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    The Situation in the Ukraine. #18

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    Karl Haushofer

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    Post  Karl Haushofer Mon Jul 20, 2015 5:59 pm

    Flagship Victory wrote:If I were a Donetsk resident, I wouldn't bother relying on NAF. I'd buy a gun off the black market and become a vigilante, hunting down Maidan soldiers like Batman. cheers

    There is a big danger in a partizan war. The junta would probably start killing way more civilians than they currently do if the civilians started making partizan attacks agains them. Remember what Nazi Germans did to Soviet civilian population to revenge partizan attacks.
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    Post  Rodinazombie Mon Jul 20, 2015 6:01 pm

    Karl Haushofer wrote:
    Flagship Victory wrote:If I were a Donetsk resident, I wouldn't bother relying on NAF. I'd buy a gun off the black market and become a vigilante, hunting down Maidan soldiers like Batman. cheers

    There is a big danger in a partizan war. The junta would probably start killing way more civilians than they currently do if the civilians started making partizan attacks agains them. Remember what Nazi Germans did to Soviet civilian population to revenge partizan attacks.

    There will no no partisan war, IF ukies win,it would be like in kharkov or odessa, small acts of sabotage, plenty of political repression and brainwashing, and lots of crime no doubt., but no partisan war. The people clearly dont have the stomach for it.
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    Post  PapaDragon Mon Jul 20, 2015 6:22 pm


    Wars cost money and Porky is in a pinch  Cool  lol1

    Eastern Ukraine - A Frozen War

    While full-scale fighting has not returned, neither side accepts the status quo or wants to put the conflict aside

    It’s rather the negotiated path to peace that has been put aside, particularly by Kiev


    http://russia-insider.com/en/politics/eastern-ukraine-frozen-war/ri8810


    Contrary to my expectations — and those of most other observers — the situation in eastern Ukraine has not so far spiraled into renewed war.

    The reason for this is the deteriorating financial situation in Ukraine itself.


    Despite pressure from the IMF talks between Ukraine and its private creditors remain deadlocked. This has led some of the ratings agencies to predict that Ukraine will fall into formal default this month.

    The IMF’s indication that it would maintain its support for Ukraine has simply triggered a demand from the Russians that the next $5 billion tranche of IMF funding Ukraine should be used to repay the $3 billion Ukraine owes Russia, which is due for repayment this year.

    It seems that the IMF’s staff is now increasingly leaning to the Russian view that this debt is indeed public debt. If so, then unless the IMF Board is willing to overrule the opinion of its own staff – which would be extremely controversial and might have serious legal consequences, Ukraine might shortly find itself cut off from private lending and in receipt of only limited funding from the IMF.

    As for other alternative sources of Western funding, the EU’s commitment to provide Greece with a third 86 billion euro bailout further reduces the funds available for Ukraine.

    It is nonetheless likely that it has been the need to bring the negotiations with the IMF and with Ukraine’s private creditors to a successful conclusion that has been the key factor in deterring Ukraine from resuming the offensive in eastern Ukraine. Back in the winter the IMF warned that any program to support Ukraine would fail in case of a renewal of the war, which all but confirmed that the IMF would halt its programme if the war resumed. With Ukraine becoming increasingly dependent on the IMF as alternative sources of external funding are closed off, this has become a major obstacle to a renewal of the war.

    None of this however is to be taken to mean that the situation in eastern Ukraine is stable.

    As predicted, the Ukrainian government has reneged on the commitments it made in Minsk.

    It refuses to negotiate with the leaders of the Donetsk and Lugansk People’s Republics, whom it continues to call terrorists. It has maintained the economic blockade.

    There has been no negotiated law granting special status, no elections held in accordance with such a law and no discussions for a new constitution. On all these questions Kiev has purported to legislate unilaterally, imposing on the Donbass its own conceptions, which continue to reflect its unitary ideology.

    Though there has been no general offensive, there is also no peace. Shelling of the Donbass towns continues at various levels of intensity and fighting between the Ukrainian army and militia units repeatedly takes place.

    Meanwhile, much as he did before the resumption of the fighting in January this year, Poroshenko has again been bragging about the revival of the Ukrainian army, with claims that the number of Ukrainian troops on the front line has once again been brought up to 60,000 – which was roughly their number at the start of the offensive on 30th June 2014.

    These claims, understandably enough, cause great alarm and are scarcely compatible with a sincere desire for peace. They are in fact as likely to be untrue as were the identical claims Poroshenko made before the resumption of the fighting in January. The reported mutiny of an entire Ukrainian tank battalion is almost certain to be a better reflection of the true state of the Ukrainian army than Poroshenko’s boasts.

    The current situation is best described therefore not as a frozen conflict but as a frozen war.

    A frozen conflict requires some degree of acceptance — however grudging — of the status quo.

    In Ukraine that acceptance does not exist – on either side.

    In the absence of the negotiations envisaged by the deal done in Minsk the Donetsk and Lugansk People’s Republics exist in limbo – under blockade, facing current shelling, without a proper legal status and without full control of the territory they claim.    

    The Ukrainian government for its part cannot bring itself to recognize or accept the separate identities of the Donetsk and Lugansk People’s Republics, but lacks the means to suppress them.

    The situation is extremely unstable and very dangerous.
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    Post  PapaDragon Mon Jul 20, 2015 6:31 pm


    Saker is inclined to agree with us russia

    http://russia-insider.com/en/politics/zakharchenko-deinego-and-pushilin-have-set-trap-poroshenko/ri8834

    If Poroshenko Attacks His Days Are Numbered
    East Ukraine rebels are going out of their way to show their interest in peace even as they have never been militarily stronger



    This is done so that when the inevitable Ukraine attack demanded by nationalists and the US comes it will be impossible to blame the rebels

    After that the rebels stand a good chance of neutralizing Ukraine attack and moving on the counter-offensive

    At which point it is unlikely Poroshenko will be able to maintain power

    Question is, is he likely to be replaced by a pro-peace or an even more pro-war faction?

    ..........................continues...........
    sepheronx
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    Post  sepheronx Mon Jul 20, 2015 6:44 pm

    Rodinazombie wrote:
    sepheronx wrote:
    Rodinazombie wrote:People need to understand the difference between removing weapons of a certain calibre and withdrawing its forces completely. NAF has removed the weapons stated, but not troops, so ukies arent just going to walk in unopposed, as soon as they try and contact is made., the tanks will be back.

    Shirokino is different as they completely demilitarised the area, allowing ukies to just stroll in. This is different.

    What is going on in Shiokino? Did osce demand PUkes leave?

    As far as I know, please correct me if im wrong. Unilateral demilitarisation (christ that sounds straight out of the state dept) of the town was agreed, NAF honoured it and pulled out but ukies just strolled right in and took over, completely against the agreement.

    As for the osce, they made some vague comments about it but didnt address the issue at all. Considering this is organised by them, you would think they would force both parties to adhere to the agreements, but sadly thy act much like the eu did when yanuk was toppled.




    So why hasnt NAF threatened OSCE and PUkes over it rather than staying quiet. Or shell it.
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    par far

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    Post  par far Mon Jul 20, 2015 6:53 pm

    PapaDragon wrote:
    Saker is inclined to agree with us russia

    http://russia-insider.com/en/politics/zakharchenko-deinego-and-pushilin-have-set-trap-poroshenko/ri8834

    If Poroshenko Attacks His Days Are Numbered
    East Ukraine rebels are going out of their way to show their interest in peace even as they have never been militarily stronger



    This is done so that when the inevitable Ukraine attack demanded by nationalists and the US comes it will be impossible to blame the rebels

    After that the rebels stand a good chance of neutralizing Ukraine attack and moving on the counter-offensive

    At which point it is unlikely Poroshenko will be able to maintain power

    Question is, is he likely to be replaced by a pro-peace or an even more pro-war faction?

    ..........................continues...........


    Nice article. very detailed. The question I have is how do we get rid of the Nazis that are in Ukraine?
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    Post  Rodinazombie Mon Jul 20, 2015 6:56 pm

    sepheronx wrote:
    Rodinazombie wrote:
    sepheronx wrote:
    Rodinazombie wrote:People need to understand the difference between removing weapons of a certain calibre and withdrawing its forces completely. NAF has removed the weapons stated, but not troops, so ukies arent just going to walk in unopposed, as soon as they try and contact is made., the tanks will be back.

    Shirokino is different as they completely demilitarised the area, allowing ukies to just stroll in. This is different.

    What is going on in Shiokino? Did osce demand PUkes leave?

    As far as I know, please correct me if im wrong. Unilateral demilitarisation (christ that sounds straight out of the state dept) of the town was agreed, NAF honoured it and pulled out but ukies just strolled right in and took over, completely against the agreement.

    As for the osce, they made some vague comments about it but didnt address the issue at all. Considering this is organised by them, you would think they would force both parties to adhere to the agreements, but sadly thy act much like the eu did when yanuk was toppled.




    So why hasnt NAF threatened OSCE and PUkes over it rather than staying quiet. Or shell it.


    Because NAF is doing the good guy impression.

    Temporarily, I hope.


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    Post  JohninMK Mon Jul 20, 2015 7:10 pm

    No change in the talking shop

    MOSCOW, July 20. /TASS/. Russian Deputy Foreign Minister Grigory Karasin and US Assistant Secretary of State Victoria Nuland discussed constitutional reform in Ukraine and security, economic and humanitarian problems in the country’s east, Russia’s Foreign Ministry said in a statement on Monday reporting a telephone conversation between the diplomats.

    Karasin and Nuland "exchanged views on the situation with the implementation of the Minsk agreements reached on February 12, 2015," the ministry said. "Particular attention has been paid to political issues linked to carrying out a real constitutional reform in Ukraine, strengthening security as well as economic and humanitarian problems in the Donbas region."

    The ministry said the diplomats also considered issues related to a new meeting involving representatives of the Contact Group on the Ukraine crisis, scheduled to take place in the Belarusian capital Minsk on Tuesday.

    "The Russian side has emphasized the importance of establishing direct dialogue between representatives of Kiev, Donetsk and Luhansk," it said, adding that the sides also highlighted the key role played by European security watchdog OSCE in resolving the internal Ukrainian conflict.

    On Tuesday, July 21, envoys of Moscow, Kiev, the self-proclaimed republics of Donetsk and Luhansk and the Organization for Security and Cooperation in Europe will gather in Minsk to continue Contact Group meetings reviewing progress of the ceasefire. Discussions are expected to include four working groups that were set up to deal with political, security, economic and humanitarian issues.
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    Post  JohninMK Mon Jul 20, 2015 7:18 pm

    More interesting titbits at Fortrus

    Donbass From Bird's Eye View By Yurasumy

    Translated from Russian by J.Hawk

    Readers have been asking me to discuss the recent events at the front. Because there's more shelling. What's the connection, what are we to expect. I'll try to lay out a few markers, and make a full assessment a bit later.

    Shelling of Donetsk and Makeyevka. In actuality both sides are twisting the truth. One side says the militia is shelling itself, while the other side claims they are as pure as driven snow. The shelling has become a tradition over the last few weeks.

    Initially artillery attacked opposing artillery. Judging by the reports from Ukrainian repair facilities, DPR/LPR artillery fired accurately. Junta's forces suffered especially heavily after July 10. Using the Mukachevo distraction, militia artillery hit enemy positions with force. Incidentally, that's when Ukrainian Colonel Tsisaruk, the chief of reconnaissance of the Rocket Forces and Artillery Command of the Operational Command "West", was killed. It would seem that, having lost the duel, junta's artillery decided to hit back.

    The second marker are the purges of the "irreconcilables." Which led to arrests of several officials and a purge within the army. DPR Prosecutor General Office and the Ministry of State Security were urged a month earlier, which included 8 or 9 employees who also SBU associates and who were still "legally" receiving their Ukrainian salaries. Apparently the purge was facilitated by a leak of information from the SBU.


    The rest of the article, politics and business is at http://fortruss.blogspot.co.uk/2015/07/donbass-from-birds-eye-view.html
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    Post  Khepesh Mon Jul 20, 2015 8:02 pm

    On eve of pravy sektor circus act tomorrow, Poroshenko leaves Kiev for Nikolaev. http://www.0512.com.ua/news/895803
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    Post  Karl Haushofer Mon Jul 20, 2015 8:30 pm

    Rodinazombie wrote:
    Karl Haushofer wrote:
    Flagship Victory wrote:If I were a Donetsk resident, I wouldn't bother relying on NAF. I'd buy a gun off the black market and become a vigilante, hunting down Maidan soldiers like Batman. cheers

    There is a big danger in a partizan war. The junta would probably start killing way more civilians than they currently do if the civilians started making partizan attacks agains them. Remember what Nazi Germans did to Soviet civilian population to revenge partizan attacks.

    There will no no partisan war, IF ukies win,it would be like in kharkov or odessa, small acts of sabotage, plenty of political repression and brainwashing, and lots of crime no doubt., but no partisan war. The people clearly dont have the stomach for it.
    Yes I agree and I actually wrote a similar post earlier. If the NAF falls it will be all over. No partizan war will emerge.
    Flagship Victory
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    Post  Flagship Victory Mon Jul 20, 2015 8:54 pm

    Russia warns US training Maidan army.

    http://www.kyivpost.com/content/ukraine-abroad/daily-mail-russia-warns-of-explosive-consequences-of-us-led-military-drills-393881.html


    The west kicks off biggest military training in western Ukraine.

    http://www.kyivpost.com/content/ukraine-abroad/newsweek-europe-us-leads-largest-multinational-exercise-held-in-ukraine-393880.html
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    Post  JohninMK Mon Jul 20, 2015 9:39 pm

    Interesting update from OSCE. TASS excerpt, full report at http://www.osce.org/ukraine-smm/173666

    VIENNA, July 20. /TASS/. Observers of the OSCE Special Monitoring Mission say in their daily report on Monday that they witnessed the pullback of two columns of weapons of under 100mm caliber from the line of contact in the troubled Donbas region.

    The report said: "The SMM was invited on 19 July by the Russian Federation Lieutenant-General, head of the Russian Federation side to the JCCC, to observe what he described as the withdrawal of "DPR" MBTs and weapons under-100mm calibre from the contact line". "The SMM, along with media representatives, first followed the Russian Federation JCCC and "DPR" delegation to Lozove ("DPR"-controlled, 13km west of Donetsk city), where it observed a column of three MBTs (T-64) move approximately 1.28km south-east and into a forest near the town," the report said. "Then around Novolapsa ("DPR"-controlled, 47km south of Donetsk), the SMM observed four BMP-1 infantry fighting vehicles drive east approximately 4.3km and park in a forest — with the journalists filming the event with the use of a camera drone," it continued.

    Possible withdrawal of such weapons had been discussed at Minsk talks on a settlement in Donbas but no agreement on the matter was reached with Kiev. The two republics have decided on unilateral withdrawal in the interests of a speedy peace settlement.

    The OSCE Special Monitoring Mission (SMM) in Ukraine has inspected heavy weapon holding areas to discover that some of them have been abandoned and not all previously recorded weapons was in situ as some of them, the Special Monitoring Mission (SMM) in Ukraine said in its annual report.

    "On 18 July, the SMM revisited 11 Ukrainian Armed Forces heavy weapon holding areas. While their locations comply with Minsk withdrawal lines, at four of the sites the SMM was not able to conclude that all previously recorded weapons were in situ. At one site, the SMM observed that four multiple launcher rocket systems (MLRS) (BM-21 Grad, 122mm) were missing and that the site had been abandoned. At a second site, the SMM observed three MLRS (BM-21 Grad, 122mm) were missing. The SMM found a third site abandoned, and with none of the six previously recorded self-propelled howitzers (2S1 Gvozdika, 122mm) in situ. At a fourth site the SMM observed that two of 10 previously recorded self-propelled artillery guns (2S3 Akatsiya, 152mm) were missing," the SMM report said.

    "On 19 July, the SMM revisited two "DPR" heavy weapon holding areas," the report went on to say. "At one site, the SMM was denied access to confirm the serial numbers on six towed antitank guns… At the other site, the SMM observed that one self-propelled howitzer (2S1 Gvozdika, 122mm) was missing," the SMM said.
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    Post  franco Mon Jul 20, 2015 9:57 pm

    An interview with an Ukrainian officer by a Russian reporter;
    https://translate.googleusercontent.com/translate_c?depth=1&hl=en&rurl=translate.google.com&sl=auto&tl=en&u=http://warfiles.ru/show-92280-otkrovennyy-razgovor-s-vysokopostavlennym-oficerom-vsu.html&usg=ALkJrhhiWp9CKjV7LO3TIP0cEcYcYK7kxw
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    Post  Flagship Victory Mon Jul 20, 2015 10:06 pm

    JohninMK wrote:Interesting update from OSCE. TASS excerpt, full report at http://www.osce.org/ukraine-smm/173666

    VIENNA, July 20. /TASS/. Observers of the OSCE Special Monitoring Mission say in their daily report on Monday that they witnessed the pullback of two columns of weapons of under 100mm caliber from the line of contact in the troubled Donbas region.

    The report said: "The SMM was invited on 19 July by the Russian Federation Lieutenant-General, head of the Russian Federation side to the JCCC, to observe what he described as the withdrawal of "DPR" MBTs and weapons under-100mm calibre from the contact line". "The SMM, along with media representatives, first followed the Russian Federation JCCC and "DPR" delegation to Lozove ("DPR"-controlled, 13km west of Donetsk city), where it observed a column of three MBTs (T-64) move approximately 1.28km south-east and into a forest near the town," the report said. "Then around Novolapsa ("DPR"-controlled, 47km south of Donetsk), the SMM observed four BMP-1 infantry fighting vehicles drive east approximately 4.3km and park in a forest — with the journalists filming the event with the use of a camera drone," it continued.

    Possible withdrawal of such weapons had been discussed at Minsk talks on a settlement in Donbas but no agreement on the matter was reached with Kiev. The two republics have decided on unilateral withdrawal in the interests of a speedy peace settlement.

    The OSCE Special Monitoring Mission (SMM) in Ukraine has inspected heavy weapon holding areas to discover that some of them have been abandoned and not all previously recorded weapons was in situ as some of them, the Special Monitoring Mission (SMM) in Ukraine said in its annual report.

    "On 18 July, the SMM revisited 11 Ukrainian Armed Forces heavy weapon holding areas. While their locations comply with Minsk withdrawal lines, at four of the sites the SMM was not able to conclude that all previously recorded weapons were in situ. At one site, the SMM observed that four multiple launcher rocket systems (MLRS) (BM-21 Grad, 122mm) were missing and that the site had been abandoned. At a second site, the SMM observed three MLRS (BM-21 Grad, 122mm) were missing. The SMM found a third site abandoned, and with none of the six previously recorded self-propelled howitzers (2S1 Gvozdika, 122mm) in situ. At a fourth site the SMM observed that two of 10 previously recorded self-propelled artillery guns (2S3 Akatsiya, 152mm) were missing," the SMM report said.

    "On 19 July, the SMM revisited two "DPR" heavy weapon holding areas," the report went on to say. "At one site, the SMM was denied access to confirm the serial numbers on six towed antitank guns… At the other site, the SMM observed that one self-propelled howitzer (2S1 Gvozdika, 122mm) was missing," the SMM said.

    What's the point of showing PR to OSCE? OSCE is nothing but a western stooge. The way OSCE puts DPR in quotation marks clearly shows OSCE's disdain of NAF.
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    Post  JohninMK Mon Jul 20, 2015 10:16 pm

    Flagship Victory wrote:
    JohninMK wrote:Interesting update from OSCE. TASS excerpt, full report at http://www.osce.org/ukraine-smm/173666

    VIENNA, July 20. /TASS/. Observers of the OSCE Special Monitoring Mission say in their daily report on Monday that they witnessed the pullback of two columns of weapons of under 100mm caliber from the line of contact in the troubled Donbas region.

    The report said: "The SMM was invited on 19 July by the Russian Federation Lieutenant-General, head of the Russian Federation side to the JCCC, to observe what he described as the withdrawal of "DPR" MBTs and weapons under-100mm calibre from the contact line". "The SMM, along with media representatives, first followed the Russian Federation JCCC and "DPR" delegation to Lozove ("DPR"-controlled, 13km west of Donetsk city), where it observed a column of three MBTs (T-64) move approximately 1.28km south-east and into a forest near the town," the report said. "Then around Novolapsa ("DPR"-controlled, 47km south of Donetsk), the SMM observed four BMP-1 infantry fighting vehicles drive east approximately 4.3km and park in a forest — with the journalists filming the event with the use of a camera drone," it continued.

    Possible withdrawal of such weapons had been discussed at Minsk talks on a settlement in Donbas but no agreement on the matter was reached with Kiev. The two republics have decided on unilateral withdrawal in the interests of a speedy peace settlement.

    The OSCE Special Monitoring Mission (SMM) in Ukraine has inspected heavy weapon holding areas to discover that some of them have been abandoned and not all previously recorded weapons was in situ as some of them, the Special Monitoring Mission (SMM) in Ukraine said in its annual report.

    "On 18 July, the SMM revisited 11 Ukrainian Armed Forces heavy weapon holding areas. While their locations comply with Minsk withdrawal lines, at four of the sites the SMM was not able to conclude that all previously recorded weapons were in situ. At one site, the SMM observed that four multiple launcher rocket systems (MLRS) (BM-21 Grad, 122mm) were missing and that the site had been abandoned. At a second site, the SMM observed three MLRS (BM-21 Grad, 122mm) were missing. The SMM found a third site abandoned, and with none of the six previously recorded self-propelled howitzers (2S1 Gvozdika, 122mm) in situ. At a fourth site the SMM observed that two of 10 previously recorded self-propelled artillery guns (2S3 Akatsiya, 152mm) were missing," the SMM report said.

    "On 19 July, the SMM revisited two "DPR" heavy weapon holding areas," the report went on to say. "At one site, the SMM was denied access to confirm the serial numbers on six towed antitank guns… At the other site, the SMM observed that one self-propelled howitzer (2S1 Gvozdika, 122mm) was missing," the SMM said.

    What's the point of showing PR to OSCE? OSCE is nothing but a western stooge. The way OSCE puts DPR in quotation marks clearly shows OSCE's disdain of NAF.
    Just in case you missed it the UAF bit was also in exclamation marks. This is normal in journalism when quoting from another source.
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    Post  PapaDragon Mon Jul 20, 2015 10:20 pm


    Good stuff here, good stuff thumbsup pwnd

    ''Right Sector loses its collective mind?''

    http://fortruss.blogspot.com/2015/07/right-sector-loses-its-collective-mind.html
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    Post  whir Mon Jul 20, 2015 10:28 pm

    Комсомольская Правда wrote:Отвод вооружений в районе Горловки / Withdrawal of weapons in the region Gorlovka

    Громадське ТБ Дніпро wrote:Duk "Right Sector" prostyvsya company commander with "Green"
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    Post  PapaDragon Mon Jul 20, 2015 10:32 pm

    J. Hawk's comment is pure gold! lol1


    Pyatt to visit Transcarpathia

    http://fortruss.blogspot.com/2015/07/pyatt-to-visit-transcarpathia.html

    Translated from Ukrainian by J.Hawk

    Tomorrow, on Tuesday July 21, the Extraordinary and Plenipotentiary (sic) US Ambassador to Ukraine Jeffrey Pyatt will arrive in the Transcarpathia Region. Mukachevo.net learned it from government sources.

    The diplomat plans to meet with the region's leaders in Uzhgorod. The ambassador intends to learn the local authorities' opinion on the situation in the region. There is little doubt the ambassador's visit is connected with the recent gun battle in Mukachevo.

    J.Hawk's Comment: His Royal Highness Sir Pyatt shall deign to breathe the same air as the lowly mortals of a remote province of a Category III vassal! He might not realize this (he probably doesn't), but trips like that do little to improve the sense, among ordinary Ukrainians, that Ukraine is a sovereign, independent, self-governing country capable of controlling its own destiny.

    Which of course it isn't, but one should at least maintain appearances!

    Say, isn't that Don Quixote in the photo's backdrop? And do I detect a certain irony in Mukachevo.net describing him as "Extraordinary and Plenipotentiary"? Just cut to the chase and refer to him as Viceroy. Saves ink and paper.


    Seriously, what happened to US diplomacy? Back when I was a wee lad they were best in business.
    These new guys that are running the show today are total noobs... scratch Suspect
    avatar
    Rodinazombie

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    The Situation in the Ukraine. #18 - Page 8 Empty Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #18

    Post  Rodinazombie Mon Jul 20, 2015 10:42 pm

    PapaDragon wrote:J. Hawk's comment is pure gold! lol1


    Pyatt to visit Transcarpathia

    http://fortruss.blogspot.com/2015/07/pyatt-to-visit-transcarpathia.html

    Translated from Ukrainian by J.Hawk

    Tomorrow, on Tuesday July 21, the Extraordinary and Plenipotentiary (sic) US Ambassador to Ukraine Jeffrey Pyatt will arrive in the Transcarpathia Region. Mukachevo.net learned it from government sources.

    The diplomat plans to meet with the region's leaders in Uzhgorod. The ambassador intends to learn the local authorities' opinion on the situation in the region. There is little doubt the ambassador's visit is connected with the recent gun battle in Mukachevo.

    J.Hawk's Comment: His Royal Highness Sir Pyatt shall deign to breathe the same air as the lowly mortals of a remote province of a Category III vassal! He might not realize this (he probably doesn't), but trips like that do little to improve the sense, among ordinary Ukrainians, that Ukraine is a sovereign, independent, self-governing country capable of controlling its own destiny.

    Which of course it isn't, but one should at least maintain appearances!

    Say, isn't that Don Quixote in the photo's backdrop? And do I detect a certain irony in Mukachevo.net describing him as "Extraordinary and Plenipotentiary"? Just cut to the chase and refer to him as Viceroy. Saves ink and paper.


    Seriously, what happened to US diplomacy? Back when I was a wee lad they were best in business.
    These new guys that are running the show today are total noobs... scratch Suspect

    Im only a mere 29 year old, but even i remember the days where US diplocmacy, even if still morally questionable, was very classy and smooth. They did things the right way without people noticing or giving em reason to feel slighted or get their backs up.

    Now, its like they have a list of how not to do it, and orders to do the exact opposite of that.






    avatar
    Rodinazombie

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    The Situation in the Ukraine. #18 - Page 8 Empty Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #18

    Post  Rodinazombie Mon Jul 20, 2015 10:47 pm

    PapaDragon wrote:
    Good stuff here, good stuff thumbsup pwnd

    ''Right Sector loses its collective mind?''

    http://fortruss.blogspot.com/2015/07/right-sector-loses-its-collective-mind.html

    Wow, a slave is a slave, regardless of colour.

    That one is just mindblowing.

    So, all that they stood for on the maidan whilst murdering police, overthrowing the government, they admit it was all a waste?

    We could have told the idiots that back then.

    Anyway, nato is in town now in western ukraine. Would be interesting if right sector got a bit carried away and attacked nato troops.



    PapaDragon
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    The Situation in the Ukraine. #18 - Page 8 Empty Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #18

    Post  PapaDragon Mon Jul 20, 2015 10:52 pm

    Rodinazombie wrote:
    PapaDragon wrote:J. Hawk's comment is pure gold! lol1


    Pyatt to visit Transcarpathia

    http://fortruss.blogspot.com/2015/07/pyatt-to-visit-transcarpathia.html

    Translated from Ukrainian by J.Hawk

    Tomorrow, on Tuesday July 21, the Extraordinary and Plenipotentiary (sic) US Ambassador to Ukraine Jeffrey Pyatt will arrive in the Transcarpathia Region. Mukachevo.net learned it from government sources.

    The diplomat plans to meet with the region's leaders in Uzhgorod. The ambassador intends to learn the local authorities' opinion on the situation in the region. There is little doubt the ambassador's visit is connected with the recent gun battle in Mukachevo.

    J.Hawk's Comment: His Royal Highness Sir Pyatt shall deign to breathe the same air as the lowly mortals of a remote province of a Category III vassal! He might not realize this (he probably doesn't), but trips like that do little to improve the sense, among ordinary Ukrainians, that Ukraine is a sovereign, independent, self-governing country capable of controlling its own destiny.

    Which of course it isn't, but one should at least maintain appearances!

    Say, isn't that Don Quixote in the photo's backdrop? And do I detect a certain irony in Mukachevo.net describing him as "Extraordinary and Plenipotentiary"? Just cut to the chase and refer to him as Viceroy. Saves ink and paper.


    Seriously, what happened to US diplomacy? Back when I was a wee lad they were best in business.
    These new guys that are running the show today are total noobs... scratch Suspect

    Im only a mere 29 year old, but even i remember the days where US diplocmacy, even if still morally questionable, was very classy and smooth. They did things the right way without people noticing or giving em reason to feel slighted or get their backs up.

    Now, its like they have a list of how not to do it, and orders to do the exact opposite of that

    I have five years on you so I remember that same period and it's just like you said, classy and smooth before, now- amateur hour... dunno
    auslander
    auslander

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    Post  auslander Mon Jul 20, 2015 11:04 pm

    PapaDragon wrote:
    Rodinazombie wrote:
    PapaDragon wrote:J. Hawk's comment is pure gold! lol1


    Pyatt to visit Transcarpathia

    http://fortruss.blogspot.com/2015/07/pyatt-to-visit-transcarpathia.html

    Translated from Ukrainian by J.Hawk

    Tomorrow, on Tuesday July 21, the Extraordinary and Plenipotentiary (sic) US Ambassador to Ukraine Jeffrey Pyatt will arrive in the Transcarpathia Region. Mukachevo.net learned it from government sources.

    The diplomat plans to meet with the region's leaders in Uzhgorod. The ambassador intends to learn the local authorities' opinion on the situation in the region. There is little doubt the ambassador's visit is connected with the recent gun battle in Mukachevo.

    J.Hawk's Comment: His Royal Highness Sir Pyatt shall deign to breathe the same air as the lowly mortals of a remote province of a Category III vassal! He might not realize this (he probably doesn't), but trips like that do little to improve the sense, among ordinary Ukrainians, that Ukraine is a sovereign, independent, self-governing country capable of controlling its own destiny.

    Which of course it isn't, but one should at least maintain appearances!

    Say, isn't that Don Quixote in the photo's backdrop? And do I detect a certain irony in Mukachevo.net describing him as "Extraordinary and Plenipotentiary"? Just cut to the chase and refer to him as Viceroy. Saves ink and paper.


    Seriously, what happened to US diplomacy? Back when I was a wee lad they were best in business.
    These new guys that are running the show today are total noobs... scratch Suspect

    Im only a mere 29 year old, but even i remember the days where US diplocmacy, even if still morally questionable, was very classy and smooth. They did things the right way without people noticing or giving em reason to feel slighted or get their backs up.

    Now, its like they have a list of how not to do it, and orders to do the exact opposite of that

    I have five years on you so I remember that same period and it's just like you said, classy and smooth before, now- amateur hour... dunno

    Good Lord I'm old enough to be the youngster's grandfather and way old enough to the the old guy's father. Suddenly I feel REALLY old. Well, maybe not.
    Flagship Victory
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    Post  Flagship Victory Mon Jul 20, 2015 11:06 pm

    Just when you thought OSCE can't get any lower as a stooge. Rolling Eyes OSCE reports seeing 20,021 men in armed uniform cross between Russia and Donbas.

    http://www.interpretermag.com/ukraine-live-day-518-heavy-fighting-across-front-with-civilian-casualties/
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    The Situation in the Ukraine. #18 - Page 8 Empty Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #18

    Post  Rodinazombie Mon Jul 20, 2015 11:07 pm

    PapaDragon wrote:
    Rodinazombie wrote:
    PapaDragon wrote:J. Hawk's comment is pure gold! lol1


    Pyatt to visit Transcarpathia

    http://fortruss.blogspot.com/2015/07/pyatt-to-visit-transcarpathia.html

    Translated from Ukrainian by J.Hawk

    Tomorrow, on Tuesday July 21, the Extraordinary and Plenipotentiary (sic) US Ambassador to Ukraine Jeffrey Pyatt will arrive in the Transcarpathia Region. Mukachevo.net learned it from government sources.

    The diplomat plans to meet with the region's leaders in Uzhgorod. The ambassador intends to learn the local authorities' opinion on the situation in the region. There is little doubt the ambassador's visit is connected with the recent gun battle in Mukachevo.

    J.Hawk's Comment: His Royal Highness Sir Pyatt shall deign to breathe the same air as the lowly mortals of a remote province of a Category III vassal! He might not realize this (he probably doesn't), but trips like that do little to improve the sense, among ordinary Ukrainians, that Ukraine is a sovereign, independent, self-governing country capable of controlling its own destiny.

    Which of course it isn't, but one should at least maintain appearances!

    Say, isn't that Don Quixote in the photo's backdrop? And do I detect a certain irony in Mukachevo.net describing him as "Extraordinary and Plenipotentiary"? Just cut to the chase and refer to him as Viceroy. Saves ink and paper.


    Seriously, what happened to US diplomacy? Back when I was a wee lad they were best in business.
    These new guys that are running the show today are total noobs... scratch Suspect

    Im only a mere 29 year old, but even i remember the days where US diplocmacy, even if still morally questionable, was very classy and smooth. They did things the right way without people noticing or giving em reason to feel slighted or get their backs up.

    Now, its like they have a list of how not to do it, and orders to do the exact opposite of that

    I have five years on you so I remember that same period and it's just like you said, classy and smooth before, now- amateur hour... dunno

    Well. It starts right at the top, just take a look at the way obama blunders his way around the world of international politics. The guy is either too dumb or just plain arrogant. The first american president that i took note of growing up was bill clinton and at the i loved the guy, i used to think he was so classy, great smile, said the right things and even though looking back i realise what an a-hole he was, you cant deny the guy was as we said, classy and smooth.

    Flagship Victory wrote:Just when you thought OSCE can't get any lower as a stooge.  Rolling Eyes  OSCE reports seeing 20,021 men in armed uniform cross between Russia and Donbas.

    http://www.interpretermag.com/ukraine-live-day-518-heavy-fighting-across-front-with-civilian-casualties/


    Let me guess, they forgot to take their cameras this time? Or maybe they had the cameras but lost the memory cards?


    Last edited by Rodinazombie on Mon Jul 20, 2015 11:09 pm; edited 1 time in total

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