.

    They don't want to bother with it

    Even with this overhaul it doesn't have much time left


    Well they could if they wanted to, look at the Chinese variants. They just got overhauled with new weapons and sensors and probably will keep serving the PLAN in to the 2030s.

    Also with the Admiral Ushakov inactive Russia has one remaining Sov in service, the Bystry in the Pacific.

    Thats 4 Udaloys and 1 Sovremenny in total.
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    Post  LMFS on Tue Dec 22, 2020 1:11 pm

    I guess they just do this because there are not enough 22350 yet, probably they don't have big plans for the ship apart from filling the gap for some years...
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    Post  Isos on Tue Dec 22, 2020 1:11 pm

    Chinese are just keeping the hull. Everything else is switched for new stuff. Even thr doors should be changed.

    Actually I don't understand why they don't just replace them with newly build type 55 destroyers. The modernization is so deep that it is similar to building a new ship.

    They showed the angled UKSK not long ago. They are upgrading this sov but also nanushka and Molniyas which all have angled launchers and could theorically get them. Actually new ships have VLS and angled launchers will only be used on upgraded ships. So it is quite sure they will all get angled UKSK. They wouldn't be creating the angled UKSK if they weren't planing to use them.


    There are tens of monlnya and nanushka and 3 Sovs. Also Oscars could get them. That would be hundreds of uksk cells more.
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    Post  walle83 on Tue Dec 22, 2020 1:20 pm

    It just seems strange that they could keep the old Smetlivy going for decads after it should have been retired, but the Sovremennys that were alot younger the cant keep going. The sov seems to have been a gapfiller from the beginning, not ment to last.
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    Post  walle83 on Tue Dec 22, 2020 1:23 pm

    Isos wrote:Chinese are just keeping the hull. Everything else is switched for new stuff. Even thr doors should be changed.

    Actually I don't understand why they don't just replace them with newly build type 55 destroyers. The modernization is so deep that it is similar to building a new ship.

    The Chinese dont seem to waste any platforms, everything from the early 90s and forward is getting overhauld and rearmed.
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    Post  PapaDragon on Tue Dec 22, 2020 2:27 pm

    walle83 wrote:It just seems strange that they could keep the old Smetlivy going for decads after it should have been retired, but the Sovremennys that were alot younger the cant keep going. The sov seems to have been a gapfiller from the beginning, not ment to last.

    Workload

    Smetlivy was good enough for Black Sea but would have never made the cut for North

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    Post  Big_Gazza on Tue Dec 22, 2020 6:40 pm

    PapaDragon wrote:
    walle83 wrote:It just seems strange that they could keep the old Smetlivy going for decads after it should have been retired, but the Sovremennys that were alot younger the cant keep going. The sov seems to have been a gapfiller from the beginning, not ment to last.

    Workload

    Smetlivy was good enough for Black Sea but would have never made the cut for North

    Yup, with the great side benefit of keeping her intact to eventually become a museum ship. Very Happy
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    Post  The-thing-next-door on Wed Dec 23, 2020 2:06 am

    walle83 wrote:

    Wouldnt it be a easy fix to replace the moskits with Kh-35s like on the modifed Udaloy.

    Why would you ever replace Moskits with KH-35s?

    The Moskit has the same range and is surface skimming while also being supersonic
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    Post  GarryB on Wed Dec 23, 2020 8:37 am

    Wouldnt it be a easy fix to replace the moskits with Kh-35s like on the modifed Udaloy.

    It wouldn't be hard, but getting rid of 8 x 4.5 ton supersonic anti ship missiles that fly below 4m above the wave tops at about mach 2.2 out to about 350km being replaced by subsonic Kh-35s with a range of about 300km is not really a trade up.

    The Soviets had large numbers of Sovremmeny class ships in service so stocks of Moskits is probably big enough to keep a few ships stocked with missiles for quite some time.

    I guess they just do this because there are not enough 22350 yet, probably they don't have big plans for the ship apart from filling the gap for some years...

    It works as it is... no point spending a lot of money because odds are it will be one of the first ships replaced as new ships become available.

    It is a tried and tested ship that works... with some upgrades of electronics and propulsion it should be a fine gap filler for a decade or so... probably less hopefully.

    They wouldn't be creating the angled UKSK if they weren't planing to use them.

    Would depend on how they performed but if it turns out like they will need to keep using this ship longer than expected then more significant changes could be warranted but I get the feeling it wont remain in use for a very long time... It might turn out they do give it a much more substantial upgrade... just before they sell it...

    It just seems strange that they could keep the old Smetlivy going for decads after it should have been retired, but the Sovremennys that were alot younger the cant keep going. The sov seems to have been a gapfiller from the beginning, not ment to last.

    Its propulsion was not the most reliable from memory, but it was a popular type.

    The Chinese dont seem to waste any platforms, everything from the early 90s and forward is getting overhauld and rearmed.

    They have the money and the workforce/capacity... why not use it....

    Smetlivy was good enough for Black Sea but would have never made the cut for North

    Different needs means different solutions... the irony is that Moskit was developed specifically to defeat AEGIS class cruisers... on launch the missile climbed to 300m altitude and looked for target ships... it then dropped down to below 7m (actually normally between 3 and 5m above the waves depending on the sea state) and continued towards the target till impact. The AEGIS crusiers could get target data from AWACS platforms but their Standard SAM missiles could not hit targets below 7m altitude, so their only defence was Phalanx... which wasn't very good at shooting at sea skimming targets.

    The real irony is taht after losing quite a few ships to sea skimming exocet missiles in the Falklands war a British naval official said they had a problem but it was OK because the Soviets didn't have any sea skimming missiles...

    Note the code for Moskit or SS-N-22 Sunburn as it was known in the west was 3M80... which indicated service entry in 1980...

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    Post  mnztr on Thu Dec 24, 2020 2:42 am

    Isos wrote:Chinese are just keeping the hull. Everything else is switched for new stuff. Even thr doors should be changed.

    Since the powerplants are steam, it should not be that hard to replace them with gas turbines. Lots of space down there. If the hull is in good shape and you have enough capacity, its still cheaper then building a new ship.
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    Post  Hole on Thu Dec 24, 2020 7:58 am

    Shaposhnikov at trials

    Udaloy and Sovremennyy destroyers - Page 19 1155m_15
    Udaloy and Sovremennyy destroyers - Page 19 1155m_16
    Udaloy and Sovremennyy destroyers - Page 19 1155m_17

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    Post  George1 on Thu Dec 24, 2020 8:29 am

    TASS wrote:The Pacific Fleet’s upgraded frigate The Marshal Shaposhnikov has test-fired the anti-ship cruise missile Uran for the first time, the fleet’s press service said on Thursday.
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    Post  walle83 on Fri Dec 25, 2020 10:14 pm

    The-thing-next-door wrote:
    walle83 wrote:

    Wouldnt it be a easy fix to replace the moskits with Kh-35s like on the modifed Udaloy.

    Why would you ever replace Moskits with KH-35s?

    The Moskit has the same range and is surface skimming while also being supersonic

    Well they are replacing the Moskit with the Kh-35 on the updated Tarantul 'Molniya' corvettes so why not on the destroyers dunno
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    Post  PapaDragon on Fri Dec 25, 2020 11:27 pm

    walle83 wrote:
    The-thing-next-door wrote:
    walle83 wrote:

    Wouldnt it be a easy fix to replace the moskits with Kh-35s like on the modifed Udaloy.

    Why would you ever replace Moskits with KH-35s?

    The Moskit has the same range and is surface skimming while also being supersonic

    Well they are replacing the Moskit with the Kh-35 on the updated Tarantul 'Molniya' corvettes so why not on the destroyers dunno

    These destroyers are not worth the hassle

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    Post  Hole on Sun Dec 27, 2020 7:30 am

    Udaloy and Sovremennyy destroyers - Page 19 7-xaic10

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    Post  GarryB on Sun Dec 27, 2020 6:42 pm

    Well they are replacing the Moskit with the Kh-35 on the updated Tarantul 'Molniya' corvettes so why not on the destroyers

    Probably a weight issue... the Uran is about 0.7 tons each while the Moskit is about 4.5 tons each... multiply that by 8 missiles and we are talking about a significant difference in top weight... 5.6 tons vs 36 tons. The potential to double the missile count and fit 16 Urans also makes it interesting too and 11.2 tons is not really comparable to 36 tons either... it is practically 1/3rd lighter.

    I would probably also mean if they only keep Moskits on the Sovs then the store of available missiles will last longer... though there was a cat type of ship that carried moskits too...

    I see on their Rosboronexport site the cat comes with a choice of missiles including Moskit, or Uran or Yakhont or a mix of the latter two.

    Option 4 on the table shows 2 Uran launchers and 2 Yakhont launchers for 8 Uran missiles and 12 Yakhonts, would be a potent mix of weapons.

    http://roe.ru/eng/catalog/naval-systems/surface-ships-ships-and-boats/sivuch/
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    Post  Big_Gazza on Sun Dec 27, 2020 7:23 pm

    GarryB wrote:I would probably also mean if they only keep Moskits on the Sovs then the store of available missiles will last longer... though there was a cat type of ship that carried moskits too...

    Moskits are also carried on Tarantul class attack boats, with about 25-ish units or so in service (albeit with variations in missile types).
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    Post  TMA1 on Mon Dec 28, 2020 9:01 am

    Hole wrote:Shaposhnikov at trials

    Udaloy and Sovremennyy destroyers - Page 19 1155m_15
    Udaloy and Sovremennyy destroyers - Page 19 1155m_16
    Udaloy and Sovremennyy destroyers - Page 19 1155m_17

    can anyone tell me what those launchers are in the middle picture? they have a really cool loading and launching function. been wanting to know what they are for awhile. unshaven

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