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    The Situation in the Ukraine. #11

    sepheronx
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    Post  sepheronx Wed Mar 11, 2015 9:04 pm

    higurashihougi wrote:http://uatoday.tv/news/afp-us-envoy-denounces-reign-of-terror-in-crimea-east-ukraine-414442.html

    "Even as Ukraine is building a peaceful, democratic, independent nation across 93 percent of its territory, Crimea and parts of eastern Ukraine are suffering a reign of terror, lol1  lol1  lol1  lol1 " Assistant Secretary of State Victoria Nuland, told the Senate Foreign Relations Committee.

    "Today Crimea remains under illegal occupation and human rights abuses Laughing  Laughing  Laughing  Laughing  are the norm, not the exception, for many at risk groups there," she said.

    She said several groups - Crimean Tatars, Ukrainians who refuse to surrender their passports, gays and lesbians, journalists and others - are at risk of persecution.

    "In eastern Ukraine, Russia and its separatist puppets unleashed unspeakable violence and pillage,"  lol1  lol1  lol1  lol1 she said.

    "This manufactured conflict - controlled by the Kremlin; fueled by Russian tanks and heavy weapons; financed at Russian taxpayers' expense - has cost the lives of more than 6,000 Ukrainians, but also of hundreds of young Russians sent to fight and die there by the Kremlin, in a war their government denies." Laughing  Laughing  Laughing  Laughing

    What is funny about all of this is a couple of things. For starters, they (USA, westerners) blame Russian propaganda as the reason why Russians hate west. But it has way more to do with people like victoria nuland opening her trap and spewing lies. But the second part is that she can openly say BS and not a single person has thrown back at her asking for evidence. At least no one important, anywhere. Lastly, there has been various private done videos of Crimea and people enjoying themselves due to being annexed. They talk of fringe groups but not whole groups. Actually, I have not heard a peep on Crimea other than "life is normal".

    There is no one being heald for accountability for running their mouths. It is like me saying "Aliens run the show. I dont have evidence of such statement being true, but trust me, it is true!". In acedemia, intellectuals would be demanding evidence and calling people out on their statements, and in US, they only seem to care to do this when it is pointless debate about whether god is real or not, when both sidea ask for proof. But when it comes to something that really matters, which could lead to a world war where millions may die, no one asks any questions? No one demands proof? And if caught lying, no one heald accountable or be thrown out of office?

    It is high time people really start questioning their representatives before it is too late.
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    Post  Hisroyalhighness Wed Mar 11, 2015 11:58 pm

    "Start killing Russians"

    “I think to no effect, Lou,” Robert Scales answered. “It is Game, Set and Match in Ukraine. The only way the US can have any effect in this region and turn the tide is to start killing Russians. Killing so many Russians that even Putin’s media can’t hide the fact that Russians are returning to the Motherland in body bags. But given the amount of support we’ve given the Ukrainians, given the ability of the Ukrainians themselves to counterattack, to get seized [ by the] 12,000 Russians camped in their country – sadly, that is not likely to happen. “

    http://sputniknews.com/world/20150311/1019344795.html

    Oh look another trigger-happy two star fartbag eager to fight Ivan.
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    Post  Vann7 Thu Mar 12, 2015 12:03 am


    Reports of Foreign mercenaries in eastern Ukraine , provoking more fight.. what a surprise?
    for sure sent by Nuland's and her Neocons minions making sure there will be no
    peace.. and Russia get more sanctions..



    I never understand why the EU.. insist in the condition for lifting sanctions on Russia only
    if there is peace?.. .. without demanding US to stop fueling the conflict and remove its fighters. US can day and night continue using its Death Squads,to sabotage any peace process and later
    blame Russia for the violence.
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    Post  sepheronx Thu Mar 12, 2015 12:50 am

    http://russia-insider.com/en/2015/03/10/4289

    Fantastic article.
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    Post  sepheronx Thu Mar 12, 2015 12:53 am

    Hisroyalhighness wrote:"Start killing Russians"

    “I think to no effect, Lou,” Robert Scales answered. “It is Game, Set and Match in Ukraine. The only way the US can have any effect in this region and turn the tide is to start killing Russians. Killing so many Russians that even Putin’s media can’t hide the fact that Russians are returning to the Motherland in body bags. But given the amount of support we’ve given the Ukrainians, given the ability of the Ukrainians themselves to counterattack, to get seized [ by the] 12,000 Russians camped in their country – sadly, that is not likely to happen. “

    http://sputniknews.com/world/20150311/1019344795.html

    Oh look another trigger-happy two star fartbag eager to fight Ivan.

    I think it is high time Russia hits back and demands their evidence and start persecuting people who are being blatantly racist. Cant say a word about blacks or Jews, but against Russians? I demand an appology from this guy and to admit he is wrong or provide the evidence already.
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    Post  Werewolf Thu Mar 12, 2015 1:17 am

    Russia should sanction the west whenever the west proclaims to have evidence here and there and damages russias reputation with false accusations. Everytime the US opens their disgusting lying mouth, immidiatley sanction them for bullshit telling, Russia does not need US, but US needs Russia very much.
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    Post  Vann7 Thu Mar 12, 2015 1:29 am

    Japan former foreign minister... visit Crimea.. and say is ashamed of his one sided
    media distorting the facts of what happens in Ukraine.. and regret the big influence of US
    gov on his country played a major role in Japan joining the sanctions against Russia

    http://tass.ru/en/world/782135

    He also sugested of Japan possibility to be interested , in investments and modernization
    and advance technology transfer to Crimea.. once the sanctions are lifted.
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    Post  sepheronx Thu Mar 12, 2015 1:55 am

    http://www.fortruss.blogspot.co.uk/2015/03/moscow-us-embassy-cables-on-wikileaks.html?m=1
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    Post  Hisroyalhighness Thu Mar 12, 2015 2:52 am

    sepheronx wrote:
    I think it is high time Russia hits back and demands their evidence and start persecuting people who are being blatantly racist. Cant say a word about blacks or Jews, but against Russians? I demand an appology from this guy and to admit he is wrong or provide the evidence already.
    Going a little far with the whole persecuting angle, but yeah a pretty dumbass statement when hostilities have been generally decreasing.

    I hope Channel 1 keeps replaying this fool's statement over and over again.
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    Post  sepheronx Thu Mar 12, 2015 3:03 am

    Werewolf wrote:Russia should sanction the west whenever the west proclaims to have evidence here and there and damages russias reputation with false accusations. Everytime the US opens their disgusting lying mouth, immidiatley sanction them for bullshit telling, Russia does not need US, but US needs Russia very much.

    After reading the wikileaks article about US and 5th coloumnists, i would say doing what venezuela doing with telling US to keep minimul amount of people in embassy and start telling them they need documents to travel to other places in Russia.
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    Post  Werewolf Thu Mar 12, 2015 4:11 am

    sepheronx wrote:
    Werewolf wrote:Russia should sanction the west whenever the west proclaims to have evidence here and there and damages russias reputation with false accusations. Everytime the US opens their disgusting lying mouth, immidiatley sanction them for bullshit telling, Russia does not need US, but US needs Russia very much.

    After reading the wikileaks article about US and 5th coloumnists, i would say doing what venezuela doing with telling US to keep minimul amount of people in embassy and start telling them they need documents to travel to other places in Russia.

    I would just right out ban entire NGO's in russia, they already have the propaganda of Russia being dictatorship and no press freedom while alone in Moscow there are over 700 foreign NGO's and we know what their job is, so russia has full right and responsibility to keep its country clean of parasites like this.
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    Post  sepheronx Thu Mar 12, 2015 4:19 am

    Werewolf wrote:
    sepheronx wrote:
    Werewolf wrote:Russia should sanction the west whenever the west proclaims to have evidence here and there and damages russias reputation with false accusations. Everytime the US opens their disgusting lying mouth, immidiatley sanction them for bullshit telling, Russia does not need US, but US needs Russia very much.

    After reading the wikileaks article about US and 5th coloumnists, i would say doing what venezuela doing with telling US to keep minimul amount of people in embassy and start telling them they need documents to travel to other places in Russia.

    I would just right out ban entire NGO's in russia, they already have the propaganda of Russia being dictatorship and no press freedom while alone in Moscow there are over 700 foreign NGO's and we know what their job is, so russia has full right and responsibility to keep its country clean of parasites like this.

    I wonder why they dont? Start banning some to scare the others into complying, or ban them too. Limit US embassy to only a few personell and thats it. Why can other countries do it but Russia?
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    Post  magnumcromagnon Thu Mar 12, 2015 5:56 am

    Surprise! Right Sector has support from Lithuania...who would've seen that coming... Rolling Eyes

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    Post  magnumcromagnon Thu Mar 12, 2015 7:25 am

    Russia: "Crimea’s referendum held in accordance with constitutional law" – Japan’s former PM


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    Post  higurashihougi Thu Mar 12, 2015 9:15 am

    magnumcromagnon wrote:Russia: "Crimea’s referendum held in accordance with constitutional law" – Japan’s former PM



    http://tass.ru/en/world/782135

    Japan’s former Prime Minister told a press conference in Simferopol in Crimea that he is ashamed that Japanese media have one-sidedly covered the situation in Crimea

    Japan currently forms its foreign policy under the influence of the Western countries and the United States, Japan’s former Prime Minister who heads the Japan - Russia Friendship Society Yukio Hatoyama said on Wednesday. He arrived in Crimea on Tuesday on a three-day visit.

    "On the issue of Crimea the Japanese government also consolidates its position with the Western countries. That’s why it imposed sanctions on Russia. The fact that in the conditions of sanctions a Japanese delegation is visiting Crimea is taken by our Foreign Ministry as inadmissible behaviour," he said, answering reporters’ questions on Wednesday

    However, he said he was not afraid to return home. "If I was afraid to return to Japan I would never come here. I’m used to government criticism," he said.

    According to Hatoyama, to lift sanctions on Russia Japan should bring a certain position home to the U.S. administration. "I think we should make certain efforts to this end," he said.

    In addition, the former prime minister said, had Japan not joined the anti-Russian sanctions, it could help revive Crimea’s industrial potential. "If we imagine that there are no sanctions, cooperation is possible in the first place in the sphere of industry and the transfer of advanced technology. I’ve heard that the industry in Crimea was not developing during its stay within Ukraine, but the potential has been preserved. I think Japan’s experience and knowledge would be in demand there," he said.

    Hatoyama told a press conference in Simferopol on the Crimean peninsula that the referendum was held peacefully and democratically in accordance with the Constitution. His remarks, which can be taken as supporting Russia’s reunification with Crimea, may draw criticism, as Japan has said it does not recognise the outcome of the vote, Kyodo news agency reported.

    According to him, he was glad to personally see the "happy peaceful life" on the peninsula. "I am ashamed that our media have one-sidedly covered the situation in Crimea. We must have the courage to tell all the facts," Hatoyama added. He also said he was ready to contribute to the development of cultural and humanitarian ties between the new Russian region and Japan. "I want to believe that through the development of cultural and human ties it is possible to create conditions also for the solution of political problems," said the politician.

    The Japanese government had urged Hatoyama not to visit Crimea, saying that a trip by a former prime minister with a Russian visa could conflict with Tokyo’s stance that Moscow unilaterally annexed the territory against international law. In Tokyo, the government and the ruling Liberal Democratic Party condemned the visit by Hatoyama, who was prime minister from September 2009 to June 2010 when the opposition Democratic Party of Japan was in power.
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    Post  higurashihougi Thu Mar 12, 2015 9:46 am

    Being a Vietnamese... I don't like that demand.

    http://www.reuters.com/article/2015/03/11/us-usa-vietnam-russia-exclusive-idUSKBN0M71NA20150311

    Exclusive: U.S. asks Vietnam to stop helping Russian bomber flights
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    Post  Big_Gazza Thu Mar 12, 2015 10:17 am

    Hisroyalhighness wrote:"Start killing Russians"

    “I think to no effect, Lou,” Robert Scales answered. “It is Game, Set and Match in Ukraine. The only way the US can have any effect in this region and turn the tide is to start killing Russians. Killing so many Russians that even Putin’s media can’t hide the fact that Russians are returning to the Motherland in body bags. But given the amount of support we’ve given the Ukrainians, given the ability of the Ukrainians themselves to counterattack, to get seized [ by the] 12,000 Russians camped in their country – sadly, that is not likely to happen. “

    http://sputniknews.com/world/20150311/1019344795.html

    Oh look another trigger-happy two star fartbag eager to fight Ivan.


    ..and these NATO/USGov freaks complain that the crash-diving reputation of Uncle Shlomo is due to Russian propaganda? Feck me dead, can the absurdity of these congenital idiots get any worse???
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    Post  magnumcromagnon Thu Mar 12, 2015 11:56 am

    higurashihougi wrote:Being a Vietnamese... I don't like that demand.

    http://www.reuters.com/article/2015/03/11/us-usa-vietnam-russia-exclusive-idUSKBN0M71NA20150311

    Exclusive: U.S. asks Vietnam to stop helping Russian bomber flights

    Maybe if the US didn't blast 3 million Vietnamese with Napalm and Agent Orange then maybe their demands would have a shred of legitimacy. Russia's presence in South East Asia/South China Sea is the best possible answer to prevent a war (as a peaceful mediator) between Vietnam and China, something the Pentagon wants so of course they don't want a peaceful, rational mediator operating in South East Asia. All they want is to pit developing countries against each other, something they've been doing for the past 70 years.
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    Post  higurashihougi Thu Mar 12, 2015 12:13 pm

    magnumcromagnon wrote:
    higurashihougi wrote:Being a Vietnamese... I don't like that demand.

    http://www.reuters.com/article/2015/03/11/us-usa-vietnam-russia-exclusive-idUSKBN0M71NA20150311

    Exclusive: U.S. asks Vietnam to stop helping Russian bomber flights

    Maybe if the US didn't blast 3 million Vietnamese with Napalm and Agent Orange then maybe their demands would have a shred of legitimacy. Russia's presence in South East Asia/South China Sea is the best possible answer to prevent a war (as a peaceful mediator) between Vietnam and China, something the Pentagon wants so of course they don't want a peaceful, rational mediator operating in South East Asia. All they want is to pit developing countries against each other, something they've been doing for the past 70 years.

    The bad thing is that the White House and Pentagon is feeding a large number of 5th columnists, who constantly blabbering about an imaginary war between Vietnam and China and spreading lies about Russia.
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    Post  Vann7 Thu Mar 12, 2015 12:19 pm

    The baltic states , wants the banning of Russian media.. Very Happy
    They can't handle the freedom of information thing that is supposed to happen
    in a democracy.

    Imagine if this people where super powers they used to be in the past of europe ,
    and could impose their will on others and had their way.. it will be like Chinese dark ages.
    Were music and books were declared illegal propaganda and had to be burned..
    Make no mistake all this things do not happen by coincidence. American tax dollars , billions
    goes every year through NGOs for the entire region ,bordering Russia to try to create the most
    radical Rusophobic states possible , and 100% incompatible with Russia.

    I like the recent news/story that happened in one of those baltic countries ,that a Russian musical group was banned for participating in a traditional festival celebrated in the country ,that attract
    musicians from all europe.. and they all canceled the festival in the fascist state and moved it to Sochi. Smile

    another nice crosstalk..

    Discussing the breakup between US and Europe on Ukraine and media war.




    Last edited by Vann7 on Thu Mar 12, 2015 1:02 pm; edited 1 time in total
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    Post  GarryB Thu Mar 12, 2015 12:42 pm



    http://sputniknews.com/russia/20150311/1019354591.html
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    Post  GarryB Thu Mar 12, 2015 3:35 pm

    The baltic states , wants the banning of Russian media.. Very Happy

    That is fantastic news... it clearly shows Russian media is having an effect... Twisted Evil

    That is why I like to hear the west say nasty stuff about Russia... they didn't care about Russias progress to democracy in the 1990s because Russia largely became irrelevant to them then.

    Now Russia is finding its feet even with hurdles thrown in its way it is still improving.

    Sure they have lots of hurdles in front of them they have created themselves... some of them very big, but I hope they remember that the west was a hinderance rather than a help and when they find their feet they know who to kick in the ass when they come wanting to be friends again with no hard feelings.

    The west has treated a lot of countries like shit because they did not conform to the wests ideals or more accurately didn't bend over and let western companies pillage their mineral and natural wealth.

    As more countries follow Russias and indeed Chinas lead and look away from the west for trading partners and mutual support ie BRICSA etc and grow more powerful despite the west rather than because of it, they wont feel like they owe the west anything like Japan and Germany seem to.
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    Post  Vann7 Fri Mar 13, 2015 2:36 am

    When you see US media , former pentagon generals.. in popular media like FOX..
    calling for the killing of Russians.. as the way to solve the conflict..  It tells you
    that..

    1)The level of frustration in the american elite.. is very high..
    2)That they feel like losers.. and outsmarted by Russia.
    3)And it also shows you ,whats is going behind the scenes..
    is that they do not have any more hope.. no plan b or c ,to counter
    attack and pretty much feel defeated.

    When Victoria Nuland and other US politicians no longer smile.. and calls for killing
    Russians , calls putin with names.. or thug.. hitler ,dictator ,calls for sending lethal weapons to Ukraine , call merkel names like defeatist.. and you see France and Germany visiting Russia
    the same day Americans visit Ukraine.. and you see the Europeans now talking about the European army so that their interest are taking seriously ,and Russian opposition killed right at the doors of the kremlin ,make no mistake.. those are signals of a major split between US and Europe in Ukraine..  but also a major frustration of US with their strategy not working.

    And it suggest pretty much RUssia is winning and the Western Neocon Elite is in
    panic and without any more ideas what to do to isolate Russia from Europe.. but much
    worse feeling panic that the opposite of what they wanted happening.. that is closer relations
    between Europe and Russia. If the cease fire holds.. is pretty much game over for US plans
    to break Russia and get a new world war..and will have to face a new reality.. a much stronger than ever Russia ,with a rebelious Europe.

    IF they continue pushing for war in Ukraine.. ignoring Europe interest.US risk  pushing too much and losing the support of Europe like never before.. but also Risk that ukraine become split and Russia grab more land.with more independent regions spliting from kiev...and risk a NATO split. Cool . and if they do nothing ,that will allow easily Russia to become more closer to Europe ,because the cease of fire will hold and the free trade between Europe and Russia deal will start its negotiations..  and pretty much will be game over.. for US world hegemony.  So in short US exceptionalism is  doomed , the only question is how they want to be defeated.. maintaining good relations with europe and allowing a multi polar world ,no longer them being the only voice.? or isolating itself from the world? becoming the new soviet union? My bet is that the hardliners in the Senate and congress will want to risk all or nothing. But this will only provoke its total collapse and revolutions on its own land..   pirat  

    So it seems that Putin Strategy in Ukraine worked.. and ukraine pretty much is game over for the west. the only question i have is Syria.. Is the one the western neocons can do more damage to Russia interest.. but the tide is a bit on the side of Syria.. even though the possibility
    of a stale mate is very high.. with them losing about 1/3 of its territory in the short or medium term..  My best guess is the west will try to push Russia for war there ..against Turkey ,Saudi Arabia and Israel.. the only card i see there is IRAN.. to balance things. Because Russia is pretty much in disadvantage in the region to defend Syria . Why Russia limits to weapons to them.. but not using their army. is still the an issue Putin will need to resolve.. the same thing
    is true in Crimea and eastern Ukraine but the opposite way.. Is near Russia land..and Russia can easily farm NATO there as long as needed ,even decades without using much resources.. just
    voluntary mercenaries and cheap weapons.
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    Post  max steel Fri Mar 13, 2015 2:59 am

    higurashihougi wrote:Being a Vietnamese... I don't like that demand.

    http://www.reuters.com/article/2015/03/11/us-usa-vietnam-russia-exclusive-idUSKBN0M71NA20150311

    Exclusive: U.S. asks Vietnam to stop helping Russian bomber flights




    Vietnam Military Blasts US for Interfering With Russian Refueling Flights angry

    Viets gave their response . thumbsup respekt russia

    http://sputniknews.com/asia/20150312/1019411679.html
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    Post  mack8 Fri Mar 13, 2015 6:13 am

    If that is the case, respect to Vietnam. After all, they stood to defend their homeland and re-unite their country against colonialism and imperialism with such determination and bravery that few other nations can take pride with. There surely is a parallel between Novorussia's and Vietnam's struggles, perhaps that also resonates in Vietnam, plus the communist ideology (apparently endorsed in Novorussia) as well.

    We have to see how this enfolds though.

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