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    The Situation in the Ukraine. #14

    Pinto
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    Post  Pinto Thu May 21, 2015 9:14 pm

    Looks like NATO will not stop interfering in ukraine, they are trying there best to lure ukraine in NATO and this might provoke Russia more. why would putin allow a NATO member as neighbour and hence Russia will try to more merge more russian speaking areas of ukraine in it further pissing west off
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    Post  sepheronx Thu May 21, 2015 9:24 pm

    Pinto wrote:Looks like NATO will not stop interfering in ukraine, they are trying there best to lure ukraine in NATO and this might provoke Russia more. why would putin allow a NATO member as neighbour and hence Russia will try to more merge more russian speaking areas of ukraine in it further pissing west off

    Any updates then refarding this? NATO knows they cant acquire Ukraine especially with its territorial issues. And they were pretty quick at denying to Ukraine defense minister about possibility of ABM's (cause they know they will be in trouble if that is the case).
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    Post  PapaDragon Thu May 21, 2015 9:50 pm

    sepheronx wrote:
    Pinto wrote:Looks like NATO will not stop interfering in ukraine, they are trying there best to lure ukraine in NATO and this might provoke Russia more. why would putin allow a NATO member as neighbour and hence Russia will try to more merge more russian speaking areas of ukraine in it further pissing west off

    Any updates then refarding this? NATO knows they cant acquire Ukraine especially with its territorial issues. And they were pretty quick at denying to Ukraine defense minister about possibility of ABM's (cause they know they will be in trouble if that is the case).

    If recent news are anything to go by even EU membership is an impossibility for the Ukraine now. Double that for NATO membership.

    They are being dropped like a third period French...
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    Post  gregoire Thu May 21, 2015 10:03 pm

    PapaDragon wrote:
    sepheronx wrote:
    Pinto wrote:Looks like NATO will not stop interfering in ukraine, they are trying there best to lure ukraine in NATO and this might provoke Russia more. why would putin allow a NATO member as neighbour and hence Russia will try to more merge more russian speaking areas of ukraine in it further pissing west off

    Any updates then refarding this? NATO knows they cant acquire Ukraine especially with its territorial issues. And they were pretty quick at denying to Ukraine defense minister about possibility of ABM's (cause they know they will be in trouble if that is the case).

    If recent news are anything to go by even EU membership is an impossibility for the Ukraine now. Double that for NATO membership.

    They are being dropped like a third period French...

    But the dog (EU) won't let go of the rabbit.
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    Post  Pinto Thu May 21, 2015 10:20 pm

    EU and NATO seems too have same motive but they have not succeeded so far and there economic sanctions seems not to have had any credible effect. If Russian economy can wither these sanctions successfully this year then EU and NATO will sit like a melted ice. In coming winters russia might again switch of gas supplies lol Laughing
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    Post  Erk Thu May 21, 2015 11:31 pm

    Pinto wrote:EU and NATO seems too have same motive but they have not succeeded so far and there economic sanctions seems not to have had any credible effect. If Russian economy can wither these sanctions successfully this year then EU and NATO will sit like a melted ice. In coming winters russia might again switch of gas supplies lol Laughing

    I don't think the sanctions against Russia are having a massive economic effect, the US mainly controls the flow of $US finance, something the world could well do without. Most goods and services can be imported from many places.
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    Post  Big_Gazza Fri May 22, 2015 12:35 am

    Godric wrote:
    PapaDragon wrote:This is rich from Yahoo News, they publish correction of a name of one "Russian soldier" in top 10 headlines totally not for no other reason than to keep "story" in focus.

    http://news.yahoo.com/russian-captured-eastern-ukraine-says-fine-155645634.html

    Now if they would be so kind to publish corrections for all that other crap they posted over past 2 years (and more) that would be freakin' sweet. Rolling Eyes  

    yahoo news is absolutely terrible they are even more biased than the BBC you had to see Yahoo during the Scottish Independence referendum it was truly sickening

    If that is not bad enough, check out the comments section....  the mindless ignorance and hateful Russophobia on display is truly awe-inspiring....  its as though the average yahoo news reader is a redneck from the Ozarks who has never been more than 20 miles from the shack were he/she was born....
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    Post  Big_Gazza Fri May 22, 2015 12:46 am

    Erk wrote:
    Pinto wrote:EU and NATO seems too have same motive but they have not succeeded so far and there economic sanctions seems not to have had any credible effect. If Russian economy can wither these sanctions successfully this year then EU and NATO will sit like a melted ice. In coming winters russia might again switch of gas supplies lol Laughing

    I don't think the sanctions against Russia are having a massive economic effect, the US mainly controls the flow of $US finance, something the world could well do without. Most goods and services can be imported from many places.

    Agreed, and some good will come from this absurd imbroglio:

    1) Russia will work to rid itself of dependency of foreign-imported technology in its defence and aerospace industries (which means investment in local engineering & manufacturing industries, thereby boosting high-value jobs and domestic taxation base)  russia

    2) The Russian public will finally be dispelled of the ridiculous notion that the west is benevolent and has Russia best interest at heart.  This will greatly assist the essential task of identifying the 5th columnists in Russian society that accept US/EU blood-stained judas-coin and who work to covertly advance the interests of hostile adversarial nations.  russia

    3) The Uh'Muricans will (eventually) receive a nice big dose of reality when their sanctions regime and their sabotage of the ruble end up as a bust and fizzles like a wet firecracker.  Hopefully, more than few of the McCain / Lindsay Graham-type psychopath Russia-haters will burst a cerebral blood vessel and turn their up toes...  Twisted Evil
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    Post  Cyberspec Fri May 22, 2015 2:30 am

    Erk wrote:
    Cyberspec wrote:
    Erk wrote:Seems this drone they shot down on the week end was a target practice drone model, not a spy drone.

    Wrong pic...it's a "Forpost" which is a Russian version of the Israeli "Searcher MkII"...

    Arrow http://bmpd.livejournal.com/1309750.html

    It's the right picture, I was talking about the one they shot down a week ago, not the one today.


    Fair enough....I wasn't aware about the target drone.

    I'm curious to hear how the war party on this forum explains the presence of Forposts in Ukraine Question Maybe El Murid will report that they were captured in a daring raid from Putin's garage by Strelkov's commandoes What a Face

    sepheronx wrote:http://russia-insider.com/en/appeal-lets-help-alternative-ukraine-reporter-crowdfund-camera/ri7211

    Dunno if this is allowed or not. But the guy brought quality footage/pics for free of what is really going on in donbass, so they are seeking money for a better camera to take photos and videos for all media outlets. Since there is 18 days to go, ill be sending money next paycheque.

    I made a donation...seems worthwhile
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    Post  Vann7 Fri May 22, 2015 2:46 am

    Ok let me explain why Ukraine cannot be a NATO member..

    1)Because United States do not want it.. being a NATO member force all NATO countries
    to defend Ukraine in case of war with Russia.. and Neocons media PR warriors ,but chicken on the battlefield ,who runs the Pentagon do not want to fight Russia in a frontal attack.. they have never done it.. they instead ,what they do is hire non american ,terrorist and criminals ,JIhadist and nazis to do the fighting for them.. and hide their hands or claim what they do is only for Ukraine right for self defense.
    2)Being A NATO member give Ukraine the right to buy any advanced American weapon..
    And the Holywood American heroes that last thing they will want to see is their Apache Hellicopters and F-35s falling from the sky like flies ,fighting the Rebels. Neither they will want
    their M1A2 tanks to be crushed by the Rebels.. Chicken Coward Neocons Exceptionalist Americans needs to maintain a world image of invulnerability and being so powerful that not even Russia can touch... but their World Image that they like so much to have of "superiority" and "Exceptionalism"  will become a major joke in the world.. if their best military hardware fails..  US Government will not cry a tear for a human life...but they will scream and yell in pain
    for anything that humiliates their Inflated Egos.. That said.. World "Exceptionalism" Image of being a Superior ,untouchable nation needs to be maintained at all cost.. and this is why the Americans does not send ANY military hardware to Ukraine ,that could be used to damage their
    image of being the most powerful nation..  So this is why US mostly supply Ukraine with Soviet Weapons.. United States is a Public Relations military Power.. is not really a real military force
    that could threaten Russia in a real challenging fight without using Nukes or the help of Europe.

    Without Europe.. US become essentially just a regional power , like it is France or UK.. They do have a really big number of inventory in planes or tanks but they are either weak planes or tanks that will not stand a chance in fight with Russia if they were to fight both one vs one in Ukraine.. Russia will eclipse American forces in a frontal fight.. and this is why they don't deny
    they do not want a fair fight with Russia.. because they know they will be crushed if invade Ukraine and seeks to remove by force the Donetsk and Lugansk separatist. It will drag Russia
    in the fight and it will kick the ass of US military in a conventional fight.. Russia have Better artillery ,better electronic warfare and better missiles..and now better tanks.. and better tactics too.. and a thousand times better determination too.. US have the world biggest suicide rate on its military..the American soldiers have the lowest morale of all world armies ,because its armed forces know they fight for US EMpire and stealing other nations resources.. is not a war for defending civilians or children. or defending their nation.  US military is only a show military ,good for third world weak nations but not good to fight strong nations..

    take a look how they wanted to use nukes in Korean war after being massacre
    by CHina army when they invade north korea to kick Americans and NATO allies from there..



    Chapter 48: MacArthur Panics
    The General abruptly changes from easy confidence to outrage. “We face an entirely new war,” he announces. Washington talks frantically—and does nothing. As X Corps on the east escapes, Eighth Army on the west withdraws 120 miles in the longest retreat in American history. President Truman is tricked by reporters into saying that the U.S. might use the atomic bomb. A world uproar follows, and British Prime Minister Clement Attlee flies to confer with Truman.

    Contrary to most belief ,US and NATO alliance have the numbers advantage in Korean war.
    they simply had inferior tactics. and the inferior armed army ,took advantage of NATO weakness.. of relying so much in air power for superiority. By fighting close distance of them.

    http://bevinalexander.com/books/korea-first-war-we-lost.htm

    US will never fight Russia with its conventional army.. in any territory.. it will be
    political suicide and a major defeat for them.. Instead their goal is to give Russia
    another Afgan war.. with Russia invading Ukraine and US fighting by proxy with someone else
    army ,and they providing the weapons.

    Maintaining this image of "superiority" is really important to keep its control over
    Europe.. this is also true for UK and other major powers.. This is why UK send their worse
    possible armored vehicles to Ukraine and not their best one.. it will be really embarrassing
    for them if Rebels shut down Eurofighters again and again and capture their pilots..

    if they for example were defeated today in a war with Russia.. the first thing you will
    see is the disband of the entire  nation...That will be the last straw for americans.. to discover
    they are not so superior as they were told.. their egos will receive a mortal hit ,that will destroy their support for such criminal government and their power image is what allow them
    to influence Europe and keep them under their control.. But if they lose Europe control..it will be impossible for their army to lead a war again anywhere in the planet.. Without Suffering major economic sanctions if Europe and Russia were allies.

    Americans projection of Power is the most important thing in the world ,and they know without Europe they will lose their world power status .and keeping Europe away of Russia their major Goal.. reason why the entire Coup against Yakunovych was made.. to isolate Russia from Europe.

    That said.. US will give NATO membership only to nations ,they know
    1)Russia will not invade.  (like Baltic States..) simply because Russia don't need it..
    2)That is strong and Russia will think twice before invading.. ie.. have nukes..

    The Whole Fascist American Government is run in a way to maintain an artificial image ,that they are Superior to Others , "exceptoinalism" and that cannot be touched and that can destroy
    anyone with the blink of an eye..   and they will continue running the country in that way..
    with a HEAVY Public Relations campaign of how "Exceptional" they are.. Riding with their tanks all europe..with their flags and by using all its capabilities to sabotage the development and economy of their major competition..that is RUssia.

    So this is why Violence and Wars "mysteriously" always happens in the nations that are
    important to Russia economic interest. You never see Alqaeda or ISIS attacking ISRAEL ,TUrkey or Saudi Arabia or Jordan.. all friendly to US interest..  but nations who had friendly relations
    to Russia or that will become very important for Russia economy.. attacked..

    So if you want to predict which countries will experience Violence or war.. just only look which countries are friendly to Russia economic Interest in Africa and middle east. But also Europe..
    SO greece will be in the line of fire if they sign the BRICS deal..and ally with Russia.. Macedonia
    is already attacked by US through their NGOs..and hired albanians muslin terrorist for stopping breaking the nation in parts and stopping Russia south pipeline to Europe.
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    Post  Cowboy's daughter Fri May 22, 2015 4:34 am

    Gopro Behind the scene:Donetsk-Peski frontline homes that have been...

    Gopro Behind the scene:Donetsk-Peski frontline homes that have been destroyed in as shelling hits near





    Gopro behind the scene:Tour by Cmdr. Sergei Vostok positions on Donetsk-Peski frontline 05/12/15


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    Post  Pinto Fri May 22, 2015 7:52 am

    US has helped made world a very messy place already be it Iraq, Iran, Syria, Egypt, Afghanistan. Wherever it goes to further its selfish rather foolish interests it leaves behind trails of destructions and misery. This time US seems to be playing with fire in Russian backyard in Ukraine and its being assisted by EU.

    EU propagates to whole world human rights and in all above nations this belief has been openly abused by US n EU in the countries mentioned above
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    Post  whir Fri May 22, 2015 10:14 am

    Новости и Политика wrote:Ukrainian security officials are targeting new weapons on peaceful settlement in LC

    BBC wrote:Russia upset over US training Ukraine soldiers
    21 May 2015 Last updated at 12:36 BST

    The Ukrainian government has enlisted the help of the United States army to help train Ukraine soldiers in an effort to strengthen their military operations amid tensions with Russia.
    It has provoked accusations from Russia that the presence of a third party will only fuel the conflict.
    Anastasiya Gribanova has been given exclusive access to one of their training sessions in Lviv in western Ukraine. Video

    Креативная жизнь wrote:Pokatushki airport Lugansk

    OSCE wrote:Latest from OSCE Special Monitoring Mission (SMM) to Ukraine based on information received as of 19:30 (Kyiv time), 20 May 2015
    KYIV 21 May 2015

    This report is for the media and the general public.

    ...

    The SMM visited the two individuals currently held at the military hospital in Kyiv, who received medical treatment. The SMM spoke to the two individuals without the presence of Ukrainian authorities. The SMM assessed their general condition and gathered their accounts about their capture.

    One of them said he had received military education in the Russian Federation. Both individuals claimed that they were members of a unit of the Armed Forces of the Russian Federation. They claimed that they were on a reconnaissance mission. They were armed but had no orders to attack. Both of them said that they came under fire, got injured and were captured on 16 May 2015 at the contact line near Shchastya. One of them said he had received orders from his military unit to go to Ukraine; he was to “rotate” after three months. Both of them said they had been to Ukraine “on missions” before. One of them stressed repeatedly that there were no Russian troops involved in fighting in Ukraine. Both said they were provided with a Ukrainian lawyer who visited them today. Continue reading.

    wrote:Russia Deployed Nuclear-Capable Gear, NATO Commander Says
    by Ian Wishart 4:50 PM CEST May 21, 2015

    Russia has deployed equipment during the conflict in eastern Ukraine that can be used for nuclear weapons, NATO’s top military commander said.

    While there’s no “direct evidence” that the Kremlin has made deployments of nuclear arms, U.S. Air Force General Philip Breedlove said on Thursday, “that does not mean that they may not have happened.”

    “Lots of the systems that the Russians use to deliver nuclear weapons are dual-use systems -- they can be either conventional or nuclear -- and some of those systems are deployed,” Breedlove said. Continue reading.

    Громадське Телебачення wrote:The Sunday Show - White House Wanted To Preserve the USSR - Harvard Historian

    Newsweek wrote:Raising a 'Russian Rebel Army' to Overthrow Putin
    BY NOLAN PETERSON 5/20/15 AT 6:10 PM

    Andrei Kuznetsov leans forward, clinches his angular jaw, narrows his sharp blue eyes and says: “I could tell you things that would shock Americans.”

    For emphasis, the 32-year-old Russian exile then raises his eyebrows and nods as he slowly leans back in his chair and takes a sip of beer. Patrons and servers at the downtown Kiev bar swirl around the table at which the St. Petersburg, Russia, native with wavy blond hair is sitting.

    “Much of Russia is being led like cattle,” Kuznetsov continues. He talks with a perpetual half-smile, using hand gestures and strategic pauses for effect like a politician making a stump speech.

    Try Newsweek: subscription offers

    “But we call ourselves ‘Different Russians.’” he goes on. “Russia needs a real, tough force that can be an opposition to the Putin regime. There are people who support an opposition movement in Russia, but there is no leader to unite them.”

    Kuznetsov, who has been living in Kiev for more than nine months, has set out to create what he calls a “Russian rebel army.” He hopes to sidestep the Kremlin’s seemingly invulnerable crackdown on domestic dissent by uniting Russian dissidents living in Ukraine and across Eastern Europe, ultimately paving the way for a legitimate opposition movement to return one day to overthrow Russian President Vladimir Putin. Continue reading.

    News-Front wrote:Would the Russian army in the Donbas - get! Preparation of the 2nd mechanized brigade of the People's Militia LC

    novayagazeta wrote:Detained in Luhansk region sergeant Alexandrov. Interviews special correspondent of the "New" Paul Kanygin

    TheMedvedova wrote:DNR Mortars at work - Ukraine
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    Post  Khepesh Fri May 22, 2015 12:34 pm

    Vann7 wrote:Ok let me explain why Ukraine cannot be a NATO member..

    1)Because United States do not want it.. being a NATO member force all NATO countries
    to defend Ukraine in case of war with Russia.. and Neocons media PR warriors ,but chicken on the battlefield ,who runs the Pentagon do not want to fight Russia in a frontal attack.. they have never done it.. they instead ,what they do is hire non american ,terrorist and criminals ,JIhadist and nazis to do the fighting for them.. and hide their hands or claim what they do is only for Ukraine right for self defense.
    2)Being A NATO member give Ukraine the right to buy any advanced American weapon..
    And the Holywood American heroes that last thing they will want to see is their Apache Hellicopters and F-35s falling from the sky like flies ,fighting the Rebels. Neither they will want
    their M1A2 tanks to be crushed by the Rebels.. Chicken Coward Neocons Exceptionalist Americans needs to maintain a world image of invulnerability and being so powerful that not even Russia can touch... but their World Image that they like so much to have of "superiority" and "Exceptionalism"  will become a major joke in the world.. if their best military hardware fails..  US Government will not cry a tear for a human life...but they will scream and yell in pain
    for anything that humiliates their Inflated Egos.. That said.. World "Exceptionalism" Image of being a Superior ,untouchable nation needs to be maintained at all cost.. and this is why the Americans does not send ANY military hardware to Ukraine ,that could be used to damage their
    image of being the most powerful nation..  So this is why US mostly supply Ukraine with Soviet Weapons.. United States is a Public Relations military Power.. is not really a real military force
    that could threaten Russia in a real challenging fight without using Nukes or the help of Europe.

    Without Europe.. US become essentially just a regional power , like it is France or UK.. They do have a really big number of inventory in planes or tanks but they are either weak planes or tanks that will not stand a chance in fight with Russia if they were to fight both one vs one in Ukraine.. Russia will eclipse American forces in a frontal fight.. and this is why they don't deny
    they do not want a fair fight with Russia.. because they know they will be crushed if invade Ukraine and seeks to remove by force the Donetsk and Lugansk separatist. It will drag Russia
    in the fight and it will kick the ass of US military in a conventional fight.. Russia have Better artillery ,better electronic warfare and better missiles..and now better tanks.. and better tactics too.. and a thousand times better determination too.. US have the world biggest suicide rate on its military..the American soldiers have the lowest morale of all world armies ,because its armed forces know they fight for US EMpire and stealing other nations resources.. is not a war for defending civilians or children. or defending their nation.  US military is only a show military ,good for third world weak nations but not good to fight strong nations..

    take a look how they wanted to use nukes in Korean war after being massacre  
    by CHina army when they invade north korea to kick Americans and NATO allies from there..



    Chapter 48: MacArthur Panics
    The General abruptly changes from easy confidence to outrage. “We face an entirely new war,” he announces. Washington talks frantically—and does nothing. As X Corps on the east escapes, Eighth Army on the west withdraws 120 miles in the longest retreat in American history. President Truman is tricked by reporters into saying that the U.S. might use the atomic bomb. A world uproar follows, and British Prime Minister Clement Attlee flies to confer with Truman.

    Contrary to most belief ,US and NATO alliance have the numbers advantage in Korean war.
    they simply had inferior tactics. and the inferior armed army ,took advantage of NATO weakness.. of relying so much in air power for superiority. By fighting close distance of them.

    http://bevinalexander.com/books/korea-first-war-we-lost.htm

    US will never fight Russia with its conventional army.. in any territory.. it will be
    political suicide and a major defeat for them.. Instead their goal is to give Russia
    another Afgan war.. with Russia invading Ukraine and US fighting by proxy with someone else
    army ,and they providing the weapons.

    Maintaining this image of "superiority" is really important to keep its control over
    Europe.. this is also true for UK and other major powers.. This is why UK send their worse
    possible armored vehicles to Ukraine and not their best one.. it will be really embarrassing
    for them if Rebels shut down Eurofighters again and again and capture their pilots..

    if they for example were defeated today in a war with Russia.. the first thing you will
    see is the disband of the entire  nation...That will be the last straw for americans.. to discover
    they are not so superior as they were told.. their egos will receive a mortal hit ,that will destroy their support for such criminal government and their power image is what allow them
    to influence Europe and keep them under their control.. But if they lose Europe control..it will be impossible for their army to lead a war again anywhere in the planet.. Without Suffering major economic sanctions if Europe and Russia were allies.

    Americans projection of Power is the most important thing in the world ,and they know without Europe they will lose their world power status .and keeping Europe away of Russia their major Goal.. reason why the entire Coup against Yakunovych was made.. to isolate Russia from Europe.

    That said.. US will give NATO membership only to nations ,they know
    1)Russia will not invade.  (like Baltic States..) simply because Russia don't need it..
    2)That is strong and Russia will think twice before invading.. ie.. have nukes..

    The Whole Fascist American Government is run in a way to maintain an artificial image ,that they are Superior to Others , "exceptoinalism" and that cannot be touched and that can destroy
    anyone with the blink of an eye..   and they will continue running the country in that way..
    with a HEAVY Public Relations campaign of how "Exceptional" they are.. Riding with their tanks all europe..with their flags and by using all its capabilities to sabotage the development and economy of their major competition..that is RUssia.

    So this is why Violence and Wars "mysteriously" always happens in the nations that are
    important to Russia economic interest. You never see Alqaeda or ISIS attacking ISRAEL ,TUrkey or Saudi Arabia or Jordan.. all friendly to US interest..  but nations who had friendly relations
    to Russia or that will become very important for Russia economy.. attacked..

    So if you want to predict which countries will experience Violence or war.. just only look which countries are friendly to Russia economic Interest in Africa and middle east. But also Europe..
    SO greece will be in the line of fire if they sign the BRICS deal..and ally with Russia.. Macedonia
    is already attacked by US through their NGOs..and hired albanians muslin terrorist for stopping breaking the nation in parts and stopping Russia south pipeline to Europe.
    I'm in general agreement with nearly all this. I differ only on assesment of what America may do as regards positioning their bases. While in previous posts I have said about NATO bases in Ukraine, but this is really just for convenience, and in the last post I made on this subject suggested a bilateral treaty between America and Ukraine and so by-passing NATO. Sure it will be a redline for any non Ukranian military bases to appear in Ukraine and I don't really think that Ukraine will ever join NATO. But I do not doubt that America wants bases in Ukraine at some time in the future. In 1991 it was inconcievable that NATO would be on the borders of Russia and that NATO forces would be exercising in Poland, yet they did this even before Poland joined NATO as was shown by British 20th Armored Brigade in Poland in 1997 on exercise "Ulan Eagle". This provocation only three years after Wundsdorf closed and the last of WGF came home, and it shows now untrustworthy and rapacious Washington and it's sycophants are. They may say they do not want bases in Ukraine, we may think they will not dare put bases in Ukraine, but I say do not believe anything they say. In Vietnam it started with "advisors", and in Ukraine we now have "advisors" and I think about twelve USAF cargo flights into Lvov everyday and who knows what arrives by train and road. And what you say about these "mysterious" wars is 100%, and perhaps having to be always on the defensive against this should stop.
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    Post  whir Fri May 22, 2015 12:58 pm

    Khepesh wrote:In 1991 it was inconcievable that NATO would be on the borders of Russia
    Sorry but that simply is not true, it was crystal clear by the end of 1991 that the alliance was going to expand all the way to the Russian border without opposition from Moscow and the end goal has been from the start to put the European border at the Russian border.
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    Post  KoTeMoRe Fri May 22, 2015 1:00 pm

    You guys have to understand something however. It has less to do with NATO or the US, than with the reality of those countries that make those deals.
    Poland without the EU is just a cheap cash cow for Djörmanie. Most of the CE2 are litterally specks to the bigger picture. They have no real independence and the interdependent unit they want to achieve is problematic because of OLD (read pre-CCCP) feuds. So indeed they're the perfect candidates for "junior" partnerships.

    The same way the EU is having a go at the Balkans with NO-ONE even daring to look at Greece and its example on how a big Union will "transform" your country. No one  putting forward that the EU is the same as Russia when it comes to "Economic-Political" tools. FFS Visa free regimes, what are they, if not the exact same thing as "cheap gas"...

    This is something that has to be explained to y'all.

    When Putin said that the CCCP downfall was a tragedy, this is was true in more than one sense and to more than just the USSR republics.

    Those CE2 that now are nothing more than cheap pro's (including Albania, my home country) lost an alternative for development. Instead of having two sides of the coin, in the case of a soft landing of the USSR and a Sino-styled transformation, now we have monopoly notes and badly faked at that.

    The alternative now comes into the form of a conglomerate of sources from PetroUSD with wahabi shit aftertaste, to Chinese funds with big asterisks from Uncle Asshole.
    Look at fvcking Ecuador. They manage a freaking miracle with Chinese money, no one opens its mouth. Venezuela goes down because of open economical warfare, Every one loses its mind.

    So all in all, the whole NATO hurr, durr is easy to understand, like all thieves, those in power know their time is limited, so they consolidate their power as much as they can, selling everything. This is something that goes above the "popular" will, it's just big business. And even those who deal with Russia (see Orban for instance) do that out of pragmatism, not because Russia represents an "Alternative". That's all. Peace is a commodity.

    Russia should have a completely different approach here, it should concentrate on making itself a virgin again, becoming a ruthless business partner, they got the money, they got the brains, they can easily uplift the Balkans (FFS they already bought half of Cyprus) to a point when the comparative advantage of joining the EU will fade away. They could help the area renew itself and make a clear link, through Bulgaristan, between post-Communist swathes. The money spent on Crimea, would do nicely in many places in the Balkans. Don't be fooled by the idiotic shit peddled by the current lapdogs in power. The Balkans are dying, they're dying because there's nothing remaining, there's nothing new there. Tourism doesn't get you very far when all the areas are already up to the neck with accomodations and Turkey can destroy your prices in a matter of milliseconds. People need jobs, they need also a more common mentality, rather than the stuck up casual Austrian telling you that you're worthless, unless between 18-25 and willing to open your legs.

    There are spots ready for taking in South-Eastern Europe. It's too bad Russia is late to that game.


    BTW NATO was already on the border through Turkey...
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    Post  Flagship Victory Fri May 22, 2015 1:33 pm

    Maidan reports 3 Maidan soldiers KIA and 12 more WIA yesterday.
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    Post  whir Fri May 22, 2015 2:52 pm

    KoTeMoRe wrote:This is something that has to be explained to y'all.
    Not really, it can be explained just by stating that fact that EE politicians have to protect their loot from their own kind, those are more frightening than any army and you know it Twisted Evil.
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    Post  whir Fri May 22, 2015 3:17 pm

    La Libre wrote:L’ombre russe plane sur le Partenariat oriental
    The Russian plane shadow on the Eastern Partnership
    SÉBASTIEN GOBERT, CORRESPONDANT À KIEV, ET OLIVIER LE BUSSY Publié le mercredi 20 mai 2015 à 19h04 - Mis à jour le jeudi 21 mai 2015 à 07h10

    INTERNATIONAL
    At my first meeting with Arseniy Yatsenyuk, I suggested it would be good to report on the use of funds allocated by international donors. The response of the Prime Minister ... surprised me, 'Why should we account for our expenses? On the eastern front, Ukrainians die young for the security of Europe! That should be enough. "

    In a restaurant in the center of Kiev, Oleksandr Borovik can not hide his bitterness. The Ukrainian Diaspora, Harvard graduate, former Microsoft expert in new technologies, has hardly accustomed to the Ukrainian capital it needs to leave. "I was approached in January 2015 to become Vice Minister of Economy. I left everything and moved to Kiev." Oleksandr Borovik is assigned an office, a team of about twenty people, and launched various projects. "But after this meeting, Yatsenyuk never signed my letter of appointment." Continue reading.

    Юго-ВОСТОК информационно-аналитическое агентство wrote:Rotation of the Army Corps of HM LC

    Kyivpost wrote:Ukraine, Georgia could get visa-free travel in case of favorable 2015 European Commission report
    May 22, 2015, 3:41 p.m. | Ukraine — by Interfax-Ukraine

    RIGA - The European Union (EU) has expressed its willingness to grant visa-free travel to Ukraine and Georgia in the event that the European Commission (EC) issues a favorable report at the end of 2015 regarding these countries' meeting of the necessary criteria, according to a joint statement released at the Eastern Partnership summit in Riga on May 22. Continue reading.
    Neutrality
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    Post  Neutrality Fri May 22, 2015 3:32 pm

    "Ukraine, Georgia could get visa-free travel in case of favorable 2015 European Commission report". Exactly, COULD get it.

    Can anyone explain to me why visa free travel is such a matter between life and death for Ukraine? For the record, I understand what visa free travel does. I just want an explanation on why this part is so highly concentrated at. Does this chocolate clown understand that people will start massively running out of the country? Including the people he needs to fight his pathetic ATO. Or is this exactly his strategy here?

    On the other hand, this would boost the Ukrainian prostitution business by exporting cheap "human capital" to Europe. Please don't tell me that this is part of the plan Rolling Eyes
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    Post  PapaDragon Fri May 22, 2015 3:42 pm

    Neutrality wrote:"Ukraine, Georgia could get visa-free travel in case of favorable 2015 European Commission report". Exactly, COULD get it.

    Can anyone explain to me why visa free travel is such a matter between life and death for Ukraine? For the record, I understand what visa free travel does. I just want an explanation on why this part is so highly concentrated at. Does this chocolate clown understand that people will start massively running out of the country? Including the people he needs to fight his pathetic ATO. Or is this exactly his strategy here?

    On the other hand, this would boost the Ukrainian prostitution business by exporting cheap "human capital" to Europe. Please don't tell me that this is part of the plan Rolling Eyes

    Simple, they need to show brainless biomass something, anything that resembles success, otherwise they risk being hanged on the lampposts outside rada soon.

    (fun fact: in Serbian language word for "lamppost" is "bandera") lol1
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    Post  Khepesh Fri May 22, 2015 3:48 pm

    whir wrote:
    Khepesh wrote:In 1991 it was inconcievable that NATO would be on the borders of Russia
    Sorry but that simply is not true, it was crystal clear by the end of 1991 that the alliance was going to expand all the way to the Russian border without opposition from Moscow and the end goal has been from the start to put the European border at the Russian border.
    I do not disagree with your contention that the end goal is to contain Russian to it's borders, and I think that Washington seriously wants to eventually break up Russia. However, nobody thought in 1991 that Ukraine would be in severe danger of falling to America. Belarus is safe, Finland is not NATO member. That Baltic states are, is unfortunate, but not a serious problem while Belarus stands. Let the Balts be in NATO if they think it is for their own "protection" from Russia, but I think they know that if they let their countries be used to hold US strategic assets that could be a real threat, or to allow an invasion along the coast, then they will be eliminated very quickly when the war begins. It is still inconcievable that the main western border, Belarus and Ukraine, will fall to NATO, unless it is allowed...
    KoTeMoRe
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    Post  KoTeMoRe Fri May 22, 2015 3:55 pm

    Neutrality wrote:"Ukraine, Georgia could get visa-free travel in case of favorable 2015 European Commission report". Exactly, COULD get it.

    Can anyone explain to me why visa free travel is such a matter between life and death for Ukraine? For the record, I understand what visa free travel does. I just want an explanation on why this part is so highly concentrated at. Does this chocolate clown understand that people will start massively running out of the country? Including the people he needs to fight his pathetic ATO. Or is this exactly his strategy here?

    On the other hand, this would boost the Ukrainian prostitution business by exporting cheap "human capital" to Europe. Please don't tell me that this is part of the plan Rolling Eyes

    Big trouble is also only 3000 or so biometric passports have been given in Ukraine...BioPass is a fundamental step to secure Visa Free regime. At around 10 000 UAH per passport the cost is too much for Ukropia to produce it on its own.
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    Post  Khepesh Fri May 22, 2015 3:58 pm

    KoTeMoRe wrote:


    BTW NATO was already on the border through Turkey...
    Turkey has always been an enemy on the border, a border that has always shifted south....
    The important border is Belarus and Ukraine, and they must be prevented from falling to America at any cost, even war.
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    Post  sepheronx Fri May 22, 2015 5:52 pm

    whir wrote:

    Newsweek wrote:Raising a 'Russian Rebel Army' to Overthrow Putin
    BY NOLAN PETERSON 5/20/15 AT 6:10 PM

    Andrei Kuznetsov leans forward, clinches his angular jaw, narrows his sharp blue eyes and says: “I could tell you things that would shock Americans.”

    For emphasis, the 32-year-old Russian exile then raises his eyebrows and nods as he slowly leans back in his chair and takes a sip of beer. Patrons and servers at the downtown Kiev bar swirl around the table at which the St. Petersburg, Russia, native with wavy blond hair is sitting.

    “Much of Russia is being led like cattle,” Kuznetsov continues. He talks with a perpetual half-smile, using hand gestures and strategic pauses for effect like a politician making a stump speech.

    Try Newsweek: subscription offers

    “But we call ourselves ‘Different Russians.’” he goes on. “Russia needs a real, tough force that can be an opposition to the Putin regime. There are people who support an opposition movement in Russia, but there is no leader to unite them.”

    Kuznetsov, who has been living in Kiev for more than nine months, has set out to create what he calls a “Russian rebel army.” He hopes to sidestep the Kremlin’s seemingly invulnerable crackdown on domestic dissent by uniting Russian dissidents living in Ukraine and across Eastern Europe, ultimately paving the way for a legitimate opposition movement to return one day to overthrow Russian President Vladimir Putin. Continue reading.

    And this is why Russians hate their oppositions and the people who follow them.  These people do it to themselves.  They think that having some sort of minority army to try to overthrow a legitimate government, whom has over 80% support, will make them leaders.  No, instead, it will make people hate them even more.  Who do they think they are and how do they suppose they will succeed?  These are the same people who are wanting to destroy their own country for their own little gain.  I openly support assassinations on these people.  They need to die, cause they are trying to create such a problem for their own country and their own people, that they are willing to hide in a country that is openly hostile (to the point of murder) of these own people, to incite the idea of creating a similar situation of their former country.  It really is so bad, that they want to split their own country apart for what?  These people need to die and a harsh death too, to have a message to the rest that if you want to destroy your own country, your own country will destroy you first.

    You never supposed to wish death upon anyone. But if a single person thinks he/she is "Smart" and thinks that destroying your own country through undemocratic movements that will just cause death and destruction, only because you don't like a leader but cannot get in yourself because people hate you, means that you deserve nothing more than a 9mm in the fucking head.

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