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    Russian population

    Mir
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    Post  Mir Sun Jul 04, 2021 8:38 pm

    Karl Haushofer wrote:I would like to add that the Russian women in those small groups born in the 1990s and early 2000s should have 2-3 children in average to compensate the demographic collapse in the 1990s to keep the Russian population from declining.  This is not going to happen unless something drastically changes in Russia. Currently the fertility rate in Russia is around 1,5.

    Funny these guys seem to think Russia's population is increasing each year?
    Can you post a direct link from Rosstat to confirm your claim(s)?

    https://www.worldometers.info/world-population/russia-population/

    Russian population - Page 35 Rupop-10

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    Mir
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    Post  Mir Sun Jul 04, 2021 8:41 pm

    Russia's current population from the same source:

    Russian population - Page 35 Ru-pop10
    franco
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    Post  franco Sun Jul 04, 2021 9:28 pm

    Or compare to Canada with just over half the land area and similar geographical aspects:


    The current population of Canada is 38,073,968 as of Sunday, July 4, 2021, based on Worldometer elaboration of the latest United Nations data.

    Canada 2020 population is estimated at 37,742,154 people at mid year according to UN data.

    Canada population is equivalent to 0.48% of the total world population.

    Canada ranks number 39 in the list of countries (and dependencies) by population.

    The population density in Canada is 4 per Km2 (11 people per mi2).

    The total land area is 9,093,510 Km2 (3,511,022 sq. miles)

    81.3 % of the population is urban (30,670,064 people in 2020)

    The median age in Canada is 41.1 years.

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    flamming_python
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    Post  flamming_python Sun Jul 04, 2021 10:44 pm

    Karl Haushofer wrote:
    flamming_python wrote:

    Invite several million Europeans, Americans to live in Russia, if necessary declare for them their own national districts within Siberian regions

    I don't see that many westerners moving to Russia until Russia can offer at least similar or better salaries than the Western countries.

    The only source that Russia realistically can get more population from is the FSU countries. And frankly I don't want to see Russia get any more Uzbeks or Tajiks or Azeris that it currently has.

    The only lasting solution for Russia's demographic challenges is to somehow get ethnic Russian women to have more babies. Right now there are very small number of women in childbearing age in Russia due to collapsed birth rate in the 1990s.  Those bigger age groups born in the 1980s are passing their fertile years and the younger age groups born in the 1990s and early 2000s are very small in comparison. Because of this there are smaller and smaller number of potential mothers in Russia each year.

    And with these women in those small age groups having very few children themselves we are witnessing Russian demographics falling off the cliff. The population fell by more than 700,000 people last year alone. This year the decline could be even bigger. We are going back to 1990s.

    I can see a whole bunch of people from Europe and America running to Russia from the Globalhomo craziness and racial tensions. Mainly traditional and rural-minded people. Let them buy some cheap land in Siberia, off they go. Salaries are not a problem, neither is even the language, if their ambitions are just to have their own farmstead and be left to their own devices.

    FSU countries are a constant source. If anything I'm kind of more worried about getting more Ukrainians as opposed to Uzbeks, Tajiks and Azeris; they could potentially try to sell out Russia much as they did their ancestral homeland. At the very least I know some Ukrainians here who have very anti-Putin views.

    Imports can also happen from the student population as I mentioned. Russia at the moment is in something like 6th place worldwide by the amount of foreign students - albeit most of them are from FSU countries as well. This is set to expand over the next few years owing to massive investments into many huge new university campuses and so on.

    And about raising fertility rates of Russian women - of course that is the main thing. Along with lowering mortality rates. I've already talked about how.

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    Azi

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    Post  Azi Mon Jul 05, 2021 12:33 am

    Karl Haushofer wrote:According to Rosstat's estimation Russian population will fall to 134 million by 2030s.

    https://vfn.su/articles/demografiya-v-rossii-2021-statistika-tendencii-prognozy.html?fbclid=IwAR0iXv6nPTnIxtNnAl9mqsKGiJm0TFmTMJhZXh-4VNpHXJHxrtba-60HKWs
    For Russia there are 3 scenarios...depending on 3 different fertility rates. Only in the worst case the population will fall down to 134 millions.

    Yes it's true that russian fertility saw a drop from nearly 1,8 to 1,5 in 2019 and 2020. I can't say why! And even scientists will have problems to discover the reasons. For EU statistiscs are only available for 2019 and according to these data Russia is exactly in the middle of ALL EU countries. For 2020 the fertility rate will see a sharp decline in EU, I'm german and the statitsics for Germany are not that nice for 2020.

    Here is a good article from Michael Kofman...

    https://warontherocks.com/2020/02/russian-demographics-and-power-does-the-kremlin-have-a-long-game/

    Demographic is in the 21. century not that important anymore. more important are a highly educated citizen and workforce. That's the most important part, more important than just pumping out children like crazy. According only to demographics the african countries must be incredible superpowers, but reality is more complex.
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    Azi

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    Post  Azi Mon Jul 05, 2021 12:35 am

    Mir wrote:
    Karl Haushofer wrote:I would like to add that the Russian women in those small groups born in the 1990s and early 2000s should have 2-3 children in average to compensate the demographic collapse in the 1990s to keep the Russian population from declining.  This is not going to happen unless something drastically changes in Russia. Currently the fertility rate in Russia is around 1,5.

    Funny these guys seem to think Russia's population is increasing each year?
    Can you post a direct link from Rosstat to confirm your claim(s)?

    https://www.worldometers.info/world-population/russia-population/

    Russian population - Page 35 Rupop-10
    I know the numbers and it seems that they are not correct.

    Karl is not lying, because the data of 1,5 births per woman are from Rostat.
    miketheterrible
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    Post  miketheterrible Mon Jul 05, 2021 12:39 am

    The drop in birthrate has entire to do with 90's era. The drop of two years is miscalculations more likely but this was gonna happen regardless.

    Russia has been bringing in people from the Russia's, to bring them back. Next will be other migrants. Russia is still one of the biggest destinations for migrants.

    Other case is they are still having children, just Covid time may have put a somewhat slowness to that. The lockdown may force Russians to find other ways to entertain themselves too - lots of sex.

    But to drop to 134M in 8 years would be nearly impossible. They would have to lose millions a year and current statistics don't even match that, not even close.
    miketheterrible
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    Post  miketheterrible Mon Jul 05, 2021 12:40 am

    Azi wrote:
    Mir wrote:
    Karl Haushofer wrote:I would like to add that the Russian women in those small groups born in the 1990s and early 2000s should have 2-3 children in average to compensate the demographic collapse in the 1990s to keep the Russian population from declining.  This is not going to happen unless something drastically changes in Russia. Currently the fertility rate in Russia is around 1,5.

    Funny these guys seem to think Russia's population is increasing each year?
    Can you post a direct link from Rosstat to confirm your claim(s)?

    https://www.worldometers.info/world-population/russia-population/

    Russian population - Page 35 Rupop-10
    I know the numbers and it seems that they are not correct.

    Karl is not lying, because the data of 1,5 births per woman are from Rostat.

    He is lying. The births of 1.5 is a 1 year statistics difference and doesn't equate to million+ loss of population per year.

    Don't be retarded. You clearly don't know the numbers either.

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    kvs
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    Post  kvs Mon Jul 05, 2021 12:45 am

    How can a TFR change have a zero lag effect on deaths? Get real, births and deaths are not correlated this way.

    The Rosstat figures are consistent and the best out there. Politically motivated projections by western haters and their
    fellow travelers in Russia are BS. So troll Karl's drivel has zero support.

    BTW, Covid-19 has had similar negative TFR impacts in the west also. People thought there would be Covid babies, how wrong they were.
    So there is no mystery in the TFR drop and the TFR drop is not permanent.

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    Post  kvs Mon Jul 05, 2021 12:47 am

    This clearly part of a smear campaign against Russia. Every freaking issue in Russia is always the sky is falling hysteria. Instigated
    by western Russia haters. The TFR is pathetic in NATzO but that is never trotted out as "the end of the world is nigh" spazzing.

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    Post  Azi Mon Jul 05, 2021 12:51 am

    I'm very optimisitic with russian fertility rates, because the road to success is to eliminate the western virus!

    In western societies the single woman is the ultimate centre of the capitalistic world. She spends more than a married woman with children. Why should a married woman with let's say three children spend endless money for makeup, clothings, party, cocaine, sex toys and other useless things...she will more save the money to have a better future for their children (50 % of their DNA). That's why in western world the view of a career super duper power single woman is propelled and to cover the inner emptiness of the sould a hedonistic lifestyle is the ultimate supreme goal of living. A woman must have at leat hundreds of sexpartners and if she is unhappy in a relation she must kick the partner immediately.

    That's the true reason for fertility rates of 1,2 or 1,5 birzhs per woman Wink not less kindergardens and schools. Because it's easier to make party and live the bitch lifestyle, than to take care of someone and raise him 16 years to an adult sovereign individuum.

    And what most woman don't get in western world is that when the end is coming and it's coming for us all, your children and grandchildren will hold your hand when you take the step to your last journey, not the career, the colleagues, the company or the hundreds of f*ckbuddies.

    Russia must find it's own way out of this western desease and what they are doing now is great and lays the foundation for a bright future. And I hope in a few years europe will learn quick from Russia!

    For Russia...stop of spreading hedonistic western (anti)cultural bullshit! Back to traditional roots (religion, family and moral). Maybe a sponsored start for young families, similar to former Libya. More money for children in cities, than for children in countryside...life in city is more expensive.

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    kvs
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    Post  kvs Mon Jul 05, 2021 12:54 am

    https://www.statista.com/statistics/1033851/fertility-rate-russia-1840-2020/

    The actual TFR in Russia has been increasing from 2000 to 2020. Going from 1.25 to 1.82.

    https://www.worldometers.info/world-population/russia-population/

    A drop from 1.8 to 1.5 amounts to 17%. How can a transient 17% drop in births produce a substantial population
    decline all the way out to 2030.

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    Azi

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    Post  Azi Mon Jul 05, 2021 12:55 am

    miketheterrible wrote:
    Azi wrote:
    Mir wrote:
    Karl Haushofer wrote:I would like to add that the Russian women in those small groups born in the 1990s and early 2000s should have 2-3 children in average to compensate the demographic collapse in the 1990s to keep the Russian population from declining.  This is not going to happen unless something drastically changes in Russia. Currently the fertility rate in Russia is around 1,5.

    Funny these guys seem to think Russia's population is increasing each year?
    Can you post a direct link from Rosstat to confirm your claim(s)?

    https://www.worldometers.info/world-population/russia-population/

    Russian population - Page 35 Rupop-10
    I know the numbers and it seems that they are not correct.

    Karl is not lying, because the data of 1,5 births per woman are from Rostat.

    He is lying. The births of 1.5 is a 1 year statistics difference and doesn't equate to million+ loss of population per year.

    Don't be retarded. You clearly don't know the numbers either.
    Numbers are from Rostat! It's not coming out of my ass! From the official site of Rostat, not some CIA clone or so.

    Fertility rates, death rates are all very seasonal more or less. Sometimes you have higher birth rates, sometimes higher death rates. Mostly it dpends on economy, the weather (no joke!!!), big sport events etc.

    2020 was a really depressing year in fertility rates all over the world. Clearly understandable...who wants to make children if you are the whole time thinking of dying tomorrow (mass hysteria!).
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    Azi

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    Post  Azi Mon Jul 05, 2021 12:56 am

    kvs wrote:https://www.statista.com/statistics/1033851/fertility-rate-russia-1840-2020/

    The actual TFR in Russia has been increasing from 2000 to 2020.  Going from 1.25 to 1.82.

    https://www.worldometers.info/world-population/russia-population/

    A drop from 1.8 to 1.5 amounts to 17%.   How can a transient 17% drop in births produce a substantial population
    decline all the way out to 2030.

    I know the data from Statista and they are clearly higher. But I can't tell you why they are different from Rostat?!
    miketheterrible
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    Post  miketheterrible Mon Jul 05, 2021 12:57 am

    I was about to post this exact same statistica links. You beat me to it.

    Because people like Karl the fake news spreader (only time he ever posts), is that they spread fake news making it seem like a constant. It ain't a constant. Never has been. Birth rates and death rates adjust every year. Gee, I wonder why?
    miketheterrible
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    Post  miketheterrible Mon Jul 05, 2021 12:58 am

    Azi wrote:
    kvs wrote:https://www.statista.com/statistics/1033851/fertility-rate-russia-1840-2020/

    The actual TFR in Russia has been increasing from 2000 to 2020.  Going from 1.25 to 1.82.

    https://www.worldometers.info/world-population/russia-population/

    A drop from 1.8 to 1.5 amounts to 17%.   How can a transient 17% drop in births produce a substantial population
    decline all the way out to 2030.

    I know the data from Statista and they are clearly higher. But I can't tell you why they are different from Rostat?!

    No one posters rosstat either. Give us birth rates and death rates from rosstat then, mixed with net migration please.

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    Azi

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    Post  Azi Mon Jul 05, 2021 12:59 am

    kvs wrote:This clearly part of a smear campaign against Russia.   Every freaking issue in Russia is always the sky is falling hysteria.   Instigated
    by western Russia haters.   The TFR is pathetic in NATzO but that is never trotted out as "the end of the world is nigh" spazzing.

    True! The Covid deaths are a smear campaign. The compare 2019 with 2020 and in 2019 the death rate in Russia was really really low! And they are saying that 500000 people in Russia died from Covid. That's complete and utterly bullshit! That's NatZo propaganda to spread mistrust in russian population against the government...clearly visible a campaign.
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    Post  Azi Mon Jul 05, 2021 1:02 am

    miketheterrible wrote:
    Azi wrote:
    kvs wrote:https://www.statista.com/statistics/1033851/fertility-rate-russia-1840-2020/

    The actual TFR in Russia has been increasing from 2000 to 2020.  Going from 1.25 to 1.82.

    https://www.worldometers.info/world-population/russia-population/

    A drop from 1.8 to 1.5 amounts to 17%.   How can a transient 17% drop in births produce a substantial population
    decline all the way out to 2030.

    I know the data from Statista and they are clearly higher. But I can't tell you why they are different from Rostat?!

    No one posters rosstat either.  Give us birth rates and death rates from rosstat then, mixed with net migration please.
    https://www.fedstat.ru/indicator/31517

    Fertility rates from Rostat. It's only fertility, no other migration etc. Go to filter to see the correct data.

    I can't tell you who is right...Statista or Rostat?!
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    Azi

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    Post  Azi Mon Jul 05, 2021 1:11 am

    kvs wrote:https://www.statista.com/statistics/1033851/fertility-rate-russia-1840-2020/

    The actual TFR in Russia has been increasing from 2000 to 2020.  Going from 1.25 to 1.82.

    https://www.worldometers.info/world-population/russia-population/

    A drop from 1.8 to 1.5 amounts to 17%.   How can a transient 17% drop in births produce a substantial population
    decline all the way out to 2030.


    No way! And I didn't wrote it!!! My expecations are more optimistic for the next years.

    Russia will face in 2021, 2022 and 2023 a large economic growth...the economic stability will lead to planning stability for families. With the containment of western NGO's the western liberal retards in Russia will face a huge blow and with them even their ideas...so Russia will be more isolated from western world but that's good and will be another reason why the fertility rate will climb. Traditional values will be cool again. Another factor is the new awakening of the youth after Covid...young people will go out have fun, make love and make maybe some children ;D haha!
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    Post  miketheterrible Mon Jul 05, 2021 1:55 am

    Azi wrote:
    miketheterrible wrote:
    Azi wrote:
    kvs wrote:https://www.statista.com/statistics/1033851/fertility-rate-russia-1840-2020/

    The actual TFR in Russia has been increasing from 2000 to 2020.  Going from 1.25 to 1.82.

    https://www.worldometers.info/world-population/russia-population/

    A drop from 1.8 to 1.5 amounts to 17%.   How can a transient 17% drop in births produce a substantial population
    decline all the way out to 2030.

    I know the data from Statista and they are clearly higher. But I can't tell you why they are different from Rostat?!

    No one posters rosstat either.  Give us birth rates and death rates from rosstat then, mixed with net migration please.
    https://www.fedstat.ru/indicator/31517

    Fertility rates from Rostat. It's only fertility, no other migration etc. Go to filter to see the correct data.

    I can't tell you who is right...Statista or Rostat?!

    Check dates.

    As well, statistics uses their calculation method based upon birth rates per year and the numbers rosstat provides in that. So depends on how they calculate it between them. Statistica uses same sources.  Rosstat hasn't done a census since 2010, it's presumed it's tough estimates all around.

    I know here in Canada a census is done every couple of years. Russia hasn't done one in a long time.

    Death rates will decline in near future since baby boomer era starts to die off naturally. The Covid scare did no help though for even the people who want children.
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    Post  Mir Mon Jul 05, 2021 8:57 am

    @Azi

    I still don't see anything remotely close to the figures you and Karl mention from Rosstat?

    You say you know the numbers and that the stats from Worldometer's wrong? The stats you show below from Rosstats seems to indicate 1.7 which is the same as from Worldometer? Interesting!
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    Post  ALAMO Mon Jul 05, 2021 9:11 am

    Azi wrote:I'm very optimisitic with russian fertility rates, because the road to success is to eliminate the western virus!
    In western societies the single woman is the ultimate centre of the capitalistic world. She spends more than a married woman with children. Why should a married woman with let's say three children spend endless money for makeup, clothings, party, cocaine, sex toys and other useless things...she will more save the money to have a better future for their children (50 % of their DNA). That's why in western world the view of a career super duper power single woman is propelled and to cover the inner emptiness of the sould a hedonistic lifestyle is the ultimate supreme goal of living. A woman must have at leat hundreds of sexpartners and if she is unhappy in a relation she must kick the partner immediately.
    That's the true reason for fertility rates of 1,2 or 1,5 birzhs per woman Wink not less kindergardens and schools. Because it's easier to make party and live the bitch lifestyle, than to take care of someone and raise him 16 years to an adult sovereign individuum.
    And what most woman don't get in western world is that when the end is coming and it's coming for us all, your children and grandchildren will hold your hand when you take the step to your last journey, not the career, the colleagues, the company or the hundreds of f*ckbuddies.
    Russia must find it's own way out of this western desease and what they are doing now is great and lays the foundation for a bright future. And I hope in a few years europe will learn quick from Russia!
    For Russia...stop of spreading hedonistic western (anti)cultural bullshit! Back to traditional roots (religion, family and moral). Maybe a sponsored start for young families, similar to former Libya. More money for children in cities, than for children in countryside...life in city is more expensive.

    Very good comment.
    I would add to that, that there has never been such a stigmatization of parenthood, particulary children, as we witness today in western societies.
    People are being trained not to have kidns, to not stabilize untill very late, to not get married at all.
    It is obvious for any who observes.
    "A single" was a freak only 15 years ago. Today, he/she is a center of universe. His own one.
    I would add one more thing to this quotation : it is a general issue with fertility. 20 years ago, people used to estabilish families in their mid-20s. 40 years ago, in early 20s. Today, it is promoted to "wait with kids" untill late 30s or even better. That brings tons of medical issues with the fertility itself. When my wife was giving a birth to my first child, 15 years ago, she was in a hospital with all the other womens who were giving a birth as well. When my second kid was born, she was there with most of other womens treated for infertility. Most of them, imagine that. If that is a problem with nature, food, air - no idea. But this is an obvious fact. Maybe it is a combination of all the things ...
    But I wuld not look for conspiracy there. The answer is rather simple. Rich and educated societies create such a conditions everywhere they exist. We are lazy.

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    Post  GarryB Mon Jul 05, 2021 9:19 am

    Over population is a problem in itself... it is only a matter of time before issues like pollution including the enormous mass of rubbish and sewerage in the worlds oceans become the big next problem and part of the solution for that problem and also the effects on the worlds food supply and the worlds fresh water supply will be population reduction.

    When farms were mainly run with manual labour then large families made sense... especially when the mortality rate was high, but these days the majority of people in the west living in cities... most more than 70%, so the need for big families has gone and in fact children are a financial burden on a couple.

    Pretty soon the addition of artificial beings is going to massively complicate things... having one kid to look after you in your old age makes sense, but having one probably means a spoiled brat who doens't want to give up years of their life looking after you... or what if they get hit by a bus and killed, so having a couple of kids might seem a better choice, but there are no guarantees.

    The days when robots start to take over... and I don't mean sci fi robots that you can't tell are not human, but a simpler robot that can carry things and hold things and measure things... in many ways electric scooters for old people give them mobility and are a type of robot assistant already.

    The Japanese are so advanced with such robots because of their aging population...

    I saw a very sad documentary about Japan a short while back and it was from the perspective of the clean up teams that go into apartments of those that past away and have no relatives... they basically empty the place of the former owners property and dispose of it and clean the house or flat up for the next user. Photo albums thrown in the rubbish. Jewelry hocked off for cash to pay for the job... it was all very sad and depressing... all these sad lonely people living alone and dying alone... they wear hazmat suits because sometimes they find pets that have been dead for some time, and often it is a while before the owner is found too...

    An ageing population and an educated one seems to create a situation where people start living more isolated lives... they can't rape or murder you through your phone...

    Of course there are about 22 million chinese men with little chance of finding a girlfriend or partner.

    I see a new news report where a new education module has been rolled out to children where the girls are taught that any alcohol means you are incapable of giving consent so any sex you had at any party where you had anything to drink was actually rape if you choose to view it that way.

    I can see trouble ahead when they are taught anything other than yes means no.

    Don't tell them they would not exist if that standard was normal in the past.
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    ALAMO

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    Russian population - Page 35 Empty Re: Russian population

    Post  ALAMO Mon Jul 05, 2021 9:22 am

    Mir wrote:@Azi
    I still don't see anything remotely close to the figures you and Karl mention from Rosstat?
    You say you know the numbers and that the stats from Worldometer's wrong? The stats you show below from Rosstats seems to indicate 1.7 which is the same as from Worldometer? Interesting!

    That game is played by the west all the time. If there is anything positive about Russia, it must be depreciated by a proper amount of negative propaganda. I find it particulary amusing, how much about the number of Russians cares the countries and nations, that are functionally dying out.
    Poland's fertility rate is much lower than Russian one. Still, we can read the news about how bad is the situation in Russia rather than Poland dunno
    How about such a success stories like Estonia or Ukraine, huh? Laughing

    GarryB wrote:Over population is a problem in itself... it is only a matter of time before issues like pollution including the enormous mass of rubbish and sewerage in the worlds oceans become the big next problem and part of the solution for that problem and also the effects on the worlds food supply and the worlds fresh water supply will be population reduction.

    Well, the general issue is that this affects the rich societies only.
    Whole Africa is boiling with kids, and age median is below 20. Imagine that from perspective of Japan, where 1/3 of the population is 60+
    They have nothing better or else to do rather than have sex. Without proper education, and with the big role that catholic church plays there - the result is rather obvious.
    The peak of births in Poland was in 1982-1983. You know why ? Because we had a martial law, people were more or less locked at homes late, and due to the general condition of economy, electricity shortages were common. I'm not kidding bro Laughing
    jhelb
    jhelb

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    Russian population - Page 35 Empty Re: Russian population

    Post  jhelb Mon Jul 05, 2021 10:00 am

    Germany had record number of births this year. But guess what ...most of these kids were born to colored immigrants like Africans and Asians.

    This is not something that should be tolerated in Russia. Already cities after cities across Russia are being filled up by Central Asians. These immigrants tend to have very high birth rate.

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    Russian population - Page 35 Empty Re: Russian population

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