Possible war between USA and Russia or China

Werewolf wrote:

Mike E wrote:

Asf wrote:

Them can't jail the whole country anyway, and war is a great way to get citizens riled up for good or for bad.

All jokes aside, it's possible during martial law. Look at nazi germany. So you have to start a war and obtain martial rights in order to mobilize people, take extraordinary power, suppress any opposition, ect.

American are mostly ignorant and patriotic (no offence!). It's not that hard to tell about red bear is alive, begin a propaganda campaign, starting with somekind of a false flag operation, say, russians attack another civilian plane full of cute kittens. Jingoistic early-war patriotism wave will wash many brains, you will see crowds screaming 'Let's show those communist bastarts the taste of an apple pie! Don't tread on us!'. And after that - first casulities, hatred and vengeance will start to burn bright, goverment will start witchhunt and many will be sure they do a right thing sppressing off the dissension. Day by day the hysteria will grow until the goverment will take full control over society, and then it will be too late. Even if someone will choose to fight own goverment, they will be displayed as radicals, terrorists and treacherous bastartds, who should be stomped outright. And granpa's shotguns, civilian berettas and yugoslavian AKs aren't arguments against artillery and strike UAVs. Don't think the goverment would be stupid enough to loose control over national guard or regular army units - USA isn't Ukraine, after all

Martial law? The US population would never let that happen, never-mind war with a country like Russia...

Most Americans are, but a large minority aren't... Despite their idiocy at times, the Right along with far-left and far-top (like myself) would be very opposed to such action. It seems plausible in theory, but "We the People" have had enough of this crap.... Many of see through the propaganda, the false-flags etc. The US would have a heck of a hard time controlling us, especially when we are armed... Our armed forces would never (many*) engage against citizens anyway.

Major BS, there is already Martial law in the US trained and forced upon several towns, police already gets militarized, after Boston Bombing False Flag they have been searching houses with APC colons without any warrant to search your house. The US is already beyond 1984, any day they can do what they want and there will be no bloody revolution to bring down this empire from within, US citizens are already zombified, as long they have junk food and TV they will not move a finger.

There is, and it is constantly rebelled against by citizens... There is a difference between the "Martial law" you are thinking about and the "Martial law" that Asf and I are thinking about.

Martial law? The US population would never let that happen, never-mind war with a country like Russia...

Ok,Russia invade Ukraine and take down a plane full of cute kittens. Politicians tell you your allies in Germany and Polland won't make it against the Red Bear, USA need to save the free world again, just like your grandparents did in Normandy. Reservists are called up, first destroyers and submarines are damaged during growing naval skirmishes, dozens of american sailors killed or injured, several MAGTFs together with japanese are ready to launch a surprise attack on Sakhalin and Vladivostok, you see a lot of fat, scared 40-years old national guardsmen walking around in your town. Politicians argue about the need of conscription. It's a russian commies, after all, f*cking hordes of them. France seems to be on their side ("traitors! after all we did for them during WWII!"), Italy is silent, and Germany have already pissed it's pants having no army to speak of. China seems to be quiet, but it's naval forces are gathering around Korea and Japan for no reason. So, as they tell you, it's time to show all the national spirit - working day will be longered, taxes will grow up, less fancy stuff in stores (after all we shouldn't trust chinese commies who are in league with russkies bastards) - but it's ok, after the war (which of course will be short and victorious!) americans will again change their cars every year, ect. Many people believe in it, you know your neighbours are speaking about 'sleeping KGB agents' who will try to sabotage America's unevitable victory from within (as they heard on patriotic meetings). Police have already took away one unfriendly guy living alone down the street - nobody seems to know there he is, somebody say he moved to Georgia or joined Navy. The Congress have given the president right to use National Guard in case of public disorders, "because of illegal migrants and mexican drug dealers". In his speech the president tells about hard times which will harden the USA, about justice which should be swift during this times of unrest and about new age of prosperity which will happen after all revisionists will be pounded into dust.

What would you do? Will you agree that the USA is challenged by some reds and go to the recruit center like a true patriot? Or will you fight the 'necessery evil' tales you are force fed like all other americans? How? Your internet traffic could already be monitored by NSA, as there was no revolution then you understood the net is under NSA's umbrella

Mike E wrote:

Asf wrote:

Any war with Russia, and you can expect a revolution here in the US.

That's what FEMA camps are for 

That's a completely loony joke of a conspiracy theory... I'm a "conspiracy theorist" myself, but FEMA camps went over the line... There really hasn't been much (if any) real evidence supporting the theory, for crying out loud they used cheap plastic coffin (holder things) as proof! 

Them can't jail the whole country anyway, and war is a great way to get citizens riled up for good or for bad.

Oh Boy.. the Fema camps is NOT conspiracy .. Is a fact.  They are concentration camps for american citizens . The US government expect major Riots and Unrest like never in history if for example a major conflict start with Russia or IRAN.. even if it is temporarily .. lets say a US Aircraft carrier is sinked.. that will create millions of angry americans turning to the streets demanding the President and the Army Generals to resign.. Many heads will roll.. and the only way to save The US Government in such scenario.. that millions protest in every city.. is arresting millions and sending
them to the Camps ,just to allow the government to continue.  The Coffins were ordered because they expect many people to die.. as consequences of the violence..  Is not conspiracy dude.. The White House is expecting their actions against Russia and or CHINA or IRAN/Syria sooner or later will backfire and they are preparing fro it..

The Fema camp are civilian prisons , concentration camps to control population.. they were created in Nazi Germany too to counter the opposition to the Government for their criminal wars in europe.. For what are the Fema concentration camps? To guarantee that even in the worse case scenario ,that the government of United States  will not be overthrow.. but what do i know? lets listen what Bill Clinton says then about the fema camps when asked..



CLinton did not deny the Rumor ,he confirms it.. He clearly says people and the government needs to go together, not separate ways.. (no revolution). So the concentration camps is nothing more than the last line of defense of the government , to hold and maintain its power , in case a major revolution happens. No such a thing like freedom exist in america.. you are only free as long as you do not interfere in the government world agendas.. of destroying everyone who is not aligned with them.

The US government is so Obsessed in creating a world empire ,and following hostile policy against Russia and other
emerging nations ,that they for sure have been preparing to arrest probably as much as 10% to 20% of its entire population ,that is 1 member of each family.  

Why did you think the US spy on all americans their phone numbers and internet?  To be 3 step ahead of any potential Revolution in USA.. that could overthrow them.. Actually Ukraine is also making their own version of Fema Camps too.. they were expecting major unrest because of their illegal war against civilians.. Whenever any government have plans to do things that its population will not support and majority will reject it ,and they expect a lot of resistance ,then they create concentration camps..   The US Gov wants war with Syria with IRAN and will continue supporting terrorist in the middle east.. all those things are highly unpopular on Americans.. So the Fema Camps have the role as Clinton say.. to allow them to continue operating with civilians collaboration as he call it and not without them.. As Clinton told.. they cannot allow Americans to go their own way ( a revolution) without the government . so thats the role of Fema Camps.. at the moment hundreds of them exist in all USA.. every state have at least one Fema concentration camp for a major unrest they expecting.  Things that can cause Unrest?

1) War
2) hundreds americans killed because of the US government illegal actions..
3) A coup by a president against his own nation.. a take over of all democratic institutions and turn US into a dictatorship.. etc..  Obama is not far from that.
4)A failed False Flag event ,where americans killed and evidence shows it was all setup by the government.
5)a lethal virus , that require the army to totally seal a City.. etc. ( This is the only one case where is justified concentration camps only if is proven beyond doubt is not Government fault.)  

And USA is already at war with Russia.. is called the Arabspring.. Basically they hire mercenaries to overthrow
any government that is friendly to Russia.. Libya was friendly to Russia check... Syria..check.. Iraq..check... Argelia revolution was in 2010.. check.. the only exception is egypt that was overthrow their president for not being totally loyal..to the west.. The jewish elite wants monkeys to rule in any country in the world..that they control.. that when they say jump..they jump.. Notice how ISIS and Alqaeda do not attack the nations in the middle east where they have their military bases..and naval bases.. terrorist never byte the hands the feeds them.

And about fema camps.I will not be surprised actually if Russia had their own concentration camps too.. If for example Russia is attacked by a nuke ,they will have to totally destroy the aggressor military infrastructure at least  and many Russian people peace activist financed/brainwashed by US NGOS..will oppose any war of Russia against anyone.. not even for the defense of their nation after being attacked.  The major difference however is that US is preparing against the strong negative reaction of civilians against their illegal and criminal actions they planning to do against other nations without being provoked.. ie.. like bombing IRAN nuclear facilities or Assad or exporting terrorist to Russia... while Russia is preparing for legitimate self defense of their nation if attacked first.

I am courios about knowing the opportunities of Russia to invande North America from Bering Strait. I have seen that Russia got many military bases near the Bering Strait in Russia and want to discuss differents aspects and facts of a such invasion.

Russia must have Canada allied to success a such invasion, right? Becouse Russian troops need to be supported with supplies if they should make it to US. First, Russia must stabilze Canada to compete US, right? Have US much military forces in Alaska, becouse Russia can surely beat Alaska, and how is the opportunities to stabilze military zones in Canada for a Russian invasion of US? I mean, food shoulden't be any problem, but supplies to the military eqiupment should also be to be foreseen? Have Russia a strong navy enough to beat US's many carriars and submarines, it kind seems funny to seet in all Russian corvetttes to fight US navy? Can Russia stabilze antiaircraft near the Bering Strait and avoid that US take the control of the airspace and sea and win the war? If Russia can stabilze antiaircraft and control the sea at Bering Strait, it shoulden't be any problem to stabilze military bases at North America and beat US, right? Canada and Alaska, Russia beat easily, and how strong is the home US army actually? I mean they got like less then a third then Russian tanks, and many vechiles, and much more aircraft's and helicopters than Russia, Russia must take substantially all their army to beat North America? And that seems pretty illogial for Russian security.

Any other facts and opinions about a such invasion? How strong is US army amongs Russian army actually?

/Henrik

. There is nothing in US which Russia wants to invade except dismantling its nuclear silos . But US neocons wants the reverse .

Already been done....they'll sneak up in container ships

henriksoder wrote:I am courios about knowing the opportunities of Russia to invande North America from Bering Strait. I have seen that Russia got many military bases near the Bering Strait in Russia and want to discuss differents aspects and facts of a such invasion.

Russia must have Canada allied to success a such invasion, right? Becouse Russian troops need to be supported with supplies if they should make it to US. First, Russia must stabilze Canada to compete US, right? Have US much military forces in Alaska, becouse Russia can surely beat Alaska, and how is the opportunities to stabilze military zones in Canada for a Russian invasion of US? I mean, food shoulden't be any problem, but supplies to the military eqiupment should also be to be foreseen? Have Russia a strong navy enough to beat US's many carriars and submarines, it kind seems funny to seet in all Russian corvetttes to fight US navy? Can Russia stabilze antiaircraft near the Bering Strait and avoid that US take the control of the airspace and sea and win the war? If Russia can stabilze antiaircraft and control the sea at Bering Strait, it shoulden't be any problem to stabilze military bases at North America and beat US, right? Canada and Alaska, Russia beat easily, and how strong is the home US army actually? I mean they got like less then a third then Russian tanks, and many vechiles, and much more aircraft's and helicopters than Russia, Russia must take substantially all their army to beat North America? And that seems pretty illogial for Russian security.

Any other facts and opinions about a such invasion? How strong is US army amongs Russian army actually?

/Henrik

Are you serious?

Let us pretend he's serious.

Conducting such an invasion would require establishing a supply route for 2-2.5 mln soldiers and to do so, Russia would have ro first defeat the US Navy altogether and that would be extremely hard. Look at how hard it was for us Germans to supply our forces in USSR during WW2, multiply the difficulty factor by 5 - and you'll know what kind of problems a Russian invasion force in USA would face. Invasions of big countries work well in movies but not so much in the real world.

During the Cold War USSR NEVER planned to invade US mainland. The entire Soviet war planning was geared towards defeating NATO forces in Europe and Soviet Navy in particular was tailor made for disrupting US supply routes to Western Europe - hence they concentrated so much on submarine warfare but not on aircraft carriers.

Keeping this invasion part apart . Why you think its difficult for Russia to completely destroy US navy ?

max steel wrote:Keeping this invasion part apart . Why you think its difficult for Russia to completely destroy US navy ?

Many times smaller in size would be the main reason. If they can not destroy it by surprise with Shkval torpedoes to destroy entire fleets with one strike it will shift from offensive to defensive very quickly that will result in losing entirely the logistical and supply chain which will leave the present soldiers on US soil cut off and they will be wiped out. Unlike most countries the US has an unique geographic position which not only makes it almost impossible to get their, but it also is completley unnecessary, since they do not have any resources of value enough to wage a totaliratrian war for several decades, or a very short and nuclear hot one.

How do you destroy world's largest navy using pretty much submarines alone? Do you know how goddamn downsized Russian Navy got since 1991?

As Werewolf already pointed out, invasion of mainland US is utterly pointless. Costs would outweight benefits several times. Such an operation could only be conducted by Mexico if it became strong enough and built a large army.

RUSSIAN NAVY WITH CHINESE NAVY CAN ISN'T IT ? CHINA HAS Larger navy than usa ( no aircraft carriers thought but it can be taken care off with missiles ) .

max steel wrote:RUSSIAN NAVY WITH CHINESE NAVY CAN ISN'T IT ? CHINA HAS Larger navy than usa ( no aircraft carriers thought but it can be taken care off with missiles ) .

For what purpose? There is no point seazing soil that holds no valuable resources which Asian continent already has in far bigger amounts than one can even imagine. There is a reason why constantly the "civilized west" attacked russia not the otherway around. Parasites always tend to go where Resources are.

Its a hypothetical thread . We can ask such hypothetical stuff . So can Russia and China navy can take care of usnavy in pacific .

Walther von Oldenburg wrote:How do you destroy world's largest navy using pretty much submarines alone? Do you know how goddamn downsized Russian Navy got since 1991?

As Werewolf already pointed out, invasion of mainland US is utterly pointless. Costs would outweight benefits several times. Such an operation could only be conducted by Mexico if it became strong enough and built a large army.

200-300 tactical nukes could annihilate any conventional military in the world, US not excluded.

Theoratically speaking yes, but only when you are optimistic for one side and pessimistic for the other, in reality that will end up with all 3 countries and their fleets all sunk, no left navy nor logistics to maintain a supply chain to conquer the US mainland. It is not realistic at all.

Werewolf wrote:Theoratically speaking yes, but only when you are optimistic for one side and pessimistic for the other, in reality that will end up with all 3 countries and their fleets all sunk, no left navy nor logistics to maintain a supply chain to conquer the US mainland. It is not realistic at all.

Even if only tactical nukes were involved, and nothing bigger, I agree everyone would probably lose. Ironically the side that's nuclear saber rattling the most is the NATO side, with talks about using tactical nuke bunker busters against Iran, and continuing placing the Euro Meatshield bases in Eastern Europe while supposedly against Iran a country that they successfully brokered a deal on nuclear enrichment, which means the Meatshield is really targeting Russia because they plan on continuing the program.

On that same note, here's why Raytheon is the most OVERRATED aerospace defense conglomerate in the world:

The Pentagon’s $10-billion bet gone bad

$10 bln down the drain? US spends billions on 'ineffective' missile defense systems

Now I reverse my question . Can US invade RF and PRC ?

Someone stated that Russia fulfill Boeing's demand of Titanium by supplying them 80 % . If Russia retaliates ( don't know when they'll get rid of their passive diplomacy ) , how one of the largest MIC company will even work ?

max steel wrote:Now I reverse my question . Can US invade RF and PRC ?

Non of those countries can defeat the other country on their own soil. The strongest in defensive would be Russia, due its vast spending on the last decades for exactly the case of defeating NATO armies on their own soil, logistcally not the strongest but neither are China nor US in the position of attacking force against russia. The entire NATO has no logistics to deploy any serious armies on russian front. The only thread in NATO is obviously the US, UK, France,Turkey,Poland and that it is actually, but even among those armies only UK posses logistical capacities to even deploy anything of the size of divsion rapidly enough on eastern front. The rest of NATO logistaclly speaking for an offensive, has no capacities in logistics. For example, Germany, Poland, Czech, Holland, France and Australia need Antonov 124 from russian companies like Dnepr, they constantly lease them to bring Leopard2 and Tiger helicopters along with Pzh2000 over Russian military bases in Kazakhstan and Azerbaijan to deploy them in Afghanistan. The entire NATO supply chain for European theatre goes 100% only through germany, meaning it is a the main threat and interest, tactical nuking of NATO logistical bases in germany would stop the invasion on its start, leaving eastern european NATO countries like Poland locked from supply and they would be fought untill the last pole and czech soldier when it comes to US.

In case of Russian invasion of US we already cleared it, the US is the weakest among those three countries of its defensive, inland, capabilities, but it has one very strong and outweighting point, its strategic geopolitical position, military speaking a fortress at least for the navies on this globe.

China is well enough protected from invasion over Siberia, the deployment for Russia would take far to long to even form a significant front against China. PRC is very strong when it comes to inland logistics, manpower and the kings of every battlefield (artillery). They pretty much can sustain decade long war, regardless if their navy gets destroyed, Chinas military power is very well suited to defeat even Superpowers on its own soil.

They are pretty much immune to each other for an invasion from each other, that would lead only to destroyed armies of invaders, destroyed navies of every involved country, destroyed Europe due its NATO aggreement and logistical and strategical Meatshield for US with millions deaths and i speak only about conventional warfare with limited theatre deployed nukes, evading strategic deployment of nukes.

No one wins and everyone losses without a single gain.

I asked a) can us invade russia ? b) can usa invade china ?

max steel wrote:Someone stated that Russia fulfill Boeing's demand of Titanium by supplying them 80 % . If Russia retaliates ( don't know when they'll get rid of their passive diplomacy ) , how one of the largest MIC company will even work ?

They will be bound to buy their Russian titanium indirect via european or asian countries, leaving them with higher costs while those european and asian countries make profit with russian titanium which they sell to US.

max steel wrote:I asked a) can us invade russia ? b) can usa invade china ?

I thought i answered that. No, the US even with entire NATO, they can not invade Russia nor does the US and NATO have the logistical or military capability to even get to Russian or Chinese soil without getting wiped out at their logistical routes.


EDIT:

Made an embarrassing mistake here.

copters along with Pzh2000 over Russian military bases in Kazakhstan and Azerbaijan to deploy them in Afghanistan.

Not over Azerbaijan but over Uzbekistan.

You mentioned Poland . Are you serious ? Even my country can level the whole poland .

max steel wrote:You mentioned Poland . Are you serious ? Even my country can level the whole poland .

South Pole has strategic weapons?

I guess Santa Claus won't be happy to hear about that. You should fear some sanctions on X-mas.