Russia Defence Forum

Would you like to react to this message? Create an account in a few clicks or log in to continue.

Military Forum for Russian and Global Defence Issues


    The Situation in the Ukraine. #8

    Regular
    Regular

    Posts : 2427
    Points : 2411
    Join date : 2013-03-10
    Location : Western Hemisphere.. mostly

    The Situation in the Ukraine. #8 - Page 11 Empty Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #8

    Post  Regular Sun Aug 31, 2014 4:24 pm

    Viktor wrote:Sadlly still no supplies but Im sure they will come in 100x magnitude if NATO or anyone else start providing loosing nazi pary and american puppets illegaly brought to power in Ukraine

    Russian T-72B3 in Ukraine - provocations continue
    So it means that Ukraine is using Sonsna-U, not PNK-6 as their sight:D
    Well we have to wait for Mr. Mindstorm to confirm it 100 percent. To me it looks identical to B3.

    I even doubt that Ukrainians have ability to modernise their tanks to this level. And look at the camo. 
    And video of Chechens posted by Georgian fella is old tho.
    Well that's why you don't supply seps with advanced weaponry. I only hope this tank will be retaken or... hit wit tochka u. Seps seem to have them now  Twisted Evil
    TheGeorgian
    TheGeorgian

    Posts : 232
    Points : 207
    Join date : 2014-06-22

    The Situation in the Ukraine. #8 - Page 11 Empty Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #8

    Post  TheGeorgian Sun Aug 31, 2014 4:58 pm

    Vann7 wrote:
    TheGeorgian wrote:An abandoned T-72BM with the white identification stripes in Ilovaisk, also seen in some footage taken by Chechen fighters. So Russia has started to deliver more advanced hardware to the sepratists and also more volunteers arriving from Russia...

    Dude how in hell you know that is ukraine? guess what ? You don't know.. that photo proof nothing..
    It will be very easy for Holywood to make a T-72 tank in plastic and show chechens rebels inside of it. LOL

    Ukrainian army uses T-72M, M1, MP, AM, AV, B, Bulats ( AG, AMG ) .... and E .... and BMT-72. They got a lot of their own neet upgrades  
    However, the T-72BM is a trademark Russian T-72 modification. That's how I know.

    In the video I've posted, you see them Chechen volunteers driving those tanks. It's a bit older footage, but seriously, what else you want to see ? Putin's portrait painted on it ?

    Rebels were receiving arms nonstop. Why is it surprising now, that they also receive top notch Russian military hardware ? only tanks I haven't seen yet are T-80s and T-90s.


    Last edited by TheGeorgian on Sun Aug 31, 2014 5:07 pm; edited 1 time in total
    Werewolf
    Werewolf

    Posts : 5289
    Points : 5490
    Join date : 2012-10-24

    The Situation in the Ukraine. #8 - Page 11 Empty Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #8

    Post  Werewolf Sun Aug 31, 2014 5:06 pm

    TheGeorgian wrote:
    Vann7 wrote:
    TheGeorgian wrote:An abandoned T-72BM with the white identification stripes in Ilovaisk, also seen in some footage taken by Chechen fighters. So Russia has started to deliver more advanced hardware to the sepratists and also more volunteers arriving from Russia...

    Dude how in hell you know that is ukraine? guess what ? You don't know.. that photo proof nothing..
    It will be very easy for Holywood to make a T-72 tank in plastic and show chechens rebels inside of it. LOL

    Ukrainian army uses T-72M, M1, MP, AM, AV, B, Bulats ( AG, AMG ) .... and E .... and BMT-72. They got a lot of their own neet upgrades  
    However, the T-72BM is a trademark Russian T-72 modification. That's how I know.

    In the video I've posted, you see them Chechen volunteers driving those tanks. It's a bit older footage, but seriously, what else you want to see ? Putin's portrait painted on it ?

    Rebels were receiving arms nonstop. Why is it surprising now, that they also receive top notch Russian military hardware ? only tanks I haven't seen so far are T-80s and T-90s.

    So far the only crap i have heared from TR1,You and Flyingdutchman that all the arms the rebels have comes from Russia without even giving a second to think that those weapons could come from the dozens of military bases in the regions and that entire military bases surrendered to rebels.
    This is not a clearified tank mod and after capturing the "ultimate proof" they only make such a low number of footage and pictures, usually ukropy army and the sparetime clowns of fascist brigades love to pose and make videos how great they are, not to much right now.

    Like by tank experts pointed out this is an unclear mod.
    Regular
    Regular

    Posts : 2427
    Points : 2411
    Join date : 2013-03-10
    Location : Western Hemisphere.. mostly

    The Situation in the Ukraine. #8 - Page 11 Empty Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #8

    Post  Regular Sun Aug 31, 2014 5:06 pm

    Question is how the hell it got captured? It doesn't seem to have external damage. A nade down the hatch would surely be my first priority before leaving this tank
    Werewolf
    Werewolf

    Posts : 5289
    Points : 5490
    Join date : 2012-10-24

    The Situation in the Ukraine. #8 - Page 11 Empty Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #8

    Post  Werewolf Sun Aug 31, 2014 5:09 pm

    That is the other point, no damage on it and why abonden something for no good reason. I mean you don't abondon something when it is still of use and far higher quality than what they usually get/capture. And sabotaging it would be common sense if you really somehow need to abondon it.
    All fishy the entire thing.
    Regular
    Regular

    Posts : 2427
    Points : 2411
    Join date : 2013-03-10
    Location : Western Hemisphere.. mostly

    The Situation in the Ukraine. #8 - Page 11 Empty Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #8

    Post  Regular Sun Aug 31, 2014 5:11 pm

    Werewolf wrote:

    Like by tank experts pointed out this is an unclear mod.
    For some reason I can't open ghurkan blog, but what's unclear about this tank?
    TheGeorgian
    TheGeorgian

    Posts : 232
    Points : 207
    Join date : 2014-06-22

    The Situation in the Ukraine. #8 - Page 11 Empty Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #8

    Post  TheGeorgian Sun Aug 31, 2014 5:12 pm

    Werewolf wrote:

    So far the only crap i have heared from TR1,You and Flyingdutchman that all the arms the rebels have comes from Russia without even giving a second to think that those weapons could come from the dozens of military bases in the regions and that entire military bases surrendered to rebels.
    This is not a clearified tank mod and after capturing the "ultimate proof" they only make such a low number of footage and pictures, usually ukropy army and the sparetime clowns of fascist brigades love to pose and make videos how great they are, not to much right now.

    Like by tank experts pointed out this is an unclear mod.

    Are you friggin kidding me ? don't make me laugh. This is a T-72BM. Nobody is saying separatists are receiving only arms from Russia, in fact I'm one of the people who suggest most supplies come from abandoned UA material.

    This tank is not Ukrainian military material. Period. If that "expert" wants to challenge me on Soviet and modern tank modifications, than sure, bring it on.

    Whatever "expert" is saying this is "unclear mod" should be fired from his position.


    Last edited by TheGeorgian on Sun Aug 31, 2014 5:14 pm; edited 2 times in total
    Werewolf
    Werewolf

    Posts : 5289
    Points : 5490
    Join date : 2012-10-24

    The Situation in the Ukraine. #8 - Page 11 Empty Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #8

    Post  Werewolf Sun Aug 31, 2014 5:12 pm

    Read the link from Viktor and the attached screenshot of a chat between gur khan and another guy.
    avatar
    gregoire

    Posts : 190
    Points : 200
    Join date : 2014-08-29
    Age : 51
    Location : somewherestan

    The Situation in the Ukraine. #8 - Page 11 Empty Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #8

    Post  gregoire Sun Aug 31, 2014 5:12 pm

    There is this trend going on to involve russia into the internal ukrainian war. If that were the case and for intents and purposes let's assume russia has been "invading" ukraine. Why do they invade one tank at the time, 10 soldiers here, a truck there? How can anybody even think that's realistic?
    Werewolf
    Werewolf

    Posts : 5289
    Points : 5490
    Join date : 2012-10-24

    The Situation in the Ukraine. #8 - Page 11 Empty Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #8

    Post  Werewolf Sun Aug 31, 2014 5:13 pm

    TheGeorgian wrote:
    Werewolf wrote:

    So far the only crap i have heared from TR1,You and Flyingdutchman that all the arms the rebels have comes from Russia without even giving a second to think that those weapons could come from the dozens of military bases in the regions and that entire military bases surrendered to rebels.
    This is not a clearified tank mod and after capturing the "ultimate proof" they only make such a low number of footage and pictures, usually ukropy army and the sparetime clowns of fascist brigades love to pose and make videos how great they are, not to much right now.

    Like by tank experts pointed out this is an unclear mod.

    Are you friggin kidding me ? don't make me laugh. This is a T-72BM. Nobody is saying separatists are receiving only arms from Russia, in fact I'm one of the people who suggest most supplies come from abandoned UA material.

    This tank is not Ukrainian military material. Period.

    Whatever "expert" is saying this is "unclear mod" should be fired from his position.

    You should first not call experts to be fired since you are completley failing to use right designation. There is no such thing as T-72BM.
    TheGeorgian
    TheGeorgian

    Posts : 232
    Points : 207
    Join date : 2014-06-22

    The Situation in the Ukraine. #8 - Page 11 Empty Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #8

    Post  TheGeorgian Sun Aug 31, 2014 5:17 pm

    Werewolf wrote:
    You should first not call experts to be fired since you are completley failing to use right designation. There is no such thing as T-72BM.

    sure .... keep your "experts" who say this is "unclear" mod. Rolling Eyes
    Werewolf
    Werewolf

    Posts : 5289
    Points : 5490
    Join date : 2012-10-24

    The Situation in the Ukraine. #8 - Page 11 Empty Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #8

    Post  Werewolf Sun Aug 31, 2014 5:17 pm

    gregoire wrote:There is this trend going on to involve russia into the internal ukrainian war. If that were the case and for intents and purposes let's assume russia has been "invading" ukraine. Why do they invade one tank at the time, 10 soldiers here, a truck there? How can anybody even think that's realistic?

    Like said pages before, if there is an intervention by Russia, you will see footages of entire brigades like in Georgia and before hand we would hear about Russians destroying the crap out of Ukrainian Air Defense System before they actually invade. There would be no doubt if they actually would get inside with the military, only idiots believe 10 Paratroopers on foot would invade Ukraine as a big scale russian invasion...or the footage of Russian invasion with Red cross controlled white unarmored,unarmed trucks with food,medicine,tents and other stuff.

    There will be no intervention in that manner not before winter starts anyway.

    sure .... keep your "experts" who say this is "unclear" mod. Rolling Eyes wrote:

    Read the pages before you fool.
    sepheronx
    sepheronx

    Posts : 7088
    Points : 7356
    Join date : 2009-08-06
    Age : 31
    Location : Canada

    The Situation in the Ukraine. #8 - Page 11 Empty Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #8

    Post  sepheronx Sun Aug 31, 2014 5:29 pm

    TheGeorgian wrote:
    Werewolf wrote:
    You should first not call experts to be fired since you are completley failing to use right designation. There is no such thing as T-72BM.

    sure .... keep your "experts" who say this is "unclear" mod. Rolling Eyes

    He is right.  There is no such thing as a T-72BM.  It was a test back in the early 2000's for a tank that would work in conjunction with T-90 being similar protected or more, with Kaktus ERA, but never came out.  How would separatists get a T-72BM that never made it in production? Wiki claims 300 were made but that is total BS, as there have not been a single one seen since it was first shown to public. I doubt they would keep a secret of T-72BM's around.
    TheGeorgian
    TheGeorgian

    Posts : 232
    Points : 207
    Join date : 2014-06-22

    The Situation in the Ukraine. #8 - Page 11 Empty Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #8

    Post  TheGeorgian Sun Aug 31, 2014 5:33 pm

    Werewolf wrote:
    Read the pages before you fool.

    Then B3. I've read it now you tool. Let's see if it's true or not. It's not like pro-Russian claims are any more valid and no dramatic denial proves, there's something on with that story. Russians neither denying nor confirming anything. So either way, separatists are getting all the stuff they need for a full out war.
    avatar
    fragmachine

    Posts : 121
    Points : 122
    Join date : 2014-05-28
    Location : Poland

    The Situation in the Ukraine. #8 - Page 11 Empty Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #8

    Post  fragmachine Sun Aug 31, 2014 5:35 pm

    Sorry for OT but anyone knows what happened to macedonian ? He was very active and since last months there is no trace of activity on the forum.

    As for actual invasion, you will see as in few days RAF will get Lvov. That's reality, actual invasions by modern armies are robust, consisting of Naval, Ground and Air units working as one body.

    What you see now is a civil war.
    Werewolf
    Werewolf

    Posts : 5289
    Points : 5490
    Join date : 2012-10-24

    The Situation in the Ukraine. #8 - Page 11 Empty Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #8

    Post  Werewolf Sun Aug 31, 2014 5:41 pm

    TheGeorgian wrote:
    Werewolf wrote:
    Read the pages before you fool.

    Then B3. I've read it now you tool. Let's see if it's true or not. It's not like pro-Russian claims are any more valid and no dramatic denial proves, there's something on with that story. Russians neither denying nor confirming anything. So either way, separatists are getting all the stuff they need for a full out war.

    For "actual war" the rebels have all necessary things since they captured the military base in lugansk and have captured hundreds of tanks/ifv/apc/artillery and grad and a few tanks if they are actually there where they claim them to be "undamaged and abondend" then they would not make much of a difference since what did they report 3 tanks? Well not much difference 3 tanks for the already existing T-64/72 they captured. When they get several dozens of them then you can claim russia is acting for more than the rebels ability to uphold.

    But the entire situation around this is far to wierd to call it glass clear, especially would be nice to know both sides if this suppossed B3 is actually in ukraine and why it is undamaged but at the same time abondoned, makes not much of sense.


    Sorry for OT but anyone knows what happened to macedonian ?

    Don't know but would like to know that, too.
    Flyingdutchman
    Flyingdutchman

    Posts : 535
    Points : 551
    Join date : 2013-07-30
    Location : The Netherlands

    The Situation in the Ukraine. #8 - Page 11 Empty Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #8

    Post  Flyingdutchman Sun Aug 31, 2014 5:45 pm

    Werewolf wrote:
    TheGeorgian wrote:
    Werewolf wrote:
    Read the pages before you fool.

    Then B3. I've read it now you tool. Let's see if it's true or not. It's not like pro-Russian claims are any more valid and no dramatic denial proves, there's something on with that story. Russians neither denying nor confirming anything. So either way, separatists are getting all the stuff they need for a full out war.

    For "actual war" the rebels have all necessary things since they captured the military base in lugansk and have captured hundreds of tanks/ifv/apc/artillery and grad and a few tanks if they are actually there where they claim them to be "undamaged and abondend" then they would not make much of a difference since what did they report 3 tanks? Well not much difference 3 tanks for the already existing T-64/72 they captured. When they get several dozens of them then you can claim russia is acting for more than the rebels ability to uphold.

    But the entire situation around this is far to wierd to call it glass clear, especially would be nice to know both sides if this suppossed B3 is actually in ukraine and why it is undamaged but at the same time abondoned, makes not much of sense.


    Sorry for OT but anyone knows what happened to macedonian ?

    Don't know but would like to know that, too.


    Are you still denying russian military support to the seperatists?
    sepheronx
    sepheronx

    Posts : 7088
    Points : 7356
    Join date : 2009-08-06
    Age : 31
    Location : Canada

    The Situation in the Ukraine. #8 - Page 11 Empty Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #8

    Post  sepheronx Sun Aug 31, 2014 5:46 pm

    If Russia would really want to support the rebels, they could have given them the T-80's that they acquired after capturing Crimea.  There was a trainload of them and they then stopped shipping them back to Ukraine, due to the conflict.

    Flyingdutchman wrote:
    Werewolf wrote:
    TheGeorgian wrote:
    Werewolf wrote:
    Read the pages before you fool.

    Then B3. I've read it now you tool. Let's see if it's true or not. It's not like pro-Russian claims are any more valid and no dramatic denial proves, there's something on with that story. Russians neither denying nor confirming anything. So either way, separatists are getting all the stuff they need for a full out war.

    For "actual war" the rebels have all necessary things since they captured the military base in lugansk and have captured hundreds of tanks/ifv/apc/artillery and grad and a few tanks if they are actually there where they claim them to be "undamaged and abondend" then they would not make much of a difference since what did they report 3 tanks? Well not much difference 3 tanks for the already existing T-64/72 they captured. When they get several dozens of them then you can claim russia is acting for more than the rebels ability to uphold.

    But the entire situation around this is far to wierd to call it glass clear, especially would be nice to know both sides if this suppossed B3 is actually in ukraine and why it is undamaged but at the same time abondoned, makes not much of sense.


    Sorry for OT but anyone knows what happened to macedonian ?

    Don't know but would like to know that, too.


    Are you still denying russian military support to the seperatists?

    Are you still denying people the right to self determination and defending themselves from aggressors?
    TheGeorgian
    TheGeorgian

    Posts : 232
    Points : 207
    Join date : 2014-06-22

    The Situation in the Ukraine. #8 - Page 11 Empty Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #8

    Post  TheGeorgian Sun Aug 31, 2014 5:49 pm

    Btw here's the footage of that corridor. Some 100 UA troops left their positions and left behind 5 tanks and a dozen BMPs for the separatists to be captured.

    sepheronx
    sepheronx

    Posts : 7088
    Points : 7356
    Join date : 2009-08-06
    Age : 31
    Location : Canada

    The Situation in the Ukraine. #8 - Page 11 Empty Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #8

    Post  sepheronx Sun Aug 31, 2014 5:50 pm

    The question I have is, why bother leaving the equipment behind intact?  For either side?  Are they that much in a hurry to run instead of rigging the equipment or quickly cause enough damage (destroying optics, etc) so it would be useless for the opposing force to use it?
    avatar
    Vann7

    Posts : 4884
    Points : 4986
    Join date : 2012-05-16

    The Situation in the Ukraine. #8 - Page 11 Empty Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #8

    Post  Vann7 Sun Aug 31, 2014 5:52 pm

    TheGeorgian wrote:
    Werewolf wrote:
    Read the pages before you fool.

    Then B3. I've read it now you tool. Let's see if it's true or not. It's not like pro-Russian claims are any more valid and no dramatic denial proves, there's something on with that story. Russians neither denying nor confirming anything. So either way, separatists are getting all the stuff they need for a full out war.

    Even if is a Russian tank.. and not a toy ,or photoshop.. there is nothing that indicates is a photo in Ukraine.. it could be Belarus or Any place in RUssia.. How do you know the place is Ukraine?  The part that made it very doubtful
    was the stupid chechen.. Russia will never give an expensive tank to a mercenary chechen even if they said he was going to help. If Russia was going to supply a T-72BM tank to Ukraine they will have given it to a Veteran soldier of the Russian armed forces. That chechen doesn't look like have the IQ to drive a tank. Very Happy

    And if that wasn't enough is claimed it was "abandoned".  You don't abandon tanks in perfect conditions ,doesn't look like was disabled . If the tank was out of fuel ,they could have easily pulled it from another tank. I don't think Russia will give an expensive tank to a chechen and later leave it abandoned in Ukraine.

    it could be real.. but so far looks like staged.. ie.. a fake.


    Last edited by Vann7 on Sun Aug 31, 2014 5:57 pm; edited 1 time in total
    sepheronx
    sepheronx

    Posts : 7088
    Points : 7356
    Join date : 2009-08-06
    Age : 31
    Location : Canada

    The Situation in the Ukraine. #8 - Page 11 Empty Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #8

    Post  sepheronx Sun Aug 31, 2014 5:56 pm

    Vann7 wrote:
    TheGeorgian wrote:
    Werewolf wrote:
    Read the pages before you fool.

    Then B3. I've read it now you tool. Let's see if it's true or not. It's not like pro-Russian claims are any more valid and no dramatic denial proves, there's something on with that story. Russians neither denying nor confirming anything. So either way, separatists are getting all the stuff they need for a full out war.

    Even if is a Russian tank.. and not a toy ,or photoshop.. there is nothing that indicates is a photo in Ukraine.. it could be Belarus or Any place in RUssia.. How do you know the place is Ukraine?  The part that made it very doubtful
    was the stupid chechen.. Russia will never give an expensive tank to a mercenary chechen even if they said he was going to help. If Russia was going to supply a T-72BM tank to Ukraine they will have given it to a Veteran soldier of the Russian armed forces. That chechen doesn't look like have the IQ to drive a tank. Very Happy

    There is no such thing as a T-72BM really. It is called the Rogatka which never made it into production.

    That said, why I doubt it is a T-72B2/B3 is that Russia barely has enough modern tanks in its armed forces as it is, most of them are T-72B's that are pretty outdated and would require B3 upgrade in order to be useful. Why send a new(ish) tank to rebels in Ukraine? It would make more sense to give them the equipment they are fazing out, like T-80's which they acquired a lot from Ukraine after taking Crimea or T-64's they acquired or T-62's they have sitting away in storage.

    There are plenty of options that make far more sense to me to send over to rebels than T-72B3's, simply because, they are new and still not enough for regular armed forces of Russia. As useful as they are to have FLIR and what not, why give such advanced equipment away? If true at least.
    Werewolf
    Werewolf

    Posts : 5289
    Points : 5490
    Join date : 2012-10-24

    The Situation in the Ukraine. #8 - Page 11 Empty Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #8

    Post  Werewolf Sun Aug 31, 2014 5:57 pm

    Flyingdutchman wrote:
    Are you still denying russian military support to the seperatists?

    Please quote me specifically where i've denied any russian support/supplies to rebels?

    I've said dozens of times that they are getting support and supplies but which so far was just some small arms, rpgs, mgs and some insignificant number of trucks that have zero military purpose and the 3 crimean T-64 with an ugly amateurish ERA job that would be a hint that they were actually ukrainian tanks since most of their equipment is still the left overs of USSR without any basic maintenance over the last 23 years.

    But sure keep hearing what you want to hear, no nazis or fascists in ukriane, russia is the evil one, dutch special forces could be able to withstand Rebels and Ukropy army with bare hands against tanks... what ever lets you sleep well at night.
    avatar
    Vann7

    Posts : 4884
    Points : 4986
    Join date : 2012-05-16

    The Situation in the Ukraine. #8 - Page 11 Empty Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #8

    Post  Vann7 Sun Aug 31, 2014 6:09 pm

    Ukrainian army captured tanks.. oddly enough they paint their tanks in white?



    The photo of the T-72bm or watherver.. is more mysterious by the time. The chechen scene make it
    like a kiev propaganda.. They have been for months selling a story that the Rebels are all chechens from Russia. roll:
    So having a chechen with a T-72bm is too good to be true..perfect for kiev  propaganda..
    and for the record i do think Russia helps the Rebels.. But the tank photo and video looks fake.
    Werewolf
    Werewolf

    Posts : 5289
    Points : 5490
    Join date : 2012-10-24

    The Situation in the Ukraine. #8 - Page 11 Empty Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #8

    Post  Werewolf Sun Aug 31, 2014 6:12 pm

    Please call it T-72 and not T-72BM, i get itchy hands when people use some designation for things that don't exist.

    Sponsored content

    The Situation in the Ukraine. #8 - Page 11 Empty Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #8

    Post  Sponsored content


      Current date/time is Fri Jun 18, 2021 5:55 pm